Signal does not need Google Play Services to send notifications. I'm saying this from experience, as I use it without Play Services installed, and still get message notifications. I believe Signal will use Google's push notifications if Play Services is available, but has a fallback approach if it's not.
Or more precisely, Signal will only use fallback notification services if Google Play Services is unavailable at the time Signal is installed.
I just wanted to clarify that it's not necessary to install Signal once with Play Services and again without. I've never had Play Services on any of my phones, but was able to start using Signal without issue.
Okay, I didn't know those were things you were concerned about :).
On the lack of self-hosting and federation, I don't like it either, but it is a deliberate choice to allow faster evolution. That post, from ten years ago, contends that federated protocols ossify too easily, while centralized can grow and adapt (relevant quote: "So while it’s nice that I’m able to host my own email, that’s also the reason why my email isn’t end-to-end encrypted, and probably never will be"). This does give me concern that Signal will not last in the long-term, but for secure communication right now, it's hard to beat.
As for US hosting, that's another thing I don't like, but they are structured to mitigate that issue. Their protocol, which has been independently audited several times, ensures neither the Signal Foundation nor any intermediaries can see user activity. They have been subpoenaed before, and have only been able to provide the date a phone number was first registered, nothing more. And since the Signal Foundation is a non-profit, they have no incentive to enshittify to turn profitable. So even under US government threat, they can't see what you're doing and have no ability nor reason to change that.
Anyway, that's why I settled on using Signal, despite its imperfections. You may be happier with Matrix; I stayed away from that because it's more work and less secure (as I understand, group chats only have message content encrypted, with metadata like users and message times being unencrypted), but its federated nature may let it outlast Signal. And there are many Matrix clients in F-Droid that don't require Google Play Services.
Hmmm, yes, understandable. I saw another user use GPS for Google Play Services and thought it was a common thing in this community. Sorry. I edited the post.
Matrix is a protocol. It's not possible to crash it.
I did find that certain Matrix implementations had a habit of breaking when encryption was used, until about a year ago. From what I've seen, recent versions appear to have fixed it. Element X is worth a try.
Back to your original question: Matrix apparently supports whatever UnifiedPush distributor you choose, such as ntfy.
I set up ejabberd maybe 15 or so years ago without any issues. Not sure about ... more recent software. But since we're in the containerization era I assume it has become easier.
Matrix was an experience, though. But it happily runs in my environment using the Synapse server and Cinny for desktop and Element X on mobile.
21 Comments
randy@lemmy.ca · 10 pts · 74d
Signal does not need Google Play Services to send notifications. I'm saying this from experience, as I use it without Play Services installed, and still get message notifications. I believe Signal will use Google's push notifications if Play Services is available, but has a fallback approach if it's not.
XLE@piefed.social · 4 pts · 74d
Signal will only use fallback notification services if you uninstall and then reinstall it while Google Play Services is unavailable.
randy@lemmy.ca · 7 pts · 74d
Or more precisely, Signal will only use fallback notification services if Google Play Services is unavailable at the time Signal is installed.
I just wanted to clarify that it's not necessary to install Signal once with Play Services and again without. I've never had Play Services on any of my phones, but was able to start using Signal without issue.
jafffacakelemmy@fedia.io · 5 pts · 74d
Use molly, a signal fork. Fully compatible with signal but you can configure how it checks for new messages. Non-google play is an explicit option
MeowerMisfit817@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 74d
The issues are: Signal is hosted on the US. And you can't selfhost it. That kinda raises some suspicions.
randy@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 73d
Okay, I didn't know those were things you were concerned about :).
On the lack of self-hosting and federation, I don't like it either, but it is a deliberate choice to allow faster evolution. That post, from ten years ago, contends that federated protocols ossify too easily, while centralized can grow and adapt (relevant quote: "So while it’s nice that I’m able to host my own email, that’s also the reason why my email isn’t end-to-end encrypted, and probably never will be"). This does give me concern that Signal will not last in the long-term, but for secure communication right now, it's hard to beat.
As for US hosting, that's another thing I don't like, but they are structured to mitigate that issue. Their protocol, which has been independently audited several times, ensures neither the Signal Foundation nor any intermediaries can see user activity. They have been subpoenaed before, and have only been able to provide the date a phone number was first registered, nothing more. And since the Signal Foundation is a non-profit, they have no incentive to enshittify to turn profitable. So even under US government threat, they can't see what you're doing and have no ability nor reason to change that.
Anyway, that's why I settled on using Signal, despite its imperfections. You may be happier with Matrix; I stayed away from that because it's more work and less secure (as I understand, group chats only have message content encrypted, with metadata like users and message times being unencrypted), but its federated nature may let it outlast Signal. And there are many Matrix clients in F-Droid that don't require Google Play Services.
MeowerMisfit817@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 73d
Matrix's websites and apps tend to crash and have bugs. I'm using Wire in the moment.
apfelwoiSchoppen@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 74d
I do not have location permissions granted to either Signal nor WhatsApp and continue to recieve notifications from both.
MeowerMisfit817@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 74d
GPS as in Google Play Services.
apfelwoiSchoppen@lemmy.world · 13 pts · 74d
That's real confusing to acronymize for Google Play Services. It is already well known for another thing.
MeowerMisfit817@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 74d
Hmmm, yes, understandable. I saw another user use GPS for Google Play Services and thought it was a common thing in this community. Sorry. I edited the post.
one_old_coder@piefed.social · 7 pts · 74d
Not on GrapheneOS. Which system are you using?
Dirk@lemmy.ml · 4 pts · 74d
Any random Matrix client. Any random XMPP client.
MeowerMisfit817@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 74d
Matrix is... really crashed and often breaks. And XMPP got me really confused trying to set it
who@feddit.org · 2 pts · 74d
Matrix is a protocol. It's not possible to crash it.
I did find that certain Matrix implementations had a habit of breaking when encryption was used, until about a year ago. From what I've seen, recent versions appear to have fixed it. Element X is worth a try.
Back to your original question: Matrix apparently supports whatever UnifiedPush distributor you choose, such as ntfy.
https://github.com/element-hq/element-x-android/pull/2873
https://forum.yunohost.org/t/how-to-setup-push-notification-with-synapse-and-element-or-element-x-android/36897
MeowerMisfit817@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 74d
No, as in the websites are slow and tend to have bugs/not send messages/crash
Dirk@lemmy.ml · 1 pts · 74d
I set up ejabberd maybe 15 or so years ago without any issues. Not sure about ... more recent software. But since we're in the containerization era I assume it has become easier.
Matrix was an experience, though. But it happily runs in my environment using the Synapse server and Cinny for desktop and Element X on mobile.
Chewie@slrpnk.net · 2 pts · 70d
I set up OpenFire (https://www.igniterealtime.org/projects/openfire/) for my XMPP server, and it was very easy on my recent version of Ubuntu. It's also easy to update when new versions come out.
I've heard good things about Prosody (https://prosody.im/), but I've not tried it myself.
MeowerMisfit817@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 71d
Element also seems to need it.
nocturne@slrpnk.net · 4 pts · 74d
Signal does not even have an option for location for me on iOS, and I get notifications.
MeowerMisfit817@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 74d
Google Play Services, I mean. I'll edit the post.