Really was hoping for a jury nullification. I don't care if he did it. I don't care who did it. People knowingly making massive profits on misery and cruelty don't deserve peaceful lives.
Yep. The real injustice is all the people who died due to the CEOs actions, and that he would have faced zero consequences. Why are they not held accountable just because they can stand a little further away from the murders?
I said if I made president he'd be pardoned. I'm not messing. I'm thinking of running, and the more I think, the more I want to fix the system for us little guys. I'll probably "Epstein" myself or fall out of a highrise window, but I'm thinking that's a risk I'll have to take.
Well I checked the law and there's no exception for monster hunters. It turns out that if you plan and execute a homicide, you're a criminal, even if you kill a monster. WHO KNEW???
The only morally self-consistent way to approach this is as civil disobedience. You gotta take the punishment or you're not an activist, you're just another monster.
What is legal is not always right, and what is right is not always legal - paraphrased from Algernon Sidley, late 1600s.
::: spoiler Full Quote
That which is not just, is not Law; and that which is not Law, ought not to be obeyed.
… the directive power of the law, which is certain, and grounded upon the inherent good and rectitude that is in it, is that alone which has a power over the conscience, whereas the coercive is merely contingent; and the most just powers commanding the most just things, have so often fallen under the violence of the most unjust men, commanding the most execrable villainies, that if they were therefore to be obeyed, the consciences of men must be regulated by the success of a battle or conspiracy, than which nothing can be affirmed more impious and absurd….
If this were so, the governments of the world might be justly called magna latrocinia; and men laying aside all considerations of reason or justice, ought only to follow those who can inflict the greatest punishments, or give the greatest rewards. But since the reception of such opinions would be the extirpation of all that can be called good, we must look for another rule of our obedience, and shall find that to be the law, which being, as I said before, sanctio recta, must be founded upon that eternal principle of reason and truth, from whence the rule of justice which is sacred and pure ought to be deduced, and not from the depraved will of man, which fluctuating according to the different interests, humors and passions that at several times reign in several nations, one day abrogates what had been enacted the other. The sanction therefore that deserves the name of a law, which derives not its excellency from antiquity, or from the dignity of the legislators, but from an intrinsick equity and justice, ought to be made in pursuance of that universal reason to which all nations at all times owe an equal veneration and obedience.
:::
A few examples for you (aside from the blatantly obvious and well known like slavery)
Jim Crow Laws
The Bloody Code (1700s England)
French salt tax
Vagrancy laws (still exist, and are nowhere near right)
Anti-LGBTQ laws - some are historic, some are current
Magdalene Laundries
the Combination Acts
Forced Assimilation laws
Window Tax
Debt Slavery
Three Strike laws
Civil asset forfeiture
Joint Enterprise laws
Extended detention without charge
Public protest bans
Tied visa systems
Sub-minimum wage exemptions
The list goes on and on and on. Many of which are still legal today, or have been reworked for the same effect and are in effect today.
Being "legal" or "illegal" is a distinction without merit.
Unless you expect "murder" to become legal soon I don't feel like this is a very strong argument.
I understand why Luigi did it and the CEO was a piece of shit, but I'm not sure legalizing the execution of these dickheads in the streets is the best answer here. I'd rather see laws outlawing what that CEO did.
He's doing civil disobedience by your definition. Literally pleading guilty. In the hypothetical where he receives a pardon, nothing has changed in that regard.
“I shot Mr. Thompson and he died,” Mangione said. “I understood that my actions would place him in fear of death or bodily injury. I knew what I was doing was illegal.”
Other executives from UnitedHealthcare, seated two rows behind the family, struggled to look at Mangione. Several put their hands on their faces, shaking their heads slowly in disbelief.
All we did was condemn millions to pain, suffering and death to maximize shareholder value and pur own bonuses and then a monster like this just comes by and kills us? Unbelievable
They got state and federal 1st degree murder charges dismissed and likely state 2nd degree murder due to double jeopardy or something so thats a still a big deal but it depends on how sentencing goes
Much respect for his fabulous lawyer Karen Friedman Agnifilo. She did a great job
He said he armed himself with a gun that he manufactured with a 3D printer and affixed with a silencer.
“I shot Mr. Thompson and he died,” Mangione said. “I understood that my actions would place him in fear of death or bodily injury. I knew what I was doing was illegal.”
This is so extremely convenient to the establishment, it raises suspicion.
