I have two previously torn meniscuses and a torn patellar tendon. I don't run a ton (my workout program does agility training for cardio), but I can just decide to go run a sub 30m 5k with no problems.
It definitely wasn't always this way. I used to have to tap after 10 minutes due to the knee pain. Until one day I thought, "Maybe I'm doing something wrong," so I did some research.
Turns out I was doing something everything wrong. I was running with the same form I used for walking, which is a heel to toe movement, and taking similar strides. This is actually the opposite of what you're supposed to do.
The first mistake I was making is the long steps. When running, your goal should be to never let your feet extend more than an inch or so further forward than your hips. Walking is more of a controlled fall, but with running you're propelling yourself forward.
The second mistake I was making is fully straightening my knees. Your knees should always be bent a little bit. And the third was landing on my heel.
When running, you want your ankles and knees to act like a spring. The ball of your foot should hit the ground first with your foot pointed somewhat down. then you absorb the initial impact by dropping your heel and bending your knees a bit. Think of it like crumple zones in a car. You don't want all of the impact transferred instantly, which is what happens if you land with a straight leg.
Then you push forward with the foot that's down, and repeat for the other leg. The faster you go, the more you'll need to lean forward to keep hitting the ground with the ball of your foot.
It does take a bit of getting used to in order for it to be muscle memory, but it should help if your issue is incorrect form.
30 Comments
wesker@lemmy.sdf.org · 36 pts · 1d
What about if my knees hurt while getting a promotion?
StabbingSky@lemmy.zip · 17 pts · 23h
Harbor Freight sells knee pads for cheap. The gel ones are super comfortable.
Blibly@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 1d
Whatever you're doing you're doing it too much or not enough
prettybunnys@piefed.social · 2 pts · 19h
That’s a workers comp claim too!
Iconoclast@feddit.uk · 21 pts · 1d
Kids naturally run with the correct form. Then we give them cushy sneakers and they learn the incorrect way.
Relevant to knee pain: I got it from heavy squats at gym and fixed it with neoprene sleeves around my knees. Not to support but to keep them warm as there's very little flesh around them to do so.
DrBob@lemmy.ca · 29 pts · 23h
This isn't true. Kids run with any form they want because they weigh almost nothing so there are no repercussions for bad mechanics.
The first running boom happened in the 1970s with the advent of the cushioned shoe. Prior to that you couldn't participate in the sport long term unless you had great natural mechanics.
ParlimentOfDoom@piefed.zip · 15 pts · 22h
Lol, no they don't. Kids run all gangley with legs flying everywhere. Knees pointed in weird directions
DrBob@lemmy.ca · 19 pts · 23h
You were landing with a straight leg?!!? Were you insane?
Also don't rip on heel striking. Lots of us do it and it's perfectly ok as part your stride mechanics.
Your mechanics will vary as a function of your relative speed and heel striking is a natural movement at the upper end. What it sounds like you were doing was overstriding - you were lengthening your stride to try gain speed rather than increasing your turnover. Get those feet moving quickly and that will keep your weight centered.
Your stride will lengthen as you speed up with quick turnover, but the heel contact will establish foot placement without a full transfer of weight. The weight transfer occurs (the stance portion of your stride) as your hips glide over the foot. When you are doing this correctly you glide smoothly without a lot of bouncing up and down. If you have vertical movement, shorten your stride until you are gliding.
StabbingSky@lemmy.zip · 24 pts · 23h
Yes, but that's a separate issue.
webp@mander.xyz · 17 pts · 20h
I heard from someone who knows better that you are supposed to run silently if you're doing correct form, because when people pound the ground with their shoes they are putting energy into the wrong direction. You want to move forward, not up.
holy_scroller@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 14h
Besides a couple of suggestions, it is difficult to impossible to improve someone's running form through coaching. The best way is years of consistent running as you naturally become more efficient...but if your knees hurt it is a bit of a Catch 22. I ran with knee braces for about a year before the knee pain went away and has been away for years.
noxypaws@pawb.social · 12 pts · 23h
so, there might be something to Vibram Fivefingers and the ways they suggest to plant the ball of the foot first?
DrBob@lemmy.ca · 9 pts · 22h
Weeeeeel. Sort of.
Yes it's true that modern shoes (especially ultra cushioned shoes) change running mechanics.
Benno Nigg is a world authority on this issue and he will open his talks with the question "is this a problem?". And the answer is not necessarily.
