I got a switch1 so I could play Monster Hunter Generations Ultimate, after putting hundreds of hours into MHGen on the DS. I really wish I could have just played MHXX on the DS instead of having to go to a Switch, but alas. I tried some other games on the Switch, but I just can’t do it. My friend lent me BotW and I got until the part where I led the cave and the framerate dipped to like 15. I snagged it on the computer and played through the whole thing at 1440p/144FPS. Every Switch game is so much better on the computer, and the online capabilities (or lack thereof) are horrid. Since then, Nintendo has quadrupled down on anti-consumer stuff. No good.
Last Sony console I got was a PS3, because the PS4 was horrid with its performance and nightmare load times. I stopped getting consoles after that, even though the PS5 and latest XBox have good performance and much smaller load times. I’m just done with them, and my decisions are reinforced every time news like this comes out!
I still fuck with old consoles, though. I need to invest in an upscaler or any device that’ll let me play them on my modern screens, since I don’t have room in most of our comfy places for my CRT at the moment.
Good news, it's not just the switch. Pretty much every other console game is also better on PC, even just because of the existence of pause/save state functionality. That's not even getting into romhacks or retro achievements or any of the other major benefits to emulation.
Ah. I was wondering exactly what you meant. Yup. There definitely is a market for good games, new or old. I wouldn't make the mistake of trying to correlate that to any trend in taste for indie or corporate, other than who is giving better value and a more fun experience.. try not to think like corporate execs who don't have a fucking clue what fun is and seeing gamers as consumers.
Corporate execs may not know what fun is, but they know what makes money. Right now, everything in the computer gaming market points to new games being more expensive than what the market will bear.
They probably see the PC market as too competitive to compete in and want to invest in technology which makes new games cheaper to make. So, Sony will abandon a market it can't make money in and will invest in a technology which can hopefully churn out assets for their new games, which will lower development costs.
The thing is, they could release on Steam, and continue doing so for years, and they'd continuously build up a catalogue of older games that still sell. Sure, the first year probably isn't going to do as well on PC as they expect from consoles. Later years will probably do better though.
Oh well though. Sony doesn't really make anything I want to play anyway. I'm not that bothered by them making bad decisions. I'd rather them be smart about it, but honestly I don't really care.
This could be them being smart about it. Compared to various Xbox models, the PlayStation models were generally custom designed to a specific set of hardware and software criteria that aren't fully mirrored on Windows PC. It is a non-zero cost to convert and support.
There may be some individual success, but the aggregate may be a money losing proposition. At that point, why support a market that is only costing them money?
Compared to various Xbox models, the PlayStation models were generally custom designed to a specific set of hardware and software criteria that aren't fully mirrored on Windows PC.
You're talking about the devices that can fully be turned into a PC. Sure, the hardware set is a specific thing (just like Xbox, though I guess they have two versions). However, the only thing that makes it not work like a PC is the software.
Yes, it is a non-zero cost. I'm pretty sure the dollar cost isn't the reason for it though. They care about the opportunity cost of not having exclusives. The PC ports made them profit. It just wasn't as much as they hoped, and it made the console less desirable.
Compared to various Xbox models, the PlayStation models were generally custom designed to a specific set of hardware and software criteria that aren’t fully mirrored on Windows PC.
While we're kibitzing about it, both the PS4 and PS5 are literally AMD x86 based PCs with AMD integrated GPUs stuffed into a plastic shell and running proprietary software. Said proprietary software is the only tricky bit, but both systems' OS is based on FreeBSD. The OS has its own set of proprietary graphics APIs because Sony is gonna Sony, but they're still talking to a commodity AMD GPU which could just as easily find its home in a PC.
There is nothing new under the sun for the Playstation platform since the PS3, which was arguably the last interesting iteration.
If the new games were any good, people would play new games. Enshittification + survivorship bias = people play old games.
There's good news though. Sony has PLENTY of old good games that aren't on steam. They could just release them. Making a PC port of a great game is much easier and cheaper than making a great game
If the new games were any good, people would play new games.
The real problems are that games aren't finished when they come out. Even small games that aren't broken generally get patches to make them somewhat better in the first year. And games tend to go on sale after around that long. So I just wait and pay less for a better game.
The combination of getting burned by Anthem straight up crashing on my hardware until after my friends were already done with it making it a complete waste of money and the horror of getting my witcher-superfan friend cyberpunk 2077 on launch as a gift and it being complete garbage made me never want to buy a newly released game again.
Out of curiosity, do we have access to new vs old game data on other platforms? Probably makes sense to compare these things rather than assume it is different with only one side of the data
Nobody's asking for AI, it's being forced upon us. It's only going to get less accurate and helpful as time goes on and all the wasted money and resources to make it run will not be recovered. But it will not go away, people will just deal with it or stop using it.
