An eyewitness said the suspect, who was arrested and later released by the police, yelled "I'd do it again".
I support the older guy implying he's the shooter to mislead the police, and I'm glad he got released. That is honestly very brave behavior assuming the witness's report is accurate.
It doesn't have to stick to serve it's purpose. It'll put him in jail for at least a couple of days and that can be a huge inconvenience for anyone that can lead to lose of their job or income. I hope it doesn't stick but I can't say I have too much faith in the 'justice' system working as it should in a highly political charged case a deep red area.
Lots of evidence in courts is based on witness testimony. Witness reports can be unreliable (especially when filtered through cops and lawyers) but It absolutely tracks that cops would arrest someone after a deadly shooting for yelling something like that. The older dude they arrested and released, they ended up later arresting for obstruction of justice, which seems like something cops would charge someone with for wasting their time.
Unless you have something that contradicts the witness, there is no reason to doubt it.
There's some pretty extreme patriotic veterans in Utah County that don't agree with MAGA. It's not far fetched to believe it's someone who thought Charlie Kirk is too far right.
They might not agree with maga completely, but they're still pretty conservative, just in a somehow weirder way. Mormon conservatives value a lot of the same things that Evangelicals and Baptists do, hating the fags, killing the muslims, keeping women in the kitchen and making babies, and keeping our borders "safe". If Kirk didn't go hard enough on of those issues, well, they might not like that too much. Could be wrong, but for now, still probably a conservative.
Honestly it can go either way. There's a whole variety of conservatives in the area. I agree, I'm willing to take bets that it was a conservative that shot him.
Crazy conspiracy theory, but it would be smart actually: get rid of someone who could really damage him and his movement. Sow fear among his other sycophants. And create a martyr and justification for more violent oppression of protests.
Not to be a mood killer, but he was a person. Dehumanizing people doesn't serve any good, it just normalizes it, and that's a giant fucking problem at a time right now where the last thing we need is for it to be normalized.
I can't condemn all violence as some is actually necessary in this imperfect world.
I do dislike political violence, however I am not sure, when we're got a fascist takeover and there are two economies and two classes emerging, maybe it's not 100% "political violence" anymore. Having your kids not be sick and starving isn't really political to me. Dying because of lack of healthcare, even with insurance, sinking into debt because of it, that's not really political. You can not follow politics and still have your house repossessed or your son dead because he didn't have insulin, sure.
In the information age of warfare, it can be so hard to miss the fact that you're at war...
I have mixed thoughts about this. On one hand, good riddance, he's done a lot of harm to our country and helped a fascist into power. On the other hand, his death will further divide the country, which is also wholistically bad. It spreads further hate and turns people against each other even more.
Overall, im not upset that it happened, just worried about what it will bring
I'd hope not but I'm constantly disappointed in people, and he has a pretty big following as far as I can tell. I worry that he becomes a political martyr and this inspires more political assassinations on both sides.
I don't know, man. I don't think there's any healing the divide that already exists. It's not like Fox and the other propaganda machines are churning out messages of unity or anything. If you're worried about a slippery slope, I hate to tell you that we've been on it for a long time, now. Obviously, the future isn't set in stone, but I think it'd take one hell of an external threat to get us all to band together at this point. Maybe those UFOs we were all concerned about last year could do it?
Their acolytes have been doing everything in their power to split themselves off from the rest of the country, and this sort of call to try to come together with them is basically a call to throw ourselves into their country-sized log splitter. They're splitting and hating and killing regardless of what their targets do to appease or not aside from full on conversion into their cult, and they've designed their cult such that it's impossible for vast swaths of people to join with long term safety just based on their physical traits.
It is going to justify the expansion of fascist power, to crack down on the dangerous, violent leftists and their evil ideology. This assassination is exactly the kind of thing the right wants, to further their agenda. They want a war.
