What was that joke about Firefox again?
"We're the browser beloved for being the only one not hitting our dick with a hammer. Now, you're probably wondering why we brought this hammer and and took out our dick. Well you see..."
More seriously, I think until the bubble pops, writing "AI" anywhere is a way for companies to attract fundings, and that money is too easy for many to pass.
That's why I tend to trust community managed distros over corpo ones. I don't see Arch or Debian pulling this bullshit.
Tho, I'd still be suspicious of the other big private company, Redhat; which is very involved in maintaining Systemd.
Honestly, if it comes to this I'll distro-hop as far as I need to escape AI.
Love my Fedora Atomic Cosmic, but absolutely we all be watching to see where they go, and if needed will play the distro-hop game in attempt to stay in the AI free zone
I think there'll always be an issue depending on how dependent a project is on a company. Because the main risk isn't that some bumbleling idiot of a CEO will run the projects and his company to the ground, but that sensible people will take decisions that serve their own interests, but not the interests of users.
Free software creates a framework wherein companies may have an interest in the success of a project and contribute to it. This is a good thing, insofar that to companies, the project is just a tool that needs to work well and to the programmers, the company is just one of several contributors.
In a community driven project, those who take decisions are the programmers who directly contribute to it and who are also usually users. Their interests are closer to those of all other end users. They want the project to work, and that may also be what financial contributors want.
However, if the software is a product of the company, they'll intend to extract value from it directly. The interest of shareholders will supercede those of programmers and end users. That is why they may take decisions that are bad from a user's perspective, not because their dumb, but because they have other interests in mind.
Inserting adds is a good way to get fundings from add companies at the detriment of users.
Adding suscription tiers is a good way to extract wealth from part of the users.
Adding AI is a good way to secure loans from banks that speculate on the AI bubble, and maybe even from companies like Nvidia, interested in making the bubble last and grow.
It's not a matter of being sensible or not, it's a matter of whose interest you're sensibly serving.
Ubuntu was easier to use out of the box, especially for some hardware like Nvidia hardware in example. Also the software from its repository and the Kernel is not updated nearly as often as Ubuntu. All of this makes it harder to use for Gaming oriented people. Back then Debian users laughed at me (Ubuntu user back then) for using a "toy" distribution. But Debian was not a good option for me back then.
My point is, it does not matter if someone laughs at you. Just use the best option for you.
Problem is when people don't use what option is best for them and make everything worse for the people who are then asked to help them (or even worse are completely unrelated and have to bear the burden anyway). There are fundamental problems how Canonical distributes security fixes (many locked behind Ubuntu Pro which is free for personal use but still requires signing up for it) and these problems are inherited by Ubuntu remixes like Mint and popOS.
If you're playing modern games that just released, they often need the newest graphics drivers to run well and look right. It also helps to have the most modern version of apps like Heroic Games Launcher and stuff, but Flatpak has solved that somewhat.
If anyone here games a lot, I'd recommend a more rolling release distro (or the version of Debian that updates packages quickly, forgot its name).
debian gamer here. Things suck because I have a non-muxing, bullshit on board graphics card not because of Debian. I have the same issues on Bazzite, Pika Os and Nobara
At least Firefox recently got a 1-click "AI off" button. I'd prefer if Mozilla concentrated on the rendering engine first and foremost but that 1-click solution isn't so bad. So at least there's that.
I’ll stop looking for alternatives when it becomes a one click AI on button instead.
Problem is that well maintained alternatives without that shit don't exist. Sure, there are Chromium and Firefox forks that strip all that shit but are you really willing to trust you data security with a fork created by two dudes in their free time to deliver updates the same day as their upstream projects? I'm not. So I rather use Firefox, turn that shit off manually and continue to hope that Servo will be good enough in two years (doubtful).
I think the best current candidate is WebKit-GTK but here's the looking bit again: I'm looking for a WebKit-GTK browser that adopts traditional cross-desktop UX and not GNOME header bars.
This is going to be all about how they implement it imo. There was a specific line in that article "for those who want it", if they go for an opt-in approach which only then installs the AI capabilities, then yeah okay I don't mind as an end-user.
