Just to remind everyone, the list is an active and ever changing document. The list has been growing slightly every day, and if you use differential compare in something like Kate, you can see the changes when you download the json again. Guess what, you got your wish!
Eh, I feel it's kinda cheating at this point. If I didn't organically make the list,I don't want to ask for it. That being said, those are my feelings and won't fault anyone for asking for the honor.
Oh yeah, see I’m not planning on straight up messaging them to get that ban. I’ll just have to proliferate a series of messages across various communities until the fascist sees it and has to deal with me.
Weird. Last time I checked they'd removed or made it private. Guess they don't care anymore that people can see it while also saying those who are looking at it are mentally handicapped?
Well if the followup doubling down post about the situation is to be believed, that basically is the case. The cat is out of the bag, and taking the filter down would allow "violent crazies" to impede upon the "Tesseract experience," after all.
The fact that they turned off commenting on it is funny. Like how much of a snowflake do you think it is a good idea to instead of using a block button to use a hidden code to force other users to follow your own thinking. How unsecured they seem.
It's streisanding like crazy as a result. If he'd allowed comments all the crazy would be on his posts. But he's disallowed so now the discussion is happening EVERYWHERE else in thousands of posts on all instances
Other folks' consent was simply less important than their need to secretly silence others with malware. The worst part about it is I could envision a plan where this list was broken up into various categories, and with a little bit of good rhetoric, could've convinced a percentage of people to willingly give them some control over their feed. It could've been fully transparent with some simple toggles, they would've got some power, and their reputation wouldn't be in the gutter. Not exactly the ideal person to trust to make your auto blacklist(s), but hey, that'd be a vastly different conversation than the one that's happening now.
If it was really just crazy users and maybe some crazy instances, I would be more willing to give the benefit of the doubt (assuming they changed it, which they are not). But the "perchance" block... Blocking Blahaj entirely... I have a very difficult time accepting this is anything but a personal grudge.
They could've only blacklisted the worst of the worst (whatever you believe that to be) and it still would've been unacceptable, because they did so without the knowledge or consent of anyone using the software. The quality of the blacklist is also bad, but the lack of choice and transparency is what matters to me. I say that as someone who also had their entire instance blocked, probably because posting anthro images is "undesirable" to "normies." I think talking about the pettiness and potential bigotry of the list misses the forest for the trees, because deploying malware on other servers is unacceptable no matter what the reason is.
You don't get to conceal code and execute it as a treat, just because you think your reasoning is good. That's quite literally how we got here in the first place.
He starts off the second post by blaming the audience for not wanting an explanation, otherwise he would answer questions. I'm saying that's hypocritical because the comments are shut down.
I do feel bad they're getting harassing DMs and death threats though, that is taking it too far. But I don't know what sort of reaction they expected from doing something so underhanded and then taking the high road after.
Oh yeah, that's fucked up. The kind of people who make that big of a deal out of it, enough to send threats, are reinforcing his reasoning. It sucks that he's stuck inside the meat grinder now, but he did throw himself in.
Looks like they're tripping down now if you go to dubvee.org.
Unsurprising they're saying others are doing darvo, and even angry at lemmy.world admins for not listening to rimu trying to get most of the fediverse blocked.
If he wanted to be a mod, then he should have done mod shit. You can't make a neutral product as a developer and then code it like a mod. The fact that he doesn't see the problem is the problem.
I don't care that he made a ban list. I don't care that I'm on it. I care that he sold a window into the community for others without telling the people using that window that he erased huge chunks of the community at large. Regardless of his opinions, that is what he did.
To do what? Gentrify Lemmy? You can't come into Tortuga and try to sell it as a resort by putting a tarp over the pirates mate.
I'd link to it but don't want to give that comms mod more ammunition to ban, especially as it's their favorite activity in the news comm or when people are pointing out the comparisons between what's happening now in Palestine to what happened in nazi Germany.