I thought about making out team name a joke, but I didn't wanna get kicked out or something, but then when other teams did I was bummed. I okay trivia at a gamer bar. Trivia is really fun, even when you lose, try to get some folks together and see how it goes!
Killing another solder in war in not the same thing as killing a fellow civilian no matter how disgusting they are.
this kind of killings will make situation worse for the US not to mention that more people would pay attention to his teaching out of sympathy and you'll get more conservatives
Kirk represents the politics of almost half the USA. He wasn't even radical. This group cleanly won a democratic election and will, especially after today, probably sweep 2026.
If you think you're justified killing a democratic majority/plurality, you should entertain the idea that you're actually not the good anti-fascists you think you are.
Denouncing empathy and celebrating the deaths of progressives made him radical. Don't let yourself believe the extreme right who pretend to represent everybody who fell for the propaganda and voted right. Most of them were sold on nebulous promised of "making things better" and fear of others.
57 Comments
AndiHutch@lemmy.zip · 101 pts · 333d
An eyewitness said the suspect, who was arrested and later released by the police, yelled "I'd do it again".
I support the older guy implying he's the shooter to mislead the police, and I'm glad he got released. That is honestly very brave behavior assuming the witness's report is accurate.
LodeMike@lemmy.today · 26 pts · 333d
The first person detained got charged with obstruction of justice. Don't really understand how they expect it to stick.
AndiHutch@lemmy.zip · 32 pts · 333d
It doesn't have to stick to serve it's purpose. It'll put him in jail for at least a couple of days and that can be a huge inconvenience for anyone that can lead to lose of their job or income. I hope it doesn't stick but I can't say I have too much faith in the 'justice' system working as it should in a highly political charged case a deep red area.
ayyy@sh.itjust.works · 20 pts · 333d
Witness reports are never accurate lol.
AndiHutch@lemmy.zip · 12 pts · 333d
'Never accurate' is way too strong in my opinion.
Lots of evidence in courts is based on witness testimony. Witness reports can be unreliable (especially when filtered through cops and lawyers) but It absolutely tracks that cops would arrest someone after a deadly shooting for yelling something like that. The older dude they arrested and released, they ended up later arresting for obstruction of justice, which seems like something cops would charge someone with for wasting their time.
Unless you have something that contradicts the witness, there is no reason to doubt it.
FerretyFever0@fedia.io · 95 pts · 333d
The guy probably shot him because he thought that Kirk wasn't conservative enough. It was in a red county in Utah, let's be realistic lol
Xella@lemmy.world · 50 pts · 333d
There's some pretty extreme patriotic veterans in Utah County that don't agree with MAGA. It's not far fetched to believe it's someone who thought Charlie Kirk is too far right.
FerretyFever0@fedia.io · 21 pts · 333d
They might not agree with maga completely, but they're still pretty conservative, just in a somehow weirder way. Mormon conservatives value a lot of the same things that Evangelicals and Baptists do, hating the fags, killing the muslims, keeping women in the kitchen and making babies, and keeping our borders "safe". If Kirk didn't go hard enough on of those issues, well, they might not like that too much. Could be wrong, but for now, still probably a conservative.
Xella@lemmy.world · 14 pts · 333d
Honestly it can go either way. There's a whole variety of conservatives in the area. I agree, I'm willing to take bets that it was a conservative that shot him.
expatriado@lemmy.world · 20 pts · 333d
didn't he have a disagreement with trump last week? hard to search now because all results are about the shooting
saimen@feddit.org · 2 pts · 332d
Crazy conspiracy theory, but it would be smart actually: get rid of someone who could really damage him and his movement. Sow fear among his other sycophants. And create a martyr and justification for more violent oppression of protests.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 332d
yeah utah valley is a pit. it is on my "AVOID AT ALL COSTS EXCEPT WHEN THERES A SHEEP FESTIVAL" list.
