Years ago I kept having this argument with the party fighter. I was playing a rogue. He had some sort of magical lens with a bonus to find traps. I was like, "let me use that so I can find traps better. You can't even find traps with a DC above 20, rules as written. That's a rogue class feature. With the lens I'd be getting like 27 if I take 10."
He was like "no. It's mine. I found it."
Like, my guy. We're all in danger if we don't find the traps. You don't see me holding onto armor I can't use.
Stuff like this is why games usually end by the 6th session.
See also: rogue steals from the party because “It’s what my character would do!” but gets upset when my barbarian kills them afterwards for the same reason.
There's a place for a dysfunctional party dynamic, particularly early on in a game. Savvy DMs can factor party dysfunction into the difficulty of an encounter and allow the story to progress even as individual party members tussle with one another.
I think one thing that players and DMs both forget to include is paths for failure in a given adventure or chronicle. Sometimes its good to write out a "Bad Ending" to a game and allow players to experience it. This doesn't have to be the end of the group, the end of the campaign, or even the end of the story. Particularly early on "everyone fucks up and gets thrown in jail together" can be its own kind of team-building exercise. And for faster and more heavy handed games, a "bad ending" can open up the possibility for players to roll up a new party to pick up the banner that the old party dropped.
What really matters is that the game itself is structured so everyone has an opportunity to enjoy themselves. And that can include a kleptomaniac and a short-tempered brute, so long as the players can agree that's the kind of game they're ready to play.
But it's definitely harder to do than a game in which everyone's a team player.
Hah, I should have. I do remember letting him search first once and being petty about it. "Oh, you got a 12? A whole twelve? Woowwwww. I'm going to take 10 and get a, let's see- twenty-two. Would be a 27 if only I had some sort of magical equipment boost"
(For those of you who don't remember, "take 10" was a 3e rule where you can opt to treat the roll as if you'd rolled a 10, so long as you're not in immediate danger. https://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/usingSkills.htm )
No, it doesn't. That's precicely what classes are for. Everyone has their job and the rogue's job is to finde traps and deal sneak attack damage. You don't see the rogue going around demanding second wind, action surge and heavy armor, now do you?
Oh sorry, I miss read it as you couldn't because rogue had some effect that only worked to 20, so you having it would only benefit you slightly until you hit the ceiling of 20 for your rogue mechanic.
Which bit of the spear, though? Cause a spear is just a staff with a pointy bit on the top, so if you've got the pointy bit, then it's just a spear. If not, you've got a staff.
But if the druid is always using wildshape or battlefield control magic they hardly need a weapon, though being OP it might have wildshape bonuses and/or enhancement to magic
Actually it would almost certainly be far better for one than the other, depending on its particular flavour of OP as each weapon
A part from including psychosis and neurosis into my characters, I would, as a rule, just avoid conflict with other players. If the druid seemed even halfway interested I'd just decide my fighter was an elitist about using greatswords only and avoid elmo.
I'd sniff out the DM's plan. The DM is the true opponent and I'd be ever vigilant. And/or dead. A lot of dead. Mostly dead.
49 Comments
jjjalljs@ttrpg.network · 78 pts · 330d
Years ago I kept having this argument with the party fighter. I was playing a rogue. He had some sort of magical lens with a bonus to find traps. I was like, "let me use that so I can find traps better. You can't even find traps with a DC above 20, rules as written. That's a rogue class feature. With the lens I'd be getting like 27 if I take 10."
He was like "no. It's mine. I found it."
Like, my guy. We're all in danger if we don't find the traps. You don't see me holding onto armor I can't use.
binarytobis@lemmy.world · 54 pts · 330d
Stuff like this is why games usually end by the 6th session.
See also: rogue steals from the party because “It’s what my character would do!” but gets upset when my barbarian kills them afterwards for the same reason.
jjjalljs@ttrpg.network · 10 pts · 330d
That doesn't seem like the same thing at all. Can you elaborate?
binarytobis@lemmy.world · 33 pts · 330d
Both are example of stubborn group members who need to be flexible and work well with others.
jjjalljs@ttrpg.network · 11 pts · 330d
The fighter in my story is the rogue in your story? That makes sense.
binarytobis@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 330d
Yes indeed!
Bakkoda@sh.itjust.works · 6 pts · 330d
Berserker rage is a helluva drug
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 329d
There's a place for a dysfunctional party dynamic, particularly early on in a game. Savvy DMs can factor party dysfunction into the difficulty of an encounter and allow the story to progress even as individual party members tussle with one another.
I think one thing that players and DMs both forget to include is paths for failure in a given adventure or chronicle. Sometimes its good to write out a "Bad Ending" to a game and allow players to experience it. This doesn't have to be the end of the group, the end of the campaign, or even the end of the story. Particularly early on "everyone fucks up and gets thrown in jail together" can be its own kind of team-building exercise. And for faster and more heavy handed games, a "bad ending" can open up the possibility for players to roll up a new party to pick up the banner that the old party dropped.
What really matters is that the game itself is structured so everyone has an opportunity to enjoy themselves. And that can include a kleptomaniac and a short-tempered brute, so long as the players can agree that's the kind of game they're ready to play.
But it's definitely harder to do than a game in which everyone's a team player.
