I love her. She's the queen of TMI during Q&A's. Like when she casually dropped that before she met her now husband, she "slept" with just about every single guest star. What a legend.
I never use the tag. Anyone annoying enough that I want to remember not to engage with them, I just default to blocking. Do they post good content or something?
So what's your point and how did you meaningfully contribute to the conversation by essentially asking what it means to sleep with someone and then saying you know what it means to sleep with someone, while somehow having an undeserved air of superiority?
They're being a bit prickly about it, but using quotes like that certainly implied to me as reader that it was meaning a suggestive usage, which doesn't make sense since the plaintext version already means fucking. I mean I understood their meaning and realized they were just unnecessary quotation marks quickly, but I also at first wondered if there was some sort of third meaning beyond rest or sex that was being suggested by the marks, so I kind of feel like the reaction to them here is a bit overblown.
Sorry, I'm confused. Weren't we talking about human language here, or are you using "never" figuratively?
(The quotation marks here are referring to acual quotation of the word you used, not a standard feature of the way the word is normally written or an indicator of some alternate meaning. I'm spelling this out because just in case you're unaware of that usage of quotation marks, which frequently occurs in the context of quoting someone. Unless you're literally asserting that the word "slept" is never quoted, "never" is a strong word to use.)
God I remember reruns of TOS on G4 where they would have like a side panel with counters for things that happened in the episode. “Spock says illogical” “Uhura panty shot”
I guess the one thing we "missed out on" (I say this sarcastically) is that the teardowns of screen-worn skants indicate that there's kind of a half-underwear thing there.
The way that the TOS uniforms "worked" is that they seem to have just declared the Space Cheerleader Shorts as clothing instead of just underwear in much the same way that actual cheerleaders have and therefore it's totally OK for the ladies to kick or crawl around in such a way to expose the Space Cheerleader Shorts.
And, like ... damn, people. I thought that a fanservice-y 90s anime aimed at teenage boys had a lot of upskirt, then I watched TOS reruns.
But, because it was very quickly relegated to background characters only, we'll never know if the skants were hiding a genuine advance in upskirt technology and only have Marina's word to go on that they probably ... weren't.
Which, well, I think mostly I just wanted to say "genuine advance in upskirt technology" and so therefore I think it's OK that the skants didn't get used more in TNG.
I'm quite fond of the long dress she got for one season. I'm sure it was hell as a costume, but I thought it looked tasteful. I also have the idea that the psychological/psychiatric lead on the ship ought to look somewhat "different" when she's working. Her uniform should be more casual, because her role is one where you want people to be able to get away from the structure, and to trust her confidentiality. The catsuits were dumb, and the Farpoint / S1 miniskirt was scandalous. but I did like the full-length dress.
Pretty much every "show off the attractive female main character" outfit that they've invented for Trek has not worked for me. Troi's outfits, Seven's outfits, T'pol's outfits... I think that actually the only exception is the Farpoint miniskirt and even then it just looks attractive but I don't like what it meant for Troi's brains so all things being equal I actually like her the most in the standard uniform jumpsuit which is, quite frankly, already designed to make people look good.
Now that we're decades away from the show and everybody involved has been interviewed a bunch of times, what I actually wish we could have seen was Troi as the diplomatic counselor instead of the vague psychological lead / poorly utilized character that we got. Because if she was the ship's therapist the long dress would work because it is tasteful and different yet still professional, but then we'd not be seeing her on the bridge the way we did.
My head canon is that when a new civilization joins the Federation, they get to pick the new Starfleet uniforms. The Betazeds gave us the TOS miniskirts.
You're a better man (I assume) than me. My young self very much appreciated Sevens outfit back in the day. Although I have to admit, the episode where she travels back in time to the Voyager in dry dock and wears the science uniform plus a ponytail was also a great look for her.
I don't think I'd categorize that as "better" just pickier about wardrobe?
Then again, at least later on in life I'm a boudoir and fine art photographer so all of that concentrated miniskirt vs catsuit energy went somewhere more positive than ... wherever Berman went with it, LOL.
I was just thinking about Troi's season 1 jumpsuit. She wore the "skant" for one episode, then that blue-grey loose fitting jumpsuit with the ruched waist sash for the rest of season one, then the mauve catsuit. That jumpsuit was made of denim, it was honestly the most modest things he wore. We'd call Yar's clingy spandex outfit the scandalous one if it weren't what all the men were also unironically wearing.