FerretyFever0@fedia.io · 3 pts · 332d
I'd even avoid the sheep festival, might be polygamist compound residents there lol
creamlike504@jlai.lu · 33 pts · 333d
It only counts if they're unpopular, ugly, and wearing an armband identifying themselves as Nazis.
/s
Stovetop@lemmy.world · 40 pts · 333d
Karjalan@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 333d
And even then... They'd still make excuses
tio_bira@lemmy.world · 30 pts · 333d
I against all violence to people.
...Also i don't consider facists people
Olgratin_Magmatoe@slrpnk.net · 30 pts · 333d
Not to be a mood killer, but he was a person. Dehumanizing people doesn't serve any good, it just normalizes it, and that's a giant fucking problem at a time right now where the last thing we need is for it to be normalized.
With that said;
Rest in piss you fascist fuck
I hope the perp walks free
msage@programming.dev · 17 pts · 332d
Tolerance of intolerance leads to fall of tolerant society.
And he was one of the horsemen of that fall.
BanMe@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 333d
I can't condemn all violence as some is actually necessary in this imperfect world.
I do dislike political violence, however I am not sure, when we're got a fascist takeover and there are two economies and two classes emerging, maybe it's not 100% "political violence" anymore. Having your kids not be sick and starving isn't really political to me. Dying because of lack of healthcare, even with insurance, sinking into debt because of it, that's not really political. You can not follow politics and still have your house repossessed or your son dead because he didn't have insulin, sure.
In the information age of warfare, it can be so hard to miss the fact that you're at war...
I_Has_A_Hat@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 332d
cheloxin@lemmy.ml · 3 pts · 332d
Political violence and politician violence aren't equal bruh
captainlezbian@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 333d
Lyudmila Pavlichenko agrees
belastend@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 3 pts · 332d
Fascists are people. People that need to be fought, but they are people. Dehumanization is the first step to wanton slaughter.
FilthyShrooms@lemmy.world · 14 pts · 333d
I have mixed thoughts about this. On one hand, good riddance, he's done a lot of harm to our country and helped a fascist into power. On the other hand, his death will further divide the country, which is also wholistically bad. It spreads further hate and turns people against each other even more.
Overall, im not upset that it happened, just worried about what it will bring
Cethin@lemmy.zip · 15 pts · 333d
Will it further divide us? Charlie Kirk? Maybe if it was Trump, but do you really think people care enough about this little fucker?
FilthyShrooms@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 333d
I'd hope not but I'm constantly disappointed in people, and he has a pretty big following as far as I can tell. I worry that he becomes a political martyr and this inspires more political assassinations on both sides.
Cethin@lemmy.zip · 11 pts · 333d
He was inspiring political assassinations while he was alive. At least him being dead makes it only one last time.
belastend@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 332d
If you look at the reactions, yes, people care about it that much.
This is only good for the accelerationists.
Cethin@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 332d
Comments online are not the same as real actions, or all politicians would be dead.
belastend@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 332d
They are still a meter for public sentiment.
elbucho@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 333d
I don't know, man. I don't think there's any healing the divide that already exists. It's not like Fox and the other propaganda machines are churning out messages of unity or anything. If you're worried about a slippery slope, I hate to tell you that we've been on it for a long time, now. Obviously, the future isn't set in stone, but I think it'd take one hell of an external threat to get us all to band together at this point. Maybe those UFOs we were all concerned about last year could do it?
traceur301@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 5 pts · 332d
Their acolytes have been doing everything in their power to split themselves off from the rest of the country, and this sort of call to try to come together with them is basically a call to throw ourselves into their country-sized log splitter. They're splitting and hating and killing regardless of what their targets do to appease or not aside from full on conversion into their cult, and they've designed their cult such that it's impossible for vast swaths of people to join with long term safety just based on their physical traits.
SolarMyth@aussie.zone · 4 pts · 333d
It is going to justify the expansion of fascist power, to crack down on the dangerous, violent leftists and their evil ideology. This assassination is exactly the kind of thing the right wants, to further their agenda. They want a war.
