That is an insult to PostgreSQL.
PostgreSQL was fully featured relational database even before it implemented SQL. It started much earlier tha MySQL.
And MySQL didn't have proper transactions or data integrity constraints (including foreign keys) for long time, while calling itself an 'SQL database'.
Thank you, I never had time to read up on its history when I was busy smashing out sites on stupid deadlines with constant last minute changes and morons for project managers.
Hatred of Oracle predates "cancelling" by decades. Oracle is and has always been one of, if not the most disgusting and vicious companies in tech. They kill everything they touch.
If you need a political component, then Oracle = Larry Ellison, but Oracle hate predates and supercedes the American political slide into fascism.
I was at a party about fifteen years ago. A guy introduced himself and we gabbed for a few minutes. Then he asked what I do for work (IT sysadmin at the time) and I told him and asked the same. He said he was in sales for a tech company. I asked which one, and he stepped close and whispered, "Oracle." I could see he was prepared for me to bring the hate. He saved himself when he told me he was actually leaving for a gig at Dell. Later, I learned from the host that he made that part about leaving up because he felt bad. I later learned he went to work for Nutanix. Poor guy hated his own employer, and it was obvious.
Nutanix...oof. I deal with them every day. It isn't their fault their shit can't handle what we do, but it is their sales folk that constantly lie and misrepresent.
Wanna know one of rhe big reasons people hate Oracle so much? It's their sales guys. They are awful. If that guy went from Oracle to Nutanix, that tells me that I cannot trust a single syllable out of their mouth.
I mean, Nestlé killed hundreds of thousands in impoverished countries. I think the Oracle service APIs can't be that bad, though I'm sure they would be if it made Larry Ellison $50.
I'm sorry I don't follow this company's actions as closely as you do. I can't even remember the last time I used Oracle-branded software. (Unless you count MySQL, which I've never had an issue with. It just works.)
I don't know the actual reason, but I personally get a bad vibe every time I see the logo because usually it means I'm trying to install or fix some java bullshit, which never goes well.
SQLite is underrated. I've used it for high traffic systems with no issues. If your system has a large number of readers and a small number of writers, it performs very well. It's not as good for high-concurrency write-heavy use cases, but that's not common (most apps read far more than they write).
My use case was a DB that was created during the build process, then read on every page load.
One of SQLite's recommended use cases is as an alternate to proprietary binary formats: https://sqlite.org/appfileformat.html. Programs often store data in binary files for performance, but you get a lot of the same functionality included with SQLite (fast random access, concurrent usage, atomicity, updates that don't need to rewrite the whole file, etc) without having to implement a file format yourself.
I'm not sure if this is still the case, but Facebook'a HHVM used to store the compiled bytecode for the whole site in a single SQLite database: https://docs.hhvm.com/docs/hhvm/advanced-usage/repo-authoritative/. Every pageload loaded the bytecode for all required files from the DB.
Blogs and forums back then when I looked it up.
Can't remember exactly where (since it's been a long time ago), but I'm sure more than someone claimed it.
Yeah,
I did a speed test comparison between Oracle MySQL and MariaDB MySQL,
MariaDB is about 10 times faster.
FYI: When Oracle bought MySQL a lot of developers left and created MariaDB, so the brains behind the project moved, and in the meantime Oracle did a great job of fucking things up.
MySQL often has moderately higher performance (particularly for workloads where you want your data clustered by PK, which is how InnoDB is natively structured) and its replication system is much more flexible than either of PostgreSQL's. I like Percona personally, but MariaDB is fine too.
Postgres with correct fillfactor, it doesn't create new pages and works very fast.
Replication in MySQL always sucked ass, only received synchronous replication in some new edition, and that also didn't sound great.
Postgres has logstream and logical replication, both of them can be set to various levels of synchronicity, and logical replication is configurable at least as well as MySQL is in terms of which data is sent.
Operating and securing Postgres is a steeper learning curve. MariaDB is more forgiving for best-effort shoestring setups without compensating scalability for it.
As a dev I'm agnostic, as an owner and computer scientiest I prefer Postgres, as a sysadmin or *Ops I will put my hand up for MariaDB any day if I'll be on call or maintain deployments.
