Developer is targeting individuals with a blacklist he maintians, enabled by default. Dev can do what he wants, but I'd like my home instance to consider removing it as a front end.
YSK post: https://lemmy.world/post/49813386
Dev post about it: https://lemmy.today/post/57096701
Blacklist: https://copyparty.adrian.place/u/?doc=policy.json
62 Comments
Shadow@lemmy.ca MOD · 134 pts · 39d
Yeah we'd been discussing this but nobody had a chance to make this thread about it yet. It feels dishonest for the app to have these hidden biases, so I'd rather just kill it.
I've pulled tesseract down now.
candyman337@piefed.ca · 13 pts · 38d
I think the photon UI is pretty good as a replacement
breakfastmtn@lemmy.ca · 10 pts · 39d
Argh this sucks. The UI is so much better than everything else.
mp3@lemmy.ca · 14 pts · 38d
Have you tried Blorp?
breakfastmtn@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 38d
Just a bit. It's not bad but I don't like the look as much. I really like the comment nesting though. I wish the mod options were better, not that I use them all that much.
Maybe I'll bounce back and forth between photon and blorp and see which one sticks.
OwOarchist@pawb.social · 13 pts · 39d
Fork in 3... 2... 1...
otter@lemmy.ca · 7 pts · 38d
What are some of the features that you like? Maybe some of the other front ends can replicate it / add it
breakfastmtn@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 38d
It's primarily just the look. Photon's easily the closest both in terms of appearance and features. I honestly haven't given other front ends a serious look for a long time, so I'll check them out and hope that team tess runs out of crazy pills soon.
otter@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 38d
Ah gotcha. If it helps anyone, the relevant pages for theming on photon:
For Blorp: https://blorp.lemmy.ca/settings (see appearance)
Of the two, Photon has a bit more customization on the theme colors
nutomic@lemmy.ml · 9 pts · 38d
Consider using the fork by db0 which removes this stuff: https://github.com/db0/tesseract
breakfastmtn@lemmy.ca · 11 pts · 38d
But are they going to actually maintain it?
Edit:
So not a huge commitment, though I'm not sure how close 1.0 is to release.
tanisnikana@lemmy.world · 36 pts · 38d
The highest fucking honor I’ve ever received: being blocked by a wimpy little fascist:
caseyweederman@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 38d
Aw, I didn't make it. I'm not trying hard enough.
Curious_Canid@piefed.ca · 2 pts · 36d
Me either. And it's not like I haven't put in the work. I guess I need to do more posting of subversive material and not just make subversive comments.
avidamoeba@lemmy.ca · 31 pts · 39d
Probably a good idea. Too much shady shit.
E: Am apparently on the blocklist! 🥳
jerkface@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 38d
I saw you. Nice.
SeductiveTortoise@piefed.social · 27 pts · 39d
Good lord, I've tried to read the post, but Dev is such an edge lord I'm beginning to suspect Elmo himself vibe coded it.
At least I'm part of the list, being filtered out by this asshole is an honor.
cecilkorik@piefed.ca · 4 pts · 38d
Me too, hooray! We're in good company I think.
Washedupcynic@lemmy.ca · 23 pts · 39d
Oh shit, I am on the block list. 😂
Darkassassin07@lemmy.ca · 15 pts · 39d
Me too! Lol, wonder who I pissed off, how... 🤷🏻😂
jerkface@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 38d
"Who" is perfectly well known...
OwOarchist@pawb.social · 12 pts · 38d
Oh wow, me too!
BCsven@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 37d
That list is huge. He must have ran a script to capture names based on content he didn't like?
swordgeek@lemmy.ca · 20 pts · 38d
I didn't even know what Tesseract was before this, and I'm on the blacklist.
floofloof@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 38d
Me too. I wonder what I said to earn my place there.
kent_eh@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 38d
I still don't know.