Carrie Fisher said of the slave Leia bikini that, because it was rigid, while she was laying against Jabba it rode forward and anyone standing behind her could see "all the way to China." and she opined that's why the actor playing Boba Fett preferred standing back there.
They had to give Riker a reason to hate his guts to hell and back. And forcing him to organize and force his staff to do four shift rotations with no justification was pretty brilliant as a motivation.
But crucially, not by anyone in the main male cast. They threw a few skants on to a couple of male extras to forestall accusations of sexism. A figurative (and and near literal) figleaf.
Frankly, a unisex, utilitarian kilt would probably have worked a lot better for gals and guys, but someone got greedy for “underbutt” and ended up with an outfit so disliked that it was quickly phased out.
It was transparent at the time, kinda cringey actually.
At least ToS focused more on the Greek morality play part, though it had cringe transparent moments too.
There's a fine line between exploring ideas and preaching, so I tend to give them some leeway - but damn if TnG didn't rub me the wrong way from the start with the stupid costumes.
Fair take. Trying to include a moral lesson is like walking a tightrope: it's cool when it feels like a natural part of the story or world-building, but it's sooo cringy when it feels like a direct lecture from the writers to you.
TNG does get more subtle, but it also does have occasional moments that practically feel like He-Man turning to camera at the end of the show to tell you why drugs are bad or crime doesn't pay.
The "drugs are bad" speech from Symbiosis is cringey-funny. But then you get the terrorism conversation from The High Ground that makes you expect another cringe speech, but then it gets really good and controversial, all of a sudden. TNG S3 is the season with the best writing!
The very last scene in Encounter at Farpoint, Yar is also wearing the minidress uniform, AFAIK it's the only scene with her in it. The camera zooms in from about where it is above into a close-up of Picard, and Denise Crosby very pointedly steps out of shot partway through.
I have to wonder if that scene wasn't the first shot actually filmed, if they weren't planning on just, having all the women in crotch-length miniskirts until they had a couple shots in the can.
I love Marina but her character was so poorly written that Guinom (Goldberg's character) did Troi's job as counselor better than Troi ever could. Poor woman's entire role in the show was to be tortured and objectified while her character primary love interest shagged his way across the galaxy, Crusher probably got an award for her work during all his alien STDs.
Problem is this is partially Marina's fault. From her own reaccounting; it was basically her first job. The writers would go to the other actors and ask what they'd like to do in a given episode, or how they'd react to something, basically making the actors part of the script creation.
But Marina told the writers "uh, I don't know. Write me something. That's your job, isn't it?"
By the time she realised she had the power to actually make her character her own, it was already several seasons into TNG and far too late to actually change anything. The writers had long since stopped trying to include her in the writing process.
Hmm... I'll try and find a clip of where she told this story...
Yeah she had a lot more demand as a performer because she only worked theater beforehand and she knew what her worth was, and people tend to hate that. Shatner did a pretty good BTS doc on TNG and the kind of weird power plays that went on that even Patrick Stewart was occasionally the target of. This period of TV production was a real high pressure environment and people had careers given and broken over pretty minor shit.
IIRC from interviews that the uniforms remained generally uncomfortable. They were very stiff, and led to the famous “Picard Maneuver.” Sirtis’ uniform was changed to get rid of the dated “Cosmic Cheerleader” outfit. IMO her character’s early uniform was more in line with ToS’s making women on the Enterprise more “hot chick” than officer.
It's the pilot or first episode when you watch it on streaming all remastered and high Def and there's scenes where they clearly had trouble position the camera to avoid a tv-ma rating, that original outfit was so short. It's also rough she still had a lot of trauma from basically being used by the industry for sex appeal and noting else. But at least Star Trek had men in the background in the same length mini skirt.
Yeah for all the equality and tech it’s stupid to have women running around in skirts.
Star Trek always portrayed an ideal future but always failed in one way or another. Tng is also the one Star Trek i couldn’t get into, tried for a season and it was bad. I hear it gets better but I can’t watch a show that takes years to get good
I thought it was widely accepted that season 1 and 2 were not very good.