Cause that one is absolute shit, very difficult to maintain, and requires lots of config changes and even replicas can disconnect when something's not 100% ok.
I will take Postgres over any other DB any day of the week.
I don't know how many new people are coming to PHP these days (as opposed to javascript/python/rust/etc), but certainly the older PHP coders grew up using mysql.
MariaDB is not always a drop-in replacement. There's several features that MySQL has that MariaDB doesn't, especially related to the optimizer (for some types of queries, MySQL will give you a more optimized execution plan compared to MariaDB). It's also missing some newer data types, like JSON (which indexes the individual fields in JSON objects to make filtering on them more efficient).
MariaDB and MySQL are both fine. Even though MySQL doesn't receive as much development any more, it doesn't really need it. It works fine. If you want a better database system, switch to PostgreSQL, not MariaDB.
101 Comments
JoMiran@lemmy.ml · 199 pts · 252d
MySQL belongs to Oracle. That's literally all you need to.know in order to avoid it.
FlowerFan@piefed.blahaj.zone · 64 pts · 252d
how did the joke go? "one rich asshole called larry ellison"?
ijhoo@lemmy.ml · 14 pts · 252d
what's the joke part?
slazer2au@lemmy.world · 25 pts · 252d
It spells Oracle.
anomnom@sh.itjust.works · 9 pts · 252d
Isn’t that the point of Postgresql. It’s basically an open source version of MySQL.
I’m sure there are some proprietary nonsense that MySQL has, but I’ve never needed it in 17 years
sobchak@programming.dev · 31 pts · 252d
Postgres is basically an open source version of Oracle DB. Much more featureful than MySQL. I believe Oracle bought MySQL just to kill it.
msage@programming.dev · 13 pts · 252d
MySQL always sucked ass.
PostgreSQL went in a different direction, started with best support of the SQL standard, then optimized everything to make it fast.
Postgres has/had the best SQL standard support out of every server, open-source or not.
MySQL was at the other end, only started catching up after Oracle bought it.
Eyekaytee@aussie.zone · 29 pts · 252d
afaik MariaDB is the open source version of MySQL
Jajcus@sh.itjust.works · 24 pts · 251d
That is an insult to PostgreSQL. PostgreSQL was fully featured relational database even before it implemented SQL. It started much earlier tha MySQL.
And MySQL didn't have proper transactions or data integrity constraints (including foreign keys) for long time, while calling itself an 'SQL database'.
anomnom@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 251d
Thank you, I never had time to read up on its history when I was busy smashing out sites on stupid deadlines with constant last minute changes and morons for project managers.
Auli@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 250d
MariaDB
Psythik@lemmy.world · -42 pts · 252d
JoMiran@lemmy.ml · 92 pts · 252d
Hatred of Oracle predates "cancelling" by decades. Oracle is and has always been one of, if not the most disgusting and vicious companies in tech. They kill everything they touch.
If you need a political component, then Oracle = Larry Ellison, but Oracle hate predates and supercedes the American political slide into fascism.
s38b35M5@lemmy.world · 26 pts · 252d
I was at a party about fifteen years ago. A guy introduced himself and we gabbed for a few minutes. Then he asked what I do for work (IT sysadmin at the time) and I told him and asked the same. He said he was in sales for a tech company. I asked which one, and he stepped close and whispered, "Oracle." I could see he was prepared for me to bring the hate. He saved himself when he told me he was actually leaving for a gig at Dell. Later, I learned from the host that he made that part about leaving up because he felt bad. I later learned he went to work for Nutanix. Poor guy hated his own employer, and it was obvious.
JoMiran@lemmy.ml · 17 pts · 252d
Nutanix...oof. I deal with them every day. It isn't their fault their shit can't handle what we do, but it is their sales folk that constantly lie and misrepresent.
Wanna know one of rhe big reasons people hate Oracle so much? It's their sales guys. They are awful. If that guy went from Oracle to Nutanix, that tells me that I cannot trust a single syllable out of their mouth.
frongt@lemmy.zip · 11 pts · 252d
Sales? No, their sales department is second to their legal department in hate.
s38b35M5@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 252d
Lol! I'm glad you picked on that. I won't badmouth them, but the user experience does that for them. That guy from the party must hate himself, haha
0x0@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 251d
So... your average sales folk?
non_burglar@lemmy.world · 48 pts · 252d
When they bought Sun, they:
AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world · 25 pts · 252d
Sun was such a useful contributor to the ecosystem and they fucking trashed absolutely everything. It's a miracle that so much stuff could be saved.