If however Canonical implement AI into Ubuntu without being opt-in, then I'm out and never turning back.
They put out LTS releases which are nice for a home server where you need relatively recent packages and a couple of years of support so that you don’t have to babysit it too much. On a server it’s much closer to Debian experience as you don’t have to deal with snap, flatpak and all that weirdness.
The ability to systematically create file embeddings and use them for semantic search. This tech is now 9 years old, it’s not wildly energy inefficient, it only sucks that when you change the model you need to recreate the entire index.
A good accessibility interface that AI tools incidentally benefit from
Accessibility features for humans, like how Apple lets you select text on any image. Or I can send an image to Gemma 4 and the transcriptions are actually quite good running locally (though the model is large)
The only ads I notice is that apt shows how many packages can be updated through an optional paid Expanded Security Maintenance. This isn’t very obtrusive but I’m on a 4 year old LTS release currently so things might have changed.
The only ads I notice is that apt shows how many packages can be updated through an optional paid Expanded Security Maintenance. This isn’t very obtrusive but I’m on a 4 year old LTS release currently so things might have changed.
Receiving updates for anything in Universe requires Ubuntu Pro which is free for home users but still requires signing up to give you access to that update repository and once you sign up, they can match your account with what you install/update, so there is server-side tracking. In theory there is the possibility of community-maintained updates there but that required adhering to Canonical's draconian version freeze rules. Something Fedora and its derivates do not have to that degree (during a release cycle any update is fine if it doesn't break compatibility).
52 Comments
SuperPengato@scribe.disroot.org · 130 pts · 103d
What was that joke about Firefox again? "We're the browser beloved for being the only one not hitting our dick with a hammer. Now, you're probably wondering why we brought this hammer and and took out our dick. Well you see..."
More seriously, I think until the bubble pops, writing "AI" anywhere is a way for companies to attract fundings, and that money is too easy for many to pass.
That's why I tend to trust community managed distros over corpo ones. I don't see Arch or Debian pulling this bullshit.
Tho, I'd still be suspicious of the other big private company, Redhat; which is very involved in maintaining Systemd.
Honestly, if it comes to this I'll distro-hop as far as I need to escape AI.
caseyweederman@lemmy.ca · 36 pts · 103d
Red Hat has been all over AI for a while
https://www.redhat.com/en/products/ai
OrganicMustard@lemmy.world · 32 pts · 103d
Also they have been collaborating with the US and Israel to kill people on wars for some time
woelkchen@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 103d
Hosting LLMs is different from pushing AI crap down end users' throats Copilot style.
spartanatreyu@programming.dev · 1 pts · 102d
That feels a lot like "War profiteers aren't guilty of shooting the gun".
kibiz0r@midwest.social · 4 pts · 103d
NixOS is whatever distro you want it to be. (As long as you learn Nix…)
BrilliantBadger@piefed.ca · 3 pts · 103d
Love my Fedora Atomic Cosmic, but absolutely we all be watching to see where they go, and if needed will play the distro-hop game in attempt to stay in the AI free zone
possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 100d
Private companies are fine as long as they are run be sensible people.
The issue with Canonical is that they have been shit for a long time. They are being proped up by Microsoft and a legacy that ended 15 years ago.
SuperPengato@scribe.disroot.org · 1 pts · 100d
I think there'll always be an issue depending on how dependent a project is on a company. Because the main risk isn't that some bumbleling idiot of a CEO will run the projects and his company to the ground, but that sensible people will take decisions that serve their own interests, but not the interests of users.
Free software creates a framework wherein companies may have an interest in the success of a project and contribute to it. This is a good thing, insofar that to companies, the project is just a tool that needs to work well and to the programmers, the company is just one of several contributors.
In a community driven project, those who take decisions are the programmers who directly contribute to it and who are also usually users. Their interests are closer to those of all other end users. They want the project to work, and that may also be what financial contributors want.
However, if the software is a product of the company, they'll intend to extract value from it directly. The interest of shareholders will supercede those of programmers and end users. That is why they may take decisions that are bad from a user's perspective, not because their dumb, but because they have other interests in mind.