We'll just say it's an apps comm in my comment history who is saying they only removed a thread there because too many people used the word nazi while the mod log reasoning was misinformation (because the dev restored or unprivated the git repo)
I do find it hilarious that the same people who say the Lemmy (the software) is shadowy and evil, while they do this and PieFed deletes users and tracks votes and limits them, while having a hard coded limit on memes and warns users of websites the software dev doesn't like. Not even getting into how PieFed now punishes users who use it too much.
At least the Lemmy devs keep their actions to .ml, it's easy to avoid if you don't like it. I sure as shit don't.
But leave to the people who find online communists the real threat instead of the fascists in office to dictate what you can and can't say on things, beyond their home instance.
The ones who concern troll about dangers with the software of Lemmy being controlled by the lemmyDevs, while doing that exact thing on piefed or their own UI projects. Every accusation is a confession apparently.
I probably spell-checked some diatribe, and suggested being able to spell a word is a crucial requirement for convincing people of your authority in the matter. It's like how we don't applaud a tenor for clearing his throat.
Man that is so true. A) learn to spell, B) if you can't spell, the Internet can spell, and C) considering both A and B, if you can't be bothered to proofread the stuff you write, why should anyone else bother to read it or take your opinion seriously?
Being passably literate is not that hard.
Side note: If you write comments that are not in your first language, that is usually evident and it's not generally spelling related.
Okay, Patrick fucked himself hard. What he did was unacceptable, period.
But come the fuck on, there's absolutely zero reason to harass anyone, ever. Block them, ignore them, report them, but once you start bandwagoning someone, no matter what they did, you're an asshole too.
You know the old saying that two wrongs don't make a right? There's reason it's a saying. It's fucking true.
Just stop already. He knows he's now a pariah. This whole "look at me" bullshit of asking to be put on the list? It's fucking childish. This isn't just directed at OP, it's to everyone. The person at the heart of the drama had their ranting excuse post, and here people are making their point for them by being toxic as fuck. Grow the fuck up, people.
Besides, I think it rather obvious that Patrick is going through some shit. Has been for a while. I'm not saying it excuses anything, but maybe, just maybe, being decent human beings and at least just leaving them the fuck alone instead of fucking with them is the actual right thing to do here, if nobody can be bothered to reach out in kindness. Hell, I can't be bothered, I got enough shit on my plate in meatspace, trying to play support to a stranger just isn't in my reach right now. But I'm sure as fuck not piling on anyone.
The dude tried to control the experience of thousands of lemmy users. Anyone who used his software gets to take it up with him. Anyone on his lists gets to take it up with him
But, OP wasn't on the list and was fucking with him just out of whatever smug self superiority they have.
But, again, there's a difference between taking an issue up with someone, which you just did with me, here; and harassing someone with shitty little messages.
What you just did here was grown up talk. You had a disagreement, approached the person directly, but with no unnecessary aggro, and said your bit.
Sending someone a shitty DM " add me to your list, dur hur", that's what junior high twits do.
Where I disagree is that he successfully filtered the experience of users. He did it in conjunction with admins that didn't fully audit what they were deploying. But, whether any of us like the way he said it (and holy hell was his "explanation" toddler level tantrum), it was there to be seen.
The problem was one of transparency. Normally, block lists are much easier to find, and the fact of them should be disclosed up front.
But it wasn't some 1337 haxxer shit, it wasn't some deeply hidden code. And, looking back through his account histories he did actually say he was going to be changing things.
Be angry. Actively communicate that anger. Just do it like a fucking adult
Besides, I think it rather obvious that Patrick is going through some shit. Has been for a while.
Again, not that this excuses a block list like this, but they had made a post in the 30 Rock community about how their childhood friend is in a medically induced coma. I cannot remember if there was any follow-up, but they were indeed "going through some shit".
Active vs structural oppression. Why is one acceptable and the other not. They're currently using their position as developer to silence diverse groups of people.
Fuck you asshole, why the fuck can't you learn to read and think?! Two wrongs don't make a right, get it through your thick skull.
Is that in any way acceptable? Had I said it for real, as an attack to you conflating two radically different things, that would be a shitty thing to say, and would make me an asshole.