And the skirt among other things in the show arw definitely dated and at times sexist.
Im not sure what you guys are defending? lol
I love Star Trek but I don’t pretend some of the crap they have pumped out in the past is gold
They were transitioning from 80s to 90s TV. This isn't like the millionth boring anime series that fans say "gets good after episode 150", it was literally the 2nd try at Trek ever. No one's saying season 1 or 2 is gold (although there are good eps in there), but the first season is like TOS with growing pains. There's a reason it got 7 seasons, and if it'd been a total failure none of the other shows would exist.
If you like Voyager, DS9, and Enterprise there's no way you wouldn't like TNG. Giving up on the entire run because the first couple seasons weren't great after an almost 20 year hiatus from TOS is why your position seems a bit strange.
Continuing to watch a show that isnt good in the hope it gets better in a few seasons, now Thats strange. It’s also why I won’t watch game of thrones, I know the ending sucks now so what’s the point.
And you’re right, im a TOS fan. I don’t like ds9 and voyager. I like TOS, SNW and similar
It's a serialized 90s show, you don't have to watch the early seasons to understand the later ones. Pick any episode and just watch, as long as it isn't a 2-parter, you'll likely get the gist of what's going on. There are some longer story arcs that do span multiple episodes or even seasons, but the information is more at the "Lore" level than "necessary to understand what's going on in this episode".
Eg, if you knew the back story, you'd have had a better chance at catching the pun in the last sentence. But all you're missing out on is maybe exhaling a bit quicker as you read it and an eye roll.
Hell, if you don't want to watch all the episodes, you might be one of the rare people who might even enjoy the clip episodes and how much they tried to set up an in-universe reason to be showing clips from previous episodes. Like Riker's memory parasite.
I believe that second one is actually from the episode where O'Brian accidentally gets all the normal sized shirts stuck in the transporter buffer so everyone breaks out their night shirts until Data suggests reversing the polarity and running them through the deflector array, after which they just had to send some folk from the lower decks outside to grab and iron them.
That episode also had the subplot where Data's memory banks get slightly corrupted and mix up the Star Fleet Protocol Reference with the Karma Sutra and The Art of War for some humourously awkward moments with Picard, LaForge, and poor Wesley Crusher.
134 Comments
JoMiran@lemmy.ml · 196 pts · 192d
I love her. She's the queen of TMI during Q&A's. Like when she casually dropped that before she met her now husband, she "slept" with just about every single guest star. What a legend.
ruuster13@lemmy.zip · 85 pts · 192d
"Not just the men, but the women and..."
socsa@piefed.social · 43 pts · 192d
SHUT UP WESLEY
ruuster13@lemmy.zip · 18 pts · 192d
Wesley: "Did he just tell me to shut up?"
Dr. Crusher: "Shut up Wesley."
Sakurai@sh.itjust.works · 11 pts · 192d
Cmdr William T Riker enters the chat
teft@piefed.social · 8 pts · 192d
Guest star. So william didnt get any.
Thomas however…
resipsaloquitur@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 192d
Iheartcheese@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 191d
He just saw what she had for breakfast.
resipsaloquitur@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 191d
I think it’s safe to say that Gene liked miniskirts.
SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 192d
Does "slept" have yet another meaning, or were they all just playing make-believe?
SARGE@startrek.website · 58 pts · 192d
SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world · -40 pts · 192d
Yes, that's one of the already-existing meanings I alluded to in my comment. It's also never written with quotation marks.
StupidBrotherInLaw@lemmy.world · 61 pts · 192d
I was starting to forget why I have you tagged "Insufferable Pedant" in Voyager. Thanks for the refresher.
qarbone@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 192d
I never use the tag. Anyone annoying enough that I want to remember not to engage with them, I just default to blocking. Do they post good content or something?
StupidBrotherInLaw@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 192d
They're just unintentionally funny. I also block most, but instead keep this one and a few others tagged for amusement.
Edit: also for watching their cumulative vote score build over time. They're at -20 as of today.
SeductiveTortoise@piefed.social · 4 pts · 192d
Sometimes I want to see others give them shit in the answers. If I block them, those are gone as well.
SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world · -19 pts · 192d
Yeah, how dare I ask for clarification.
