How do you all cope with the rejection that you go through in the workplace? I've largely only ever been socially successful among groups where I share an interest, and even then, I still struggle socially quite a bit and tend to be somewhat disliked in any sort of group setting. Among the general public (so classes, and now work for many years) I've never really been able to make friends, and people range from being neutral to me but not liking me, to disliking me, to hating me in a way that feels like it should really only be reserved for people who actually brought you significant harm, to trying to be 'friendly' and then making fun of me when I'm still in earshot, and such. But I still have to work, which means that I have to just go to work and deal with hearing my coworkers talk about me negatively when I'm within earshot, noticing the difference in the demeanor when they interact with anyone else versus interact with me, notice when they actively try to do things to make my job harder (thankfully this is somewhat rare but it happens unfortunately).
If I try to bring it up to anyone who's allistic then they don't even believe me and will only take the most overt examples of extreme bullying as a sign that my coworkers don't like / dislike me, but it's hard when I have to deal with what can possibly be over a hundred micro-rejections just in a given day, and then I just have to wake up and do the same thing tomorrow, and every job's been like this so even if I felt like I deserved better and went somewhere else, then I'd just get treated the same way anyways (and this has been true for all of my work experiences and was the case in all of my grade-collegiate schooling as well, so I think that it's just something I'm always going to have to deal with). So how do you all deal with it? I can't just simply ignore it forever, since it still affects me even if I pretend that it doesn't. Rejection still hurts even if it's from people who I don't even really like anyways, and no matter how I act, whether I try to act friendly or whether I just try to keep my distance, it doesn't seem to change things. I don't think that there's any way to not be rejected, so what can I do to ease the pain from it?
21 Comments
nightmare786@leminal.space · 11 pts · 2d
if someone's trying to actively make your job harder, bring that up with a supervisor or HR. make sure you document the evidence over time.
personally i expect rejection and have learned to just chill in my own bubble. i don't even try to be likeable anymore. never worked before, and it's fake anyway.
jellohound420@piefed.social · 5 pts · 2d
It's rare enough thankfully that the incidence is isolated and hasn't become a consistent enough pattern of behavior to the point where I've had to do that. It was a little worse when I was younger in different jobs but at least I'm not there anymore.
I expect rejection at this point too from many people, but I still try to be cordial. It's fake but the whole person you have to be at work is fake anyways. But even though these are people who I know I wouldn't get along with outside of work, to have to just be there, day in and day out and have to just exist in this space where I know several people who I work in a direct capacity with for eight hours can't stand me is just so draining emotionally since I know that if I go elsewhere, it'll be the same since this has been my experience with the general public for my entire life.
_deleted_@aussie.zone · 8 pts · 2d
What worked for me was having a nervous breakdown and being fired. No more workplace, don’t have to deal with those people any more.
jellohound420@piefed.social · 4 pts · 2d
I'm sorry. I worry that this could happen to me eventually. I hope you were able to find something with a different dynamic.
TerdFerguson@lemmy.ca · 6 pts · 1d
Hey, story of my life and why I've left so many workplaces.
So, what does help? Self-esteem, which is really hard to tackle if you're in a low or negative self-esteem space. If you have a decent self-esteem you can start making more active decisions on how to value the opinions others have about you, which you should apply very selectively. It's actually harder to maintain an "I don't care what anyone thinks" attitude, and causes more harm, than it is to make the individual determination for each person at your work. Steve and Jeff and Greg each deserve their own individual value assessment.
The other thing is framing the issue. People largely do not like you because you have a social connection disability that affects how you present yourself to the group. In a lot of ways, I kind of liken the neurotypical judgements to a physical disability analogue to help me see it better. For example, someone has to slowly follow a cane-user up the stairs and is irritated that they can't go as fast as they would like but they're also unwilling to let the disabled person take the elevator instead because of a misperception on what would be fair for everyone. That's ridiculous... and so you can regard the situation appropriately and understand you have no responsibility to correct their perceptions. Let them be.