But you are still conflating two radically different things. Maybe, if I said instead:
Look my fellow lemmite, what I'm getting at is that doing something nasty to someone just to be nasty doesn't change what they did. It does nothing to correct the wrong done, it doesn't even help the person being nasty, unless one wishes to also conflate being smugly self satisfied with being good for mental health.
This isn't some tin pot despot here. It's just a guy that made some software and doesn't want it used in ways he considers unethical. He did it in the worst way possible. Well, maybe third or fourth way possible.
There are many ways to go about handling that error. But there is no universe in which sending childish messages to harass the person are on that list. It's just an excuse for someone to feel superior by being shitty to someone. Justifying that by pointing to the wrong done is bullshit.
Do you see what I'm getting at? It isn't about what he did or didn't do. It's about what we do and are. Are you the kind of person that dogpiles hate and venom, or are you the kind of person that recognizes human error, finds sympathy and/or empathy to say "there but for the grace of the FSM go I"?
Me? I'm an asshole. It's a fact I've learned to live with. I have little tolerance for bullshit, and my filter broke a long time ago. That I'm the guy saying to chill out and remember that there's a human behind the error should frighten people into looking at what they're doing and why. I should never be the voice of reason in a community because I'm nucking futs.
What we should be doing, instead of sending shitty DMs with infantile virtue signalling is just let it fucking go. Block his accounts, communicate with one's admins to see if a fork is being used on one's instance, then either advocate for a fork to be in place instead of the shitty version or be prepared to move instances. That's it. That's the sane, adult response.
As a pure emotional outburst? No. As a response to someone who has openly refused to understand or acknowledge their abuse of influence. I can't blame them. If you want respect you show respect. Which dubs hasn't been known to do. I'm not going to @ them myself. But they've certainly soiled their own reputation.
Had the feature been opt in and transparent would this have been an issue? No. They knew what they were doing and obfuscated this on purpose. Further they've been unrepentant regarding it. Taking advantage to more or less be Shadow admin on the servers of those who run the front end.
I have little respect for the way the Lemmy devs run their own server. Among other things. But at least they keep their influence to their echo chamber. Unlike this.
When I get butt hurt by someone's actions, I can be nasty and childish, and that behaviour should be excused.
Again, it isn't about respect. It's about how a person comports themselves in a social structure. You know the whole sinking to their level idea? Where the more you sacrifice your own ethics, your own adherence to some kind of code, the closer you become to whatever it is you're angry at.
IDGAF what he did, I am a grown ass man. I will always strive to treat others in the way I believe everyone should treat everyone. That's who I am, and I think that should be the default, not an exception. In life, you may have to take action to protect someone or something, or even to avenge some wrong. It's up to all of us to decide how we'll do that, how ugly we're willing to be to achieve that goal.
What I'm saying is that if you want to talk to the guy, go ahead. Say what you need to say. But don't resort to that kind of childish, churlish, performative malarkey. Say to that other human being: hey, what you did sucked. I'm angry about that. I don't believe your explanation has enough weight to counter your poor execution.
I 100% agree with you, attack the ideas, not the man. The idea of a secret filter being applied, whatever the stated intention, is in itself a massive ethical problem. Of course, the person implementing such a filter can and should be shunned, but any overt forms of bullying and harassment are totally counterproductive, as it only serves to bolster the claimed need for such a filter, like you mentioned.
Having said that, I'm not in any way defending what he did. And tbh the memes have been quite funny and mostly on point.
I found it funny that in your text you basically validated every involved side's actions, be it the Tesseract guy's list, the people clowning on him, and the stance of the grown ass man. We're all choosing how far we are willing to go to protect something or somebody, after all.
Eh, I figured out a long time ago that people with a screen in front of them are prone to their worst, and will react poorly to having a mirror appear where they desire applause.
87 Comments
Foxfire@pawb.social · 90 pts · 27d
Just to remind everyone, the list is an active and ever changing document. The list has been growing slightly every day, and if you use differential compare in something like Kate, you can see the changes when you download the json again. Guess what, you got your wish!
jackal@infosec.pub · 38 pts · 27d
Well, I’ll be… I can still make the cut?! Yeehaw! Come on gang, let’s go fuck up a Nazi’s day.
