Yes, the “centrists” are capitalist conservatives. The progressives are social democrats. Since it’s a two party system, the Republicans fell to the far right, and the conservative capitalists will fall to the social democrats. It’s cute that they still think they’re in charge of the party.
You think?
Seems to me that they aren't so nervous becuase they have not make even a single minor change. The most they did was Hillary recently blaming Biden for the election loss, while not even mentioning the genocide at all. Just more shenanigans.
As has been the case throughout human history, those in charge will rarely ever be willing to change what has worked for them up until then. They will see the resistance, and try to clamp down on it hard in an attempt to keep the status quo.
Democrats see the successful nibbling away at their power, and are trying to bully their way through it. The fact they're doing so means they're taking it seriously, and that means they're nervous about it. Because it means losing their cash cow backers, they will not change until they have little other option left. We, the people, have to remove all other options from them.
It's far from inevitable that the progressives will win that fight. The big money's on the side of the corporate bootlickers, and so is the vast majority of the media.
Here are the proud capitalist DINO MAGAs that just sacrificed their careers because they were more concerned with appeasing MAGA, than serving those that actually VOTED for them. Don't make that mistake again.
Rep. Tom Suozzi (D-NY) — Co-leading the initiative
Hey dumb fucks the US economy isn't even capitalism at this point, it's a fucked up breed of corporatism. I'd fucken kill for Smithian capitalism at this point because it'd be an active improvement over the current system.
Hey dumb fucks the US economy isn’t even capitalism at this point, it’s a fucked up breed of corporatism.
All existent and historic forms of capitalism have been entangled with the state, and capture by self-serving business interests goes right back to the beginning as well.
I’d fucken kill for Smithian capitalism at this point
You've got it already. As Adam Smith described the situation in his time: "People of the same trade seldom meet together, even for merriment and diversion, but the conversation ends in a conspiracy against the publick, or in some contrivance to raise prices."
If you mean the system Smith advocated, that has always been aspirational. And there are two commonly-promoted attributes of free trade: freedom to compete (no barriers to entry), and freedom from regulation. But without regulation, self-dealing oligopolies inevitably form, creating barriers to entry as they find ways to stitch up their captive markets. And even with regulation, the oligopolists' strategy of regulatory capture is a constant problem.
I'm referring to the aspirational side of things and venting irritation meaning practicality didn't quite factor in. My point was moreso that the system is so fucken corrupted that it barely even resembles most historical forms of capitalism with basically the sole exception of the gilded age, but even then I think we've managed to surpass that on the inequality side of things.
A bunch of policies are good both for society and for capitalism (universal healthcare, free college/trade school, taxing the rich). Why don't we tackle those before we argue amongst ourselves?
Universal Healthcare in their view is bad because it retracts capitalism for insurance "providers". Free college to them is bad because it retracts capitalism from banks who are able to create loans that follow someone their entire life through multiple bankruptcies. Taxing the rich is bad from their perspective because they think a higher tax burden retracts from the goal of capitalism, which is to be a slumlord or whatever.
They don't allow those problems to be put* aside for the enormous benefits and freer economy when people aren't living paycheck to paycheck scared of what the next emergency is going to be with their body.
You can tell they don't understand capitalism very well, by their support of capitalism
There's a joke I'm riffing off, that Christians read the bible to reinforce their belief in God. What do atheists read to reinforce their lack of belief? The same.
I agree, but put another way, it's much harder to show actions that result in profits for their big donors if the method of those profits being bigger is filtered through regular people and increasing their ability to afford the products of said donor. By keeping us out of the loop they can take more credit when their 6 or 2 year review comes up.
Even when giving us that ability to afford things may in many cases lead to capital interests becoming very rich maybe even more rich than if they had put their effort torwards deregulation or corporate socialism/subsidies instead, especially in markets where the products are expensive but desirable to most people.