Long story short? It really is about skilling up in how to not care about what doesn't matter. You are already on the right track that this is needed, but just need to figure out how to get to the next level. Maybe its easier to decide what you DO care about and leave everything else as whatever... There's different roads to success here.
You'll be okay. https://www.amazon.ca/Courage-Be-Disliked-Phenomenon-Happiness/dp/1668069539 - Maybe try this too if you need to expand your thinking on this. There are other books that support these ideas as well, but this one is quite accessible to most readers, even if it is kind of silly at times.
jellohound420@piefed.social · 2 pts · 1d
I know that at least some of the people who dislike me, completely independent of their dislike of me, are people who I wouldn't like anyways because of some of their personal beliefs that they've also brought up at work. I know logically that I am not compatible with them and should not care what they think. But my lizard brain still makes the social ouchie when I hear them talking badly about me when I'm in earshot...and I'm aware that the reason I'm so disliked is largely because of my autistic communication style and that's part of why autism is a disability in the first place. I know my self-esteem isn't great but I don't really know what I can realistically do for better self-esteem that doesn't just feel fake.
I've tried to read that book, and I forget what, but some section or another of it bothered me and I never ended up finishing it. I think the ideas behind it were good though.
TerdFerguson@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 1d
Yeah, so I would say you are actively moving forward through figuring out what you need to manage this for yourself. Self-esteem is fundamental to being effective in driving this, so if that's a weak area for you then you can prioritize your efforts there.
Self-esteem has two key parts: boundaries and values. Maybe there is more to it than that, but I overhauled my own deeply entrenched negative self-esteem and found it was fundamentally these two things. You have to say 'no' to things and establish what you won't put up with for yourself... which is not necessarily easy to figure out but its the first one. And then you need to decide who you are and live according to those values. You have to act in line with your own specific values.. if you are kind, show kindness for its own sake because that's who you are... or be honest because thats who you are, even in the face of rejection, to choose yourself.
By doing so, you can build self-esteem despite social rejection. You might even find that you can occasionally enjoy that rejection as an affirming sign that you are doing right by your own self.
None of this is easy to learn or maintain. It is possible though, I started in as bad a place as anyone. I think you're gonna figure this out, have hope.
Tom@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 2d
I'm sorry. I've been where you're at and I don't have any reasonable long-term solutions for you.
I've been toying with the idea of setting up an autist-run and autist-led company or companies for quite a while now so people can just work together with as little friction as possible and live enjoyable lives, or at least feel comfortable in their jobs, but I really don't have the heart for entrepreneurship anymore so I'm hoping you or someone else here does and steals this idea and finds a way to make it work, for all of us. I can't do it alone anymore but I'd be happy to help any autist willing to try.
jellohound420@piefed.social · 5 pts · 2d
That sounds like a lovely idea. I feel so worn down by the concept of work that I don't know that I'd be able to identify skills that I'd have if a company like that popped up. But it still sounds like a great idea. I definitely don't have the entrepreneurial spirit though so couldn't be me either.
Strider@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 22h
The issue is, if you know one autist, you just know one Autist.
I think by routine we're also harsh and intolerant to each other - I noticed that in myself as an example, but maybe that's also 'just' masking.
What I am trying to get at is I think it's highly individual so I wouldn't know how this could work, but tolerance of course goes a long way and I've seen reports of companies doing this.
But eg for me with sudden overload it's impossible in the workday to just say 'nah that's it for me' ehen it happens. So I guess I just have to bear it.
Madzielle@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 2 pts · 2d
jellohound420@piefed.social · 1 pts · 2d
I've only talked briefly about a few of the people who particularly dislike me with one other person who was a regular witness to their behavior, who more or less confirmed that they can't stand me. I know that it's not that everyone actively dislikes me, but there are enough people who do in my immediate workplace that I have to interact with on a daily basis that just makes it a drain to be there.