0x0@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 251d
Oracle triggered a fork bomb.
dukatos@lemmy.zip · 12 pts · 252d
You forgot what they did to Java, plus they sued Google for using Java API.
hexmasteen@lemmy.ml · 3 pts · 247d
and OpenOffice and VirtualBox
iturnedintoanewt@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 252d
https://www.reddit.com/r/selfhosted/comments/11fyt1b/whats_with_the_stigma_behind_oracle/
Psythik@lemmy.world · -5 pts · 252d
Oh so it's a greed thing, but not quite a Nestlé level of evil thing, then. Meh.
partofthevoice@lemmy.zip · 10 pts · 252d
You clearly haven’t tried using one of there services APIs.
azertyfun@sh.itjust.works · 6 pts · 252d
I mean, Nestlé killed hundreds of thousands in impoverished countries. I think the Oracle service APIs can't be that bad, though I'm sure they would be if it made Larry Ellison $50.
0x0@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 251d
Can you elaborate on Nestlé?
I know they're shit and avoid anything Nes* but am unaware of actual data.
badgermurphy@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 251d
frongt@lemmy.zip · 9 pts · 252d
Only due to lack of capability, not desire.
forrgott@lemmy.zip · 13 pts · 252d
Why would you keep track? Can't form your own opinions?!
And what the fuck hasn't Oracle done? Like, seriously, they've been a known bad actor for literally decades now...
Psythik@lemmy.world · -3 pts · 252d
I'm sorry I don't follow this company's actions as closely as you do. I can't even remember the last time I used Oracle-branded software. (Unless you count MySQL, which I've never had an issue with. It just works.)
jubilationtcornpone@sh.itjust.works · 11 pts · 252d
"Lets use Oracle DB for that."
Statements made by the utterly deranged.
fizzle@quokk.au · 6 pts · 252d
I don't know the actual reason, but I personally get a bad vibe every time I see the logo because usually it means I'm trying to install or fix some java bullshit, which never goes well.
0x0@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 251d
Here's a few.
0x0@lemmy.zip · 5 pts · 251d
Have you been living under a rock? Think 2010 for starters...
Auli@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 250d
People have hated Oracle for decades.
slacktoid@lemmy.ml · 89 pts · 252d
Stop using mysql, you have postgres.
possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip · 25 pts · 252d
And mariaSQL
call_me_xale@lemmy.zip · 43 pts · 252d
Hell, even SQLite is good enough for most small projects.
dan@upvote.au · 38 pts · 252d
SQLite is underrated. I've used it for high traffic systems with no issues. If your system has a large number of readers and a small number of writers, it performs very well. It's not as good for high-concurrency write-heavy use cases, but that's not common (most apps read far more than they write).
My use case was a DB that was created during the build process, then read on every page load.
derpgon@programming.dev · 3 pts · 252d
Wow, I never thought about storing build data in an SQLite file. That's quite clever.
dan@upvote.au · 13 pts · 252d
One of SQLite's recommended use cases is as an alternate to proprietary binary formats: https://sqlite.org/appfileformat.html. Programs often store data in binary files for performance, but you get a lot of the same functionality included with SQLite (fast random access, concurrent usage, atomicity, updates that don't need to rewrite the whole file, etc) without having to implement a file format yourself.
I'm not sure if this is still the case, but Facebook'a HHVM used to store the compiled bytecode for the whole site in a single SQLite database: https://docs.hhvm.com/docs/hhvm/advanced-usage/repo-authoritative/. Every pageload loaded the bytecode for all required files from the DB.
hoppolito@mander.xyz · 3 pts · 251d
Fascinating read, I should definitely also make way more use of sqlite for little side projects.
Thanks for the link!