StupidBrotherInLaw@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 192d
Haha, okay. DARVO much?
SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world · -16 pts · 192d
Sure, Jan.
Knoxvomica@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 192d
Yeah would be better if she just said she fucked everyone, damn people these days with their lack of clarity. Argh!
Arcadeep@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 191d
So what's your point and how did you meaningfully contribute to the conversation by essentially asking what it means to sleep with someone and then saying you know what it means to sleep with someone, while somehow having an undeserved air of superiority?
Vespair@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 191d
They're being a bit prickly about it, but using quotes like that certainly implied to me as reader that it was meaning a suggestive usage, which doesn't make sense since the plaintext version already means fucking. I mean I understood their meaning and realized they were just unnecessary quotation marks quickly, but I also at first wondered if there was some sort of third meaning beyond rest or sex that was being suggested by the marks, so I kind of feel like the reaction to them here is a bit overblown.
luciferofastora@feddit.org · 1 pts · 191d
Sorry, I'm confused. Weren't we talking about human language here, or are you using "never" figuratively?
(The quotation marks here are referring to acual quotation of the word you used, not a standard feature of the way the word is normally written or an indicator of some alternate meaning. I'm spelling this out because just in case you're unaware of that usage of quotation marks, which frequently occurs in the context of quoting someone. Unless you're literally asserting that the word "slept" is never quoted, "never" is a strong word to use.)
Serialchemist@ttrpg.network · 152 pts · 192d
“Gene Roddenberry’s vision” was usually an upskirt shot.
Endymion_Mallorn@kbin.melroy.org · 50 pts · 192d
Which wasn't helped by Berman.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works · 22 pts · 192d
Oh the short skirts were 100% Gene. Rick is the one with the catsuit fetish. He was the one who decided to shrink wrap Jeri Ryan.
Endymion_Mallorn@kbin.melroy.org · 9 pts · 192d
Yeah. You might have been able to see what Marina was eating for lunch, but she and Denise Crosby didn't need rescue oxygen.
Rusty@lemmy.ca · 11 pts · 191d
BowtiesAreCool@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 192d
God I remember reruns of TOS on G4 where they would have like a side panel with counters for things that happened in the episode. “Spock says illogical” “Uhura panty shot”
wirehead@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 192d
I guess the one thing we "missed out on" (I say this sarcastically) is that the teardowns of screen-worn skants indicate that there's kind of a half-underwear thing there.
The way that the TOS uniforms "worked" is that they seem to have just declared the Space Cheerleader Shorts as clothing instead of just underwear in much the same way that actual cheerleaders have and therefore it's totally OK for the ladies to kick or crawl around in such a way to expose the Space Cheerleader Shorts.
And, like ... damn, people. I thought that a fanservice-y 90s anime aimed at teenage boys had a lot of upskirt, then I watched TOS reruns.
But, because it was very quickly relegated to background characters only, we'll never know if the skants were hiding a genuine advance in upskirt technology and only have Marina's word to go on that they probably ... weren't.
Which, well, I think mostly I just wanted to say "genuine advance in upskirt technology" and so therefore I think it's OK that the skants didn't get used more in TNG.
cattywampas@lemmy.world · 145 pts · 192d
Captain Jellico's "put on a real uniform" command was written in at Marina's request.
foodandart@lemmy.zip · 84 pts · 192d
Smart move. Even by 1989's standards and fashions, some of the costumes they put her in were hideous.
Endymion_Mallorn@kbin.melroy.org · 44 pts · 192d
I'm quite fond of the long dress she got for one season. I'm sure it was hell as a costume, but I thought it looked tasteful. I also have the idea that the psychological/psychiatric lead on the ship ought to look somewhat "different" when she's working. Her uniform should be more casual, because her role is one where you want people to be able to get away from the structure, and to trust her confidentiality. The catsuits were dumb, and the Farpoint / S1 miniskirt was scandalous. but I did like the full-length dress.
wirehead@lemmy.world · 30 pts · 192d
Pretty much every "show off the attractive female main character" outfit that they've invented for Trek has not worked for me. Troi's outfits, Seven's outfits, T'pol's outfits... I think that actually the only exception is the Farpoint miniskirt and even then it just looks attractive but I don't like what it meant for Troi's brains so all things being equal I actually like her the most in the standard uniform jumpsuit which is, quite frankly, already designed to make people look good.
