Because, he’d have to know the answer and then willfully lie for his nose to grow.
Alternatively, giving a confident answer when he doesn’t know would make his nose grow regardless of him being correct.
I think in another comic, it was determined that it doesn't matter if he knew the answer. The nose knows the answer and changes size based on his answer.
I've had conversations with my friends on whether his nose grows based on deception or the truth value of the statement. My friend and I with rather secular upbringings grew up thinking it was based on deception and my friends with rather extreme Christian upbringings grew up thinking it was based on the truth. Obviously a very small sample size but I do wonder if there is a correlation
I think in this case it's the exact opposite. The secular friends believed it changed based on pinocchio's personal beliefs and attempted deceptions, while the christians apparently believed it changed based on whether his words reflected some absolute truth, regardless of his personal thoughts and beliefs. fwiw
I'm saying that the Pinocchio nose thing is clearly based on his lying, i.e. on stating something he knows/believes to be false, not an objective truth. It is the theme of the story.
And all too commonly, Christian (and other) fundamentalists extend beyond mere faith into delusion where they lose track of what is their personal belief and what is ubiquitous accepted reality. Sometimes to the point that that they actually cannot accept that others simply don't believe in their deity. They genuinely think that their deity not only definitely exists, but such a fact is unquestionably apparent on the face of it to everyone and competely beyond reproach. So when one claims to be an atheist, or hold another faith, the only conclusion that they can come to is that you actually do know their deity exists and so your denial of them is either out of evil, misplaced anger, brainwashing (by evil men or the devil or something similar) or you are a grifter with some other agenda. Whatever it is, it most certainly can't be a sound, justified, reasonable lack of belief in their god. That's nonsense.
Again, that's not all of them, but any means. But it's not uncommon either.
If you say something you're convinced is correct with the best intentions. But it turns out to be incorrect. Will you burn in hell for breaking one of the 10 commandments? Asking for a friend.
I'd like to believe there would be some carve out here for willful ignorance. Like if the truth is easily accessible and you choose to believe contrary to that because of some other thing, maybe you don't get grace on that.
Going strictly by the biblical wording, that wouldn't matter. As long as you definitely believe it's true, it's not a lie. Now, if you have some doubt, but don't admit it? That would qualify.
Lying by omission and lying by over-reaction ("histrionics", but that word's a bit nerdy) are definitely ones that ought to be added to Bible 3, which I heard~ is supposed to be a prequel—isn't that fun?
Yep, still working through this with one of my kids. Lying requires an intent to deceive, to mislead. You can say things that are untrue without meaning to, which is not lying
This only works if Pinocchio is an all knowing entity. If he doesn't know shit about the universe, than his lies aren't proof that the opposite statement is true.
"When I talk to philosophers on Zoom, I use a background that's a picture of my real background so that I can trick them into having a justified true belief that is not knowledge."
"I am telling you, I saw Kojima in my town's coffee shop ride the rising gear of metal in the fountain!"
However, I'm a hyperphantasiac to the extreme where I hardly distinguish between being present in my dreams and reality.
I told you the truth, I did see that, but the fact of whether that happened is not there.
Iunno tho, I'm taking a wild guess of what they could've meant, this logic seems most sound for that statement to be sensical
Truth: during the middle ages doctors believed that disease was caused by miasma, or "bad air," and that by breathing it in could cause illness.
Fact: Disease was caused by microorganisms, which spread by vectors such as insect bites, coughing and sneezing, and contaminated drinking water, among others.
48 Comments
tacosanonymous@mander.xyz · 85 pts · 25d
How would he know?
Because, he’d have to know the answer and then willfully lie for his nose to grow. Alternatively, giving a confident answer when he doesn’t know would make his nose grow regardless of him being correct.