SereneSadie@lemmy.myserv.one · 10 pts · 333d
They don't need justification. They have already been steamrolling over any opposition in the legal sense.
This is one less leader to rally around. That's all.
JackbyDev@programming.dev · 12 pts · 332d
Tonight for trivia, among the 25ish teams there were
The last mat have just been a star wars joke but the timing was interesting.
lennybird@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 332d
That sounds like a hella fun trivia group. I need to find a group like that.
JackbyDev@programming.dev · 1 pts · 332d
I thought about making out team name a joke, but I didn't wanna get kicked out or something, but then when other teams did I was bummed. I okay trivia at a gamer bar. Trivia is really fun, even when you lose, try to get some folks together and see how it goes!
ShaggySnacks@lemmy.myserv.one · 8 pts · 333d
Typically liberal, centrist response.
ThunderWhiskers@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 333d
👏👏👏
WanderWisley@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 333d
Charlie Kirk got shot. Is a fire name for a rap song.
sun_is_ra@sh.itjust.works · -32 pts · 333d
Killing another solder in war in not the same thing as killing a fellow civilian no matter how disgusting they are.
this kind of killings will make situation worse for the US not to mention that more people would pay attention to his teaching out of sympathy and you'll get more conservatives
Photuris@lemmy.ml · 34 pts · 333d
OsrsNeedsF2P@lemmy.ml · 3 pts · 332d
Have you ever considered this might be better for the world
Cruel@programming.dev · -47 pts · 332d
Kirk represents the politics of almost half the USA. He wasn't even radical. This group cleanly won a democratic election and will, especially after today, probably sweep 2026.
If you think you're justified killing a democratic majority/plurality, you should entertain the idea that you're actually not the good anti-fascists you think you are.
WizardofFrobozz@lemmy.ca · 24 pts · 332d
Counterpoint: it was a REALLY good day and you’re carrying water for nazis
Cruel@programming.dev · -25 pts · 332d
You're deranged. From no perspective was it a good day, except for actual Nazis who want people radicalized.
WizardofFrobozz@lemmy.ca · 14 pts · 332d
Only one thing has ever stopped fascists.
Guttural@jlai.lu · 4 pts · 332d
Bullets?
WizardofFrobozz@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 332d
If there is another proven way I’d love to hear it.
Duke_Nukem_1990@feddit.org · 18 pts · 332d
you should use past tense, that asshole is cold now
killing fascists is anti-fascist action. How is that hard to understand?
Cruel@programming.dev · -26 pts · 332d
Fascism rejects democracy. Like you, apparently.
Absolutely no self-awareness.
Duke_Nukem_1990@feddit.org · 15 pts · 332d
You should educate yourself about the paradox of tolerance before talking about self-awareness.
Natanael@infosec.pub · 18 pts · 332d
Denouncing empathy and celebrating the deaths of progressives made him radical. Don't let yourself believe the extreme right who pretend to represent everybody who fell for the propaganda and voted right. Most of them were sold on nebulous promised of "making things better" and fear of others.
Cruel@programming.dev · -23 pts · 332d
Which progressive's deaths did he celebrate?
Natanael@infosec.pub · 18 pts · 332d
He was part of the crowd mocking this
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/13/nyregion/ryan-carson-murder.html
TheEighthDoctor@lemmy.zip · 11 pts · 332d
That's a weird way of saying 32%
andros_rex@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 332d
"If I see a Black pilot, I'm gonna be like 'boy, I hope he is qualified.”
He was a fucking Nazi.
Guttural@jlai.lu · 5 pts · 332d
Charlie Kirk, who told his audience to post bail for Paul Pelosi's attacker, is not a radical? Sure, troll.
Deathray5@lemmynsfw.com · 1 pts · 331d
So did fucking Hitler and the Nazis???