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today · 29 pts · 27d
Eh, I feel it's kinda cheating at this point. If I didn't organically make the list,I don't want to ask for it. That being said, those are my feelings and won't fault anyone for asking for the honor.
SailorFuzz@lemmy.world · 25 pts · 27d
I was on the list before it was cool
Marthirial@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 27d
Yeah. You can't SEO into the list.
jackal@infosec.pub · 4 pts · 27d
Oh yeah, see I’m not planning on straight up messaging them to get that ban. I’ll just have to proliferate a series of messages across various communities until the fascist sees it and has to deal with me.
lastweakness@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 26d
Yeaah, wish I was on the list...
Taleya@aussie.zone · 27 pts · 27d
Oh my god he's still fucking doing this???
TheEighthDoctor@lemmy.zip · 9 pts · 26d
They are thinbloods, nothing like us first generation Listers
cookiecoookie@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 26d
Look at what they need to mimic a fraction of our power
goferking0@lemmy.sdf.org · 9 pts · 27d
Weird. Last time I checked they'd removed or made it private. Guess they don't care anymore that people can see it while also saying those who are looking at it are mentally handicapped?
Foxfire@pawb.social · 21 pts · 27d
Well if the followup doubling down post about the situation is to be believed, that basically is the case. The cat is out of the bag, and taking the filter down would allow "violent crazies" to impede upon the "Tesseract experience," after all.
Sonicdemon86@lemmy.world · 20 pts · 27d
The fact that they turned off commenting on it is funny. Like how much of a snowflake do you think it is a good idea to instead of using a block button to use a hidden code to force other users to follow your own thinking. How unsecured they seem.
Taleya@aussie.zone · 18 pts · 27d
It's streisanding like crazy as a result. If he'd allowed comments all the crazy would be on his posts. But he's disallowed so now the discussion is happening EVERYWHERE else in thousands of posts on all instances
Foxfire@pawb.social · 17 pts · 27d
Other folks' consent was simply less important than their need to secretly silence others with malware. The worst part about it is I could envision a plan where this list was broken up into various categories, and with a little bit of good rhetoric, could've convinced a percentage of people to willingly give them some control over their feed. It could've been fully transparent with some simple toggles, they would've got some power, and their reputation wouldn't be in the gutter. Not exactly the ideal person to trust to make your auto blacklist(s), but hey, that'd be a vastly different conversation than the one that's happening now.
JackbyDev@programming.dev · 5 pts · 27d
If it was really just crazy users and maybe some crazy instances, I would be more willing to give the benefit of the doubt (assuming they changed it, which they are not). But the "perchance" block... Blocking Blahaj entirely... I have a very difficult time accepting this is anything but a personal grudge.
Foxfire@pawb.social · 3 pts · 26d
They could've only blacklisted the worst of the worst (whatever you believe that to be) and it still would've been unacceptable, because they did so without the knowledge or consent of anyone using the software. The quality of the blacklist is also bad, but the lack of choice and transparency is what matters to me. I say that as someone who also had their entire instance blocked, probably because posting anthro images is "undesirable" to "normies." I think talking about the pettiness and potential bigotry of the list misses the forest for the trees, because deploying malware on other servers is unacceptable no matter what the reason is.
You don't get to conceal code and execute it as a treat, just because you think your reasoning is good. That's quite literally how we got here in the first place.
Wren@lemmy.today · 8 pts · 27d
There's been an another doubling down with an extra edit to double the downing: https://lemmy.today/post/57202811
Taleya@aussie.zone · 7 pts · 27d
O irony
Wren@lemmy.today · 4 pts · 27d
It reads like no one gave them a chance to open a dialogue on a post where they shut down the dialogue.
Taleya@aussie.zone · 2 pts · 27d
Could you clarify?
The previous post was a monologue from the get go, it was explicitly created with the comment section muzzled
Wren@lemmy.today · 5 pts · 27d
He starts off the second post by blaming the audience for not wanting an explanation, otherwise he would answer questions. I'm saying that's hypocritical because the comments are shut down.
