This should be the standard in greater LA.
Santa Monica can do it. Why can't Los Angeles?
Santa Monica’s new bike lane just opened 🥰
https://cdn.imgchest.com/files/239f7586f056.mp4
https://cdn.imgchest.com/files/239f7586f056.mp4
This should be the standard in greater LA.
Santa Monica can do it. Why can't Los Angeles?
66 Comments
SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 47 pts · 198d
It's nice to see the traffic bollards, but they really couldn't put any on the corner that the biker turns right on at the end?
It's definitely nice to see effort put into separating it from the rest of the street, which is the safest option for cyclists.
errer@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 198d
That’s a crosswalk, you can’t stick a bollard there because it would block the ramp for a wheelchair-bound person. Designing this shit that works for everyone is hard when cars are in the mix…would be a lot easier to just ban the cars to come up with a design that works for everyone else.
SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 11 pts · 198d
This is, emphatically, not a crosswalk, and is the bit I am talking about. It's a raised curb which still protects the biker and extends between the two crosswalks but not crossing over them.
I guess my point is an out of control vehicle can still fly over that curb and cream a biker and/or pedestrians so it seems (to me) like a good place for bollards.
Wider view showing in context with the crosswalks:
grue@lemmy.world · 19 pts · 198d
But that would be unsafe because it might injure the drivers of the out-of-control cars.
(This really is the 'logic' traffic engineers often use. The cyclist or pedestrian that might be on the other side of the bollard is rarely considered.)
hobovision@mander.xyz · 12 pts · 198d
Those aren't bollards. They're just thin plastic tubes with reflective tape on them to help drivers see where they aren't supposed to drive better.
What you're seeing this is one that already got run over or removed.
SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 12 pts · 198d
Yes, that's my point, there are actual bollards elsewhere on this stretch of bike lane, and I'm proposing actual bollards on this curb.
I feel like I'm taking crazy pills, how are so many people misunderstanding this?
These are the actual bollards I'm referring to. Fuck me. Why does everyone assume I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about. I know what a fucking actual bollard looks like. It's a concrete post with a rebar center that extends down into the base concrete/asphalt underneath. It's the whole reason I used the word "bollard."
I'm definitely not talking about these worthless things:
My point is those curb markers are not enough, as evidenced by one already being run over and torn away. Which is once again why there should be actual bollards there.
jumjummy@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 198d
I may be wrong, but those white markers aren’t actual bollards either. They’re still plastic tubes with reflective tape. I don’t think they’d stop a car from driving through.
AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 197d
They look like standard plastic lane markers to me. They're designed to be fairly cheap and are therefore certainly not going to slow down any four wheeled vehicle.
I've seen some filled with cement, bu I don't think you're actually supposed to use them that way.
NarrativeBear@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 198d
Using this logic we should have bollards at all pedestrian crossings/intersections.
Its strange how a person on a bike highlights how unsafe streets and roads are because of cars
Also, these bollars that you are referring to here are actually only called curb markers. These are to show cars or snow plows where the curb is in low visibility. They are very similar to the marlers you may see for center curbs like these.
SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 7 pts · 198d
No, these are the bollards I'm talking about, they have actual bollards at various places on this stretch of bike lane.
My point is they could be effectively used in more places. I'm not a fucking idiot, I know what an actual bollard is. I'm talking about a concrete post with a rebar center firmly affixed to the base concrete/asphalt. Why would I even be using the word "bollard" if I didn't know what the fuck it was?
I'm not talking about these:
errer@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 198d
Ah. Yeah that seems like it would be a good idea.
robocall@lemmy.world · 25 pts · 198d
It makes sense for Southern California to use bicycles as transportation. There's great weather and little rain most of the year.
Wfh@lemmy.zip · 37 pts · 198d
The entire country of the Netherlands have proven that infrastructure, not weather, makes cycling the most popular mode of transportation. Hell, most of Nordic big cities are cycling heavens despite their shitty snowy/rainy weather.
Scrollone@feddit.it · 9 pts · 198d
I live in Copenhagen. I confirm: great cycle infrastructure, even in snow.
frank@sopuli.xyz · 5 pts · 198d
Same and same (almost always, I mean 2 weeks ago there was a day or two where the bike lane was too full of slushy crap)
sparky@lemmy.federate.cc · 3 pts · 198d
Sure, but great weather just makes it that much more appealing. It’s not a prerequisite but it’s a huge plus. So, not having great bicycle infrastructure in a place with great weather seems like such a loss.
robocall@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 197d
I really dislike bicycling in the rain
Wfh@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 197d
It's not the best and given the choice, I'd rather bike in dry weather but with the right equipment (waterproof jacket, waterproof overpants and waterproof shoes), it's fine.