I probably should have been more clear that when people don't seem to think that I'm disliked at work unless I bring up issues of overt bullying or verbal abuse said directly to my face, is when I try to verbally discuss the issue with allistic people, who I do not work with, when they ask me about work and the conversation extends beyond just a basic one-line response. And I don't think it's that everyone at work hates me, and I'm not even sure that I would want friend-friends from my workplace. As I said in the OP, it's kind of a mix or a range between neutrality to utter disdain and unfortunately there's a decent cluster of people who have enough disdain and also social cliquishness to go along with that. If everyone was in the neutral to some dislike but still cordial zone, then I think I would actually kind of like my job. It's that enough people do actively dislike me to the point where it's very draining and hard to not have the misery carry over and have to be something that constantly weighs me down. I think that the solution is figuring out how to deal with the burden of the pain that the rejection and exclusion causes, even though I logically understand that I wouldn't even really want to be close with many of the people doing this anyways. The rejection won't go away, but if I can manage the pain, then I'll be able to more solidly engage with the logic that I'm incompatible with nearly everyone who holds me in active disdain anyways. But as it is, there's just so much rejection that it's just hard.
aoidenpa@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 2d
I relate a lot. I'm having hard time defending myself. I can't get angry. It is a performance and I suck at acting. Trauma of autism.
Arcanepotato@crazypeople.online · 2 pts · 2d
I was going to try and give advice but then I realized I haven't been in a situation where everyone was an ass so I'm not sure how helpful I can be. Some parts of my job make me unpopular but I don't normally think it's about me, just people lashing out and I happen to be there.
I can hurt if it's clear people don't like me but I tell myself that not everyone is going to like everyone and that the are judging the perception of me that they have, which is something I have no control over so it's not worth worrying about. That is not helpful if it interferes with your work.
I've had okay success hashing things out with people but the person was my peer and we needed to be able to work together and maybe more importantly not give the appearance of conflict between us because it would impact how our teams worked together. I knew why they didn't like me and I knew it was a miscommunication/mismatch in approaches so I asked for some time, brought a tea and was like "Yo, we are hitting a road bump and I want to figure this out because I respect you and I don't want to fight." It probably helps that I was direct but also emphased that we were peers because the root of the conflict was they thought I was being a know it all engineer trying to make them look stupid but I was asking questions because I wanted to understand, not because I wanted to embarrass them.
Do you think any of the problems you are having are due to "cultural differences" between autistic and allistic communication? If so, it may be worth being direct. You don't need to mention autism. For me it was like, I know you think I am undermining you but I am dealing just looking for information. Is there a way I can do that so that you don't feel attacked? They might be reacting to something you aren't actually doing but they think you are. It doesn't make their behaviour okay, but maybe it's a misunderstanding.
As another example I learned in a round about way that when I declined a lunch invitation the person thought I was insulting them. I'm vegan and gluten free and autistic, I'm not eating lunch at a restaurant lol. So now I know to suggest going for a beverage instead! I did say why I declined (food allergies) but they thought it was an "excuse" i.e. a slightly more polite way of insulting them. I don't understand them lol.
The talking about you within ear shot is fucked. One possible thing they could be doing is this social ritual where people "gently tease" each other to make the target feel like they are included in the group and there is also a certain level of intimacy. This sounds absurd to me, but my husband values that ritual with his male friends. Because I am pretty masculine some of the guys are work tired it with me (also ambushing me with nerf guns) and I had to ask them not to 😬 I told them I appreciated them wanting to include me but that I wasn't okay with it and they stopped because they were not seeking to hurt me. If you are able to manage it, and you think there is any chance it's not intended as cruel, it might be good to tell them that you find it distracting or something and ask them to stop. I would suggest practicing what you are going to say ahead of time so you can be clear and direct and not get frazzled.