Inserting adds is a good way to get fundings from add companies at the detriment of users.
Adding suscription tiers is a good way to extract wealth from part of the users. Adding AI is a good way to secure loans from banks that speculate on the AI bubble, and maybe even from companies like Nvidia, interested in making the bubble last and grow.
It's not a matter of being sensible or not, it's a matter of whose interest you're sensibly serving.
possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 100d
Not all companies are chasing short term profit
In a healthy environment companies work to maintain a healthy customer base. Competition is what drives innovation and keeps companies well behaved.
slazer2au@lemmy.world · 53 pts · 103d
Not like we need more reasons to not use Ubuntu.
username_1@programming.dev · 26 pts · 103d
Eyekaytee@aussie.zone · 21 pts · 103d
Why are you offended being called a slowpoke using slowpoke OS?
I use it on my server because of this reason
Its been dead according to linux purists since 2011 when they went to Unity over Gnome or KDE so ignore them :P
thingsiplay@lemmy.ml · 11 pts · 103d
Ubuntu was easier to use out of the box, especially for some hardware like Nvidia hardware in example. Also the software from its repository and the Kernel is not updated nearly as often as Ubuntu. All of this makes it harder to use for Gaming oriented people. Back then Debian users laughed at me (Ubuntu user back then) for using a "toy" distribution. But Debian was not a good option for me back then.
My point is, it does not matter if someone laughs at you. Just use the best option for you.
woelkchen@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 103d
Problem is when people don't use what option is best for them and make everything worse for the people who are then asked to help them (or even worse are completely unrelated and have to bear the burden anyway). There are fundamental problems how Canonical distributes security fixes (many locked behind Ubuntu Pro which is free for personal use but still requires signing up for it) and these problems are inherited by Ubuntu remixes like Mint and popOS.
Truscape@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 0 pts · 103d
You're probably not the gaming type, I presume.
dgdft@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 103d
I’ve been gaming on Debian stable for 6-7 years now; works great.
popcar2@programming.dev · 2 pts · 103d
If you're playing modern games that just released, they often need the newest graphics drivers to run well and look right. It also helps to have the most modern version of apps like Heroic Games Launcher and stuff, but Flatpak has solved that somewhat.
If anyone here games a lot, I'd recommend a more rolling release distro (or the version of Debian that updates packages quickly, forgot its name).
dgdft@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 103d
I’ve never had that be an issue in practice. The NV DC drivers cover this need quite well IME: https://wiki.debian.org/NvidiaGraphicsDrivers
It’s also the best route I’ve found for setting up CUDA, so two birds, one stone.
username_1@programming.dev · 6 pts · 103d
radar@programming.dev · 4 pts · 103d
I game on Debian unstable daily. I don't have the newest hardware but most things work about as well as Windows
Skullgrid@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 103d
debian gamer here. Things suck because I have a non-muxing, bullshit on board graphics card not because of Debian. I have the same issues on Bazzite, Pika Os and Nobara
Muffi@programming.dev · 43 pts · 103d
The enshittification of Ubuntu and Firefox these last years have been tragic to watch, even though i no longer use any of them.
woelkchen@lemmy.world · 22 pts · 103d
At least Firefox recently got a 1-click "AI off" button. I'd prefer if Mozilla concentrated on the rendering engine first and foremost but that 1-click solution isn't so bad. So at least there's that.
atomicbocks@sh.itjust.works · 14 pts · 103d
I’ll stop looking for alternatives when it becomes a one click AI on button instead.
woelkchen@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 103d
Problem is that well maintained alternatives without that shit don't exist. Sure, there are Chromium and Firefox forks that strip all that shit but are you really willing to trust you data security with a fork created by two dudes in their free time to deliver updates the same day as their upstream projects? I'm not. So I rather use Firefox, turn that shit off manually and continue to hope that Servo will be good enough in two years (doubtful).
atomicbocks@sh.itjust.works · 5 pts · 103d
Yup, that’s why I’m still looking.
woelkchen@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 103d
I think the best current candidate is WebKit-GTK but here's the looking bit again: I'm looking for a WebKit-GTK browser that adopts traditional cross-desktop UX and not GNOME header bars.