JackbyDev@programming.dev · 6 pts · 27d
I do feel bad they're getting harassing DMs and death threats though, that is taking it too far. But I don't know what sort of reaction they expected from doing something so underhanded and then taking the high road after.
Wren@lemmy.today · 9 pts · 27d
Oh yeah, that's fucked up. The kind of people who make that big of a deal out of it, enough to send threats, are reinforcing his reasoning. It sucks that he's stuck inside the meat grinder now, but he did throw himself in.
Goferking0@ttrpg.network · 5 pts · 26d
Looks like they're tripping down now if you go to dubvee.org.
Unsurprising they're saying others are doing darvo, and even angry at lemmy.world admins for not listening to rimu trying to get most of the fediverse blocked.
OnyxRex@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 4 pts · 26d
If he wanted to be a mod, then he should have done mod shit. You can't make a neutral product as a developer and then code it like a mod. The fact that he doesn't see the problem is the problem.
I don't care that he made a ban list. I don't care that I'm on it. I care that he sold a window into the community for others without telling the people using that window that he erased huge chunks of the community at large. Regardless of his opinions, that is what he did.
To do what? Gentrify Lemmy? You can't come into Tortuga and try to sell it as a resort by putting a tarp over the pirates mate.
Wren@lemmy.today · 3 pts · 26d
I wanna make snide remarks but I'm convinced this is a mental health thing now.
Goferking0@ttrpg.network · 3 pts · 26d
Exactly. And hope they are actually logged out not still going around commenting with a startrek alt
OnyxRex@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 26d
oh no! If I'm shadow banned from the trek communities I might actually be upset. I need my trek memes!
goferking0@lemmy.sdf.org · 8 pts · 27d
Completely unsurprising they are still blaming everyone else and doing no self reflection.
Along with the only place they attempted to explain themselves was removed by a mod that seems to want to protect the person and or tesseract
Edit, oh and they've done another follow up post in response to continue anger at users for not liking the shit tesseract does
AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 27d
Where was that?
goferking0@lemmy.sdf.org · 3 pts · 27d
I'd link to it but don't want to give that comms mod more ammunition to ban, especially as it's their favorite activity in the news comm or when people are pointing out the comparisons between what's happening now in Palestine to what happened in nazi Germany.
We'll just say it's an apps comm in my comment history who is saying they only removed a thread there because too many people used the word nazi while the mod log reasoning was misinformation (because the dev restored or unprivated the git repo)
AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 27d
Oh good ol' geddy
goferking0@lemmy.sdf.org · 4 pts · 26d
Oh and they nuked that thread as well so guess doesn't matter
goferking0@lemmy.sdf.org · 2 pts · 27d
They pinky promise swear they don't let their biases influence their moderation actions....
Taleya@aussie.zone · 20 pts · 27d
He changed the repo because people were forking it wirh things like "removing bullshit censorship" and he considers that bullying the big meanies
goferking0@lemmy.sdf.org · 4 pts · 27d
Which still surprises me they restored it in the original repo. Well unless it to give people cover for saying the removal was fake news
Taleya@aussie.zone · 6 pts · 27d
I reckon they went full batshit and decided to Make A Moral Stand.
Either that or they broke some functionality for .world
dreadbeef@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 5 pts · 26d
If he sees this add me I was disappointed when I saw I wasnt on it :(
tutter@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 4 pts · 24d
How do you get this list now? Dubvee throws a 'could not resolve' error when i try to curl the list, so im assuming they shut the servers down?
rockSlayer@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 62 pts · 27d
This meltdown keeps getting better and better
eugenevdebs@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 50 pts · 27d
I do find it hilarious that the same people who say the Lemmy (the software) is shadowy and evil, while they do this and PieFed deletes users and tracks votes and limits them, while having a hard coded limit on memes and warns users of websites the software dev doesn't like. Not even getting into how PieFed now punishes users who use it too much.
At least the Lemmy devs keep their actions to .ml, it's easy to avoid if you don't like it. I sure as shit don't.