It's been raining nonstop for months here and I'm still happier on my bike than in any alternative like getting stuck in traffic for hours searching for a parking spot or shoving myself in public transportation with hundreds of people including reeking teenagers who confuse a shower with Axe body spray.
robocall@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 197d
The smells on public transit usually aren't pleasant.
I get frustrated with carrying around waterproof clothes. But, Southern California, especially with the high costs of cars, I don't understand why people aren't enthusiastically switching to e bikes.
NarrativeBear@lemmy.world · 19 pts · 198d
Infrastructure not weather makes bicycling great.
Similarly having great trails and sidewalks makes walking great, not the weather.
People have been walking in the rain and snow for millennia.
azimir@lemmy.ml · 10 pts · 198d
Oulu, Finland is a massive biking center. The weather is winter most of the year. Their infrastructure for bikes is amazing so people use it, even when it's cold.
https://oulu.com/en/living/mobility/cycling/
birdwing@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 198d
Yup, salt can do a lot on the snow.
azimir@lemmy.ml · 2 pts · 198d
They also have very strick guidelines about how quickly the bike roads are plowed after/during snowfalls. They keep the routes open and useful so people can trust the transit modality all year round.
The US just plows the snow onto the bike lanes and then complains about how bad biking is.
explodicle@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 198d
Does the salt damage the bicycles?
birdwing@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 23 pts · 198d
The only criticism I have is that the bicycle path is too narrow to let another person pass. You'd ideally want a bicycle path of at least 2.5 m wide, not just 1 m.
3.5 m would be even better, then you can have a couple bike next to each other, with another passing.
tiramichu@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 197d
Pass in the same direction? I assume that's what you mean, since for the opposite direction you'd want another lane on the other side of the road.
birdwing@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 3 pts · 197d
Yeah same direction. Though bike pathes also exist where you pass in the opposite direction, on roads where you only have one bicycle path.
Usually, bidirectional bike paths tend to have space only for 1 bike on one lane, so if you want to pass, you have to wait behind another bicyclist and make sure there's no one too close behind you or incoming.
PetteriSkaffari@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 197d
Same direction indeed. If there's somebody slow ahead of you. Looks pretty narrow with tight turns, but it's probably better than biking between the cars.
SCmSTR@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 18 pts · 198d
Was expecting something terrible to happen. Whole time, I'm thinking "wow this is super nice and everything seems well done and fairly safe.
explodicle@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 198d
IKR, I've been watching too many videos of bad news.
panda_abyss@lemmy.ca · 13 pts · 198d
Damn, that’s a nice bike lane!
look how it protects riders and jeans into the existing public transit infrastructure!
FundMECFS@anarchist.nexus · 2 pts · 198d
Yeah! It’s actually a proper bike lane not a paint line. Good to see.
crystalmerchant@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 198d
Tons of this all over Portland! Love to see the growth
Gork@sopuli.xyz · 10 pts · 198d
If only the rest of the country had such thoughtful urban planning.
tdawg@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 198d
What's really sad about that is how this is really the bare minimum needed
P00ptart@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 198d
THAT'S how you do a bike lane!
Ooops@feddit.org · 8 pts · 198d
Looks generally okay-ish, especially with all the proper protection. But isn't that awfully narrow for all but a very few bikes? If we learned some thing from the car-brain planning then that induced demand indeed exists.
Just like yet another lane does not reduce but in fact increase car traffic, one proper bike lane will increase bike traffic (and reduce car traffic)... and will quickly outgrow the capacity of these narrow green strips.
Brkdncr@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 198d
Can’t wait for there to be congestion in these bike lanes…
Ooops@feddit.org · 5 pts · 198d
Okay, it's still a step into the right direction.
NarrativeBear@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 198d
Its a step in the right direction, and you would not build a 10 lane highway right away, lanes would be added on and expanded as time progress.
Canadian_Cabinet@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 198d
What does the red paint on the curb mean?
takeda@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 10 pts · 198d
It means that cars cannot stop or park in those sections.
It looks like they painted still on curb just in case the drivers would claim that didn't see it or it doesn't apply because the curb wasn't painted.
NateNate60@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 198d
Red paint and yellow paint both mean parking against it is forbidden. Red is typically, but not exclusively, used for fire lanes, which are spaces which must not be obstructed because they are where the fire trucks park in the event of a fire.