My searching tells me Tesseract is open source OCR software, but that doesn't make sense in the context I'm seeing in these threads.
otter@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 38d
This page might help, it explains what alternative UIs are and which ones are available. Some of them can also be used in the mobile web browser.
https://fedecan.ca/en/guide/threadiverse/alternative-uis
(It says tesseract is available on lemmy.ca, but that is out of date now)
This issue with Tesseract affects anyone that was using it. So it is possible that someone did not see a comment or post you made, without knowing why they could not see it. Past that, it likely hasn't affected you since you said you don't use it :)
kent_eh@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 38d
It sounds like I might not have known if I was using it or not, depending on how I accessed Lemmy.
breakfastmtn@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 38d
It's extremely unlikely that you were using it without knowing. Though if you were you'd know now because reloading the page would load Lemmy-UI instead of Tesseract. They don't look at all alike.
edit:
https://photon.lemmy.ca/ looks very similar to tesseract, if you want to see the difference.
IronKrill@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 38d
Thanks so much for sharing this, I couldn't find an actual screenshot of Tesseract anywhere what with Dubvee redirecting everything to a "goaway" picture.
cecilkorik@piefed.ca · 3 pts · 38d
It's a semi-popular Lemmy web frontend that a lot of Lemmy sites use instead of Lemmy itself. It seems like the original repo by asimons04 has been taken down, but here's a random fork of it for example.
Sc00ter@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 38d
So if i use mobile exclusively via voyager app. Does that mean im not implicated in this mess?
I have no idea what any of this means, technically. I understand and agree that some shadow ban black list blocking users is bad, and i dont want that, but i dont even know what people are being blocked from
TwiddleTwaddle@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 38d
If you only ever use Voyager (or any other mobile app) you won't be directly affected by this, other than that you might be on the block list and if so people using teseract wouldn't ever be able to see your posts or comments.
kent_eh@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 38d
Thank you.
jerkface@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 37d
Oh, I've used that for processing uploaded images in a web app.
can@sh.itjust.works · 19 pts · 39d
Hahaha
4am@lemmy.zip · 19 pts · 38d
Apparently some things are still blocked, even with this option enabled
can@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 38d
Of course they are
panda_abyss@lemmy.ca · 19 pts · 39d
I have no objection to stuff like the nsfw blocklist by default, I can even think of justification for a lot of filters. But the way it was done is shady and weird.
breakfastmtn@lemmy.ca · 16 pts · 38d
This whole thing is crazy for current users. I'd been trying to figure out why Tesseract was behaving so strangely when I hadn't changed anything. Digging through settings and messing around with filters. There was no notice at all. And this only makes sense if you only use Tesseract. I use Voyager on my phone and I was receiving notifications there that weren't appearing in my browser. I'd post comments from my phone and not be able to see them in Tesseract because I guess someone else in the comment chain was on this list. Usability nightmare.
And then you can't disable it without having a big ever-present content warning telling you you're in Toxic Mode. Yeesh. You know who else is a level-headed guy who's been wading through the sewage for 3(+) years? THIS GUY. I know my way around this glorious sewer, my dude.
jerkface@lemmy.ca · 10 pts · 38d
Toxic mode does not disable the secret blacklist.
breakfastmtn@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 38d
So there's a super secret blocklist distinct from the list people are discussing in this thread? Is there a link to it? Or are you saying that the list being discussed here can't be disabled?
otter@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 38d
Yea I think some of this would work better as an automod or reporting tool.
I've played with Reddit's automod, and even well designed automod regex tends to make lots of mistakes, and you need to slowly make adjustments to refine it.
Other parts of it should have been opt in, and ideally in a way that you can import any list. That would also help with the gaming issue, since a bad actor can't look at one list and game it when people can be using any combination of blocklists. Similar to how ublock origin does it.
owenfromcanada@lemmy.ca · 17 pts · 38d
Hell yeah, made the list. You know us Canadians and how abrasive we can be.
ThrowawayPermanente@sh.itjust.works · 6 pts · 38d
One of us, one of us, one of us
BlameTheAntifa@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 39d
Look at that, I made the list.
