I lived the movement back in the day, but was always annoyed at how they failed. They refused to name a concise list of demands. Whenever anyone would ask them what they wanted, from either side of the aisle, they would give a rambling incoherent complaint list, and it made all leaders tune out immediately.
Bothered the hell out of me because yes, it was a good movement, but you need to have one, maybe two obvious and easy to digest demands. If their demand was simply "no more corporate campaign contributions" or "pass harsher banking legislation" that is something politicians could have actually acted on.
Same thing with BLM at George Floyd. I knew it would fizzle, it was the same thing. I think BLM posted 15+ things they wanted done? There's no way our government would ever do 15 things at once. Choose one, rally behind it. If they had all clearly said "demilitarization of police" that actually could have happened. Politicians were sympathetic and open to doing something, and that could have been an easy win. But instead they got incoherent ramblings again.
I'm just frustrated. I hate the system we have, but we are forced into it so we have to understand how to make change. If your demands are nebulus a few don't really have a clear goal, then they are just going to wait out the protests until everyone goes home. If you all say "do this thing" then you might actually get something done.
You can't blame the protestors too much for this. There are entire agencies and industries staffed by very bright class traitors with the sole purpose of breaking consensus and solidarity.
During Occupy, the media zoomed in on individuals on the street rather than interviewing leaders of the movement, which is where you got the impression that there were so many competing ideas and no organization. There were also plainclothes police and TLA members surveilling the camp to identify high profile targets for harassment, and agitate the group into violent acts that would facilitate police intervention.
You're right that people need organization, but the fundamental problem isn't that people aren't organizing, it's that in the arms race, the people are far behind the opposing force. We need toolkits and methodologies that support unified messaging and action, and resist contemporary police state counterintelligence and sabotage.
2 Comments
scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech · 13 pts · 14h
I lived the movement back in the day, but was always annoyed at how they failed. They refused to name a concise list of demands. Whenever anyone would ask them what they wanted, from either side of the aisle, they would give a rambling incoherent complaint list, and it made all leaders tune out immediately.
Bothered the hell out of me because yes, it was a good movement, but you need to have one, maybe two obvious and easy to digest demands. If their demand was simply "no more corporate campaign contributions" or "pass harsher banking legislation" that is something politicians could have actually acted on.
Same thing with BLM at George Floyd. I knew it would fizzle, it was the same thing. I think BLM posted 15+ things they wanted done? There's no way our government would ever do 15 things at once. Choose one, rally behind it. If they had all clearly said "demilitarization of police" that actually could have happened. Politicians were sympathetic and open to doing something, and that could have been an easy win. But instead they got incoherent ramblings again.
I'm just frustrated. I hate the system we have, but we are forced into it so we have to understand how to make change. If your demands are nebulus a few don't really have a clear goal, then they are just going to wait out the protests until everyone goes home. If you all say "do this thing" then you might actually get something done.
disorderly@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 14h
You can't blame the protestors too much for this. There are entire agencies and industries staffed by very bright class traitors with the sole purpose of breaking consensus and solidarity.
During Occupy, the media zoomed in on individuals on the street rather than interviewing leaders of the movement, which is where you got the impression that there were so many competing ideas and no organization. There were also plainclothes police and TLA members surveilling the camp to identify high profile targets for harassment, and agitate the group into violent acts that would facilitate police intervention.
You're right that people need organization, but the fundamental problem isn't that people aren't organizing, it's that in the arms race, the people are far behind the opposing force. We need toolkits and methodologies that support unified messaging and action, and resist contemporary police state counterintelligence and sabotage.