It's one thing to continuously move dates like that, but the uniqueness of giving a 3 month window and saying it with such confidence is very amusing to me.
As we reported last week, the “unsupervised” Robotaxis spotted on January 22 were all being followed by trailing Tesla vehicles with safety monitors inside.
Genius. Musk invented a taxi service that needs 2 cars and 2 drivers per ride.
When Musk says there’s “no safety monitor in the car,” he’s technically telling the truth, the monitor is in a different car, following right behind. But the implication that Tesla has achieved true unsupervised autonomy is misleading at best.
Oh, there's efficiency--just in the wrong place. He efficiently made a 4% bump in Tesla stock value by telling a few lies. That's all this is, and has been: profiting on hype/fomo.
On the earnings call yesterday, they claim (I haven't seen proof yet) that the chase car has been removed now.
Edit: Just updating with a quote someone transcribed. I thought it was paid rides with no chase car, but reading the actual quote, it sounds like they are claiming it is with nobody in the car and no chase car.
“We were able to do our first rides with no safety monitor in the car in Austin — these are paid rides, so these were just randomly paid rides with no safety monitor, and [umm] maybe as of maybe yesterday or so we actually don’t even have a chase car or anything like that so these are just cars with no people in them and no one’s following the car in Austin.”
Saying there's no chase car anymore isn't fraud if there's no chase car anymore. I just haven't seen any video proof yet of new rides in the past couple days.
Edit: Looks like it’s actually real with no chase cars. It’s been 2 rides so far. They arrived in 1 (which has no one in it) and then take a ride in another one that has no one in it and no chase car.
They've said they've removed drivers from inside the taxis, then put them in cars trailing the taxis.
Now they said there's no chase car anymore, and there isn't, because they put the drivers back in the taxi again.
Both statements were technically correct, but purposefully misleading to bump the stock by a few billion right before earnings call.
And at no point during all this did Tesla taxis drive autonomously.
I think we gotta give them more than 24h after he says something is now happening to see if it is happening or not?
It's going to come out soon enough either way.
edit: The call was explicit, no chase cars, no driver in the passenger seat, fully autonomous. And it's not every car, but a small amount, which really could mean just 1.
So far it seems to be zero, or one of the many Youtubers who've been hailing Tesla taxis all day long in order to be the first would have uploaded by now.
You know what, I saw someone transcribe the quote, and I don't think they were claiming there are passengers in the cars with no chase vehicles
"We were able to do our first rides with no safety monitor in the car in Austin — these are paid rides, so these were just randomly paid rides with no safety monitor, and [umm] maybe as of maybe yesterday or so we actually don't even have a chase car or anything like that so these are just cars with no people in them and no one's following the car in Austin."
these are just cars with no people in them and no one's following the car in Austin.
So ya we might not get any videos or proof of this statement which makes it useless.
I really don't care about any of that, what you're doing is called moving the goal post.
You baselessly claimed they committed fraud on the earnings call by saying something, which we truly don't know if they did or didn't yet. Maybe they did, maybe they didn't, we'll find out soon enough.
Edit: Sorry it's not moving the goal post, it's a whataboutism. What about that other time.
The chase car has been removed - but no one's seen the self-driving cars either, not since the chase car was removed. It's another intentional misdirection.
I updated my post above with the actual quote after someone transcribed it. He's saying there's a car driving around with nobody in it, and no chase car, so not a paid passenger ride.
So I imagine it's going to be really difficult to get video proof of this if its true, because someone will have to spot a random Tesla driving around without a driver and bother to record it. It's not like an influencer is going to hail it and be able to video it.
Not gonna lie, when I heard it, it wasn't as clear that this was the case as when i see it written out.
I can't wait for Musks dominoes to fall. Once Tesla investors realize their investment is worthless all his other companies he has cross leveraged everything with will all list start collapsing and the whole thing comes down.
That would be devastating to the markets, and it hasn't even address the AI bubble which is going to pop and the biggest economic downfall and depression in American history begins.
Tough times ahead no matter what, but the sooner Trump is gone they can start rebuilding.
The problem is that Tesla has become a self fulfilling prophecy. Not in any ability to actually make the products they advertise, but in making investors money. So many people have invested so much that the stock price now effectively describes investor’s aspirations for money, not their faith in Tesla. This has been true for some time. The value of the stock has been largely divorced from the reality of production targets, new products, or even the endless controversies.
