Hi, OP. I could see this being considered borderline, but I'd ask per Rule 2 that you mark this as NSFW. At the same time, I'd also like to hear others' thoughts on that request to get a better idea going forward.
(Edit: Undistinguishing, but still feel free to share here if and how you think the NSFW tag should be applied/enforced.)
Bit overzealous in my opinion, but I appreciate you making the request rather than delete first and ask questions never like most mods with a problem, so sure!
Lots of jobs have expected down time. It's always better to err on the side of caution because for a chunk of the Lemmy population, you can be fired for anything.
While I sure wouldn't go sharing it in an email thread, I wouldn't say it's overtly nsfw. Might raise a few questions of that was your common taste though.
You're preaching to the choir on the speciesism angle.
This isn't my own prescriptivist moral judgment; it's trying to be descriptive of what someone would reasonably think "would otherwise draw unwanted attention by nosy coworkers [...]". That attempt at descriptivism is why I was hoping for feedback like your comment.
Moreover, if you were to swap out the victims and faces in this comic with cows, pigs, etc., I'd probably still be asking the OP to mark this as NSFW.
I’m sure I could go and easily find more that fit your description, people take offense to eating burgers, so can’t post anything related to that? Something will always upset someone, that’s a horrible metric to moderate by.
Edit this depicts a sexual act and isn’t mentioned anything…
Rules shouldn’t be arbitrary, and you should leave veganism out of comics, what’s that got to do with moderating comics? So you can use this place for propaganda and your own interests?
Gonna have an issue with a comic depicting eating a burger? Because that’s the point that’s being made by bringing veganism in here. Doesn’t belong.
I think you’re right about it being borderline. At first glance, Leatherface just looks like a cartoon zombie. You have to look closely and maybe read the comic to understand the implied gore.
Yes women do have their lives ended by men a lot in our society.
I think this fact overshadows any humor I can find in the idea of two normalized killers (in that it centers on them) calling their trophy collection a literal "facebook".
The morbid reality that lots of men do think of women as lesser, objectifiable, and disposable is just going to creep in on me, sorry.
For point of reference, is there any name/description that wouldn't make you upset? They could say any name and any description and there's some case somewhere of that group being harmed. That all not accounting for the notion that there's no indication his entire 'book' is young women to give it some measure of objectification/lessering.
It's just a crass comic depicting crazy killer sorts, whole movie/tv franchises have been spawned off such tales and events.
Everyone wants an excuse to complain about some form of opinionated injustice. At the end of the day it’s all worthless and will be forgotten in 200 years.
That’s because of the value of human life generated by culture and society. A murderer is a horrible thing, a human death is a tragedy. How many insects you killed today? Nobody gives a shit about industrial cow killers except the snowflakes that want them to live better than the homeless. Remember we decide what lives and what dies in history even if it’s only the victors.
Not finding the comic funny isn't the same as being upset by the comic.
It's the absence of socio-cultural self-reflection I'm upset by, the stuff in the real world. So I'm causing some reflection to happen by commenting.
But I'm not interested in being put into the woke-scald, fragile snowflake, or content-police roles. I said what I said, and I'll let others have their own thoughts on it.
I don't think being aware of the landscape of violence against women and femicide makes me "superior"...
... although I do find it very odd that saying I have trouble enjoying media that contains violence or suggestions of violence against women because of that awareness has gotten so many downvotes.
I can get it, speaking for myself I think a big part of the 'ick' to the comment comes from the environment of the fedi itself.
There seems to be an over-representation of people on here with a self-righteous, purity tested sort of mentality preaching to others how they should be shamed for not abiding by some rigid standard they would see as worthy. It wears thin after a while.
The 'curse of' bit has a feel of that, 'you're an unenlightened cur for finding it amusing'.
The balance as I see it is between 'nobody should be upset about anythin so say whatever you want' vs 'you have to be forever careful of every word lest someone be upset'. Somewhere in there is a balance where people don't have to be constantly on edge but aren't acting like an unrestrained asshole.
I think it's a curse because it would be easier to not notice, or say anything... Like the alt-right kind of looks fun in the same way being irresponsible and selfish is fun. That's what it means for me, it's a curse because these discussions aren't fun and don't win upvotes.
