If shoelaces always come untied and headphone wires always get tangled, why don't they make shoelaces out of headphone wires and headphone wires out of shoelaces?
There's one way for a cable to be untangled, and an incalculable amount of ways for it to be tangled. When letting it randomly change state it is very improbable for it to randomly end up in the untangled state.
Same for shoelaces, there is but a few ways for the shoes to be properly knot, and a comparatively essentially infinite ways for them not to be.
I know it's a joke, but I find this perspective fascinating.
If it was just infinite ways for shoelaces to improperly knot then headphones would also not properly knot and easily untangle by pulling one end. But that doesn't happen.
The difference is from the physics of lengths of string/wire and the shoelaces are under tension while headphone wires aren't.
Shoelaces have a "proper" knot while headphones do not. If we were tying our shoes into the abominations I pull out of my pocket, maybe that'd play out differently.
I was thinking of this when I saw the post. I only properly understood the granny knot recently and since changing how I tie my laces, they very rarely untie now. That Ian chap showed a particular knot that he claimed never comes undone and I can attest to that.
I do the "Secure Ian Knot" (loop, second loop, cross them over, right goes towards you, through the hole away from you, left goes away from you, back through the hole towards you - pull)
I've been heavily considering investing in the Knipex micro flush cut side cutters but 30 euros is a heavy investment for someone with zipties for shoelaces.
All my life, I was tying the knot "wrong side up", so it was untying. I was checking out a videonon how to tie high boots the easiest way, and the problem was mentioned. Now nothing ever happens to them.
It's hard to explain in details, so here's a quick check if your shoes are untying themselves. When you start tying, you hold two loops in your hands and cross them, putting one above the other, right? Well, this time, put them the other way around (left on right if it was right on left), and finish the same way you always did it.
You will immediately feel that the knot is not slipping. This is because you also do the first simple knot in a certain way, and first and the main knot has to be different relative to each other
i managed the opposite. had no problem tying my shoes, then watched a video because i wasn't sure i was doing it like everyone else, and that made me lose the ability to tie my shoes for a few years. had to sit down and really think through the steps to get it back.
For those who can't be bothered looking up the difference between a double-slipped granny knot and a double-slipped reef knot, tie the first and second knots with different ends of the string on top (eg. right over left, then left over right). If you do it right it will hold, no need for a double knot.
As for earphones (does anyone even use those anymore?) push them into a small pouch, start from one end and work your way along, pull them out the same way (it's quicker than it sounds).
I think I'd have to pay 5x the price to get equivalent sound quality for wireless headphones. Having to untangle the wire every time I use them is worth that.
One of my shoelaces has stayed for 2 or so years now, the other comes apart every few weeks. It's pretty annoying cause I feel like I'm tying it well enough and I haven't been able to find anything that might be forcefully pulling it apart. But hey maybe I got it right this last time and it'll stick for 2 years
It's never to late to relearn a suboptimal skill you thought you knew. I believe I found this site several decades after being taught the standard shoe lace knot and a child. That one ALWAYS needed a second knot to keep my laces tied. Now I tie either the two loop knot "bunny ears" or Ian's Secure Shoelace knot. Both are balanced so the knots always stays tied and both can be pulled apart and undone with a simple tug at both free ends of the shoelace. Haven't tied my laces the way my parents taught me ever since.
They tried that, and during the early 2000s, teenagers were hanging themselves with iPod headphone wires. That’s why Apple invented Bluetooth— so people like you could torture everyone else with existentialism
55 Comments
FiskFisk33@startrek.website · 99 pts · 100d
Entropy always increases.
There's one way for a cable to be untangled, and an incalculable amount of ways for it to be tangled. When letting it randomly change state it is very improbable for it to randomly end up in the untangled state.
Same for shoelaces, there is but a few ways for the shoes to be properly knot, and a comparatively essentially infinite ways for them not to be.