Tesla isn't a car company, it's a techbro company. They don't sell cars, they sell the idea that any day now they'll achieve a technological breakthrough.
But it's becoming obvious that won't happen, so they now pivot to robots. Selling the idea that they'll achieve a breakthrough in that space soon.
Those buying the products aren't the target audience, the investors are. The customers are just useful cattle.
Anyone else feel like Tesla is actually how Elon is being paid for being the one to make twitter fascist and the DOGE bs? Like the majority of shareholders don't actually gaf how the company does and the billion dollar compensation package had nothing to do with Tesla other than it being the vehicle through which the payment was made?
I don’t see how. This is just a continuation of what he was already doing, facilitated by a board of his friends and relatives.
Even worse I have to say I’m not totally against it. All too often ceos get excessive pay regardless of their results. While I haven’t looked in detail not at the history, the claim is these are only for Tesla meeting some extremely ambitious milestones and the payment is stock. Certainly his previous ridiculous allay was in stock and Tesla had some extraordinary growth. If the stock doesn’t go up, then he should never receive that wealth
If it’s truly contingent on the company growth and the board doesn’t throw him a life preserver, that’s not entirely bad. Excessive yes. Extremely excessive. Excessively excessive. But more execs need to have their wealth gated on actual results
The thing that makes it more suspect IMO is that shareholders voted for it, not just the board. Courts specifically said they didn't need to but shareholders (dominated by large account holders) still voted for it.
My pet theory is that Musk was installed at Tesla by the Saudis (who apparently have a bit of money) to destroy the very idea of electric cars by putting out as bad and overpriced a product as possible. Despite his best efforts, people still want the goddamn things.
70 Comments
YaksDC@sh.itjust.works · 145 pts · 197d
In a different time the SEC would have been all over this obvious stock market manipulation.
ExcessShiv@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 100 pts · 197d
This is just plain lying by electrek...he started promising "self-driving next year" long before that.
mech@feddit.org · 62 pts · 196d
You can go on the SpaceX website right now and book a trip to Mars for 2026.
floquant@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 12 pts · 196d
Don't make me miss the good timeline like that
sexy_peach@feddit.org · 9 pts · 196d
No way I checked, this is real. Unbelievable
Mog_fanatic@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 196d
Earlier than that it's absolutely insane that anyone believes anything this dunce says now.
baller_w@lemmy.zip · 10 pts · 196d
And The Music Man just announced this will be a monthly service to make stonk go up.
“The market will bear the cost”
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 196d
I don't think it was next year every year before that?
It was just very soon before that.
ExcessShiv@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 5 pts · 196d
He may have used "end of year" before 2018...I'm pretty sure he promised "coast-to-coast" FSD capabilities "by end of the year" back in 2016
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 196d
Oh turns out my timelines are off, I thought the coast to coast promise was 2019.
It was in 2016, for the end of 2017.
hovercat@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 6 pts · 196d
"3 months maybe, 6 months definitely" is still one of my favorite quotes from his timeline estimates.
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 196d
Not the "two weeks" for months on end?
hovercat@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 4 pts · 196d
It's one thing to continuously move dates like that, but the uniqueness of giving a 3 month window and saying it with such confidence is very amusing to me.
hovercat@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 196d
"3 months maybe, 6 months definitely" is still one of my favorite quotes from his timeline estimates.
boonhet@sopuli.xyz · 2 pts · 196d
"It could take more than 3 months but it definitely will take more than 6"
SickofReddit@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 196d
2 weeks
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 196d
You left off the TM
2 weeks^tm^
mech@feddit.org · 97 pts · 196d
Genius. Musk invented a taxi service that needs 2 cars and 2 drivers per ride.
HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club · 1 pts · 193d
It is easier to get the public to accept they don't have a safety driver involved at all with this middle step.
HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club · 1 pts · 193d
devolution@lemmy.world · 93 pts · 197d
aramis87@fedia.io · 60 pts · 197d
I followed a link in that article to this one: Tesla didn’t remove the Robotaxi ‘safety monitor’ – it just moved them to a trailing car:
ChicoSuave@lemmy.world · 51 pts · 197d
Tesla has achieved remote control driving. It's the only taxi service that has 2 cars per fare.
