Ubuntu has taken another step that, honestly, leaves me scratching my head. While most distributions try to offer as many convenient GUI tools as possible to help users manage every part of their system, Ubuntu… apparently sees things a bit differently.
I say this because Ubuntu 26.04 LTS (scheduled for release on April, 23) will no longer ship the long-standing “Software & Updates” graphical tool by default on fresh desktop installs, following a change proposed in Launchpad as bug 2140527.
The adjustment replaces the software-properties-gtk package in the desktop seed with software-properties-common, effectively removing the visible GUI while keeping the underlying repository management tools in place.
Is Ubuntu Treating Its Users as If They Can’t Be Trusted?
https://linuxiac.com/is-ubuntu-treating-its-users-as-if-they-cant-be-trusted/
45 Comments
kadu@scribe.disroot.org · 41 pts · 204d
After experiencing Canonical's recruitment process, which they claim to be extremely proud of, I can only imagine that if the other departments operate with a similar mindset the entire company is a non-sensical hell.
WiseFirefighter7299@sh.itjust.works · 26 pts · 204d
this is why you should Debian
grue@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 204d
I usually use [K]ubuntu because I always try to install Debian first, but it ships with kernels so outdated that it rarely "just works" on the not-particularly-weird hardware I throw at it. That's understandable when it's missing drivers for my AMD 9070 XT GPU on launch day, but not so much when it's missing drivers for the Intel AX101 wifi chipset that got released 3.5 years before. (I've also experienced weird installation failures with Debian related to the partitioning and/or bootloader, but I don't remember the details of those right now. Point is, Ubuntu is -- unfortunately -- more reliable to install without tweaking or troubleshooting, in my experience.)
poinck@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 204d
grue@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 204d
I'm too lazy and set in my ways to switch away from
apt.(I also used Gentoo, many years ago when I could actually be bothered.)
chronicledmonocle@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 203d
I am an apt boi as well, but I recently switched to Fedora KDE spin. God has it been a breath of fresh air to have decently updated packages WITH stability on my desktop and laptop.
I'm still Debian all the way for server and "LTS" computers, like my HTPC, but Fedora is killing it overall.
grue@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 202d
I mean, Kubuntu has "decently updated packages WITH stability," too. It just has Snap that annoys me, but that probably annoys me less than
command 'apt' not foundwould.chronicledmonocle@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 202d
Snap and the stink of Canonical are the reason anything Ubuntu is not an option for me
caseyweederman@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 203d
Hmm.
When is the last time you tried Debian, and what version was it?
If I'm recommending it to people, I'd like to be able to warn them about potential hurdles.
grue@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 202d
A week or so ago, with whatever version was current as of a week or so ago. I was about to install Linux on my kids' mini PCs, fired up the Debian live environment, and noticed that WiFi didn't work. Switched to Kubuntu and the WiFi did work, so proceeded to install with that.
Technically, I suppose it's possible that the actual installed kernel might've worked even though the live environment didn't, but I didn't want to take that chance. Plus, I needed networking in the live environment before install anyway, so I could copy a backup of the factory Win11 install to my other computer, just in case.
caseyweederman@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 202d
Hm. Did you see an option for "non-free firmware"? It should be included as an option since Debian major version 11.
grue@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 202d
It's an Intel wifi chip. It shouldn't need non-free firmware!
caseyweederman@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 202d
You're right about that. I wonder how it can be fixed so that other people don't hit the same issue.
benignintervention@piefed.social · 4 pts · 204d
By sheer coincidence, I just made an install image yesterday and will be switching soon
WiseFirefighter7299@sh.itjust.works · 8 pts · 204d
nice, Debian is more stable and you will have an easy switch, use the graphical install.
Encephalotrocity@feddit.online · 4 pts · 204d
This is what really pisses me off about the Linux community. Everyone says the same thing about every distro, except Arch. That shits apparently for hardcore CLI only programmers or something.