Additionally, in the Los Angeles area, green paint is used to indicate that parking is allowed there, but there is a low time limit (such as 30 minutes).
SchwertImStein@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 3 pts · 198d
probably "don't fucking hit it"
NarrativeBear@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 198d
Wish more cities would use these types of markings, they usually mean red/yellow being no parking and blue being accessible parking. In some European cities they use zigzag markings meaning no parking.
mouseirl@lemmy.ml · 2 pts · 198d
fire lane from before the bike lane opened, i'd assume
knexcar@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 198d
I do feel like the S bends are a bit tight, seems like it would make it hard to keep a consistent speed if you have to slow down for every intersection. Specifically thinking of e-cargo trikes and trailers that can’t lean into corners like a regular bike can, and take longer to get up to speed.
roscoe@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 10 pts · 198d
I'm not sure if it was intended as behavioral engineering to encourage slowing down at crosswalks, but even if it's unintentional, I consider it a feature.
cmhe@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 197d
I would agree, but if cars can just drive straight, why should bikes be slowed down?
Fast road bike drivers will then just drive in the road instead, because there they can just keep their speed unhindered.
If bike lanes have a worse experience then driving on the road, for instance sharp curves, steeper hills, worse maintained asphalt or less optimal ways to turn into a side road, then bicycle drivers will want to continue to use the road. Because they are treated as a second class traffic participant.
Cars instead should be treated as a second-class vehicle, because it requires more space, infrastructure and is less efficient.
gon@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 6 pts · 198d
Looks pretty good actually. A little narrow, maybe, but the separation is nice :D
Croquette@sh.itjust.works · 5 pts · 197d
Car brains see that and complaint about removing parking spaces.
fallaciousBasis@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 198d
Needs more chicanes.
Try that in the North with ICE and you're deported.
Mac@mander.xyz · 4 pts · 198d
Hey, check it out-!
Homie's hittin' the skinny!
lemmydividebyzero@reddthat.com · 4 pts · 197d
This is positive, so it's just a matter of time until idiots want to get rid of it.
chunes@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 198d
It looks like the lane either ends or someone parked in it at the end of the video..
fizzle@quokk.au · 3 pts · 198d
This looks quite cool. We don't have anything like this here.
Ours come in 2 forms.
The first is just a designated shoulder - a line on the side of the road, no physical barrier, but formally designated with markings. These are meaningless to cars and I'm certain that almost all drivers (and cyclists) don't realise that there's any difference between this and an ordinary road shoulder.
The second is really daft. It's basically a lane marked on the pavement in the right of this video. It stops at every intersection, so each section is only 1 block long and then you just become pedestrian traffic and have to negotiate intersections.
No solution is perfect and I can see some potential issues here but it's pretty good.
NarrativeBear@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 198d
I see bike banana's and I upvote!
Xanthrax@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 198d
Damn, you're making me miss Westwood.
Sprocketfree@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 198d
That's one creaky bike though
Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works · -8 pts · 198d
Oh well, yet another place it's impossible to park and drop a wheelchair ramp. That blue thing with the red-zone paint and curb cut is a bus stop. Buses are wheelchair accessible but too few and difficult to access for a person who's well-buggered-up.
Catoblepas@piefed.blahaj.zone · 7 pts · 198d
It’s Santa Monica, there are a ton of bus stops (OP rode past one in the first 10 seconds of the video) and this isn’t every single road, or even most of them. Bike lanes that aren’t protected from traffic lead to dead cyclists, which on balance I think is probably worse than using the bus stop or getting out one block over.
Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 198d
I'm not objecting to the bus stop. Just noting that although it's blue and has a perfect wide platform for the bus wheelchair lift/ramp, and a curbcut to get to the sidewalk, it's a bus stop, not a disabled parking space. Which would be fine if there were any other spot similarly designed on that or any of the other streets with this type of bike lane. So far I haven't seen any.
reabsorbthelight@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 198d
What are your referring to? It is pretty accessible from what I can see. It's illegal to build things that aren't accessible. Americans with Disabilities Act had pretty good specs
Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 198d
No the bus stop is perfectly accessible! It shows they know exactly how to design a handicap space for this type of bike lane, so people with ramped minivans could park. But they don't. All the others have the narrow raised cement lump, that leaves a ramp hanging into the air 6" above the middle of the bike lane.
reabsorbthelight@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 198d
Oh the car parking 🫣. I guess I hate cars so much I didn't care to notice
Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 198d
Fair enough, we're in the right instance.