DashboTreeFrog@discuss.online · 242 pts · 25d
They actually get into this in the other panels that aren't posted. Having trouble finding non-reddit links to it though https://www.reddit.com/r/theotherendcomics/s/9X4C16J7yi
Also, not very experienced adding photos from my phone to comments but trying to attach screenshots
Siethron@lemmy.world · 59 pts · 25d
Lies of P is looking weird
87Six@lemmy.zip · 13 pts · 24d
This asks more questions than it answers lmao
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 15 pts · 24d
DashboTreeFrog@discuss.online · 6 pts · 24d
And these scientists are sure as hell gonna work on answering them with that freaky deaky nose
Hideakikarate@sh.itjust.works · 82 pts · 25d
I think in another comic, it was determined that it doesn't matter if he knew the answer. The nose knows the answer and changes size based on his answer.
Edit:
notabot@piefed.social · 21 pts · 25d
This one and the OP have different amounts of nose growth. One of them is a lie. Is nothing sacred anymore!!?!
tigeruppercut@lemmy.zip · 9 pts · 25d
Nah, I have it on good authority from Verizon that 3 mm is the same as 0.3 mm.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUpZg-Ua5ao
FiniteBanjo@feddit.online · 6 pts · 25d
It grew because he gave an answer he has no confidence in, but only by 0.3mm because the amount of truth in it is indiscernible.
wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz · 3 pts · 24d
Because he's an elf from the salvia dimension is my interpretation
BitUnWise@programming.dev · 55 pts · 25d
I've had conversations with my friends on whether his nose grows based on deception or the truth value of the statement. My friend and I with rather secular upbringings grew up thinking it was based on deception and my friends with rather extreme Christian upbringings grew up thinking it was based on the truth. Obviously a very small sample size but I do wonder if there is a correlation
kryptonianCodeMonkey@lemmy.world · 19 pts · 24d
Christian thinks that belief = truth. News at 11.
Ruthalas@infosec.pub · 1 pts · 24d
I think in this case it's the exact opposite. The secular friends believed it changed based on pinocchio's personal beliefs and attempted deceptions, while the christians apparently believed it changed based on whether his words reflected some absolute truth, regardless of his personal thoughts and beliefs. fwiw
kryptonianCodeMonkey@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 24d
I'm saying that the Pinocchio nose thing is clearly based on his lying, i.e. on stating something he knows/believes to be false, not an objective truth. It is the theme of the story.
And all too commonly, Christian (and other) fundamentalists extend beyond mere faith into delusion where they lose track of what is their personal belief and what is ubiquitous accepted reality. Sometimes to the point that that they actually cannot accept that others simply don't believe in their deity. They genuinely think that their deity not only definitely exists, but such a fact is unquestionably apparent on the face of it to everyone and competely beyond reproach. So when one claims to be an atheist, or hold another faith, the only conclusion that they can come to is that you actually do know their deity exists and so your denial of them is either out of evil, misplaced anger, brainwashing (by evil men or the devil or something similar) or you are a grifter with some other agenda. Whatever it is, it most certainly can't be a sound, justified, reasonable lack of belief in their god. That's nonsense.
Again, that's not all of them, but any means. But it's not uncommon either.
petrol_sniff_king@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 24d
Based on the small sample size of arguments I've personally had with proud theologians, I absolutely think this is true.
hakunawazo@lemmy.world · 35 pts · 24d
Shrek Pinoccio:
BillyClark@piefed.social · 35 pts · 25d
The other advantage is that the more he lies, the more free firewood you can get.
deacon@lemmy.world · 16 pts · 25d
You monster.
finallymadeanaccount@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 25d
Shades of Cassidy's involuntary salami slices in the Preacher TV series (given that he regrows that which is thinly-sliced off) ...
gray@lemmy.ml · 20 pts · 25d
If you say something you're convinced is correct with the best intentions. But it turns out to be incorrect. Will you burn in hell for breaking one of the 10 commandments? Asking for a friend.