It doesn't have to, similar to how an all powerful ruler doesn't necessarily have to be totalitarian, it could be better... it just chooses not to, and ironically our economy chose for it not to. There's something very sick to me about investing in a company doing good things for the world and then being told by new management of that company that stock holders aren't getting the returns they should and so their fiduciary responsibility would be to cut "unneeded jobs" slim process waste, expensive eco friendly packaging, and otherwise veer towards efficiency and maximum return instead of world impact.
It seems like the moment a company goes public they become the same as everyone else. I think the laws around public ownership have gotten the wrong idea from people who directly trade stocks, who are traditionally far worse people than those would would look at a list and choose that one for mitigation of harm. By design? Or just the natural result of an expanding work week with a million things competing for our attention?
Both healthcare and education should be public goods. The encroachment of the private sector into those spheres is Marx's "expropriation of the commons." According to Marx, capitalism has two ways to expand: organic growth, and seizing public goods.
I'm not someone who thinks Marx was right about everything, but that observation seems correct to me.
because we have a strict time table to get rid of capitalism to lessen the impact of climate change. We need to attack capitalism non stop with no excuses or compromise.
how about you guys start telling us what you will do. Your selling point was "We aren't trump", now your selling point is "we aren't trump or Zohran". How about you start trying to sell your message for what you plan to do for the average american.
That is the message. They're not Trump. They're not Mamdani. They don't have a policy. They don't have a plan. They just want everyone to stop shouting so they can do their corruption in peace.
And that is why we fucking hope you ALL get primaried.
We do not want centrists! We don't want anyone who offers the olive branch to PEDOPHILES AND THIEVES. What we want is for our representatives to remember they work for us, not the other way around.
We stand for nothing! We're basically republicans that support gay marriage.
I hope every one of the signatories to this dumbshit letter get primaried. These people are why our country is a shithole. They stand for nothing. They're in government to get rich and make their friends rich. They're not guided by morals or convictions, they worship the dollar. Get them all the fuck out.
Come senators, congressmen
Please heed the call
Don't stand in the doorway
Don't block up the hall
For he that gets hurt
Will be he who has stalled.
The battle outside ragin'
Will soon shake your windows
And rattle your walls
For the times they are a-changin'
Well, maybe this time they will. Last time, we got a reactionary counter-revolution that stifled our society for over a generation.
Come mothers and fathers
Throughout the land
And don't criticize
What you can't understand
Your sons and your daughters
Are beyond your command
Your old road is rapidly agin'
Please get out of the new one
If you can't lend your hand
For the times they are a-changin'
42 Comments
BigMacHole@thelemmy.club · 60 pts · 48d
Good for these STRONG Politicians to REBUKE the ONLY People WINNING Elections in their Party! It will NEVER backfire on Them!
adespoton@lemmy.ca · 47 pts · 48d
Yes, the “centrists” are capitalist conservatives. The progressives are social democrats. Since it’s a two party system, the Republicans fell to the far right, and the conservative capitalists will fall to the social democrats. It’s cute that they still think they’re in charge of the party.
WhoIzDisIz@lemmy.today · 13 pts · 48d
They are for the moment, but they're rightly starting to get pretty nervous about where things are going.
kreskin@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 47d
You think? Seems to me that they aren't so nervous becuase they have not make even a single minor change. The most they did was Hillary recently blaming Biden for the election loss, while not even mentioning the genocide at all. Just more shenanigans.
WhoIzDisIz@lemmy.today · 6 pts · 47d
As has been the case throughout human history, those in charge will rarely ever be willing to change what has worked for them up until then. They will see the resistance, and try to clamp down on it hard in an attempt to keep the status quo.
Democrats see the successful nibbling away at their power, and are trying to bully their way through it. The fact they're doing so means they're taking it seriously, and that means they're nervous about it. Because it means losing their cash cow backers, they will not change until they have little other option left. We, the people, have to remove all other options from them.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 47d
Their strategy is to hold the line as best they can, and keep as many corporate shills in office as possible, thereby undermining the progressives.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip · 5 pts · 47d
It's far from inevitable that the progressives will win that fight. The big money's on the side of the corporate bootlickers, and so is the vast majority of the media.