I will take it as a badge of honor.
fyzzlefry@retrolemmy.com · 12 pts · 39d
Second
sidalsolgun@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 38d
otter@lemmy.ca · 6 pts · 38d
It's nice, and I know the https://lemdro.id/ instance has it as the default
However since it is a third party frontend, there is a chance that a future Lemmy update will come out without having full Photon support right away. So it's usually safer to keep them separate, and encourage people to try out the frontends to see what they like
Xylight@lemdro.id · 3 pts · 38d
Photon's Lemmy V1 compatibility is actually pretty much complete with a lot of technical improvements as well, I'm kinda hoping the Lemmy devs release Lemmy v1 soon as I don't really want to make a lemmy v0.x adapter
otter@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 38d
Oh sweet, thank you :)
AgaveInMyAss@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 38d
Fuck yes I'm on it
theacharnian@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 36d
Line 2459, I'm on the list baby!
https://youtu.be/sHd2O_KuCxA
makeshift0546@lemmy.today · -7 pts · 38d
Nomad@infosec.pub · -18 pts · 39d
For those who actually read the post... I wholeheartedly agree with that part. I actually understand hiding what reporting wont fix.
Calls for beheadings, murder or torturing rich people, criminals and political opponents is "in" in Lemmy and it fucking sucks. It wouldn't be tolerated as a form of religious extremism and it shouldn't be tolerated just because its our side doing the extremism.
I actually try to engage with that do people encounter opposite opinions here and learn to be somewhat regulated members of society. That down votes are not counted globally makes that actually possible, because "why execute if locking up somebody is perfectly acceptable" gets unbelievably many people riled up into a downvote frenzy foaming at the mouth.
I think the intention is good and the option to choose is not taken and I would opt to keep Tesseract and just add some visible warning about toxic mode.
otter@lemmy.ca · 19 pts · 38d
I agree with what you're saying, and some of this is also against our drafted new guidelines. While people have suggestions on the wording and implementation, those guideline proposals have been received positively
However this implementation doesn't really solve the problem effectively.
your comment would also have been hidden, along with any comment that wants to discuss the issue or make the same point you are making (or a completely unrelated topic, see Scunthorpe problem)
mods and admins are less likely to notice the obviously bad actors. So instead of those accounts getting banned and purged, they might still be posting harmful content or coded language that the filters don't pick up on and can't keep up with
Some words SHOULD get blanket banned, but we already have the admin level keyword blocklist for that.
Otherwise I think that a frontend is the wrong place for this functionality, and It should be handled by a proper automod or reporting tool/plugin
Elgenzay@lemmy.ml · 13 pts · 38d
lemmy.ml also loves overreaching:
teslekova@sh.itjust.works · 5 pts · 38d
As an Australian I find this censorship offensive. I can't express myself without that word, it's like tying an Italian's hands!
otter@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 38d
Well that's a funny direct example
We did also adjust the default filters for our Canadian instances, to account for words that are harmless in French but harmful in English. For example: https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english-french/late
Nomad@infosec.pub · 4 pts · 38d
I hear what you are saying and I agree on so far that something needs to be done. Having a small frontend team that controls a somewhat opaque block list is not ideal. I get where they come from and I get why they decided to do something they could do. I think at least some good came from that in so far that the thing gets discussed now and that there are some new content guidelines soon. I don't think we will see hexbear reformed anytime soon but there will probably be somewhat improved self regulation on Lemmy and isn't that what good anarchism is all about? Communities self governing and regulating?
jerkface@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 38d
I agree with this in principle. But I have no doubt I ended up on the blacklist for calling out his own daily violence against vulnerable individuals. I've never advocated for a violent solution to the many problems we discuss.
He also ... said a lot of stuff. Wow. The further I get into that post, the less meaningful it seem. Buddy's falling apart, and externalizes the blame on us.
avidamoeba@lemmy.ca · 6 pts · 38d
I read the dev post. Oh boy, does this person has got issues. Not to imply I or anyone has no issues but some of those decisions.. 😔
Lots of bad assumptions, conclusions and misunderstandings too. Like this whole thing abt people banned from reddit being the bad ones on Lemmy. Buddy, my account on reddit is alive and well with fairly high karma. I left both in protest as well as a conscious decision to contribute whatever time (and actually more) to a non-corporate social media. I am on the blocklist. Bravo dev. 👏
Nomad@infosec.pub · 3 pts · 38d
I think there is good intention there and the post is worded carefully. He saw a problem and tried to affect change the only way he could. I think that is not a solution that should stay but I think doing something instead of nothing should be applauded even if he is imperfect, he has done a lot for Lemmy.
StillAlive@piefed.world · 2 pts · 39d
Boooo!