0x0@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 251d
They also have a (one-time fee) encryption extension.
immobile7801@piefed.social · 13 pts · 252d
FWIW mariadb was bought by a private equity firm in 2024
psoul@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 252d
Oh no… it was the easy solution for Wordpress and other plug and play self hosted services .
alibloke@feddit.uk · 2 pts · 252d
The corporation was bought by k1 capital. The foundation and therefore the open source version will always be free
melfie@lemy.lol · 55 pts · 252d
skisnow@lemmy.ca · 6 pts · 251d
wow, I didn't need any more reasons not to support Oracle but thanks anyway
herseycokguzelolacak@lemmy.ml · 53 pts · 252d
Didn't Postgresql effectively win the database wars? Why use anything else?
dogs0n@sh.itjust.works · 29 pts · 252d
Postgres or sqlite are the only ones I ever consider nowadays.
Takios@discuss.tchncs.de · 8 pts · 251d
If only the upgrade process wasn't so annoying with postgres...
msage@programming.dev · 6 pts · 251d
What do you mean?
Stop DB, run pg_upgrade, start it, win?
Or set up logical replication into newer version, wait for sync, test use-cases, switch write?
Where do you get better experience?
Hawk@lemmynsfw.com · 5 pts · 251d
See also duckdb and clickhouse for OLAP of course.
MrSoup@lemmy.zip · 47 pts · 252d
MariaDB >>>
I've been using it since ever on my rpi because they say it's easier on resources
YurkshireLad@lemmy.ca · 14 pts · 252d
Who are “they”?
We use MariaDB at work but I don’t know why it was originally chosen over PostgreSQL, as that was before my time.
MrSoup@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 251d
Blogs and forums back then when I looked it up.
Can't remember exactly where (since it's been a long time ago), but I'm sure more than someone claimed it.
Shimitar@downonthestreet.eu · 43 pts · 252d
If you don't want to use postgresql for some obscure reason use MariaDB real open source MySQL drop in replacement.
schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de · 42 pts · 252d
Are there real advantages to using either MySQL or MariaDB instead of PostgreSQL?
jubilationtcornpone@sh.itjust.works · 50 pts · 252d
No. But there are a number of advantages of using PostgreSQL over the others.
Rikj000@discuss.tchncs.de · 10 pts · 252d
Yeah,
I did a speed test comparison between Oracle MySQL and MariaDB MySQL,
MariaDB is about 10 times faster.
FYI: When Oracle bought MySQL a lot of developers left and created MariaDB, so the brains behind the project moved, and in the meantime Oracle did a great job of fucking things up.
schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de · 12 pts · 252d
That's not what I asked. I asked about a comparison of both of them to PostgreSQL.
Rikj000@discuss.tchncs.de · 4 pts · 252d
Oh misread my bad,
not much experience with PostgreSQL
illusionist@lemmy.zip · 7 pts · 252d
Depends on the task but for general usage there is no big difference. You would choose one over the other if you need one for work.
roguelazer@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 252d
MySQL often has moderately higher performance (particularly for workloads where you want your data clustered by PK, which is how InnoDB is natively structured) and its replication system is much more flexible than either of PostgreSQL's. I like Percona personally, but MariaDB is fine too.
msage@programming.dev · 0 pts · 252d
Is it true?
Postgres with correct fillfactor, it doesn't create new pages and works very fast.
Replication in MySQL always sucked ass, only received synchronous replication in some new edition, and that also didn't sound great.
Postgres has logstream and logical replication, both of them can be set to various levels of synchronicity, and logical replication is configurable at least as well as MySQL is in terms of which data is sent.
kumi@feddit.online · 5 pts · 252d
Operating and securing Postgres is a steeper learning curve. MariaDB is more forgiving for best-effort shoestring setups without compensating scalability for it.
As a dev I'm agnostic, as an owner and computer scientiest I prefer Postgres, as a sysadmin or *Ops I will put my hand up for MariaDB any day if I'll be on call or maintain deployments.
msage@programming.dev · 1 pts · 251d
Is Maria that much better than MySQL?
Cause that one is absolute shit, very difficult to maintain, and requires lots of config changes and even replicas can disconnect when something's not 100% ok.
I will take Postgres over any other DB any day of the week.