YerLam@lemmy.world · 26 pts · 330d
Did you let him become chief trap finder? That's a quick way to get the item back.
jjjalljs@ttrpg.network · 30 pts · 330d
Hah, I should have. I do remember letting him search first once and being petty about it. "Oh, you got a 12? A whole twelve? Woowwwww. I'm going to take 10 and get a, let's see- twenty-two. Would be a 27 if only I had some sort of magical equipment boost"
(For those of you who don't remember, "take 10" was a 3e rule where you can opt to treat the roll as if you'd rolled a 10, so long as you're not in immediate danger. https://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/usingSkills.htm )
edit: fixed typo that reversed meaning
VindictiveJudge@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 330d
*not in immediate danger
feannag@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 330d
Which got even more OP in 5e, at least for the rogue.
peoplebeproblems@midwest.social · 5 pts · 330d
TBF, that's pretty much what every rogue I know would say
Nikls94@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 329d
Random VLDL that fits nicely: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WKr7K6pe83w&pp=ygUWVmxkbCBmYWlsZWQgcGVyY2VwdGlvbg%3D%3D
Szyler@lemmy.world · -3 pts · 329d
Make the lens also go above that rule, because that rule sucks if the dm is adding a lot of traps above 20.
XM34@feddit.org · 8 pts · 329d
No, it doesn't. That's precicely what classes are for. Everyone has their job and the rogue's job is to finde traps and deal sneak attack damage. You don't see the rogue going around demanding second wind, action surge and heavy armor, now do you?
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social · 2 pts · 329d
Yes, I see rogues doing that
Szyler@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 329d
Oh sorry, I miss read it as you couldn't because rogue had some effect that only worked to 20, so you having it would only benefit you slightly until you hit the ceiling of 20 for your rogue mechanic.
ZombiFrancis@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 329d
I mean 'sneak attack totally applies here' is the classic 'rogue doing fighter things' trope.
don@lemmy.ca · 43 pts · 330d
Druid: You wanna try it
Fighter: Yeah let’s see what happens
Both: grab item together
webghost0101@sopuli.xyz · 26 pts · 330d
One side becomes staff, one side becomes spear.
Its rather unwieldy.
Susaga@sh.itjust.works · 13 pts · 330d
Which bit of the spear, though? Cause a spear is just a staff with a pointy bit on the top, so if you've got the pointy bit, then it's just a spear. If not, you've got a staff.
KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 5 pts · 330d
Tip or stern of either.
webghost0101@sopuli.xyz · 4 pts · 330d
Hand that is closest.
snooggums@piefed.world · 13 pts · 330d
Oh, so it is a swinger party.
peoplebeproblems@midwest.social · 6 pts · 330d
They merge into a grotesque tree with a moving face that makes a sound when ever a breeze occurs "kill me... kill me..."
Szyler@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 329d
It splits in two, and both weapons now gain a downside as they broke the magic holding the power in balance between the two states.
The Druid loses bonus actions on hits below 10 or when surrounded.
The fighter lets out a massive roar that causes all neaby targets to focus him when he lands a critical hit.
edgemaster72@lemmy.world · 29 pts · 330d
Meanwhile, the Rogue with a bag of holding: "What staff/spear are you guys talking about?"
rainwall@piefed.social · 11 pts · 330d
You mean the rogue with an epic, OP bag of holding that steals things automatically.
surph_ninja@lemmy.world · 26 pts · 330d
Proper min/max-ers will set aside their ego, and coordinate swapping the item as necessary. So thankful I’ve got a group with zero ego issues.
chuckleslord@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 330d
It requires attunement
surph_ninja@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 329d
Good point. Still not worth a fight.
pennomi@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 330d
Szyler@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 329d
Russian world war 1 strategy of having a dead mate. When your friend dies you pick up his weapon and continue on.
Kolanaki@pawb.social · 6 pts · 329d
Bard: "I'll just hold onto it until you two work this out."
staff turns into a giant horse cock dildo
NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone · 4 pts · 329d
At least with op staff you’d have people to answer the phone and arrange party logistics.
moondoggie@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 329d
And pizza on Fridays
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 329d
Standard Action: Use the item
Move Action: Throw the item to the other guy
Jerkface@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 328d
Exactly what I came here for.
markovs_gun@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 329d
This is the plot of Soul Calibur lmao
Blackmist@feddit.uk · 3 pts · 329d
Hunter weapon tbh
Witchfire@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 330d
They give it to the Rogue because they're both convinced it's cursed
ZombiFrancis@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 329d
I'd let the druid have it everytime. The druid could use either version and my fighters would scoff at a silly 1d6 weapon. Not even a martial weapon.
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social · 2 pts · 329d
On strike effects go brrrr
psud@aussie.zone · 2 pts · 326d
But if the druid is always using wildshape or battlefield control magic they hardly need a weapon, though being OP it might have wildshape bonuses and/or enhancement to magic
Actually it would almost certainly be far better for one than the other, depending on its particular flavour of OP as each weapon
ZombiFrancis@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 326d
A part from including psychosis and neurosis into my characters, I would, as a rule, just avoid conflict with other players. If the druid seemed even halfway interested I'd just decide my fighter was an elitist about using greatswords only and avoid elmo.
I'd sniff out the DM's plan. The DM is the true opponent and I'd be ever vigilant. And/or dead. A lot of dead. Mostly dead.
Xenny@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 329d
Multi class time
otter@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 328d
Real talk: do you allow wildshape to include owlbear as an option? 😅😶
psud@aussie.zone · 1 pts · 326d
If bg3 is any indication there's nothing wrong with an owlbear druid in a party that doesn't otherwise have a tank
otter@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 326d
FTFY 🥰