George Carlin: Sigmund Freud said “sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.” Oh yeah? Well sometimes it’s a big brown dick… with a fat, arrogant, white-collared, business-criminal a*****e sucking on the wet end of it!
The world can be full of subtext and extra meanings, but it's high stress to always be on watch for it. 🙃
I think you might be overthinking a comic where the punchline is "Hey remember Leatherface from the well-known horror film The Texas Chain Saw Massacre, who had the mask made of human skin? I bet if he referred to "Facebook", it would be a literal book filled with faces."
Hell, I'd bet real money that the only reason they specifically mentioned a teenage blonde is because one of the film victims was a teenage blonde. They mention her "hanging" around there, and the blonde teen in the film gets hung on a meat hook.
It sounds like your gripe is with the film, and the horror genre in general. This comic is just a pun.
Violence against women isn't the same character of crime as violence against men, its not a crime where you (God like), can switch one gender out for another and have it play out to the same social/gendered beats, for the same social and cultural reasonings and circumstances.
I've said elsewhere that it's not the comic that bothers me, it's the wider social issues that push or lead to violence against women and femicide.
All that said, and perhaps more in line with what you're asking (although my response probably won't satisfy you): I'm not interested in redeeming or fixing the comic, or making it subversive. I'll leave that to the content creators.
And, even more murky is that that genre is often very popular with women. They have a fascination with the dangers that are sometimes a real possibility to them, especially when they can be expressed in an over-the-top way safely behind a screen.
Yeah, people keep thinking when I talk about violence against women, I'm talking about some comic or movie. I'm not.
My comment was that I have trouble finding humor or fun in these things, knowing about the real world problems, yet that fairly moderate statement has received wide downvoting.
personally when I trap women in my basement to butcher, I want them to fight it. I mean that with all sincerity. I spent the last ten years building this murder hut into the side of a mountain so nobody can hear you scream, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't scream.
I mean come on, look at all the effort I had to go through to make this dream a reality! the least a woman could do is play along with it.
but no. modern women just crawl into one of the roach infested corners and sob quietly as I peel their sorority sisters face off. such a fucking insult! sure Barbara, you can write a flame review for your pumpkin spiced latte with a turd in it, but you won't give my efforts the time of day?!
you know, this is probably why I kill them. not because I want to, but because if I didn't skin them alive they would just think less of me as a man.
I think it's because most would agree the punchline isn't it's funny because the Facebook is real faces - that's just not very funny, especially given the context of Texas Chainsaw Massacre and Leatherface, that takes away any absurdist element as it's grounded in their context.
To explain this to downvoters, imagine it was an unknown killer speaking to a random accomplice and they were browsing a bunch of assorted races and gendered faces in the book, without the reference to the blonde 18yo girl. Is that still funny, or is it just a meh joke hardly worth drawing, and not worth an upvote. I think the latter?
The real punchline is that it's funny because of how casually they talk about the murder of 18 year old, screaming girls. It's subversive edgy humour in the worst way - punching down to a relatively powerless group in a way that dehumanises them to nothing more than a throwaway premise about a Facebook.
One of the reasons horror is celebrated is because it’s art imitating life. Often, it makes people feel uncomfortable, and the way they express that fear is worrying life will imitate art.
Sadly, it probably has happened before, but never without a long basis of hatred and mental health issues. The bigger question to me is how many people would like to see less of horror tropes, to the point that we don’t see violence against women on screen - but the rate of it in our alleyways remains unchanged.
We can think of it a bit like Childish Gambino in “This is America” taking a gun from his pants, shooting a bound prisoner, and then gently putting the gun on a pad. It’s not supposed to feel cool. It’s supposed to make you feel uncomfortable because it reflects something we don’t like to talk about. To me, making casual jokes surrounding fictional killers isn’t going much further.
Your are overthinking a comic where the punchline is "facebook but taken too literally".
Honestly i think lemmy has this problem where too many people overthink on jokes
53 Comments
TheTechnician27@lemmy.world · 27 pts · 1d
Hi, OP. I could see this being considered borderline, but I'd ask per Rule 2 that you mark this as NSFW. At the same time, I'd also like to hear others' thoughts on that request to get a better idea going forward.