But leave to the people who find online communists the real threat instead of the fascists in office to dictate what you can and can't say on things, beyond their home instance.
MysticMushroom1776@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 28 pts · 27d
The ones who concern troll about dangers with the software of Lemmy being controlled by the lemmyDevs, while doing that exact thing on piefed or their own UI projects. Every accusation is a confession apparently.
goferking0@lemmy.sdf.org · 47 pts · 27d
Again. This is a user who's said multiple times they're leaving lemmy and their instance is read only.
and is a committed dev because of that
eugenevdebs@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 5 pts · 27d
At some point we'll have a dollar for a nickle each time this happens.
Luci@lemmy.ca · 28 pts · 27d
I also had my, I think very measured, response to this whole thing removed
Confused_Emus@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 24 pts · 27d
Blocked from Tesseract and some lemmy.world instances. I fail to see the problem. Your fediverse experience may even improve in quality.
Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 23 pts · 27d
Without the context of the DM itself I can't say PTB for sure. But PTB seems the most likely, given. You know. Everything.
Luci@lemmy.ca · 65 pts · 27d
Oh yeah no I was totally being an asshole to him
rockSlayer@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 30 pts · 27d
So absolutely in BPR territory, but also funny as fuck
sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 23 pts · 27d
Hah!
I just straight up trolled him on a few comms he moderates, and then blocked them, and then him, and then his alt.
"what are you gonna do, ban me?"
He can kiss my entire asshole, censorious fucking coward.
I play by rules when people are civilized.
Only, when people are civilized.
dreamy@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 17 pts · 27d
I've been trying to up my toxicity game lately. One day I'll get on that list too perchance 🥺? 👉👈
JPAKx4@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 8 pts · 27d
The question mark just means that 🥺 is optional
JackbyDev@programming.dev · 7 pts · 27d
Maybe I'll just say perchance in every post so they don't have to see me lol
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 4 pts · 27d
Luckily for those of us on the list, that SoaD masterpiece is from 2002 and thus outside of the decades we're not allowed to enjoy 😁
Zannsolo@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 27d
Always a good listen, but Jesus Christ the bassist and guitarist have disgusting beards.
limer@lemmy.ml · 15 pts · 27d
This is humble bragging
Maxxie@piefed.blahaj.zone · 12 pts · 27d
ask and ye shall receive 🧞
corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca · 11 pts · 27d
Wait.
WE CAN FIND OUT HOW WE GOT ON THE LIST?
I probably spell-checked some diatribe, and suggested being able to spell a word is a crucial requirement for convincing people of your authority in the matter. It's like how we don't applaud a tenor for clearing his throat.
dream_weasel@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 27d
Man that is so true. A) learn to spell, B) if you can't spell, the Internet can spell, and C) considering both A and B, if you can't be bothered to proofread the stuff you write, why should anyone else bother to read it or take your opinion seriously?
Being passably literate is not that hard.
Side note: If you write comments that are not in your first language, that is usually evident and it's not generally spelling related.
SailorFuzz@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 27d
Most thinned skin faschy
dream_weasel@sh.itjust.works · 8 pts · 27d
Well shit and I'm still not on it. I feel like DM is cheating but now everyone is doing it and I don't want to fall behind...
freeman@sh.itjust.works · 7 pts · 26d
So he is still a mod on communities outside his instance and bans people from them for personal reasons.
Unsurprisingly it's .world
TheTechnician27@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 27d
Back to the 50s with ye!
guynamedzero@piefed.zeromedia.vip · 2 pts · 27d
Asking for a friend, which account should I dm to do the same thing?
Luci@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 27d
Yeah no I ain’t getting banned from another community thanks
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works · -10 pts · 27d
Okay, Patrick fucked himself hard. What he did was unacceptable, period.
But come the fuck on, there's absolutely zero reason to harass anyone, ever. Block them, ignore them, report them, but once you start bandwagoning someone, no matter what they did, you're an asshole too.
You know the old saying that two wrongs don't make a right? There's reason it's a saying. It's fucking true.
