In Canada, especially in the rural parts, it is a ceremony that lasts on average about one hour and takes place from the kitchen table / living room couch to the end of the driveway. And there is a 20% chance that the farewell may be cancelled and the visitor invited to stay for supper or to spend the night, where the ritual will be repeated again the next day.
Okay but if we're talking about Midwesterners, they're not leaving yet. There's gonna be another 20 minutes of conversation while everyone is standing, then they'll head over to the door for another 20 minutes conversation, once the door is open they'll stand on the front porch and talk for another 20 minutes.
As a midwesterner, it is unethically misleading to suggest this level of efficiency to an outsider. While, yes, the welp-knee-slap is a polite and unmistakable sign that the life of this social interaction is coming to an end, that does not mean that interaction is over. The journey from "welp" to guests pulling out of your driveway can be anywhere from a 5 to 45 minute trek of baby-stepping toward the door, off the porch, down the footpath, to the car, all while tying up loose ends in conversations, corraling children (and toys, diaper bags, electronics, etc.), planning follow up meetings, last minute inquiries into various family members' health, work and relationship status, discussions over the weather and road conditions, misremembered jokes someone heard from a guy at work, repeated offers of food or drink for the road, and assurances that either they're not too tipsy to drive or that they "actually drive better with a buzz" while turning down offers to sleep it off... their kids may very well sit belted in the car longer while waiting for the adults to stop talking at the car door than they will for the entire drive home. The Midwestern goodbye may be one of the least efficient goodbyes every devised by man.
Haydn's patron Nikolaus I, Prince Esterházy was resident, together with all his musicians and retinue, at his favorite summer palace at Eszterháza in rural Hungary. The stay there had been longer than expected, and most of the musicians had been forced to leave their wives back at home in Eisenstadt, about a day's journey away. Longing to return, the musicians appealed to their Kapellmeister for help. The diplomatic Haydn, instead of making a direct appeal, put his request into the music of the symphony: during the final adagio each musician stops playing, snuffs out the candle on his music stand, and leaves in turn, so that at the end, there are just two muted violins left (played by Haydn himself and his concertmaster, Luigi Tomasini). Esterházy seems to have understood the message: the court returned to Eisenstadt the day following the performance.
From Texas, we do this too, but we combine it with the wrap up conversation, then the standing by the door conversation, then the standing by the car conversation.
Then the carpooling to another town conversation, then the "for fuck sake, how did I end up following you home?" conversation, and eventually the "happy 60th anniversary, honey!" conversation
My Bio father used to politely say "Honey let's go to sleep that the visitors want to go home" lol since my father is notoriously antisocial and rude people would laugh amd leave.
The slapping of the knee and the "Welp!" is just the start of the goodbye ritual. It only takes another hour, (sometimes longer), for the guest to actually go away. Since all parties will stand and visit in the home and then visit all the way to the car as everyone very slowly makes their way to the vehicle.
Once the guest actually gets into the car, you can then begin the final 30+ minute ritual of the leaving. And as the guests finally leave, the hosts must follow them down the driveway waving until the guests are out of sight.
And the kids are standing there the whole time saying "damn it we had time to finish that game of Tecmo Bowl if you had gotten us when you were actually going to leave!
"hey, I'm tired / have plans so I'm going to have to kick you out, it was lovely to see you, I hope we can meet again soon!" with a sincere tone. It's show my friends and I do it.
There are so many ways to do this all over the world!
How about
"We really should do this again sometime!" - but then both parties immediately notice that was slightly too forward and everybody makes an awkward dance to express "I didn't mean to throw you out" and "No offense taken, really" ...
Whatever the reasons, it always takes substantial time from the initial communication 'til the final closing of the front door and a heaved sigh on both sides of it.
My coworkers boyfriend is iconic in my eyes:
When he feels like he socialized enough he just says goodbye and goes to his workshop. In his own home. He just leaves them then and there and they figure it the rest.
My wife leaves the room, comes back in pajamas, and then falls asleep in the middle of the social event until people figure out that it's time to leave.
I'm poly and a pack type, so I usually just prefer that the people I'm with stay forever.
But if they aren't my people and I have to get up early and do stuff without them, I'll usually start talking about needing to go to bed soon to do a thing, and talk about that thing if I feel comfortable with them knowing. Usually steers things quickly.
If it was my parents or something, I would probably go with the "welp, it's getting to be about that time. It was great seeing you." Or "we should do this more often" Etc.
Psych nurse protip: "I wanna be able to give this my full attention so we're gonna put a pin in this and circle back." Then you literally just leave, possibly mid-sentence if they're really that hyperverbal. Some acutely manic patients are so hyperverbal that I have to take their temperature under their armpit because they literally cannot keep their mouth closed around the probe.
I just say: "Well, I'm going to bed. You're welcome to stay if you like. I can bring you some bedding for the couch. Otherwise, please lock the door on your way out."