(Edit: Undistinguishing, but still feel free to share here if and how you think the NSFW tag should be applied/enforced.)
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 22 pts · 1d
Bit overzealous in my opinion, but I appreciate you making the request rather than delete first and ask questions never like most mods with a problem, so sure!
ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net · 9 pts · 1d
I think that if you can get in trouble by watching something like this at work you should not be browsing internet at work.
village604@adultswim.fan · 1 pts · 20h
Lots of jobs have expected down time. It's always better to err on the side of caution because for a chunk of the Lemmy population, you can be fired for anything.
ShellMonkey@piefed.socdojo.com · 9 pts · 1d
While I sure wouldn't go sharing it in an email thread, I wouldn't say it's overtly nsfw. Might raise a few questions of that was your common taste though.
Sibbo@sopuli.xyz · 7 pts · 1d
I think NSFW is good in this case.
plantfanatic@sh.itjust.works · 6 pts · 1d
So a mask is okay if it’s animal skins or depicting anything else, but not human? What’s the nsfw part? There’s no gore or blood.
starik@lemmy.today · 19 pts · 1d
Most of this comm’s readership is human.
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 12 pts · 1d
Big if true
TheTechnician27@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 1d
Haha, yes. I agree, fellow reader. bzz bzz 🐝
plantfanatic@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 23h
And? What’s that change?
Oh no, it’s a human face! The horror!!!!
Some people take offense to someone eating a burger, that doeant mean someone eating one is NSFW.
dreadbeef@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 1d
Not counting the bots of course
TheTechnician27@lemmy.world · 14 pts · 1d
You're preaching to the choir on the speciesism angle.
This isn't my own prescriptivist moral judgment; it's trying to be descriptive of what someone would reasonably think "would otherwise draw unwanted attention by nosy coworkers [...]". That attempt at descriptivism is why I was hoping for feedback like your comment.
Moreover, if you were to swap out the victims and faces in this comic with cows, pigs, etc., I'd probably still be asking the OP to mark this as NSFW.
Interpreting "gore" as "pictures and videos of graphic violence and human death", this is:
plantfanatic@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 23h
Well I mean this is currently on the front page and depicts murdering animals, so it seems to be a random line on this community.
https://slrpnk.net/pictrs/image/c3227240-ed95-4e50-a8c2-bee2ddc9a342.webp
How’s this worse than that?
I’m sure I could go and easily find more that fit your description, people take offense to eating burgers, so can’t post anything related to that? Something will always upset someone, that’s a horrible metric to moderate by.
Edit this depicts a sexual act and isn’t mentioned anything…
Rules shouldn’t be arbitrary, and you should leave veganism out of comics, what’s that got to do with moderating comics? So you can use this place for propaganda and your own interests?
Gonna have an issue with a comic depicting eating a burger? Because that’s the point that’s being made by bringing veganism in here. Doesn’t belong.
starik@lemmy.today · 3 pts · 1d
I think you’re right about it being borderline. At first glance, Leatherface just looks like a cartoon zombie. You have to look closely and maybe read the comic to understand the implied gore.
WorldsDumbestMan@lemmy.today · -2 pts · 1d
People are pussies. Protect innocent eyes.
agentTeiko@piefed.social · 19 pts · 1d
I mean he kind of looks like Zuckerberg
slaacaa@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 22h
BigDiction@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 21h
Definitely dark, but for a lot true crime fans this is just an average Tuesday.
OldChicoAle@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 6h
Tie over the apron?
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 6 pts · 6h
Yeah, THAT'S what he's wearing that's the most objectionable 😄
M0oP0o@mander.xyz · 2 pts · 5h
Well one of these fashion choices I have seen before, and its not the tie over the apron.
starik@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 1d
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · -22 pts · 1d
Yes women do have their lives ended by men a lot in our society.
I think this fact overshadows any humor I can find in the idea of two normalized killers (in that it centers on them) calling their trophy collection a literal "facebook".
The morbid reality that lots of men do think of women as lesser, objectifiable, and disposable is just going to creep in on me, sorry.
Curse of the politically aware.