I know it's a joke, but I find this perspective fascinating.
someone@sopuli.xyz · 31 pts · 100d
This is why I hate math ;-;
FiskFisk33@startrek.website · 23 pts · 100d
this is why I love it!
zwerg@feddit.org · 11 pts · 100d
Just as well that this is physics then!
sylver_dragon@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 100d
relevant
zwerg@feddit.org · 4 pts · 100d
Yeah... But I know of no purely mathematical theory that predicts entropy - this really is a physics thing.
masterspace@lemmy.ca · 7 pts · 100d
The danger of an over simplified model.
Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 100d
If it was just infinite ways for shoelaces to improperly knot then headphones would also not properly knot and easily untangle by pulling one end. But that doesn't happen.
The difference is from the physics of lengths of string/wire and the shoelaces are under tension while headphone wires aren't.
FiskFisk33@startrek.website · 4 pts · 100d
shoelaces can be a tangled mess yet not properly knotted
AHemlocksLie@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 100d
Shoelaces have a "proper" knot while headphones do not. If we were tying our shoes into the abominations I pull out of my pocket, maybe that'd play out differently.
Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 100d
I wouldn't care as much if shoelaces tangled themselves into a knot that took extra work to untie.
I have some laces that I double tie and they still untie themselves.
Iconoclast@feddit.uk · 40 pts · 100d
Most people only think that they know how to tie their shoes but they're doing the so-called "granny knot" which is why it unties itself.
It could also just be a lack of imagination too:
NABDad@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 100d
[slaps shoe]
"That ain't goin' nowhere!"
waldfee@feddit.org · 9 pts · 100d
Ian's Shoelace Site – Granny Knot Info
DamienGramatacus@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 100d
I was thinking of this when I saw the post. I only properly understood the granny knot recently and since changing how I tie my laces, they very rarely untie now. That Ian chap showed a particular knot that he claimed never comes undone and I can attest to that.
lemmyman@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 100d
What a fantastic website
funkless_eck@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 100d
I do the "Secure Ian Knot" (loop, second loop, cross them over, right goes towards you, through the hole away from you, left goes away from you, back through the hole towards you - pull)
Super easy to learn, and never looked back.
Kalothar@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 100d
I put these on my running shoes and they work great:
Iconoclast@feddit.uk · 2 pts · 100d
But zipties can withstand being showered with sparks from angle grinder.
fleem@piefed.zeromedia.vip · 2 pts · 100d
bro better have they damn flush cuts up in this bitch
Iconoclast@feddit.uk · 2 pts · 100d
I've been heavily considering investing in the Knipex micro flush cut side cutters but 30 euros is a heavy investment for someone with zipties for shoelaces.
SolacefromSilence@fedia.io · 19 pts · 100d
Holy shit, they've solved it!
Onomatopoeia@lemmy.cafe · 8 pts · 100d
And a real shower thought!
Battle_Masker@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 13 pts · 100d
Have you tried putting your shoe laces in your pocket? That'll keep em tied
unexposedhazard@discuss.tchncs.de · 13 pts · 100d
They do make headphone cables like that. Its those fabric sleeved, slightly stiff ones. Those dont get tangled.
kamenlady@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 100d
I had some of those, but they made a horrible sound when moving and the cables touched any clothing. But yeah, no tangling.
unexposedhazard@discuss.tchncs.de · 4 pts · 100d
Yeah that happens if there is no section at the end that decouples vibrations in the cable from the earpiece.
HeHoXa@lemmy.zip · 4 pts · 100d
Friends smarter than me assure me these are more likely to... whattaya call it when the wire breaks inside the sleeve... that.
... I still like them.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 99d
Short?
toofpic@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 100d
All my life, I was tying the knot "wrong side up", so it was untying. I was checking out a videonon how to tie high boots the easiest way, and the problem was mentioned. Now nothing ever happens to them.
It's hard to explain in details, so here's a quick check if your shoes are untying themselves. When you start tying, you hold two loops in your hands and cross them, putting one above the other, right? Well, this time, put them the other way around (left on right if it was right on left), and finish the same way you always did it.
