@modem_down@beep@Semi_Hemi_Demigod The software walks the person using it through enabling Android Debug Bridge and extracting data with it. It's either not going to work or will be able to see many signs of what happened. GrapheneOS is well known to the forensic data companies and they make a point of trying to support it. They haven't had much success with locked GrapheneOS devices but they can certainly handle detecting it and detecting if a feature like this was used via ADB.
@orclev Standard operating procedure is increasingly to extract data with standard forensics software. If it doesn't go smoothly then they'll likely detain people and get experts to deal with it.
@modem_down@beep@Semi_Hemi_Demigod It would be trivially detected by widely distributed standard forensic software including the non-Premium variant of Cellebrite able to run on a laptop.
@Antti The UI and application layer which is largely closed source is in fact a huge portion of what they've made and is not the only part of SailfishOS which is closed source.
@Antti No, not many companies based in Europe directly partnered with the Russia government starting after they invaded Ukraine. That's not business as usual, that's directly working with authoritarians. No amount of your lies about when the partnership and ownership ended or the extent of it is going to successfully cover it up. Jolla is run by people not aligned with individual rights and certainly not aligned with the well being of the EU. Their marketing is as hollow as their values.
@Antti They didn't choose the licensing for the portions of SailfishOS not developed by them. They didn't make the Linux kernel or choose the GPLv2 license it uses. For the majority of what they've developed themselves rather than taken from others, the code is closed source. The project itself is largely closed source. you're trying to present it as if code they took from elsewhere should be credited to them while meanwhile the portions they actually made which is mainly the UI are closed.
@Antti Jolla began closely partnering with Russia in 2015, a year after their invasion of Crimea. They were fully aware they were partnering with an authoritarian regime engaging in assassinations, invasions and ethnic cleansing. Jolla demonstrated their values with this partnership and they're absolutely not people who believe in personal freedoms, privacy or who have any backbone to stand up to authoritarianism. They chose that partnership and chose to be largely owned by Russia.
@helloclippy@jfr_1980@keepandroidopen It's not surprising to see someone with an online identity based around content from a prominent Kiwi Farmer is making disingenous attacks on our project and team. We're going to continue countering the dishonest claims about us with factual information. You're trying and failing to misdirect away from it.
From your bio:
> I'm part of the LGBTQ+ community
Meanwhile, you support Kiwi Farmers and their attacks on us:
@jfr_1980@lineageos@keepandroidopen Are you really so confident that France, Germany and other European countries aren't going to elect authoritarians? If you move to an OS and services largely marketed and based around the fact that they're French, you can't expect them to protect you from a future French government violating human rights even more than the current government. Governments are largely backing the whole digital sovereignty push because they want access and control themselves.
@jfr_1980@lineageos@keepandroidopen The EU passed Chat Control in a somewhat watered down form but it still passed. It's not going to be the end of it. We wouldn't feel very comfortable if we were based in the EU. We had to leave France and French providers entirely to protect our users because they've gone after organizations for providing secure devices before and started threatening to do the same to us due to GrapheneOS protecting devices from commercial exploit tools.
@jfr_1980@lineageos@keepandroidopen Yet all of those are largely made with US tech. You're going to need to avoid the Snapdragon, the Linux kernel and a massive amount of other tech if you want to avoid technology primarily made and controlled within the US. A company being geographically located within the US doesn't mean the components and software they're using aren't largely US tech.
Europe is leading the charge on age verification, cracking down on end-to-end encryption, etc. not the US.
@jfr_1980@lineageos@keepandroidopen Pixels are currently the only available devices providing reasonable security combined with proper alternate OS support. That's why those are the only devices we currently support. There are companies in Europe such as NitroKey selling phones with them which are not partnered with us and we aren't involved in it but it's permitted by the open source licensing. Our OEM partnership is a much different thing since the devices are being improved to support it.
> You need to sell your soul and put graphene in some ready from shelf phone
There are companies selling phones with GrapheneOS.