Just stop already. He knows he's now a pariah. This whole "look at me" bullshit of asking to be put on the list? It's fucking childish. This isn't just directed at OP, it's to everyone. The person at the heart of the drama had their ranting excuse post, and here people are making their point for them by being toxic as fuck. Grow the fuck up, people.
Besides, I think it rather obvious that Patrick is going through some shit. Has been for a while. I'm not saying it excuses anything, but maybe, just maybe, being decent human beings and at least just leaving them the fuck alone instead of fucking with them is the actual right thing to do here, if nobody can be bothered to reach out in kindness. Hell, I can't be bothered, I got enough shit on my plate in meatspace, trying to play support to a stranger just isn't in my reach right now. But I'm sure as fuck not piling on anyone.
Taleya@aussie.zone · 20 pts · 27d
The dude tried to control the experience of thousands of lemmy users. Anyone who used his software gets to take it up with him. Anyone on his lists gets to take it up with him
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works · -4 pts · 27d
Well, I would agree with most of that.
But, OP wasn't on the list and was fucking with him just out of whatever smug self superiority they have.
But, again, there's a difference between taking an issue up with someone, which you just did with me, here; and harassing someone with shitty little messages.
What you just did here was grown up talk. You had a disagreement, approached the person directly, but with no unnecessary aggro, and said your bit.
Sending someone a shitty DM " add me to your list, dur hur", that's what junior high twits do.
Where I disagree is that he successfully filtered the experience of users. He did it in conjunction with admins that didn't fully audit what they were deploying. But, whether any of us like the way he said it (and holy hell was his "explanation" toddler level tantrum), it was there to be seen.
The problem was one of transparency. Normally, block lists are much easier to find, and the fact of them should be disclosed up front.
But it wasn't some 1337 haxxer shit, it wasn't some deeply hidden code. And, looking back through his account histories he did actually say he was going to be changing things.
Be angry. Actively communicate that anger. Just do it like a fucking adult
SatyrSack@quokk.au · 11 pts · 27d
Again, not that this excuses a block list like this, but they had made a post in the 30 Rock community about how their childhood friend is in a medically induced coma. I cannot remember if there was any follow-up, but they were indeed "going through some shit".
Canonical link: https://dubvee.org/post/3610056
Mirror: https://quokk.au/post/27539
Eldritch@piefed.world · 10 pts · 27d
Active vs structural oppression. Why is one acceptable and the other not. They're currently using their position as developer to silence diverse groups of people.
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 27d
As an example:
Fuck you asshole, why the fuck can't you learn to read and think?! Two wrongs don't make a right, get it through your thick skull.
Is that in any way acceptable? Had I said it for real, as an attack to you conflating two radically different things, that would be a shitty thing to say, and would make me an asshole.
But you are still conflating two radically different things. Maybe, if I said instead:
Look my fellow lemmite, what I'm getting at is that doing something nasty to someone just to be nasty doesn't change what they did. It does nothing to correct the wrong done, it doesn't even help the person being nasty, unless one wishes to also conflate being smugly self satisfied with being good for mental health.
This isn't some tin pot despot here. It's just a guy that made some software and doesn't want it used in ways he considers unethical. He did it in the worst way possible. Well, maybe third or fourth way possible.
There are many ways to go about handling that error. But there is no universe in which sending childish messages to harass the person are on that list. It's just an excuse for someone to feel superior by being shitty to someone. Justifying that by pointing to the wrong done is bullshit.
Do you see what I'm getting at? It isn't about what he did or didn't do. It's about what we do and are. Are you the kind of person that dogpiles hate and venom, or are you the kind of person that recognizes human error, finds sympathy and/or empathy to say "there but for the grace of the FSM go I"?
Me? I'm an asshole. It's a fact I've learned to live with. I have little tolerance for bullshit, and my filter broke a long time ago. That I'm the guy saying to chill out and remember that there's a human behind the error should frighten people into looking at what they're doing and why. I should never be the voice of reason in a community because I'm nucking futs.
What we should be doing, instead of sending shitty DMs with infantile virtue signalling is just let it fucking go. Block his accounts, communicate with one's admins to see if a fork is being used on one's instance, then either advocate for a fork to be in place instead of the shitty version or be prepared to move instances. That's it. That's the sane, adult response.