ShellMonkey@piefed.socdojo.com · 21 pts · 1d
For point of reference, is there any name/description that wouldn't make you upset? They could say any name and any description and there's some case somewhere of that group being harmed. That all not accounting for the notion that there's no indication his entire 'book' is young women to give it some measure of objectification/lessering.
It's just a crass comic depicting crazy killer sorts, whole movie/tv franchises have been spawned off such tales and events.
DeathsEmbrace@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 1d
Everyone wants an excuse to complain about some form of opinionated injustice. At the end of the day it’s all worthless and will be forgotten in 200 years.
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
I'm starting to think the psycho killers might have an inside on how to live on forever.
everyone remembers Jack the Ripper, nobody remembers Janice the Whore.
DeathsEmbrace@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
That’s because of the value of human life generated by culture and society. A murderer is a horrible thing, a human death is a tragedy. How many insects you killed today? Nobody gives a shit about industrial cow killers except the snowflakes that want them to live better than the homeless. Remember we decide what lives and what dies in history even if it’s only the victors.
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 1d
Not finding the comic funny isn't the same as being upset by the comic.
It's the absence of socio-cultural self-reflection I'm upset by, the stuff in the real world. So I'm causing some reflection to happen by commenting.
But I'm not interested in being put into the woke-scald, fragile snowflake, or content-police roles. I said what I said, and I'll let others have their own thoughts on it.
I'm not obligated to comment further.
ShellMonkey@piefed.socdojo.com · 1 pts · 23h
Be wary of phrases that imply superiority of awaness or thought
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 7h
I don't think being aware of the landscape of violence against women and femicide makes me "superior"...
... although I do find it very odd that saying I have trouble enjoying media that contains violence or suggestions of violence against women because of that awareness has gotten so many downvotes.
I just feel it's a difficult topic to get right.
ShellMonkey@piefed.socdojo.com · 2 pts · 6h
I can get it, speaking for myself I think a big part of the 'ick' to the comment comes from the environment of the fedi itself.
There seems to be an over-representation of people on here with a self-righteous, purity tested sort of mentality preaching to others how they should be shamed for not abiding by some rigid standard they would see as worthy. It wears thin after a while.
The 'curse of' bit has a feel of that, 'you're an unenlightened cur for finding it amusing'.
The balance as I see it is between 'nobody should be upset about anythin so say whatever you want' vs 'you have to be forever careful of every word lest someone be upset'. Somewhere in there is a balance where people don't have to be constantly on edge but aren't acting like an unrestrained asshole.
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 4h
I think it's a curse because it would be easier to not notice, or say anything... Like the alt-right kind of looks fun in the same way being irresponsible and selfish is fun. That's what it means for me, it's a curse because these discussions aren't fun and don't win upvotes.
ShellMonkey@piefed.socdojo.com · 1 pts · 19m
The world can be full of subtext and extra meanings, but it's high stress to always be on watch for it. 🙃
agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works · 11 pts · 1d
I think you might be overthinking a comic where the punchline is "Hey remember Leatherface from the well-known horror film The Texas Chain Saw Massacre, who had the mask made of human skin? I bet if he referred to "Facebook", it would be a literal book filled with faces."
Hell, I'd bet real money that the only reason they specifically mentioned a teenage blonde is because one of the film victims was a teenage blonde. They mention her "hanging" around there, and the blonde teen in the film gets hung on a meat hook.
It sounds like your gripe is with the film, and the horror genre in general. This comic is just a pun.
starik@lemmy.today · 5 pts · 1d
The comic is a reference to a character from The Texas Chain Saw Massacre (1974).
Noel_Skum@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 1d
If the man / woman roles were reversed in the four panel comic would you find humour in its subversiveness and reversal of tropic norms?
Edit: by “tropic” I mean relating to tropes, not Cancer nor Capricorn.
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · -5 pts · 1d
Violence against women isn't the same character of crime as violence against men, its not a crime where you (God like), can switch one gender out for another and have it play out to the same social/gendered beats, for the same social and cultural reasonings and circumstances.
I've said elsewhere that it's not the comic that bothers me, it's the wider social issues that push or lead to violence against women and femicide.
All that said, and perhaps more in line with what you're asking (although my response probably won't satisfy you): I'm not interested in redeeming or fixing the comic, or making it subversive. I'll leave that to the content creators.