Now that we're decades away from the show and everybody involved has been interviewed a bunch of times, what I actually wish we could have seen was Troi as the diplomatic counselor instead of the vague psychological lead / poorly utilized character that we got. Because if she was the ship's therapist the long dress would work because it is tasteful and different yet still professional, but then we'd not be seeing her on the bridge the way we did.
DagwoodIII@piefed.social · 19 pts · 192d
I've posted this before.
My head canon is that when a new civilization joins the Federation, they get to pick the new Starfleet uniforms. The Betazeds gave us the TOS miniskirts.
wirehead@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 192d
I approve.
MaggiWuerze@feddit.org · 17 pts · 192d
You're a better man (I assume) than me. My young self very much appreciated Sevens outfit back in the day. Although I have to admit, the episode where she travels back in time to the Voyager in dry dock and wears the science uniform plus a ponytail was also a great look for her.
wirehead@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 192d
I don't think I'd categorize that as "better" just pickier about wardrobe?
Then again, at least later on in life I'm a boudoir and fine art photographer so all of that concentrated miniskirt vs catsuit energy went somewhere more positive than ... wherever Berman went with it, LOL.
MaggiWuerze@feddit.org · 1 pts · 192d
That's a low bar if I've ever seen one :D
hakunawazo@lemmy.world · 42 pts · 192d
It may be an unpopular opinion, but I think she looked way cooler in uniform.
teslekova@sh.itjust.works · 13 pts · 192d
It's a popular opinion. She looks WAY better. Hotter, too, which shows how dumb Berman is.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works · 9 pts · 192d
I was just thinking about Troi's season 1 jumpsuit. She wore the "skant" for one episode, then that blue-grey loose fitting jumpsuit with the ruched waist sash for the rest of season one, then the mauve catsuit. That jumpsuit was made of denim, it was honestly the most modest things he wore. We'd call Yar's clingy spandex outfit the scandalous one if it weren't what all the men were also unironically wearing.
Tattorack@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 191d
Way cooler, and way more hot. Her "regular" clothes are tacky and off putting.
WorldsDumbestMan@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 191d
Rehabilitated!
Snowclone@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 191d
Agreed, the 'sexy' outfits were pretty dumb.
scarabic@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 192d
As a female friend pointed out to me: “and you never see her panty line.”
bizarroland@lemmy.world · 130 pts · 192d
"Dress was so short that you could see what I had for breakfast" is such an amazing turn of words
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works · 44 pts · 192d
Carrie Fisher said of the slave Leia bikini that, because it was rigid, while she was laying against Jabba it rode forward and anyone standing behind her could see "all the way to China." and she opined that's why the actor playing Boba Fett preferred standing back there.
ICastFist@programming.dev · 9 pts · 192d
Butta Fett
HerbalGamer@sh.itjust.works · 7 pts · 192d
" All the way to Alderaan"
socsa@piefed.social · 7 pts · 192d
I'm immediately imagining the South Park episode where Paris Hilton sits on the pineapple.
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · 99 pts · 192d
Oh, she ate pussy for breakfast?
aeronmelon@lemmy.world · 46 pts · 192d
Tower@lemmy.zip · 14 pts · 192d
Ahhhh, ok. Now it clicked.
VaalaVasaVarde@sopuli.xyz · 68 pts · 192d
My teenage self had no complaints about Troi's uniforms.
Taleya@aussie.zone · 12 pts · 192d
Tf are you still listening to that hormonal idiot, it's been over 30 years
totally_human_emdash_user@piefed.blahaj.zone · 9 pts · 192d
I have to listen to my teenage self if I want to have any chance of getting him to listen to me!
scarabic@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 192d
None? He lacked inagination!
Zephorah@discuss.online · 57 pts · 192d
Even back then I thought she looked like she was freezing.
PhoenixDog@lemmy.world · 44 pts · 192d
I mean yeah... It's cold in space.