ThePantser@sh.itjust.works · 38 pts · 197d
So instead of just paying a human driver for a taxi they have instead decided to use 2 whole cars AND a human driver. That's peek efficiency there.
frunch@lemmy.world · 21 pts · 196d
Oh, there's efficiency--just in the wrong place. He efficiently made a 4% bump in Tesla stock value by telling a few lies. That's all this is, and has been: profiting on hype/fomo.
Pieisawesome@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 3 pts · 196d
Waymo and others used a chase car, but they were transparent about that.
They still have some, but the ratio is now many self driving vehicles to one safety car
nyan@lemmy.cafe · 7 pts · 197d
Double your traffic congestion, or your money back!
. . . or not, since I've never heard of Tesla voluntarily refunding anything.
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 196d
On the earnings call yesterday, they claim (I haven't seen proof yet) that the chase car has been removed now.
Edit: Just updating with a quote someone transcribed. I thought it was paid rides with no chase car, but reading the actual quote, it sounds like they are claiming it is with nobody in the car and no chase car.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 13 pts · 196d
Remember when the SEC used to call this fraud?
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 196d
Saying there's no chase car anymore isn't fraud if there's no chase car anymore. I just haven't seen any video proof yet of new rides in the past couple days.
Edit: Looks like it’s actually real with no chase cars. It’s been 2 rides so far. They arrived in 1 (which has no one in it) and then take a ride in another one that has no one in it and no chase car.
https://x.com/DavidMoss/status/2016939137031381487
mech@feddit.org · 6 pts · 196d
They've said they've removed drivers from inside the taxis, then put them in cars trailing the taxis.
Now they said there's no chase car anymore, and there isn't, because they put the drivers back in the taxi again.
Both statements were technically correct, but purposefully misleading to bump the stock by a few billion right before earnings call.
And at no point during all this did Tesla taxis drive autonomously.
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · -2 pts · 196d
I think we gotta give them more than 24h after he says something is now happening to see if it is happening or not?
It's going to come out soon enough either way.
edit: The call was explicit, no chase cars, no driver in the passenger seat, fully autonomous. And it's not every car, but a small amount, which really could mean just 1.
mech@feddit.org · 2 pts · 196d
So far it seems to be zero, or one of the many Youtubers who've been hailing Tesla taxis all day long in order to be the first would have uploaded by now.
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 196d
Ya, I would expect a video any day now to confirm this one way or the other. This isn't a lets wait a month and find out situation.
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 196d
You know what, I saw someone transcribe the quote, and I don't think they were claiming there are passengers in the cars with no chase vehicles
So ya we might not get any videos or proof of this statement which makes it useless.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 196d
Remember the Tesla Semi? They had videos transporting either empty boxes or potato chips, literally the least dense cargo possible.
AA5B@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 196d
If you have a concern different from the thread, please start another post.
Yes the biggest pilot customer used it to haul lightweight snack items but als yes the claimed fully loaded to the legal limit tests
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 196d
I really don't care about any of that, what you're doing is called moving the goal post.
You baselessly claimed they committed fraud on the earnings call by saying something, which we truly don't know if they did or didn't yet. Maybe they did, maybe they didn't, we'll find out soon enough.
Edit: Sorry it's not moving the goal post, it's a whataboutism. What about that other time.
aramis87@fedia.io · 3 pts · 196d
The chase car has been removed - but no one's seen the self-driving cars either, not since the chase car was removed. It's another intentional misdirection.
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 196d
I updated my post above with the actual quote after someone transcribed it. He's saying there's a car driving around with nobody in it, and no chase car, so not a paid passenger ride.
So I imagine it's going to be really difficult to get video proof of this if its true, because someone will have to spot a random Tesla driving around without a driver and bother to record it. It's not like an influencer is going to hail it and be able to video it.
Not gonna lie, when I heard it, it wasn't as clear that this was the case as when i see it written out.
sem@piefed.blahaj.zone · 1 pts · 195d
It would be easy to get video proof if they recorded the video themselves. They know where the car is going to be.
If it really happened that is
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 41 pts · 196d
Next he will sell diagnostic machine that only needs one drop of blood.
brsrklf@jlai.lu · 41 pts · 197d
Fake it till you... Scratch that, just fake it.
umbrella@lemmy.ml · 12 pts · 196d
skozzii@lemmy.ca · 38 pts · 196d
I can't wait for Musks dominoes to fall. Once Tesla investors realize their investment is worthless all his other companies he has cross leveraged everything with will all list start collapsing and the whole thing comes down.