Mint's whole paradigm is an OS that emphasizes stability and usability and you claim Debian is more stable even though it's the cutting edge base of an entire distro tree while Mint is 2 years behind it's Ubuntu base to ensure functionality? Make it make sense.
lagoon8622@sh.itjust.works · 7 pts · 204d
You're a little confused about how this stuff works. Debian is not cutting-edge.
E: btw "not cutting-edge" is neither inherently positive, nor inherently negative
Overspark@piefed.social · 7 pts · 204d
Well Mint is based on Ubuntu (unless you get the Debian Edition) and Ubuntu is based on Debian sooo...
Basically the majority of Linux distros are based on either Debian, Fedora or Arch. IMHO it's usually best to go with one of the originals, not the derivatives. Although I will admit Ubuntu has made Debian a lot better over the years, but that's only because they took the bits from Ubuntu that actually made sense and ignored the rest.
_haha_oh_wow_@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 204d
I was just thinking about swapping from Mint to Debian the other day actually...
orionsbelt@midwest.social · 2 pts · 204d
you can try linux mint debian edition. i love it so far <3
_haha_oh_wow_@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 204d
I might have to check that out, thanks!
CardboardVictim@piefed.social · 6 pts · 204d
What's the recruitment process like?
kadu@scribe.disroot.org · 27 pts · 204d
There's an opening for a position you're interested in, so you fill one of these long "everything is in your CV, but you need to retype on our formulary again" registrations.
A week later, they contact you via email. A very enthusiastic person, signing by their own name and no automated HR shenanigans claims to have enjoyed what they saw and you're through to the next step. There's some corporate "we are an amazing workplace for excepcional people" fluff, but nothing terrible, so let's proceed.
You now have a week to type and send a document that is got nothing to do with the position or your technical skills. You need to type a biography, you need to describe how you were in high school, were you social? You need to show proof of your high school grades, then college, you need to give a biographical memoir of your life. But sure, it's Canonical right, great for your career so you proceed.
So then a technical interview comes up. You have a time limit to fill it out, but the questions won't be actually deep enough to test your skills - they would just veto somebody with zero idea of what's going on, so it becomes tedious. A child with an AI Chatbot can probably score enough.
So then you move on to an IQ test, with baffling things such as tests of reaction time (if I ever needed fast reaction times in my field of study, ring the bell because a zombie apocalypse just ruptured our office building).
You're tired of the bs, but they email you three times in a row telling you about the deadlines for completion. Now somebody wants to speak with you, and guess what, they haven't checked your CV, or your biography, or your results from the tests, so get used to explaining everything again.
You'll have quite a few meetings like this, always moving up to the "higher ups" that are equally unaware of who you are, until you reach a VP. And then they put you on hold... so hope things work out, because they actually can leave you in hold forever, answer that the position is actually no longer available, or finally hire you. They have KPIs that incentivize having "candidates being evaluated" which means keeping you on limbo at the end of the process is a great result on their dashboards. Oh, and don't trust the "oh we loved you, you're in, let's sign next week" because the probability of not signing is still high.
CardboardVictim@piefed.social · 14 pts · 204d
I'm at a loss for words. I don't think I could write better satire that's still believable.
That's just terrible, dang.
rozodru@piefed.world · 10 pts · 204d
wait you have to verify your grades...from high school!?
shit I'd turn it around on them and say "I could verify my grades from high school for you but first I'd like you to verify how you believe every update you release won't some how break a majority of users Ubuntu installs"
kadu@scribe.disroot.org · 10 pts · 204d
Yep. More than once.
eleitl@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 204d
I'm glad I never applied.
lvxferre@mander.xyz · 26 pts · 204d
lengau@midwest.social · 0 pts · 203d
Mir came about because the people behind Wayland were fucking around for years without making progress. Now that Wayland has actually matured, Mir is a Wayland compositor.
Snaps predate (and do a whole lot more than) flatpak.
1 out of 3 isn't great.
lvxferre@mander.xyz · 0 pts · 203d
lengau@midwest.social · 1 pts · 203d
Canonical employees have been part of making Wayland since before Mir existed. Mir came about because Canonical wanted to have something that actually worked within a reasonable amount of time. The result? A bunch of places where groups with lots of resources will contribute to Linux (such as automotive systems) use Mir because it was actually practical to use within a reasonable timeframe. A lot of the recent progress in Wayland has come because the people who were holding it up for years finally gave up and listened to the practical concerns from experts who work at places like Canonical and Nvidia.