Klear@quokk.au · 35 pts · 192d
There's no kind of atmosphere 🎶
wizzer@eviltoast.org · 23 pts · 192d
We’re all alone, more or less
then_three_more@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 192d
Let me fly, far away from here,
yannic@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 192d
THP_iz_da_law@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 192d
In fact it’s cold as h*ll
hakunawazo@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 192d
And it's a long road.
hemko@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 8 pts · 192d
And no underwear
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 46 pts · 192d
Based Jellico.
The_Picard_Maneuver@piefed.world · 34 pts · 192d
I've seen so many meme edits of this scene that I was waiting for the reveal, lol.
Washedupcynic@lemmy.ca · 9 pts · 192d
😆 🤣
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 7 pts · 192d
Aw, he should have let her keep that one!
FlatFootFox@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 192d
I still love how Jellico’s changes were all just stealth excuses for cast requests.
That being said, a four shift rotation is absurd.
Snowclone@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 191d
They had to give Riker a reason to hate his guts to hell and back. And forcing him to organize and force his staff to do four shift rotations with no justification was pretty brilliant as a motivation.
Tattorack@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 191d
Yes, and the moment Diana walked onto the bridge with a medical uniform on she instantly became a lot more hot.
The weird, tacky, revealing clothes she wore on duty were a lot more off putting.
Buddahriffic@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 191d
I remember being a bit confused about why everyone other than her had to wear a uniform but she could wear "what she wanted".
Never would have guessed it was Star Trek producers demonstrating very non-Star Trek traits.
militaryintelligence@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 192d
ceiphas@piefed.social · 37 pts · 192d
In the first season that dress was also worn by men... How woke...
sundray@lemmus.org · 35 pts · 192d
But crucially, not by anyone in the main male cast. They threw a few skants on to a couple of male extras to forestall accusations of sexism. A figurative (and and near literal) figleaf.
Frankly, a unisex, utilitarian kilt would probably have worked a lot better for gals and guys, but someone got greedy for “underbutt” and ended up with an outfit so disliked that it was quickly phased out.
SatyrSack@quokk.au · 18 pts · 192d
We just needed more men in the knee-high boots
Onomatopoeia@lemmy.cafe · -5 pts · 192d
More like grasping at anything to be progressive.
It was transparent at the time, kinda cringey actually.
At least ToS focused more on the Greek morality play part, though it had cringe transparent moments too.
There's a fine line between exploring ideas and preaching, so I tend to give them some leeway - but damn if TnG didn't rub me the wrong way from the start with the stupid costumes.
The_Picard_Maneuver@piefed.world · 10 pts · 192d
Fair take. Trying to include a moral lesson is like walking a tightrope: it's cool when it feels like a natural part of the story or world-building, but it's sooo cringy when it feels like a direct lecture from the writers to you.
TNG does get more subtle, but it also does have occasional moments that practically feel like He-Man turning to camera at the end of the show to tell you why drugs are bad or crime doesn't pay.
shutz@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 192d
The "drugs are bad" speech from Symbiosis is cringey-funny. But then you get the terrorism conversation from The High Ground that makes you expect another cringe speech, but then it gets really good and controversial, all of a sudden. TNG S3 is the season with the best writing!
The_Picard_Maneuver@piefed.world · 2 pts · 192d
Yeah, I'll take a handful of eye rolls for seasons and seasons of some of the best TV ever. (I may be a tad biased)
BrilliantantTurd4361@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 192d
The fact that you're triggered by this says a lot.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works · 30 pts · 192d
The very last scene in Encounter at Farpoint, Yar is also wearing the minidress uniform, AFAIK it's the only scene with her in it. The camera zooms in from about where it is above into a close-up of Picard, and Denise Crosby very pointedly steps out of shot partway through.
I have to wonder if that scene wasn't the first shot actually filmed, if they weren't planning on just, having all the women in crotch-length miniskirts until they had a couple shots in the can.
albbi@piefed.ca · 11 pts · 192d
The very first scene also has a man in the minidress uniform, I guess to show equality.
edit: Oh, this was mentioned a lot further down.
Rakonat@lemmy.world · 23 pts · 192d
I love Marina but her character was so poorly written that Guinom (Goldberg's character) did Troi's job as counselor better than Troi ever could. Poor woman's entire role in the show was to be tortured and objectified while her character primary love interest shagged his way across the galaxy, Crusher probably got an award for her work during all his alien STDs.