You'll be happy to know one of the top 10 Android OEMs by sales is announcing a partnership with us early next month (March 2026). They're making devices meeting all of our requirements for updates and security features which will launch in 2027 with official support for GrapheneOS and perhaps variants with it preinstalled.
@jfr_1980@lineageos@keepandroidopen The reason we have a major issue with /e/ and Murena is because they've spent years misinforming people about GrapheneOS as part of falsely marketing their products/services. It's very much a for-profit company putting money about ethics. /e/ also has a separate non-profit which is used to build the products for the for-profit while funding them with grants / donations. The same people control both and are directly profiting from the supposed non-profit.
@jfr_1980@lineageos@keepandroidopen A serious alternative to GrapheneOS is using an iPhone 17. Apple is providing strong privacy and security. They have their own end-to-end encrypted cloud services too but people can use many alternatives to those such as the Proton app suite on GrapheneOS.
/e/ isn't in the same space at all and we don't consider it competition. We worry about what Apple is implementing and how we can stay ahead / keep up, not a project doing nearly the opposite of us.
@jfr_1980@lineageos@keepandroidopen Instead of doing local processing for speech-to-text as Apple and GrapheneOS are doing, /e/ has a supposedly private service for it which actually just sends the sensitive user data to OpenAI and calls it anonymized since they pass it through their own servers:
@jfr_1980@lineageos@keepandroidopen GrapheneOS is a privacy and security hardened OS greatly improving those areas. /e/ is the direct opposite of it. /e/ massively reduces privacy and security compared to AOSP. /e/ lags extremely far behind on privacy/security patches including major OS updates required for full patches. /e/ adds a bunch of invasive services including one sending user data to OpenAI along with a bunch of always on Google services and privileged Google service integration.
@jfr_1980@lineageos@keepandroidopen We won't participate or support anything which involves or includes /e/ and Murena. Including them is excluding the people who they've spent years targeting with fabricated stories and harassment. If our support is wanted then people can stop including serial harassers and scammers. There is no coming back from what they've done to us. There will be no unity or collaboration with people who have done what they have. They should leave the industry completely.
@modem_down @beep @Semi_Hemi_Demigod The software walks the person using it through enabling Android Debug Bridge and extracting data with it. It's either not going to work or will be able to see many signs of what happened. GrapheneOS is well known to the forensic data companies and they make a point of trying to support it. They haven't had much success with locked GrapheneOS devices but they can certainly handle detecting it and detecting if a feature like this was used via ADB.
@orclev Standard operating procedure is increasingly to extract data with standard forensics software. If it doesn't go smoothly then they'll likely detain people and get experts to deal with it.
@modem_down @beep @Semi_Hemi_Demigod It would be trivially detected by widely distributed standard forensic software including the non-Premium variant of Cellebrite able to run on a laptop.
@LorenzoVujade You could sell the device for more than the cost of replacing the screen and speaker after doing it so it's probably worth it.
@Antti The UI and application layer which is largely closed source is in fact a huge portion of what they've made and is not the only part of SailfishOS which is closed source.
@Antti No, not many companies based in Europe directly partnered with the Russia government starting after they invaded Ukraine. That's not business as usual, that's directly working with authoritarians. No amount of your lies about when the partnership and ownership ended or the extent of it is going to successfully cover it up. Jolla is run by people not aligned with individual rights and certainly not aligned with the well being of the EU. Their marketing is as hollow as their values.
@Antti They didn't choose the licensing for the portions of SailfishOS not developed by them. They didn't make the Linux kernel or choose the GPLv2 license it uses. For the majority of what they've developed themselves rather than taken from others, the code is closed source. The project itself is largely closed source. you're trying to present it as if code they took from elsewhere should be credited to them while meanwhile the portions they actually made which is mainly the UI are closed.
@Antti Jolla began closely partnering with Russia in 2015, a year after their invasion of Crimea. They were fully aware they were partnering with an authoritarian regime engaging in assassinations, invasions and ethnic cleansing. Jolla demonstrated their values with this partnership and they're absolutely not people who believe in personal freedoms, privacy or who have any backbone to stand up to authoritarianism. They chose that partnership and chose to be largely owned by Russia.