0x0@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 251d
MariaDB is MySQL's fork, initiated by the main developers, so...
msage@programming.dev · 1 pts · 251d
Does that mean it's still an utter borderline unusable shit?
0x0@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 251d
I'd say ti's a little bit better.
0_o7@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 2 pts · 252d
If you're constrained by resources (CPU/RAM).
There's a reason most web hosts usually have mariadb and not postgres.
Wispy2891@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 252d
Maybe that once every 2 years when you upgrade to major version it does it automatically? You save 15 mins every 2 years?
800XL@lemmy.world · 41 pts · 252d
What year is this? No one should be using Mysql since MariaDB came about.
BrilliantantTurd4361@sh.itjust.works · 33 pts · 252d
Why would anyone ever choose mysql over postgres?
Scrollone@feddit.it · 11 pts · 252d
MySQL has been the "default" choice for a long time for PHP programmers. I don't know why.
Evotech@lemmy.world · 13 pts · 252d
LAMP indeed
WhyAUsername_1@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 252d
We need LAPP . Stat!
whoisearth@lemmy.ca · 9 pts · 251d
It used to be free with less of a barrier to entry than postgres
msage@programming.dev · 3 pts · 251d
Tutorials mostly.
Andres4NY@social.ridetrans.it · 1 pts · 252d
@Scrollone @BrilliantantTurd4361 Because it used to be a lot faster than postgresql for smaller sites. MyISAM (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MyISAM) was super lightweight, at the expense of the occasional corrupt database (oops).
I don't know how many new people are coming to PHP these days (as opposed to javascript/python/rust/etc), but certainly the older PHP coders grew up using mysql.
0x0@lemmy.zip · 27 pts · 251d
No one should be using MySQL since 2010.
UnknownMp@lemmy.world · 27 pts · 252d
Perhaps MariaDB is a better choice.
unknownmp@mastodon.social · 1 pts · 252d
ikidd@lemmy.world · 23 pts · 252d
What rock do you live under if you're using MySQL over MariaDB?
lechekaflan@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 251d
Older people about to return to programming, and most of the online tutorials they have are about 20 years old, having no idea an alternative exists.
dan@upvote.au · 12 pts · 252d
MariaDB is not always a drop-in replacement. There's several features that MySQL has that MariaDB doesn't, especially related to the optimizer (for some types of queries, MySQL will give you a more optimized execution plan compared to MariaDB). It's also missing some newer data types, like JSON (which indexes the individual fields in JSON objects to make filtering on them more efficient).
MariaDB and MySQL are both fine. Even though MySQL doesn't receive as much development any more, it doesn't really need it. It works fine. If you want a better database system, switch to PostgreSQL, not MariaDB.
possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip · 10 pts · 252d
That's why I moved to MSSQL
/s
androidul@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 252d
when is Oracle gonna go Broadcom mode on MySQL, still waiting for the moment 🍿
Grandwolf319@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 252d
But but but, it has the word “my” in it
/s
folekaule@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 252d
Both MySQL and MariaDb are named after the developer's daughters.
bored_boar_onboard@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 251d
Clearly you can’t use MySQL because it isn’t webscale.
SneakyWeasel@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 251d
Wamp anyone? (I think thats what its called, im at work and cant check my pc) Or am i the odd one out.
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 252d
tacosanonymous@mander.xyz · 4 pts · 252d
Dude. You never finish.
otto@programming.dev · 1 pts · 251d
In case you are Czech, there is a translation at https://www.root.cz/clanky/prestante-uz-pouzivat-mysql-neni-to-skutecny-open-source/?nahled=1
Glad to see more translations show up!
ianhclark510@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 0 pts · 252d
Apache Phoenix: allow me to introduce myself
AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 252d
Who?
ianhclark510@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 251d
Apache Phoenix
AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 250d
Looks great for my blog!
fizzle@quokk.au · -4 pts · 252d
I didn't know this was ever in question?
Also stop calling it "my sequel"
TrickDacy@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 252d
Why?
frongt@lemmy.zip · -5 pts · 252d
Sequel is Microsoft. S-Q-L is Linux.
surewhynotlem@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 252d
Microsoft's is "squeal". Like a pig. When you get the bill.