You will immediately feel that the knot is not slipping. This is because you also do the first simple knot in a certain way, and first and the main knot has to be different relative to each other
Hjalamanger@feddit.nu · 7 pts · 100d
It's the difference between a square knot and a calf knot. Here they are (without the extra loops, they just allow for easy untying)
Squar knot, good
Granny knot, bad
toofpic@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 100d
ah, so the first plus the second knot are forming one of those two you linked to?
lime@feddit.nu · 4 pts · 100d
i managed the opposite. had no problem tying my shoes, then watched a video because i wasn't sure i was doing it like everyone else, and that made me lose the ability to tie my shoes for a few years. had to sit down and really think through the steps to get it back.
Whostosay@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 100d
Those motherfuckers never told me.
StillAlive@piefed.world · 7 pts · 100d
Skill issue
https://www.fieggen.com/shoelace/knots.htm
observes_depths@aussie.zone · 6 pts · 100d
For those who can't be bothered looking up the difference between a double-slipped granny knot and a double-slipped reef knot, tie the first and second knots with different ends of the string on top (eg. right over left, then left over right). If you do it right it will hold, no need for a double knot.
As for earphones (does anyone even use those anymore?) push them into a small pouch, start from one end and work your way along, pull them out the same way (it's quicker than it sounds).
Onomatopoeia@lemmy.cafe · -3 pts · 100d
Who bothers with wired headphones these days?
Hisse@programming.dev · 4 pts · 100d
this is either sarcastic or im being left behind by society
Individual_Orchid@sh.itjust.works · 5 pts · 100d
My corded headphone batteries never die
FishFace@piefed.social · 3 pts · 100d
I think I'd have to pay 5x the price to get equivalent sound quality for wireless headphones. Having to untangle the wire every time I use them is worth that.
agent_nycto@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 100d
Cheaper, no battery to charge, harder to lose... Not sure why people bother with wireless
Ioughttamow@fedia.io · 1 pts · 100d
For working out or casual listening with chores, yeah cordless for sure, but otherwise corded all day, ALL DAY
Dallimjp@sh.itjust.works · 6 pts · 99d
You're probably tying your shoes wrong. The knot you want is a double slipped square knot. If you tie it that way it never comes undone.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 99d
Or a monkey knot. Those you can leave tied for a year and turn your shoes into slip ons
notabot@piefed.social · 5 pts · 100d
Now this is the big brain thinking I come to the fediverse for!
Robotunicorn@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 100d
Some Michigan State students made untie resistant shoelaces!
https://www.brce.shop/
InFerNo@lemmy.ml · 4 pts · 99d
What an obnoxious website.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 99d
At least they tell us right up front they went on shark tank so we know to buy other laces
remon@ani.social · 4 pts · 100d
Do people really have that problem with shoelaces? I tied mine almost a year ago and they're holding up fine.
boobs_@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 100d
One of my shoelaces has stayed for 2 or so years now, the other comes apart every few weeks. It's pretty annoying cause I feel like I'm tying it well enough and I haven't been able to find anything that might be forcefully pulling it apart. But hey maybe I got it right this last time and it'll stick for 2 years
Wolf314159@startrek.website · 4 pts · 100d
It's never to late to relearn a suboptimal skill you thought you knew. I believe I found this site several decades after being taught the standard shoe lace knot and a child. That one ALWAYS needed a second knot to keep my laces tied. Now I tie either the two loop knot "bunny ears" or Ian's Secure Shoelace knot. Both are balanced so the knots always stays tied and both can be pulled apart and undone with a simple tug at both free ends of the shoelace. Haven't tied my laces the way my parents taught me ever since.
Admetus@sopuli.xyz · 2 pts · 100d
Haha, I love how a guy called Ian made a 'secure shoelace knot'
MutantTailThing@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 100d
#TeamVelcro
LuminousLuddite@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 100d
someone@sopuli.xyz · 1 pts · 100d
Somewhere in the world...
Hint: Inside the shower room.
homes@piefed.world · 2 pts · 100d
They tried that, and during the early 2000s, teenagers were hanging themselves with iPod headphone wires. That’s why Apple invented Bluetooth— so people like you could torture everyone else with existentialism
¯\_(ツ)_/¯