Good luck. You deserve better than this.
jellohound420@piefed.social · 1 pts · 1d
I wouldn't say that everyone's an ass (though a few of the people who seem to strongly dislike me are, but those are for reasons that aren't even necessarily related to their treatment of me but I wonder if it might be part of why they dislike me) and not liking me can run from being more neutral towards me to utterly loathing me. It's not that everyone loathes me, but there are enough people who do who I have to spend a decent amount of time around.
I'm pretty sure that it is at least partially because of differences in communication styles between autistic and allistic people if not a large part of it. I don't know. I don't think I can make the people who particularly dislike me not dislike me, but I just wish they would at least wait until I'm firmly out of earshot. But I don't know of a way to say that, and I'm worried that it could backfire and then they'd do it more. It's definitely not friendly banter, though, otherwise I'd be included on it. I think I just have to figure out how to make it affect me less, or how to deal with how it affects me, really.
Arcanepotato@crazypeople.online · 2 pts · 1d
That's a reasonable concern. I'm sorry I can't give you better advice. I hope you can figure it out.
TerdFerguson@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 1d
"Hey. You fucking losers are talking about me again, huh?"
I mean, if you want to.. if that doesn't put you at any risk. It's an option. I only suggest it because it sounds like you have nothing to lose and might as well just assert yourself. You don't have to call them losers, but their behavior is objectively pathetic so it is appropriate to me as an option to treat them as they treat you.
caesaravgvstvs@feddit.org · 2 pts · 21h
Your coworkers are socially inept assholes.
It's not so hard to treat people at work with respect. They clearly haven't earned yours.
I have had to deal with plenty of difficult and or diverse people at work and, if it's necessary, I make an effort to find common ground to make our relationship easier.
But this social aspect should not be this big an issue, we shouldn't do our jobs better or worse because it involves any specific coworker.
You also don't need to be friends with people at work. You've already come to this realization, now it's time to figure out how to emotionally manage this.
Also (and you've seem to have realized this too), their micro rejections are more of a reflection of them than of you. They're not able to manage their emotions.
I face a good amount of rejection in my life and I've developed a number of coping mechanisms that ultimately sum up to "it's their loss, not mine". Just focus on being competent and do the best job you can. Don't point out anyone's mistakes or shortcomings, they'll do they to themselves eventually.
How_do_I_computah@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
I'm sorry you've gotta deal with this. It sucks. I feel like with a lot of technical jobs the hardest part really is the social aspect of it.
A thing that helps me is to consider it part of my job duties, because like you said this will likely happen wherever you go. This shifts these negative interactions from something that just happens to you that you're powerless to stop to an obstacle that you deal with.
Instead of "I solved big problem that most people don't understand. Nobody cares. People still antagonize me."
It becomes "I solved big problem even in less than ideal conditions. I'm proud of myself for overcoming the technical and environmental challenges here. If I can thrive here then I can thrive elsewhere too."
jellohound420@piefed.social · 2 pts · 2d
I do my best to try and think of being rejected / disliked as part of the work experience as an autistic person. But it's hard to think that way long-term because it doesn't improve with time. I know that there's not much I can do about it, but I just wish there was a better way to cope with the large amount of negative energy that I absorb on a daily basis.
reversedposterior@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 1d
Honestly, therapy is the thing that helped me put things into perspective. Of course it never goes away that you are always treated as an 'outsider' to some extent but as you say that's life as an autistic person to some degree. You just need help on how to reframe things so they genuinely don't matter as much to you. Depending on where you are and what accommodations you can get, it's also worth asking for stuff like home working if possible.
jellohound420@piefed.social · 1 pts · 1d
Unfortunately, my experiences with therapy have been middling to bad. I've been contemplating giving it another shot at some point, though. Maybe if I try someone who specializes in a different modality, it'll be different this time. Work from home is not possible for my job unfortunately. I have thought about looking for a WFH job but this job is fairly stable....but maybe that's also something I should maybe consider in the longer run.