As a visitor, it helps to be an introvert, so I can pick up the signals long before it becomes a thing. My excuse to leave usually is something about having to get up early for work. Understandable and convenient.
As for being the host with that problem... well, that's my secret. Don't host. :p
It's a funny thing because it's in everyone's best intrest to have a clear signal when someone has had enough of socializing but no one has the balls to just say that.
52 Comments
dnick@sh.itjust.works · 76 pts · 247d
But you don't actually head out at that point, that's just the time you start to reckon whether you outa.
piconaut@lemmy.ca · 20 pts · 247d
I think I've seen a documentary on this topic
https://youtu.be/oiSzwoJr4-0
rainwall@piefed.social · 8 pts · 247d
Ha, i was thinking more this one:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MHCmE4ABnNs
A_norny_mousse@feddit.org · 3 pts · 246d
HowAbt2day@futurology.today · 2 pts · 246d
Whatever
ininewcrow@lemmy.ca · 46 pts · 247d
In Canada, especially in the rural parts, it is a ceremony that lasts on average about one hour and takes place from the kitchen table / living room couch to the end of the driveway. And there is a 20% chance that the farewell may be cancelled and the visitor invited to stay for supper or to spend the night, where the ritual will be repeated again the next day.
NaibofTabr@infosec.pub · 9 pts · 247d
I don't think we're there just yet...
GalacticSushi@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 38 pts · 247d
Okay but if we're talking about Midwesterners, they're not leaving yet. There's gonna be another 20 minutes of conversation while everyone is standing, then they'll head over to the door for another 20 minutes conversation, once the door is open they'll stand on the front porch and talk for another 20 minutes.
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 14 pts · 246d
Further confirmation of my hypothesis that (upper) Midwesterners never stopped being mostly rural Scandinavians.
The fact that several of those states have more bars than churches, like it's SUPPOSED to be, is another hint 😁
dipcart@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 247d
It is very possible that western Canadians are midwesterners now that I hear this description
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 8 pts · 246d
And they're all Scandinavians.
dipcart@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 246d
Lol I'm Fijian but yeah I get you
kryptonianCodeMonkey@lemmy.world · 35 pts · 246d
As a midwesterner, it is unethically misleading to suggest this level of efficiency to an outsider. While, yes, the welp-knee-slap is a polite and unmistakable sign that the life of this social interaction is coming to an end, that does not mean that interaction is over. The journey from "welp" to guests pulling out of your driveway can be anywhere from a 5 to 45 minute trek of baby-stepping toward the door, off the porch, down the footpath, to the car, all while tying up loose ends in conversations, corraling children (and toys, diaper bags, electronics, etc.), planning follow up meetings, last minute inquiries into various family members' health, work and relationship status, discussions over the weather and road conditions, misremembered jokes someone heard from a guy at work, repeated offers of food or drink for the road, and assurances that either they're not too tipsy to drive or that they "actually drive better with a buzz" while turning down offers to sleep it off... their kids may very well sit belted in the car longer while waiting for the adults to stop talking at the car door than they will for the entire drive home. The Midwestern goodbye may be one of the least efficient goodbyes every devised by man.
waggz@programming.dev · 5 pts · 246d
you are spoiled if your upper limit is 45 minutes. i once stood in a doorway for THREE HOURS
danekrae@lemmy.world · 31 pts · 247d
Easy...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symphony_No._45_(Haydn)
WhiteOakBayou@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 246d
I know when people usually say this they are being jerks but in the literal sense I bet you are fun at parties. This is a great anecdote.
danekrae@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 246d
Thank you, that's really nice of you to say!
Gerudo@lemmy.zip · 30 pts · 247d
From Texas, we do this too, but we combine it with the wrap up conversation, then the standing by the door conversation, then the standing by the car conversation.
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 5 pts · 246d
Then the carpooling to another town conversation, then the "for fuck sake, how did I end up following you home?" conversation, and eventually the "happy 60th anniversary, honey!" conversation
Aneb@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 246d
For real this is also the Midwest too. Its the long goodbye
FuyuhikoDate@feddit.org · 28 pts · 247d
German way:
Sooooo slaps hands on hips and stands slowly up
MissJinx@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 246d
My Bio father used to politely say "Honey let's go to sleep that the visitors want to go home" lol since my father is notoriously antisocial and rude people would laugh amd leave.
Almacca@aussie.zone · 12 pts · 246d
My last partner used to just cheerfully say 'Get out of my house.' which worked well enough.
Bluewing@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 246d
The slapping of the knee and the "Welp!" is just the start of the goodbye ritual. It only takes another hour, (sometimes longer), for the guest to actually go away. Since all parties will stand and visit in the home and then visit all the way to the car as everyone very slowly makes their way to the vehicle.
Once the guest actually gets into the car, you can then begin the final 30+ minute ritual of the leaving. And as the guests finally leave, the hosts must follow them down the driveway waving until the guests are out of sight.