NM_Gringo@lemmy.world · 31 pts · 48d
Not anymore. Read the room.
Fishnoodle@lemmy.world · 29 pts · 48d
At a certain point if you can't win over voters in your own party, then the problem isn't with the fucking voters
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 21 pts · 47d
Here are the proud capitalist DINO MAGAs that just sacrificed their careers because they were more concerned with appeasing MAGA, than serving those that actually VOTED for them. Don't make that mistake again.
Rep. Tom Suozzi (D-NY) — Co-leading the initiative
Rep. Adam Gray (D-CA) — Co-leading the initiative
Rep. Josh Gottheimer (D-NJ)
Rep. Susie Lee (D-NV)
Rep. Don Davis (D-NC)
Rep. Vicente Gonzalez Jr. (D-TX)
Rep. Laura Gillen (D-NY)
Rep. Janelle Bynum (D-OR)
Rep. Kristin McDonald Rivet (D-MI)
Rep. Maggie Goodlander (D-NH)
Jessica Killin (candidate)
Marlene Galán Woods (candidate)
Bobby Pulido (candidate)
vaultdweller013@sh.itjust.works · 19 pts · 47d
Hey dumb fucks the US economy isn't even capitalism at this point, it's a fucked up breed of corporatism. I'd fucken kill for Smithian capitalism at this point because it'd be an active improvement over the current system.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 47d
All existent and historic forms of capitalism have been entangled with the state, and capture by self-serving business interests goes right back to the beginning as well.
You've got it already. As Adam Smith described the situation in his time: "People of the same trade seldom meet together, even for merriment and diversion, but the conversation ends in a conspiracy against the publick, or in some contrivance to raise prices."
If you mean the system Smith advocated, that has always been aspirational. And there are two commonly-promoted attributes of free trade: freedom to compete (no barriers to entry), and freedom from regulation. But without regulation, self-dealing oligopolies inevitably form, creating barriers to entry as they find ways to stitch up their captive markets. And even with regulation, the oligopolists' strategy of regulatory capture is a constant problem.
vaultdweller013@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 47d
I'm referring to the aspirational side of things and venting irritation meaning practicality didn't quite factor in. My point was moreso that the system is so fucken corrupted that it barely even resembles most historical forms of capitalism with basically the sole exception of the gilded age, but even then I think we've managed to surpass that on the inequality side of things.
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 0 pts · 47d
Pure copium.
sunbrrnslapper@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 48d
A bunch of policies are good both for society and for capitalism (universal healthcare, free college/trade school, taxing the rich). Why don't we tackle those before we argue amongst ourselves?
Lasherz12@lemmy.world · 22 pts · 48d
Universal Healthcare in their view is bad because it retracts capitalism for insurance "providers". Free college to them is bad because it retracts capitalism from banks who are able to create loans that follow someone their entire life through multiple bankruptcies. Taxing the rich is bad from their perspective because they think a higher tax burden retracts from the goal of capitalism, which is to be a slumlord or whatever.
They don't allow those problems to be put* aside for the enormous benefits and freer economy when people aren't living paycheck to paycheck scared of what the next emergency is going to be with their body.
Edit: put*, not out
sunbrrnslapper@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 48d
Then they don't understand capitalism very well.
Fedegenerate@fedinsfw.app · 12 pts · 48d
You can tell they don't understand capitalism very well, by their support of capitalism
There's a joke I'm riffing off, that Christians read the bible to reinforce their belief in God. What do atheists read to reinforce their lack of belief? The same.
Lasherz12@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 48d
I agree, but put another way, it's much harder to show actions that result in profits for their big donors if the method of those profits being bigger is filtered through regular people and increasing their ability to afford the products of said donor. By keeping us out of the loop they can take more credit when their 6 or 2 year review comes up.
Even when giving us that ability to afford things may in many cases lead to capital interests becoming very rich maybe even more rich than if they had put their effort torwards deregulation or corporate socialism/subsidies instead, especially in markets where the products are expensive but desirable to most people.
sunbrrnslapper@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 48d
You are totally right, and I hate that our politicians are so nearsighted and greedy. Bleck.