Only the children that can’t separate the fascinating technology from the techbros feel that way. The adults and people who understand nuance can clearly draw the line between what’s harmful to society and a new interesting technology with many applications.
Looks like it is time to build a platform for the people. A commoners console if you will. It is clear we have to move beyond these corporations for gaming now. They bought up all the studious and now they are killing them all so they can deliver us AI slop instead.
It could be as simple as that. But I was thinking a nonprofit with standardized hardware and a team to integrate it with Linux properly. All the games can be open source and community supported.
Something being popular because it works better than all its competitors is not a monopoly.
using price fixing
Accused of using price fixing, it's an ongoing legal process.
If you're going to criticize Valve do it by going after the incontrovertible stuff like benefiting massively from loot boxes (gambling, skimming off the secondary market) or providing "community tools" with very little support for moderation or protection from malicious reviews. There's plenty to criticize.
Listen, they meet the market definition of a monopoly with 75%. That is higher than Microsoft, another well known monopoly.
I really don't care what the courts say. There are numerous testimonials proving without a doubt they have engaged in price fixing. Specifically, they request that any game that is listed on Steam cannot be listed somewhere else for a lower regular price.
This is classic monopoly behavior and your feelings really don't matter.
Thanks for bringing up their other unbelievably shitty practices though. Did you know they used to not offer refunds? Yeah, a court smacked them down which lead to their stellar return policy.
Stop pretending they are anything but a corporation.
Specifically, they request that any game that is listed on Steam cannot be listed somewhere else for a lower regular price.
Officially this only applies to Steam Keys. Unofficial there are a couple of allegations that they've done this in other contexts. This is not "numerous testimonials proving" nor is it reflective of actual policy. Part of the legal process is determining if the allegations are factual and if they represent actual policy or if they're the actions of individual managers misunderstanding or overstepping policy.
If the allegations are true, yes it's monopolistic behavior. In the meantime you're free to use Epic, Origin, Ubisoft Connect, GOG, itch.io, whatever Microsoft is calling their store these days, Humble, or wherever else people publish their games.
Valve makes it easy to buy and sell, simple to update, and has integrated social features like a friends list and messaging that simply work. They keep margins low by having a small number of employees. They don't need to engage in anti-competitive price bullying to be embarrassingly profitable. Maybe they are anyway. I'm not going to use a worse store for no gain while I wait for those lawsuits to finish. (I do like to buy through GOG or itch.io when it's an option because I'd rather have the software unreliant on a third-party or internet-connected launcher)
I have immensely enjoyed a handful of the Sony PC releases, like Horizon and Spider-man titles, even bought some of them at full price. But locking them away from me behind a playstation hardware requirement just means you don't get any money from me Sony
55 Comments
Alexstarfire@lemmy.world · 79 pts · 51d
Kolanaki@pawb.social · 61 pts · 51d
👎
Eternal192@anarchist.nexus · 42 pts · 51d
Good luck with that.
Mac@mander.xyz · 38 pts · 51d
I wish i could not buy, again, the Playstation and Nintendo consoles that i don't own.
EtnaAtsume@lemmy.world · 23 pts · 51d
I have good news for you! You just did(n't).
Mac@mander.xyz · 24 pts · 51d
Rai@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 3 pts · 50d
I got a switch1 so I could play Monster Hunter Generations Ultimate, after putting hundreds of hours into MHGen on the DS. I really wish I could have just played MHXX on the DS instead of having to go to a Switch, but alas. I tried some other games on the Switch, but I just can’t do it. My friend lent me BotW and I got until the part where I led the cave and the framerate dipped to like 15. I snagged it on the computer and played through the whole thing at 1440p/144FPS. Every Switch game is so much better on the computer, and the online capabilities (or lack thereof) are horrid. Since then, Nintendo has quadrupled down on anti-consumer stuff. No good.
Last Sony console I got was a PS3, because the PS4 was horrid with its performance and nightmare load times. I stopped getting consoles after that, even though the PS5 and latest XBox have good performance and much smaller load times. I’m just done with them, and my decisions are reinforced every time news like this comes out!
I still fuck with old consoles, though. I need to invest in an upscaler or any device that’ll let me play them on my modern screens, since I don’t have room in most of our comfy places for my CRT at the moment.
emeralddawn45@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 50d
Good news, it's not just the switch. Pretty much every other console game is also better on PC, even just because of the existence of pause/save state functionality. That's not even getting into romhacks or retro achievements or any of the other major benefits to emulation.
calcopiritus@lemmy.world · 26 pts · 50d
Customers: we want Bloodborne on PC!