HugeNerd@lemmy.ca · 11 pts · 191d
🫤
dajoho@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 191d
Tattorack@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 191d
Problem is this is partially Marina's fault. From her own reaccounting; it was basically her first job. The writers would go to the other actors and ask what they'd like to do in a given episode, or how they'd react to something, basically making the actors part of the script creation.
But Marina told the writers "uh, I don't know. Write me something. That's your job, isn't it?"
By the time she realised she had the power to actually make her character her own, it was already several seasons into TNG and far too late to actually change anything. The writers had long since stopped trying to include her in the writing process.
Hmm... I'll try and find a clip of where she told this story...
wirehead@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 191d
To be fair tho, Gates told the writers a lot of things and got her ass fired as a result.
Snowclone@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 191d
Yeah she had a lot more demand as a performer because she only worked theater beforehand and she knew what her worth was, and people tend to hate that. Shatner did a pretty good BTS doc on TNG and the kind of weird power plays that went on that even Patrick Stewart was occasionally the target of. This period of TV production was a real high pressure environment and people had careers given and broken over pretty minor shit.
Tattorack@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 191d
Yeah. That sucked.
HugeNerd@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 191d
What's going on here?
Tattorack@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 191d
Typo. Shite. ^^;
bandwidthcrisis@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 191d
Possibly her best scene was in Enterprise, where during an appointment with Data you see that her PADD says "top beach destinations".
aeronmelon@lemmy.world · 20 pts · 192d
It wasn't just the dress, it was those knee-high boots that made critics call her an intergalactic cheerleader.
Paranoidfactoid@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 192d
resipsaloquitur@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 192d
SatyrSack@quokk.au · 16 pts · 192d
Does Twitter or whatever have a La Forge emoji or something?
Ironfacebuster@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 192d
I think it's added in because of the hashtag, unfortunately not an emoji you can use whenever you want
SatyrSack@quokk.au · 4 pts · 192d
Hmm, yeah, it is probably some browser extension or something that added it to that screenshot. It is definitely not present in the original post
https://web.archive.org/web/20211205215519/https://twitter.com/Marina_Sirtis/status/1310707416770592768
Ironfacebuster@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 192d
The mystery deepens!
teft@piefed.social · 5 pts · 192d
Slack has one. :geordi-laforge: so it wouldn't surprise me if twitter does too.
regedit@lemmy.zip · 14 pts · 191d
Didn't they revamp the uniforms after season one because they were horribly uncomfortable?
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 191d
IIRC from interviews that the uniforms remained generally uncomfortable. They were very stiff, and led to the famous “Picard Maneuver.” Sirtis’ uniform was changed to get rid of the dated “Cosmic Cheerleader” outfit. IMO her character’s early uniform was more in line with ToS’s making women on the Enterprise more “hot chick” than officer.
resipsaloquitur@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 192d
Could be worse.
minorkeys@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 192d
And it's still more modest than a lot of what gets worn today.
manuallybreathing@lemmy.ml · 7 pts · 192d
There are far too many people in here with this I didn't have a problem with it kinda energy
psycho_driver@lemmy.world · 14 pts · 192d
As a 13 or 14 year old boy at the time, I certainly didn't have a problem with it.
kandoh@reddthat.com · 1 pts · 191d
Yeah I might not have watched Star Trek at all if they weren't appealing to my male gaze during puberty
Limerance@piefed.social · 1 pts · 191d
Not all of us are prudes.
daggermoon@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 191d
I want the starfleet unisex dress
Snowclone@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 191d
It's the pilot or first episode when you watch it on streaming all remastered and high Def and there's scenes where they clearly had trouble position the camera to avoid a tv-ma rating, that original outfit was so short. It's also rough she still had a lot of trauma from basically being used by the industry for sex appeal and noting else. But at least Star Trek had men in the background in the same length mini skirt.
Ghostie@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 191d
Sasquatch@lemmy.ml · 3 pts · 191d
I had a protein bar
Akasazh@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 191d
Taco Bell
But_my_mom_says_im_cool@lemmy.world · -9 pts · 192d
Yeah for all the equality and tech it’s stupid to have women running around in skirts. Star Trek always portrayed an ideal future but always failed in one way or another. Tng is also the one Star Trek i couldn’t get into, tried for a season and it was bad. I hear it gets better but I can’t watch a show that takes years to get good
tigeruppercut@lemmy.zip · 20 pts · 192d
This has to be bait.