That would be devastating to the markets, and it hasn't even address the AI bubble which is going to pop and the biggest economic downfall and depression in American history begins.
Tough times ahead no matter what, but the sooner Trump is gone they can start rebuilding.
Zron@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 196d
The problem is that Tesla has become a self fulfilling prophecy. Not in any ability to actually make the products they advertise, but in making investors money. So many people have invested so much that the stock price now effectively describes investor’s aspirations for money, not their faith in Tesla. This has been true for some time. The value of the stock has been largely divorced from the reality of production targets, new products, or even the endless controversies.
sexy_peach@feddit.org · 5 pts · 196d
that's going to take a long time
neidu3@sh.itjust.works · 36 pts · 197d
Anything to distract from the fact that they're a car company selling fewer and fewer cars.
floofloof@lemmy.ca · 16 pts · 197d
Ah but now they're going to be a robot company selling fewer and fewer robots instead.
Mihies@programming.dev · 6 pts · 196d
People in robot suits you mean
CheeseNoodle@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 196d
iirc the robots worked but were remotely piloted? I can totally see a brand of rich person who would rather have the 'staff' be physically off site.
Mihies@programming.dev · 3 pts · 196d
They didn't work that well either.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 6 pts · 196d
4D chess....the Optimus robots will drive the cabs.
NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 196d
That would be hilarious and such a malicious way to get the taxi number and robot number for the pay package.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 196d
Steve Buscemi's greatest role.
AA5B@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 196d
And an ai company with no ai product
Peruvian_Skies@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 196d
But they can't sell fewer than zero! Egads, Tesla has found a way to never shrink their business anymore!
obviouspornalt@lemmynsfw.com · 1 pts · 196d
Well, they could pay people to take their cars. Would that be less than 0?
Peruvian_Skies@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 196d
They couldn't pay me to take a Tesla. No resale value.
mech@feddit.org · 11 pts · 196d
Tesla isn't a car company, it's a techbro company. They don't sell cars, they sell the idea that any day now they'll achieve a technological breakthrough.
But it's becoming obvious that won't happen, so they now pivot to robots. Selling the idea that they'll achieve a breakthrough in that space soon.
Those buying the products aren't the target audience, the investors are. The customers are just useful cattle.
alsimoneau@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 196d
I though they were a stock company, since that's all they sell.
SouthFresh@lemmy.world · 24 pts · 197d
Herr Musk is a lying nazi, and anyone holding Tesla is a fool and will get what they deserve
4am@lemmy.zip · 16 pts · 197d
I’m not so sure that everyone holding Tesla is going to get what they deserve anymore.
I agree they should get it, though.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 196d
At this point if one buys a Tesla vehicle anytime between '22 and today, it's on them
Peruvian_Skies@sh.itjust.works · 17 pts · 197d
Surprised pikachu dot jay peg
Buddahriffic@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 196d
Anyone else feel like Tesla is actually how Elon is being paid for being the one to make twitter fascist and the DOGE bs? Like the majority of shareholders don't actually gaf how the company does and the billion dollar compensation package had nothing to do with Tesla other than it being the vehicle through which the payment was made?
AA5B@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 196d
I don’t see how. This is just a continuation of what he was already doing, facilitated by a board of his friends and relatives.
Even worse I have to say I’m not totally against it. All too often ceos get excessive pay regardless of their results. While I haven’t looked in detail not at the history, the claim is these are only for Tesla meeting some extremely ambitious milestones and the payment is stock. Certainly his previous ridiculous allay was in stock and Tesla had some extraordinary growth. If the stock doesn’t go up, then he should never receive that wealth
If it’s truly contingent on the company growth and the board doesn’t throw him a life preserver, that’s not entirely bad. Excessive yes. Extremely excessive. Excessively excessive. But more execs need to have their wealth gated on actual results
Buddahriffic@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 196d
The thing that makes it more suspect IMO is that shareholders voted for it, not just the board. Courts specifically said they didn't need to but shareholders (dominated by large account holders) still voted for it.
ChickenLadyLovesLife@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 196d
My pet theory is that Musk was installed at Tesla by the Saudis (who apparently have a bit of money) to destroy the very idea of electric cars by putting out as bad and overpriced a product as possible. Despite his best efforts, people still want the goddamn things.