TLDR: please don't just put solar on your roof, we're past those days, please either get an EV you can charge during the day or battery
TLDR: please don't just put solar on your roof, we're past those days, please either get an EV you can charge during the day or battery
16 Comments
umbrella@lemmy.ml · 6 pts · 315d
Eyekaytee@aussie.zone · 3 pts · 314d
how would you rethink the system of too much supply and not enough demand?
eureka@aussie.zone · 6 pts · 314d
I'm not up to date on how effective large-scale battery tech is, but it seems odd that there wouldn't be demand for electrical energy, especially when non-renewable power sources are still in use.
If we can make electricity a post-scarse resource that isn't profitable to generate, that's an amazingly good thing.
Honestly might even be worth the government investing in a sort of nationalisation of home solar electricity, rather than this counterproductive market.
Eyekaytee@aussie.zone · 5 pts · 314d
it would be but it’s unrealistic as infra needs paying for and someone has to pay for it
if you make electricity non-profitable then everyone’s fit rate gets reduced to 0c removing a major incentive for people to get solar, if you make electricity ultra cheap, why would anyone buy solar panels?
the energy market is a near perfect market, supply has to meet demand and demand has to meet supply at all times 24x7, if either get out of whack the power goes out
that’s the problem with solar, only works when the sun is out :p
that’s pretty much the main convo happening right now, grid firming
there is more demand coming in the form of big batteries but a big problem is that the people with the capital don’t have much incentive to build them when they are not very profitable, if you had 10 billion would you invest it in renewables and get 2% return or something else and get 8%
try to pretend you’re someone who likes money 😝
https://reneweconomy.com.au/bp-to-abandon-renewable-targets-divest-assets-in-shift-back-to-fossil-fuels/
so the labor gov stepped in to underwrite revenues so projects don’t become unprofitable:
https://www.dcceew.gov.au/energy/renewable/capacity-investment-scheme
the idea of the gov taking over the whole thing is you run the risk of getting a tony abbott who immediately halts all renewables, gotta remember we went nearly 30 years with coalition in power majority of the time and they’re still not happy with renewables at all
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2025-10-27/the-coalition-s-ongoing-civil-war-over-net-zero/105939634
you’d also have to explain to tax payers why they are now paying even more tax when the largest users of electricity are factories and businesses
so it’s a bit complicated 🫠
eureka@aussie.zone · 3 pts · 313d
Thanks for the details :)
Haha, I just can't stand that the people with the capital get to stop society from fixing so many things.
Yeah that's a good point. Nationalising is unstable in our current two-major-party flip-flopping.
YeahToast@aussie.zone · 4 pts · 314d
We need to just create energy sinks.. well effectively batteries but not in the traditional sense. Like kinetic storage. Sure, they're not efficient, but what does it matter if they're only in use when electricity has a negative value
umbrella@lemmy.ml · 1 pts · 314d
Tau@aussie.zone · 2 pts · 314d
The nearly endless resource doesn't put out at night though - hence the supply and demand problem still being an issue. We've now got enough production to cover demand at peak solar output but now we need enough storage to utilise that peak supply and cover demand at other times.
umbrella@lemmy.ml · 1 pts · 313d
Eyekaytee@aussie.zone · 2 pts · 312d
Yes that's what the article is saying
The day time negative pricing is because coal power plants can't turn off but are needed at night, if we stop needing them at night we can just shut them down
HubertManne@piefed.social · 5 pts · 314d
I would get a batter system before solar anyway. My electricity has hourly rates and in addition to those savings being able to function in a power outage is a rather nice quality of life.
quokka1@mastodon.au · 3 pts · 314d
@HubertManne @Eyekaytee It's sticking in my mind that's there extra "stuff" that needs to happen for a battery to supply power to the house if the mains feed drops. But I can't remember what the man said. I will have to read up on it again and consider if it's worth it - I'm not sure I expect many outages (metro area, with newly-upgraded/buried power lines). And i'd just go to the park if there was one.
FiskFisk33@startrek.website · 4 pts · 315d
Couldn't a home system feasibly be built to just auto shut off when prices become negative?
Eyekaytee@aussie.zone · 6 pts · 315d
yeah it def can be done, I've seen people who are on Amber electric do it as they pay the cost if they export solar during the day (see screenshot) the problem is that they'd switch off most days, any time the state isn't covered in rain clouds or going through a heat wave the price is negative:
So for Amber customers their primary job is fill up battery and don't export power until night time which is basically a practical implementation of what the article is saying
I was hoping to get this:
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/redearth-v2g-charger-mb3299/
So cool! I'll fill up my 40kw EV battery during the day (as it sits at home most days) and then export to the grid at night!
................. what a joke, it needs to be around $2000 tops... for $11000 I may as well just buy a 40kw battery, it'll be cheaper
hanrahan@piefed.social · 3 pts · 314d
Then you need it wired in AND you need to upgrade to 3 phase. I do think they have a single phase version in the works.
Creat@discuss.tchncs.de · 5 pts · 314d
This is actually done by law since I think 2025 in Germany and (I assume) other EU countries. Your inverter has to be comfortable by your electricity provider to be disabled or throttled when prices become negative.
zurohki@aussie.zone · 2 pts · 314d
That's how it should be done - overbuild renewables and intelligently shut some of them off when not required.
Aeri@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 312d
Surely this varies by region? My area is definitely one where it would just shave a bit off my electric bill.
Eyekaytee@aussie.zone · 1 pts · 312d
what is your area?