Sony: people don't want PC games. They want AI!
wingnut@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 50d
🤮
melsaskca@lemmy.ca · 26 pts · 51d
I sell honey at a local garden market. My sales went up 460% once I started labelling it "A.I. Honey". /s
Doom@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 50d
Apiary Intelligence?
Feyd@programming.dev · 5 pts · 50d
This may be the first time AI has made me smile
mrfriki@lemmy.world · 25 pts · 51d
I think that this 2 letters swap is gonna cost them a pretty penny.
HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club · -8 pts · 50d
If it? What's the market for new games on PC?
SCmSTR@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 13 pts · 50d
Steam, Epic, GoG, and some other markets.
HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club · 4 pts · 50d
Steam's records show that an overwhelming majority of playing time is going to older games. The market may not be large enough for Sony to care.
SCmSTR@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 4 pts · 50d
Ah. I was wondering exactly what you meant. Yup. There definitely is a market for good games, new or old. I wouldn't make the mistake of trying to correlate that to any trend in taste for indie or corporate, other than who is giving better value and a more fun experience.. try not to think like corporate execs who don't have a fucking clue what fun is and seeing gamers as consumers.
HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club · 0 pts · 50d
Corporate execs may not know what fun is, but they know what makes money. Right now, everything in the computer gaming market points to new games being more expensive than what the market will bear.
They probably see the PC market as too competitive to compete in and want to invest in technology which makes new games cheaper to make. So, Sony will abandon a market it can't make money in and will invest in a technology which can hopefully churn out assets for their new games, which will lower development costs.
SCmSTR@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 1 pts · 50d
So then we are back to where we started, and people need to stop buying into advertising and garbage. Line doesn't need to keep going up.
HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club · 1 pts · 50d
And don't be surprised when corporations stop producing for a platform when it no longer makes them money.
Cethin@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 50d
The thing is, they could release on Steam, and continue doing so for years, and they'd continuously build up a catalogue of older games that still sell. Sure, the first year probably isn't going to do as well on PC as they expect from consoles. Later years will probably do better though.
Oh well though. Sony doesn't really make anything I want to play anyway. I'm not that bothered by them making bad decisions. I'd rather them be smart about it, but honestly I don't really care.
HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club · 0 pts · 50d
This could be them being smart about it. Compared to various Xbox models, the PlayStation models were generally custom designed to a specific set of hardware and software criteria that aren't fully mirrored on Windows PC. It is a non-zero cost to convert and support.
There may be some individual success, but the aggregate may be a money losing proposition. At that point, why support a market that is only costing them money?
Cethin@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 50d
You're talking about the devices that can fully be turned into a PC. Sure, the hardware set is a specific thing (just like Xbox, though I guess they have two versions). However, the only thing that makes it not work like a PC is the software.
Yes, it is a non-zero cost. I'm pretty sure the dollar cost isn't the reason for it though. They care about the opportunity cost of not having exclusives. The PC ports made them profit. It just wasn't as much as they hoped, and it made the console less desirable.
HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club · 1 pts · 50d
If PC game sales are cannibalizing PS sales, then there is a higher cost to creating and selling a PC port than just porting the game.
dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 50d
While we're kibitzing about it, both the PS4 and PS5 are literally AMD x86 based PCs with AMD integrated GPUs stuffed into a plastic shell and running proprietary software. Said proprietary software is the only tricky bit, but both systems' OS is based on FreeBSD. The OS has its own set of proprietary graphics APIs because Sony is gonna Sony, but they're still talking to a commodity AMD GPU which could just as easily find its home in a PC.
There is nothing new under the sun for the Playstation platform since the PS3, which was arguably the last interesting iteration.
calcopiritus@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 50d
If the new games were any good, people would play new games. Enshittification + survivorship bias = people play old games.
There's good news though. Sony has PLENTY of old good games that aren't on steam. They could just release them. Making a PC port of a great game is much easier and cheaper than making a great game
Feyd@programming.dev · 1 pts · 50d
The real problems are that games aren't finished when they come out. Even small games that aren't broken generally get patches to make them somewhat better in the first year. And games tend to go on sale after around that long. So I just wait and pay less for a better game.
The combination of getting burned by Anthem straight up crashing on my hardware until after my friends were already done with it making it a complete waste of money and the horror of getting my witcher-superfan friend cyberpunk 2077 on launch as a gift and it being complete garbage made me never want to buy a newly released game again.
Feyd@programming.dev · 1 pts · 50d
Out of curiosity, do we have access to new vs old game data on other platforms? Probably makes sense to compare these things rather than assume it is different with only one side of the data
papalonian@lemmy.world · 19 pts · 50d
DudeImMacGyver@kbin.earth · 19 pts · 51d
This truly is the dumbest timeline.
frunch@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 51d
Nobody's asking for AI, it's being forced upon us. It's only going to get less accurate and helpful as time goes on and all the wasted money and resources to make it run will not be recovered. But it will not go away, people will just deal with it or stop using it.