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 0 pts · 47d
It seems like you're the one who doesn't understand capitalism very well. This is exactly what it's meant to do.
Lasherz12@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 47d
It doesn't have to, similar to how an all powerful ruler doesn't necessarily have to be totalitarian, it could be better... it just chooses not to, and ironically our economy chose for it not to. There's something very sick to me about investing in a company doing good things for the world and then being told by new management of that company that stock holders aren't getting the returns they should and so their fiduciary responsibility would be to cut "unneeded jobs" slim process waste, expensive eco friendly packaging, and otherwise veer towards efficiency and maximum return instead of world impact.
It seems like the moment a company goes public they become the same as everyone else. I think the laws around public ownership have gotten the wrong idea from people who directly trade stocks, who are traditionally far worse people than those would would look at a list and choose that one for mitigation of harm. By design? Or just the natural result of an expanding work week with a million things competing for our attention?
phutatorius@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 47d
Both healthcare and education should be public goods. The encroachment of the private sector into those spheres is Marx's "expropriation of the commons." According to Marx, capitalism has two ways to expand: organic growth, and seizing public goods.
I'm not someone who thinks Marx was right about everything, but that observation seems correct to me.
kreskin@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 48d
theuniqueone@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 2 pts · 48d
because we have a strict time table to get rid of capitalism to lessen the impact of climate change. We need to attack capitalism non stop with no excuses or compromise.
lemmylump@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 47d
Put these centrist out of a fucking job.
Shit is so far goddamn right that a centrist dem is that same as a GW Bush Republican.
Fuck these people.
In 50 years we have only gone fucking backwards. Time for progress.
TheFogan@programming.dev · 17 pts · 48d
how about you guys start telling us what you will do. Your selling point was "We aren't trump", now your selling point is "we aren't trump or Zohran". How about you start trying to sell your message for what you plan to do for the average american.
Phil_in_here@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 48d
That is the message. They're not Trump. They're not Mamdani. They don't have a policy. They don't have a plan. They just want everyone to stop shouting so they can do their corruption in peace.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 47d
They're stumblebums, like the Washington Generals. They're leeches trying to stay latched onto the body politic. They're a waste of air.
switcheroo@lemmy.world · 13 pts · 47d
And that is why we fucking hope you ALL get primaried.
We do not want centrists! We don't want anyone who offers the olive branch to PEDOPHILES AND THIEVES. What we want is for our representatives to remember they work for us, not the other way around.
theacharnian@lemmy.ca · 13 pts · 47d
Take a load of these idiots that haven't figured out that social democracy and democratic socialism can and usually do coexist in centre left parties.
ButtermilkBiscuit@feddit.nl · 11 pts · 47d
We stand for nothing! We're basically republicans that support gay marriage.
I hope every one of the signatories to this dumbshit letter get primaried. These people are why our country is a shithole. They stand for nothing. They're in government to get rich and make their friends rich. They're not guided by morals or convictions, they worship the dollar. Get them all the fuck out.
BeardededSquidward@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 5 pts · 47d
They're the ratchet.
Treczoks@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 47d
And that exactly is the core of the partie's problems.
Lasherz12@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 48d
The hubris of saying you know what your party is better than the voters. Please say it loudly, often, and put your name all over it.
JigglySackles@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 47d
Love that it's bringing the problem people we want gone front and center. Bye Felicia.
Big_Boss_77@fedinsfw.app · 3 pts · 47d
You might be...
AshMan85@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 48d
Either get in line or join maga
phutatorius@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 47d
Well, maybe this time they will. Last time, we got a reactionary counter-revolution that stifled our society for over a generation.
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 1 pts · 47d
Also a fitting verse
Auk@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 47d
Not in THIS economy!
Feathercrown@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 47d
"'We'? There is no 'we'. Without
meus, there wouldn't even be a 'you'!"- Manny from Ice Age
zbyte64@awful.systems · 3 pts · 47d
Affordable cost of living is a communist plot to destroy America