57 Comments
jtrek@startrek.website · 108 pts · 21d
Really was hoping for a jury nullification. I don't care if he did it. I don't care who did it. People knowingly making massive profits on misery and cruelty don't deserve peaceful lives.
Cethin@lemmy.zip · 35 pts · 20d
Yep. The real injustice is all the people who died due to the CEOs actions, and that he would have faced zero consequences. Why are they not held accountable just because they can stand a little further away from the murders?
BeardededSquidward@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 12 pts · 20d
They have the money to grease the right people's pockets.
Sunshine@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 21d
White Russian monarchists included.
UPGRAYEDD@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 19d
Thats like.. your opinion man....
lemmygarden@lemmy.today · 102 pts · 21d
He should be pardoned and released
unitedwithme@lemmy.today · 29 pts · 21d
I said if I made president he'd be pardoned. I'm not messing. I'm thinking of running, and the more I think, the more I want to fix the system for us little guys. I'll probably "Epstein" myself or fall out of a highrise window, but I'm thinking that's a risk I'll have to take.
VitoRobles@lemmy.today · 20 pts · 20d
If violent terrorists on Jan 6 can be pardoned to then commit more crime, Luigi can be pardoned.
LostCarcosan@lemmy.today · 6 pts · 20d
Fuck it, can't be worse than what we got going on now. You got my vote
WolfLink@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 19d
I’d vote for a rando on the internet over anyone who was on the ballot during the last two elections
jerkface@lemmy.ca · -52 pts · 21d
just because? what is your legal philosophy here
Coupable@lemmy.world · 71 pts · 21d
Because he killed a monster. Monster hunters are heroes not criminals.
jerkface@lemmy.ca · -67 pts · 21d
Well I checked the law and there's no exception for monster hunters. It turns out that if you plan and execute a homicide, you're a criminal, even if you kill a monster. WHO KNEW???
The only morally self-consistent way to approach this is as civil disobedience. You gotta take the punishment or you're not an activist, you're just another monster.
decolo@piefed.social · 58 pts · 21d
Slavery was and still is legal, so maybe reconsider what point you're making here.
curbstickle_lw@lemmy.world · 45 pts · 21d
What is legal is not always right, and what is right is not always legal - paraphrased from Algernon Sidley, late 1600s.
::: spoiler Full Quote
That which is not just, is not Law; and that which is not Law, ought not to be obeyed.
… the directive power of the law, which is certain, and grounded upon the inherent good and rectitude that is in it, is that alone which has a power over the conscience, whereas the coercive is merely contingent; and the most just powers commanding the most just things, have so often fallen under the violence of the most unjust men, commanding the most execrable villainies, that if they were therefore to be obeyed, the consciences of men must be regulated by the success of a battle or conspiracy, than which nothing can be affirmed more impious and absurd….
If this were so, the governments of the world might be justly called magna latrocinia; and men laying aside all considerations of reason or justice, ought only to follow those who can inflict the greatest punishments, or give the greatest rewards. But since the reception of such opinions would be the extirpation of all that can be called good, we must look for another rule of our obedience, and shall find that to be the law, which being, as I said before, sanctio recta, must be founded upon that eternal principle of reason and truth, from whence the rule of justice which is sacred and pure ought to be deduced, and not from the depraved will of man, which fluctuating according to the different interests, humors and passions that at several times reign in several nations, one day abrogates what had been enacted the other. The sanction therefore that deserves the name of a law, which derives not its excellency from antiquity, or from the dignity of the legislators, but from an intrinsick equity and justice, ought to be made in pursuance of that universal reason to which all nations at all times owe an equal veneration and obedience.
:::
A few examples for you (aside from the blatantly obvious and well known like slavery)
The list goes on and on and on. Many of which are still legal today, or have been reworked for the same effect and are in effect today.
Being "legal" or "illegal" is a distinction without merit.
ChairmanMeow@programming.dev · 1 pts · 19d
Unless you expect "murder" to become legal soon I don't feel like this is a very strong argument.
I understand why Luigi did it and the CEO was a piece of shit, but I'm not sure legalizing the execution of these dickheads in the streets is the best answer here. I'd rather see laws outlawing what that CEO did.
curbstickle_lw@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 19d
I don't believe I said anything of the sort.
I said legality is a distinction without merit. It is a completely irrelevant element unless you are discussing the morality of a law.
Coupable@lemmy.world · 24 pts · 21d
Fuck off nerd
k0e3@lemmy.ca · 6 pts · 20d
I dunno about nerd. They just seem like an idiot.
AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 20d
What is this, the 80s? Nerd as an insult, really?
LostCarcosan@lemmy.today · 2 pts · 20d
What a weird thing to be morally outraged by, nerd
Coupable@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 20d
Yep
Mistakes@sopuli.xyz · 17 pts · 21d
He's doing civil disobedience by your definition. Literally pleading guilty. In the hypothetical where he receives a pardon, nothing has changed in that regard.
dickalan@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 21d
hey 🤓
NoPanko@feddit.uk · 73 pts · 21d
“I killed him, yeah” -Zac Oyama
SkyezOpen@lemmy.world · 33 pts · 21d
"I'll fuckin do it again." - Goofy
slaacaa@lemmy.world · 68 pts · 21d
“I shot Mr. Thompson and he died,” Mangione said. “I understood that my actions would place him in fear of death or bodily injury. I knew what I was doing was illegal.”
tanisnikana@lemmy.world · 70 pts · 21d
He’s a liar, he was with me the whole time, in Oregon.
Sunshine@lemmy.ca · 44 pts · 21d
They forced him to say that hogwash. He is innocent.
Sunshine@lemmy.ca · 67 pts · 21d
United Health is trying to assainate his character to keep the private healthcare grift going.
gedfromgont@piefed.ca · 27 pts · 21d
Uh, they don't really need to. Has anything meaningful changed for you over there in the US since that dude got shot?
anomnom@sh.itjust.works · 22 pts · 21d
Our premiums just went up again
SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world · 14 pts · 20d
Very briefly, they stopped blanket-denting claims.
chunes@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 20d
1 insurance company out of thousands. Mine denied me a much-needed MRI two weeks after the incident.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 0 pts · 19d
While Trump made healthcare even more expensive.
Absolutely nothing was practically accomplished.
fyzzlefry@retrolemmy.com · 5 pts · 20d
Would we know if it did? The news doesn't work.
Sunshine@lemmy.ca · -6 pts · 21d
Universal Healthcare in the Soviet Union was fought for in blood, the white Russians leadership wanted to leave every everyday Russian for dead.
FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world · 54 pts · 21d
This doesn't make sense.
I was having ribs with the dude.
Sunshine@lemmy.ca · 20 pts · 21d
He was with family having a beer.
dream_weasel@sh.itjust.works · 8 pts · 20d
I worked hard on those ribs!
phoenixz@lemmy.ca · 30 pts · 19d
All we did was condemn millions to pain, suffering and death to maximize shareholder value and pur own bonuses and then a monster like this just comes by and kills us? Unbelievable
raman_klogius@ani.social · 27 pts · 21d
Your Honor I call bs
Zink@programming.dev · 26 pts · 20d
I saw the video and was clearly the same fucker in the photo of the Flock camera vandal.
(shaking fist) Benjamin Netanyahuuuuuu!
MushuChupacabra@piefed.world · 25 pts · 21d
That's impossible. I shot him.
dream_weasel@sh.itjust.works · 8 pts · 20d
Please do not shoot luigi.
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 7 pts · 20d
I'm
SpartacusBrianthe as of yet unidentified guy in the hoodie they're looking for, and so is my wife!SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 20d
I am Spartacus
certified_expert@lemmy.world · 24 pts · 21d
Now what? What's the defense's plan?
nullspace@lemmy.world · 28 pts · 20d
A guilty plea indicates a deal was likely made for a reduced sentence.
cheese_greater@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 11d
They got state and federal 1st degree murder charges dismissed and likely state 2nd degree murder due to double jeopardy or something so thats a still a big deal but it depends on how sentencing goes
Much respect for his fabulous lawyer Karen Friedman Agnifilo. She did a great job
Abyssian@lemmy.world · 24 pts · 20d
He was framed! The only thing he killed was my certainty of my heterosexuality.
Pennywise@quokk.au · 15 pts · 21d
WhoIzDisIz@lemmy.today · 5 pts · 21d
"I shat him!"
Pennywise@quokk.au · 5 pts · 21d
k0e3@lemmy.ca · 14 pts · 20d
He was shooting hoops with me, not CEOs. That was probably some other hero.
Pennywise@quokk.au · 11 pts · 21d
gh0stb4tz@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 21d
Jury Nullification.
RainbowBlite@piefed.ca · 32 pts · 21d
No jury in a guilty plea...
acockworkorange@mander.xyz · 4 pts · 19d
This is so extremely convenient to the establishment, it raises suspicion.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 19d
Or, sometimes a white cat is just a white cat.