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 14 pts · 24d
No. Lying is making a claim you actually believe is untrue. It's actual truthfulness is irrelevant. If you believe it's true, it's not a lie.
psivchaz@reddthat.com · 5 pts · 24d
I'd like to believe there would be some carve out here for willful ignorance. Like if the truth is easily accessible and you choose to believe contrary to that because of some other thing, maybe you don't get grace on that.
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 24d
Going strictly by the biblical wording, that wouldn't matter. As long as you definitely believe it's true, it's not a lie. Now, if you have some doubt, but don't admit it? That would qualify.
petrol_sniff_king@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 24d
Lying by omission and lying by over-reaction ("histrionics", but that word's a bit nerdy) are definitely ones that ought to be added to Bible 3, which I heard~ is supposed to be a prequel—isn't that fun?
5too@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 24d
Yep, still working through this with one of my kids. Lying requires an intent to deceive, to mislead. You can say things that are untrue without meaning to, which is not lying
AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works · 9 pts · 25d
Doesn't matter, by the Bible you're either saved and forgiven or burning in hell anyway.
gray@lemmy.ml · 4 pts · 25d
Right, Christianity is so convenient that way
Okokimup@lemmy.world · 14 pts · 24d
The all-knowing lie-detector
SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 24d
This only works if Pinocchio is an all knowing entity. If he doesn't know shit about the universe, than his lies aren't proof that the opposite statement is true.
Etterra@discuss.online · 7 pts · 25d
Unfortunately truth does not usually equal fact.
Feathercrown@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 24d
"When I talk to philosophers on Zoom, I use a background that's a picture of my real background so that I can trick them into having a justified true belief that is not knowledge."
PlaidBaron@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 24d
You monster.
tias@discuss.tchncs.de · 6 pts · 25d
Elaborate.
MrChewy@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 25d
"I am telling you, I saw Kojima in my town's coffee shop ride the rising gear of metal in the fountain!" However, I'm a hyperphantasiac to the extreme where I hardly distinguish between being present in my dreams and reality. I told you the truth, I did see that, but the fact of whether that happened is not there.
Iunno tho, I'm taking a wild guess of what they could've meant, this logic seems most sound for that statement to be sensical
Alcoholicorn@mander.xyz · 7 pts · 24d
I met Kojima in a coffee shop too!
Turns out there's a lot of Kojima, it's not an uncommon name.
MrChewy@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 24d
Is it uncommon to to ride gears of metal that are rising tho?
Grail@multiverse.soulism.net · 2 pts · 24d
You mean honesty, not truth
MrChewy@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 24d
In the hypothetical, it is the truth, just not of the shared reality (am I schizoposting with this one btw?)
Grail@multiverse.soulism.net · 1 pts · 24d
Ooh are you an antirealist?
MrChewy@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 24d
No, it's just somewhat of a struggle to distinguish reality from dream from how exactly the same I experience them :(
Just trying to argue that technically, truth and fact don't need to neccessarily match depending on the subjective experience of the person telling it
Etterra@discuss.online · 1 pts · 10d
Archaic example.
Truth: during the middle ages doctors believed that disease was caused by miasma, or "bad air," and that by breathing it in could cause illness.
Fact: Disease was caused by microorganisms, which spread by vectors such as insect bites, coughing and sneezing, and contaminated drinking water, among others.
hansolo@lemmy.today · 4 pts · 24d
Fool. Wong question.
"Do things in undiscovered extra dimensions affect our dimension by way gravity?"
suff@piefed.social · 2 pts · 25d
Thanks for pointing me to kohney.com
alcea@feddit.org · 2 pts · 24d
If taking hostages is required for solving the "universe's secrets" it can gladly keep its secrets.
At the end of it there will be a CEO extracting money from completly unrelated research. Humans are dumb.
Tja@programming.dev · 8 pts · 24d
I hate to break it to you, but Pinocchio isn't real. This whole comic might be pure fiction. Bummer, I know.
alcea@feddit.org · 1 pts · 20d
Bu But But the economic value of that nose !!111
Oppopity@lemmy.ml · 1 pts · 24d
Read that as gravy at first