BeMoreCareful@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 1d
I mean, isn't that a part of the original IP as well?
I have no opinion on role reversal either, that's sort of dumb.
But horror movies have been exploring/exploiting violence against women for longer that I've been alive.
So, it's part of a much larger conversation that is ongoing.
Edit: this gives very American Psycho vibes
Katana314@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 23h
And, even more murky is that that genre is often very popular with women. They have a fascination with the dangers that are sometimes a real possibility to them, especially when they can be expressed in an over-the-top way safely behind a screen.
BeMoreCareful@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 22h
Almost like women are people, strange
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 7h
Yeah, people keep thinking when I talk about violence against women, I'm talking about some comic or movie. I'm not.
My comment was that I have trouble finding humor or fun in these things, knowing about the real world problems, yet that fairly moderate statement has received wide downvoting.
Noel_Skum@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 1d
Thanks for the response but, honestly, I only expected a “yes, no, depends…” type answer.
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 1d
personally when I trap women in my basement to butcher, I want them to fight it. I mean that with all sincerity. I spent the last ten years building this murder hut into the side of a mountain so nobody can hear you scream, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't scream.
I mean come on, look at all the effort I had to go through to make this dream a reality! the least a woman could do is play along with it.
but no. modern women just crawl into one of the roach infested corners and sob quietly as I peel their sorority sisters face off. such a fucking insult! sure Barbara, you can write a flame review for your pumpkin spiced latte with a turd in it, but you won't give my efforts the time of day?!
you know, this is probably why I kill them. not because I want to, but because if I didn't skin them alive they would just think less of me as a man.
fucking women, am I right guys?
pulsewidth@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 1d
This satire is too close to what too many redpilled losers believe for me to enjoy it. I appreciate the quality effort though.
pulsewidth@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
It's not funny to me either.
I think it's because most would agree the punchline isn't it's funny because the Facebook is real faces - that's just not very funny, especially given the context of Texas Chainsaw Massacre and Leatherface, that takes away any absurdist element as it's grounded in their context.
To explain this to downvoters, imagine it was an unknown killer speaking to a random accomplice and they were browsing a bunch of assorted races and gendered faces in the book, without the reference to the blonde 18yo girl. Is that still funny, or is it just a meh joke hardly worth drawing, and not worth an upvote. I think the latter?
The real punchline is that it's funny because of how casually they talk about the murder of 18 year old, screaming girls. It's subversive edgy humour in the worst way - punching down to a relatively powerless group in a way that dehumanises them to nothing more than a throwaway premise about a Facebook.
Bleh.
starik@lemmy.today · 7 pts · 1d
The 18yo blonde is a horror trope, and part of the original movie. The comic is really just about the “Facebook” joke.
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 1d
Why do you think that's a horror trope? How do you think that got to be that way?
starik@lemmy.today · 2 pts · 1d
Because it sold tickets?
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 1d
Art imitating life. Young women were a target for violence long long long before it was a Hollywood trope.
Katana314@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 22h
One of the reasons horror is celebrated is because it’s art imitating life. Often, it makes people feel uncomfortable, and the way they express that fear is worrying life will imitate art.
Sadly, it probably has happened before, but never without a long basis of hatred and mental health issues. The bigger question to me is how many people would like to see less of horror tropes, to the point that we don’t see violence against women on screen - but the rate of it in our alleyways remains unchanged.
We can think of it a bit like Childish Gambino in “This is America” taking a gun from his pants, shooting a bound prisoner, and then gently putting the gun on a pad. It’s not supposed to feel cool. It’s supposed to make you feel uncomfortable because it reflects something we don’t like to talk about. To me, making casual jokes surrounding fictional killers isn’t going much further.
pulsewidth@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 1d
I'm aware and I said that already.
I also explained why the joke isn't funny alone in my hypothetical for downvoters, but you ignore that because it didn't suit your interpretation.
creamfresh@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 1d
Wouldn't hardly be the first unfunny strip in this comm that's highly upvoted.
Axolotl_cpp@feddit.it · 1 pts · 3h
Your are overthinking a comic where the punchline is "facebook but taken too literally".
Honestly i think lemmy has this problem where too many people overthink on jokes