Otherwise congrats on being the 1st person ever I've seen online to prefer Voyager, TOS, Picard, and Disco to TNG.
usernamefactory@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 192d
I can believe it if they stopped early enough. Season 1 is pretty rough.
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 192d
this user is a notorious troll. so yes. it's probably bait.
MaggiWuerze@feddit.org · 1 pts · 192d
I mean, Voyager is also my favorite Trek, but I would place both STD and Picard at the bottom of the list. But I only watched TOS in stretches.
But_my_mom_says_im_cool@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 192d
I thought it was widely accepted that season 1 and 2 were not very good. And the skirt among other things in the show arw definitely dated and at times sexist. Im not sure what you guys are defending? lol
I love Star Trek but I don’t pretend some of the crap they have pumped out in the past is gold
tigeruppercut@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 191d
They were transitioning from 80s to 90s TV. This isn't like the millionth boring anime series that fans say "gets good after episode 150", it was literally the 2nd try at Trek ever. No one's saying season 1 or 2 is gold (although there are good eps in there), but the first season is like TOS with growing pains. There's a reason it got 7 seasons, and if it'd been a total failure none of the other shows would exist.
If you like Voyager, DS9, and Enterprise there's no way you wouldn't like TNG. Giving up on the entire run because the first couple seasons weren't great after an almost 20 year hiatus from TOS is why your position seems a bit strange.
But_my_mom_says_im_cool@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 191d
Continuing to watch a show that isnt good in the hope it gets better in a few seasons, now Thats strange. It’s also why I won’t watch game of thrones, I know the ending sucks now so what’s the point. And you’re right, im a TOS fan. I don’t like ds9 and voyager. I like TOS, SNW and similar
Buddahriffic@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 191d
It's a serialized 90s show, you don't have to watch the early seasons to understand the later ones. Pick any episode and just watch, as long as it isn't a 2-parter, you'll likely get the gist of what's going on. There are some longer story arcs that do span multiple episodes or even seasons, but the information is more at the "Lore" level than "necessary to understand what's going on in this episode".
Eg, if you knew the back story, you'd have had a better chance at catching the pun in the last sentence. But all you're missing out on is maybe exhaling a bit quicker as you read it and an eye roll.
Hell, if you don't want to watch all the episodes, you might be one of the rare people who might even enjoy the clip episodes and how much they tried to set up an in-universe reason to be showing clips from previous episodes. Like Riker's memory parasite.
Psaldorn@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 192d
They had male crew in those skirts too though, to be fair.
bunkyprewster@startrek.website · 6 pts · 192d
I think just one shot, a guy in the hallway walking in the background.
_stranger_@lemmy.world · 14 pts · 192d
This guy?
Yeah, he was just a freak, the rest of the time they wear it with pants
Buddahriffic@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 191d
I believe that second one is actually from the episode where O'Brian accidentally gets all the normal sized shirts stuck in the transporter buffer so everyone breaks out their night shirts until Data suggests reversing the polarity and running them through the deflector array, after which they just had to send some folk from the lower decks outside to grab and iron them.
That episode also had the subplot where Data's memory banks get slightly corrupted and mix up the Star Fleet Protocol Reference with the Karma Sutra and The Art of War for some humourously awkward moments with Picard, LaForge, and poor Wesley Crusher.
bunkyprewster@startrek.website · 3 pts · 192d
I wish I could get one of those outfits too.
baines@lemmy.cafe · 1 pts · 191d
literally a tunic, usually has a belt
resipsaloquitur@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 192d
_stranger_@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 191d
"Senior Officers get pants?!"
resipsaloquitur@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 191d
Someone had a crossed wire when they heard "dress uniform."
AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 192d
Wasn't it that episode where the air conditioning was broken?
this_1_is_mine@lemmy.ml · 3 pts · 192d
Men wore that outfit it was unisex I'm to lazy to link a image ore a dozen right now but tng was pretty inclusive vs the og series
RedGreenBlue@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 192d
Then start at season 2.
Skullgrid@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 192d
which season? try 5. EDiT : at least the darmok episode?