BrilliantBadger@piefed.ca · 21 pts · 103d
Librewolf has done a great job and has a strong stance on disabling/removing AI pieces
But yeah, it's just sad to always be fighting against the tide
Aetherial@nord.pub · 5 pts · 102d
Kudos to its little brother, Ironfox.
Keshara@piefed.blahaj.zone · 28 pts · 103d
This is going to be all about how they implement it imo. There was a specific line in that article "for those who want it", if they go for an opt-in approach which only then installs the AI capabilities, then yeah okay I don't mind as an end-user.
If however Canonical implement AI into Ubuntu without being opt-in, then I'm out and never turning back.
possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 100d
Based on what they did with snap I wouldn't hold your breath
MehBlah@lemmy.world · 24 pts · 103d
Okay Okay, I'll find a new go to distro.
quick_snail@feddit.nl · 17 pts · 102d
Does anyone use Ubuntu anynore?
They've been the evil distro since, what, a decade?
misk@piefed.social · 5 pts · 102d
They put out LTS releases which are nice for a home server where you need relatively recent packages and a couple of years of support so that you don’t have to babysit it too much. On a server it’s much closer to Debian experience as you don’t have to deal with snap, flatpak and all that weirdness.
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 102d
can't pull Ubuntu away from all the plebs who think it's the best OS in the world.
meh, at least it's not Microsoft. not much better, but still slightly better.
possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 100d
You'd be surprised
panda_abyss@lemmy.ca · 11 pts · 103d
All I really want related to AI in my OS is:
Skullgrid@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 103d
https://lemmy.world/post/46121131?scrollToComments=true
https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/the-future-of-ai-in-ubuntu/81130
Context from the horse's mouth. The goals seem fine. They might botch the execution as ubuntu has before, but the stated goals seem sensible.
onlinepersona@programming.dev · 10 pts · 103d
Didn't hey start putting ads into their start menu, search results, or something? This is not really a surprise given that trajectory.
misk@piefed.social · 12 pts · 103d
The only ads I notice is that apt shows how many packages can be updated through an optional paid Expanded Security Maintenance. This isn’t very obtrusive but I’m on a 4 year old LTS release currently so things might have changed.
Eyekaytee@aussie.zone · 4 pts · 103d
He's remembering things from Ubuntu 12.10, yeah 14 years ago :)
onlinepersona@programming.dev · 4 pts · 103d
Oh wow, you're right! That's when I quit Ubuntu. I feel fucking old now...
misk@piefed.social · 2 pts · 103d
I used Ubuntu back then too but I’m a Gnome person so I missed out on this innovation from Canonical.
onlinepersona@programming.dev · 4 pts · 103d
I was remembering my Ubuntu Unity days which apparently ended in 2012 or so. Didn't realise it was so long ago.
Ubuntu might've had ads in the OS even before Microslop. Who knows, maybe they even gave them the idea.
woelkchen@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 103d
Receiving updates for anything in Universe requires Ubuntu Pro which is free for home users but still requires signing up to give you access to that update repository and once you sign up, they can match your account with what you install/update, so there is server-side tracking. In theory there is the possibility of community-maintained updates there but that required adhering to Canonical's draconian version freeze rules. Something Fedora and its derivates do not have to that degree (during a release cycle any update is fine if it doesn't break compatibility).
xep@discuss.online · 9 pts · 102d
Why not use Debian?
rbos@lemmy.ca · 9 pts · 103d
See also the dick-inna-mousetrap thread. https://retro.social/@ifixcoinops/112847682153491798
aichan@piefed.blahaj.zone · 3 pts · 102d
Wow I did not expect that much dedication put into that thread
rbos@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 102d
it's pretty legendary
e461h@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 102d
That would make some good reality tv
heliotrope@retrofed.com · 5 pts · 103d
(laughs in void)
ComicalMayhem@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 102d
How will this affect Mint OS?
doc_rootbeer@fedia.io · 2 pts · 101d
Maybe more people will just run the Debian Edition