@helloclippy @jfr_1980 @keepandroidopen It's not surprising to see someone with an online identity based around content from a prominent Kiwi Farmer is making disingenous attacks on our project and team. We're going to continue countering the dishonest claims about us with factual information. You're trying and failing to misdirect away from it.
From your bio:
> I'm part of the LGBTQ+ community
Meanwhile, you support Kiwi Farmers and their attacks on us:
https://kiwifarms.st/members/larossmann.132201/
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen Are you really so confident that France, Germany and other European countries aren't going to elect authoritarians? If you move to an OS and services largely marketed and based around the fact that they're French, you can't expect them to protect you from a future French government violating human rights even more than the current government. Governments are largely backing the whole digital sovereignty push because they want access and control themselves.
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen The EU passed Chat Control in a somewhat watered down form but it still passed. It's not going to be the end of it. We wouldn't feel very comfortable if we were based in the EU. We had to leave France and French providers entirely to protect our users because they've gone after organizations for providing secure devices before and started threatening to do the same to us due to GrapheneOS protecting devices from commercial exploit tools.
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen Yet all of those are largely made with US tech. You're going to need to avoid the Snapdragon, the Linux kernel and a massive amount of other tech if you want to avoid technology primarily made and controlled within the US. A company being geographically located within the US doesn't mean the components and software they're using aren't largely US tech.
Europe is leading the charge on age verification, cracking down on end-to-end encryption, etc. not the US.
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen Pixels are currently the only available devices providing reasonable security combined with proper alternate OS support. That's why those are the only devices we currently support. There are companies in Europe such as NitroKey selling phones with them which are not partnered with us and we aren't involved in it but it's permitted by the open source licensing. Our OEM partnership is a much different thing since the devices are being improved to support it.
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen
> You need to sell your soul and put graphene in some ready from shelf phone
There are companies selling phones with GrapheneOS.
You'll be happy to know one of the top 10 Android OEMs by sales is announcing a partnership with us early next month (March 2026). They're making devices meeting all of our requirements for updates and security features which will launch in 2027 with official support for GrapheneOS and perhaps variants with it preinstalled.
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen The reason we have a major issue with /e/ and Murena is because they've spent years misinforming people about GrapheneOS as part of falsely marketing their products/services. It's very much a for-profit company putting money about ethics. /e/ also has a separate non-profit which is used to build the products for the for-profit while funding them with grants / donations. The same people control both and are directly profiting from the supposed non-profit.
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen A serious alternative to GrapheneOS is using an iPhone 17. Apple is providing strong privacy and security. They have their own end-to-end encrypted cloud services too but people can use many alternatives to those such as the Proton app suite on GrapheneOS.
/e/ isn't in the same space at all and we don't consider it competition. We worry about what Apple is implementing and how we can stay ahead / keep up, not a project doing nearly the opposite of us.
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen Instead of doing local processing for speech-to-text as Apple and GrapheneOS are doing, /e/ has a supposedly private service for it which actually just sends the sensitive user data to OpenAI and calls it anonymized since they pass it through their own servers:
https://community.e.foundation/t/voice-to-text-feature-using-open-ai/70509
It's representative of their approach. You should read https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/24134-devices-lacking-standard-privacysecurity-patches-and-protections-arent-private and the third party content from Divested Computing, Mike Kuketz and Eylenburg linked there.
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen GrapheneOS is a privacy and security hardened OS greatly improving those areas. /e/ is the direct opposite of it. /e/ massively reduces privacy and security compared to AOSP. /e/ lags extremely far behind on privacy/security patches including major OS updates required for full patches. /e/ adds a bunch of invasive services including one sending user data to OpenAI along with a bunch of always on Google services and privileged Google service integration.
@jfr_1980 @lineageos @keepandroidopen We won't participate or support anything which involves or includes /e/ and Murena. Including them is excluding the people who they've spent years targeting with fabricated stories and harassment. If our support is wanted then people can stop including serial harassers and scammers. There is no coming back from what they've done to us. There will be no unity or collaboration with people who have done what they have. They should leave the industry completely.