Narann@jlai.lu · 14 pts · 51d
How can you drop something you never had?
jtrek@startrek.website · 14 pts · 51d
No one with an intact soul likes AI.
lIlIlIlIlIlIl@lemmy.world · -4 pts · 50d
Only the children that can’t separate the fascinating technology from the techbros feel that way. The adults and people who understand nuance can clearly draw the line between what’s harmful to society and a new interesting technology with many applications.
fox2263@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 50d
I want to play games on PC not AI
stringere@sh.itjust.works · 11 pts · 50d
Thanks, Sony, for reinforcing my decision to leave your products behind.
nosuchanon@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 50d
Sony has ALWAYS done stupid shit that no one wants.
CD rootkits anyone?
TemplaerDude@sh.itjust.works · 5 pts · 50d
Nobody wants this. No one.
Doomsider@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 50d
Looks like it is time to build a platform for the people. A commoners console if you will. It is clear we have to move beyond these corporations for gaming now. They bought up all the studious and now they are killing them all so they can deliver us AI slop instead.
RichardDegenne@lemmy.zip · 11 pts · 50d
This close to inventing computers. 🤏
Doomsider@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 50d
No, honestly in my mind it would me more like investing in a community platform that would use open standards. Think Risc-V Vortex.
Obviously, we are not quite there yet with the hardware. It would be pretty awesome to have a proprietary free setup though.
mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 50d
This is literally just building your own computer and putting Linux on it
Doomsider@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 50d
It could be as simple as that. But I was thinking a nonprofit with standardized hardware and a team to integrate it with Linux properly. All the games can be open source and community supported.
We could call it the Playtendobox.
Dangerhart@lemmy.zip · 5 pts · 50d
/s? https://store.steampowered.com/sale/steammachine
Doomsider@lemmy.world · -4 pts · 50d
You mean Steam... the monopolistic company that is using price fixing on the entire PC game industry?
Not exactly what I was thinking to be honest. It is certainly standard hardware on Linux that is supported by a community though, so it isn't all bad.
Soggy@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 50d
Something being popular because it works better than all its competitors is not a monopoly.
Accused of using price fixing, it's an ongoing legal process.
If you're going to criticize Valve do it by going after the incontrovertible stuff like benefiting massively from loot boxes (gambling, skimming off the secondary market) or providing "community tools" with very little support for moderation or protection from malicious reviews. There's plenty to criticize.
Doomsider@lemmy.world · -4 pts · 50d
Listen, they meet the market definition of a monopoly with 75%. That is higher than Microsoft, another well known monopoly.
I really don't care what the courts say. There are numerous testimonials proving without a doubt they have engaged in price fixing. Specifically, they request that any game that is listed on Steam cannot be listed somewhere else for a lower regular price.
This is classic monopoly behavior and your feelings really don't matter.
Thanks for bringing up their other unbelievably shitty practices though. Did you know they used to not offer refunds? Yeah, a court smacked them down which lead to their stellar return policy.
Stop pretending they are anything but a corporation.
Soggy@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 50d
Officially this only applies to Steam Keys. Unofficial there are a couple of allegations that they've done this in other contexts. This is not "numerous testimonials proving" nor is it reflective of actual policy. Part of the legal process is determining if the allegations are factual and if they represent actual policy or if they're the actions of individual managers misunderstanding or overstepping policy.
If the allegations are true, yes it's monopolistic behavior. In the meantime you're free to use Epic, Origin, Ubisoft Connect, GOG, itch.io, whatever Microsoft is calling their store these days, Humble, or wherever else people publish their games.
Valve makes it easy to buy and sell, simple to update, and has integrated social features like a friends list and messaging that simply work. They keep margins low by having a small number of employees. They don't need to engage in anti-competitive price bullying to be embarrassingly profitable. Maybe they are anyway. I'm not going to use a worse store for no gain while I wait for those lawsuits to finish. (I do like to buy through GOG or itch.io when it's an option because I'd rather have the software unreliant on a third-party or internet-connected launcher)
Lumisal@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 50d
So Kazeta?
https://itsfoss.com/news/kazeta/
gnuplusmatt@reddthat.com · 3 pts · 50d
I have immensely enjoyed a handful of the Sony PC releases, like Horizon and Spider-man titles, even bought some of them at full price. But locking them away from me behind a playstation hardware requirement just means you don't get any money from me Sony
mechoman444@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 50d
There is absolutely nothing worse than marketing.