Eldritch@piefed.world · 7 pts · 27d
As a pure emotional outburst? No. As a response to someone who has openly refused to understand or acknowledge their abuse of influence. I can't blame them. If you want respect you show respect. Which dubs hasn't been known to do. I'm not going to @ them myself. But they've certainly soiled their own reputation.
Had the feature been opt in and transparent would this have been an issue? No. They knew what they were doing and obfuscated this on purpose. Further they've been unrepentant regarding it. Taking advantage to more or less be Shadow admin on the servers of those who run the front end.
I have little respect for the way the Lemmy devs run their own server. Among other things. But at least they keep their influence to their echo chamber. Unlike this.
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works · -1 pts · 27d
So, to translate your stance:
When I get butt hurt by someone's actions, I can be nasty and childish, and that behaviour should be excused.
Again, it isn't about respect. It's about how a person comports themselves in a social structure. You know the whole sinking to their level idea? Where the more you sacrifice your own ethics, your own adherence to some kind of code, the closer you become to whatever it is you're angry at.
IDGAF what he did, I am a grown ass man. I will always strive to treat others in the way I believe everyone should treat everyone. That's who I am, and I think that should be the default, not an exception. In life, you may have to take action to protect someone or something, or even to avenge some wrong. It's up to all of us to decide how we'll do that, how ugly we're willing to be to achieve that goal.
What I'm saying is that if you want to talk to the guy, go ahead. Say what you need to say. But don't resort to that kind of childish, churlish, performative malarkey. Say to that other human being: hey, what you did sucked. I'm angry about that. I don't believe your explanation has enough weight to counter your poor execution.
Flatworm7591@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 9 pts · 26d
I 100% agree with you, attack the ideas, not the man. The idea of a secret filter being applied, whatever the stated intention, is in itself a massive ethical problem. Of course, the person implementing such a filter can and should be shunned, but any overt forms of bullying and harassment are totally counterproductive, as it only serves to bolster the claimed need for such a filter, like you mentioned.
Having said that, I'm not in any way defending what he did. And tbh the memes have been quite funny and mostly on point.
drmoodmood@lemmy.ml · -2 pts · 27d
Hmm, maybe you should start a list and put people's names on it who don't conform to your beliefs!
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 26d
Okay, out of all the tangential silliness thrown at my comment, this approaches absurdity. It makes zero sense based on what was said
You're propping up straw, and it ain't even man shaped
drmoodmood@lemmy.ml · 0 pts · 25d
I found it funny that in your text you basically validated every involved side's actions, be it the Tesseract guy's list, the people clowning on him, and the stance of the grown ass man. We're all choosing how far we are willing to go to protect something or somebody, after all.
pinto@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 27d
So he's allowed to do things that impact people but people can't say things to him about it. I see.
Ah, as we all know, having a bad day justifys all actions!
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works · -8 pts · 27d
Are you thick?
Say things, yeah. But make them something other than the shitty bullying attempts of a child.
Frankly, I'm starting to see his point. I really thought lemmy had more people with compassion and decency.
I'll say this again in all caps so it's fucking clear
TWO WRONGS DO NOT MAKE A RIGHT. Grow the fuck up lemmy
pinto@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 26d
Won't someone be nice to the fascists? :'(
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works · 0 pts · 26d
Boy, people sure do love throwing that word around. Over any fucking thing
pinto@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 26d
I know, if you act like a fascist, hate trans people, hate leftists and break laws to get what you want, it tends to be called fascist.
Won't someone please think of the fascist?! He's just so misunderstood! Let boys be boys and get away with!
Luci@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 27d
Okay
Nima@leminal.space · -9 pts · 27d
you're the only one in the thread speaking sense and you're getting downvoted.
it's like reddit drama in the fediverse, lately. and it's extremely boring at this point.
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works · 0 pts · 27d
Eh, I figured out a long time ago that people with a screen in front of them are prone to their worst, and will react poorly to having a mirror appear where they desire applause.