(This is the abbreviated version)
eestileib@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 1 pts · 245d
And the kids are standing there the whole time saying "damn it we had time to finish that game of Tecmo Bowl if you had gotten us when you were actually going to leave!
chunes@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 246d
It's the good old Irish exit for me. Even if I was the host.
Saapas@piefed.zip · 11 pts · 247d
You make up a commandment from God telling your visitors to know when to leave, obviously
(This shit cracked me up)
FuyuhikoDate@feddit.org · 7 pts · 247d
I was born and raised a Muslim... Never knew that... That's now my way to go tactic!
NaibofTabr@infosec.pub · 5 pts · 247d
Yep, definitely can't have anyone talking directly to your wives.
TigerAce@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 11 pts · 246d
"hey, I'm tired / have plans so I'm going to have to kick you out, it was lovely to see you, I hope we can meet again soon!" with a sincere tone. It's show my friends and I do it.
trashcroissant@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 4 pts · 246d
Why the fuck is this not the standard, like bitch just say what you mean I'm tired and I don't want to read your secret signals.
TigerAce@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 246d
Welcome to Dutch directness.
NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone · 8 pts · 246d
This is how you get out of a social situation in England too, except you say “well”.
A_norny_mousse@feddit.org · 8 pts · 246d
There are so many ways to do this all over the world!
How about
"We really should do this again sometime!" - but then both parties immediately notice that was slightly too forward and everybody makes an awkward dance to express "I didn't mean to throw you out" and "No offense taken, really" ...
Whatever the reasons, it always takes substantial time from the initial communication 'til the final closing of the front door and a heaved sigh on both sides of it.
InevitableWaffles@midwest.social · 7 pts · 246d
My goto as a Midwesterner is, "Well, I'll get out of your hair. "
dogs0n@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 246d
And then you sign over the deed to the house and hand them the keys
ComfortableRaspberry@feddit.org · 6 pts · 245d
My coworkers boyfriend is iconic in my eyes:
When he feels like he socialized enough he just says goodbye and goes to his workshop. In his own home. He just leaves them then and there and they figure it the rest.
I think that's hilarious and awesome :D
Toribor@corndog.social · 3 pts · 244d
My wife leaves the room, comes back in pajamas, and then falls asleep in the middle of the social event until people figure out that it's time to leave.
ComfortableRaspberry@feddit.org · 1 pts · 244d
I mean.. the signs are all there. It's their own fault, if they don't leave ¯_(ツ)_/¯
cnirrad@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 247d
Midwesterner here. This is absolutely correct.
secretsoundwave@lemmy.ml · 5 pts · 246d
In the South we sometimes use "Well... Let me let you go..."
SCmSTR@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 4 pts · 246d
I'm poly and a pack type, so I usually just prefer that the people I'm with stay forever.
But if they aren't my people and I have to get up early and do stuff without them, I'll usually start talking about needing to go to bed soon to do a thing, and talk about that thing if I feel comfortable with them knowing. Usually steers things quickly.
If it was my parents or something, I would probably go with the "welp, it's getting to be about that time. It was great seeing you." Or "we should do this more often" Etc.
Apytele@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 246d
Psych nurse protip: "I wanna be able to give this my full attention so we're gonna put a pin in this and circle back." Then you literally just leave, possibly mid-sentence if they're really that hyperverbal. Some acutely manic patients are so hyperverbal that I have to take their temperature under their armpit because they literally cannot keep their mouth closed around the probe.
electric_nan@lemmy.ml · 4 pts · 247d
I just say: "Well, I'm going to bed. You're welcome to stay if you like. I can bring you some bedding for the couch. Otherwise, please lock the door on your way out."
DrDystopia@lemy.lol · 1 pts · 246d
Congrats, you've gotten another new housemate!
DrDystopia@lemy.lol · 1 pts · 246d
Congrats, you've gotten another new housemate!
electric_nan@lemmy.ml · 1 pts · 246d
Hasn't happened yet.
DrDystopia@lemy.lol · 2 pts · 245d
I live behind your couch, you don't vacuum thoroughly enough to get me.
electric_nan@lemmy.ml · 2 pts · 245d
Goddam roomba!
Rhaedas@fedia.io · 2 pts · 247d
As a visitor, it helps to be an introvert, so I can pick up the signals long before it becomes a thing. My excuse to leave usually is something about having to get up early for work. Understandable and convenient.
As for being the host with that problem... well, that's my secret. Don't host. :p
halvar@lemy.lol · 1 pts · 245d
It's a funny thing because it's in everyone's best intrest to have a clear signal when someone has had enough of socializing but no one has the balls to just say that.
87Six@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 246d
Be friends enough with people to tell them to fuck off before they give you a hug and leave just yo hang out again 20 years later
It's what I do with all my friends
Some found it offensive how unfiltered I speak, and left, and that's fine. If I couldn't speak plainly around my friends I think I'd go insane.