And snaps still do things that Flatpaks don't, such as being able to package a kernel and system services. So even if Canonical wanted to switch to flatpak, they couldn't. Not without making changes that are fundamentally contrary to the design of flatpak.
I didn't mention the Unity thing because while I don't agree with your assertions, I do think it's an example of how someone at Canonical's hate for KDE has prevented them from making the same good decision at least 3 times.
If you want to pretend it's Canonical vs. nonprofits, you're going to have an ugly surprise when you find out which corporation hired most of the people who held up Wayland for so long and has its tentacles so deeply in Flatpaks. (HINT: it's not SuSE)
Die4Ever@retrolemmy.com · 14 pts · 204d
Isn't this GUI how you manage your Nvidia drivers? Pretty big hit to accessibility if they take that away
LiveLM@lemmy.zip · 11 pts · 204d
If they want to modernize or simplify the tool, fine.
What really bothers me is removing the current tool before you have a replacement ready. Worst tech trend ever!
WiseFirefighter7299@sh.itjust.works · 7 pts · 204d
OH WHAT THE FUCK CANONICAL IS GOING ALL MICROSLOP-MODE
RickyRigatoni@piefed.social · 4 pts · 204d
Time for someone to make Updatebuntu spin to add it back
CaperGrrl79@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 204d
Does Timeshift work on Ubuntu? It works on Mint, which is based on Ubuntu.
But if this crap keeps up, I might go with LMDE7.
PokerChips@programming.dev · 3 pts · 204d
At this point I'm starting to wonder if Canonical is in the Epstein files.
lengau@midwest.social · 2 pts · 203d
Alongside bash? https://www.justice.gov/epstein/files/DataSet%209/EFTA00315784.pdf
TrumpetX@programming.dev · 3 pts · 203d
Am I the only Ubuntu user who actively avoids the GUI and only uses the command line for updates?
coronach@lemmy.sdf.org · 1 pts · 202d
Probably not since their GUI tools have historically been slow and buggy though the years.
opensourceit@friendica.world · 2 pts · 204d
@cm0002 Meh, every distro has its issues, and I don't think the arguments for its removal are insane, although I would prefer it was kept and fixed. I think the only thing I've ever tweaked on that thing are the security and version update settings. Wonder what #ubuntu will set the defaults to.
Denixen@feddit.nu · 2 pts · 203d
They are not entirely wrong for not trusting them though. I have broken more than one Ubuntu installs... and I consider myself a semi-advanced user.
If more windows people join and Ubuntu wants to keep them, they need protection from doing stupid things like uninstalling all display and graphics drivers or system critical packages...
Don't underestimate people's stupidity, at least that something that Microsoft and apple get right.
ulterno@programming.dev · 1 pts · 204d
Maybe it's just trying to be Linux, for Windows users.
ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net · 1 pts · 204d
I was thinking about it recently. For Linux to compete with Windows in corporate settings it has to offer some very specific functionalities. It has to basically be remotely managed. At one of my previous companies Mac users were not able to use AirDrop or even change the desktop background and screen saver. Linux users still had root level access and could do whatever they wanted because the company didn't have tools to manage Linux desktops. If Canonical is trying to get corporate clients (and I think they are) then yes, they absolutely need to treat their users as if they can't be trusted. That's because corporations don't trust their employees. And it's perfectly fine, just don't use Ubuntu as a personal distro.
Taleya@aussie.zone · 7 pts · 204d
This is not true in any way shape or form.
User roles and controls are baked into linux and have been since its inception
Also RHEL has been The Corporate Linux for decades
msokiovt@lemmy.today · -1 pts · 204d
Someone bought them outright. To be fair about this, what they're doing, at this entity's hands, is treating people like Microsoft and Apple treat their users: like criminals.
Corporations police harder than governments, though.