It's true that modern footwear reduces the reliance on supporting musculature of the foot and ankle. If you have a philosophical attachment to using everything then this is not good. But if you have poor mechanics or structural weakness, then cushioned shoes represent a chance to participate in sport that might not otherwise be available.
Prior to the introduction of cushioned shoes very few people could participate in running as an endurance sport because of pain and injury. And they were all running in the equivalent of a minimal shoe because there was no alternative. The introduction of the waffle trainer and subsequent shoes powered the first running boom of the 1970s.
For people who switch to a minimal shoe, those with good mechanics may love them, and those with poor mechanics will not, and may injure thselves if they pursue them. They are not a panacea for runners by any means.
huppakee@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 23h
I dont have a pair of those but do have shoes with zero drop, without cushioned heel etc, and I really didn't know I landed my feet with a lot of force. Been exclusively using barefoot shoes for a few years now and I wouldn't say it changed my life but also I will not go back. Probably if someone gave me super expensive 'regular' shoes I would still not walk on them. Maybe if they paid me. Maybe.
timbuck2themoon@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 15h
Same. Zero drop is the way.
Reading Born to Run is a great gateway into what it's all about.
Kolanaki@pawb.social · 8 pts · 15h
It could also be a deficiency in the cartilage that cushions the joint. Found out that was my case in 7th grade after I hurt myself playing raquetball by just pivoting. Had to drop out of all the sports I played because of it to not further fuck my knees up. :(
hereiamagain@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 14m
My friend has that, unfortunately.
She never knew, just thought everyone's joints always hurt that bad. She did a lot of running, into her 30s, until she fell down a cliff and tore something in her knee.
They didn't find her cartilage problem right away.
Her knees are bone on bone. Can't relax too much or the bone will start to fuse together. So after her first surgery, she was laid up for awhile, and that they started fusing and causing all kinds of new problems and pain.
She ended up needing surgery in both knees, and now she's on strict instructions. She has to walk a certain minimum every day. Not too much, not too little, to keep the bone on bone happy, without wearing it out too fast.
Really sucks, she was an extremely active person. Now she wears double knee braces.
edgemaster72@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 20h
I'm pretty sure it's cuz I'm very fat. Which I guess could be considered "incorrect" form. Touché, person whom I never gave a chance to respond.
Dozzi92@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 5h
I was always in really good shape up into my late 20s, played sports, ran, swam, the whole nine. In my early 30s I let go a bit and put on about 20 pounds.
A good friend of mine was a great runner and someone I'd worked out a bunch with. He is a personal trainer at this point. I talk to him about how I'm getting old and how I get pains now when I run, and he goes "It's because you're fat now. You were carrying less weight, and now you're not, and you're feeling it." He went on to explain that, if you've always been heavier, your body gets used to that (not that it's good, just used to it), but if you add the weight later, your body has a tougher time dealing with it.
I've since shaved most of it off and things have returned to close to what they were. Can't run as well as I did at 22, but I'm 39 and don't expect to.
lokalhorst@feddit.org · 6 pts · 20h
There are many reasons for hurting knees when running. Running is just not a beginners sport. For me it was a muscle imbalance - relative to the average my front thighs were at 130%, while my back thighs were at 70%. I did more than one year resistance training to get even that imbalance out. Now I can just run without knee pain anymore.
TheBluetoofs@piefed.social · 4 pts · 14h
OR the fact that I have little cartilage left between my femur and tibia.
cuboc@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 11h
Although this is not particularly aimed at OP, as I cannot assess their situation, you should also check the fit and quality of your shoes if you start getting pains. One of my running friends ran with the wrong shoes for years and was out of the running (heh) at regular intervals because he figured that he could wear the same type of shoes as his father did.
Also, the manufacturer's advice is that running shoes last 800-1000 kilometers. I personally do not really trust that advice since they do have to actually sell shoes, but that's another rant. Also, my current pair has just touched 1200kms and I have no weird pains yet. I will be switching soon though, so I am not that stubborn.
As for barefooot shoes, I switched to barefoot shoes in everyday life three years ago and I rarely use traditional shoes anymore. My posture has improved and I have fewer back pains (I'm old). I also love being able to feel what's below my feet as it somehow makes me more aware of my surroundings. However, I still run in traditional running shoes. Part of the reason is that I mostly run on paved roads. I am a masochist, but not that much. I was able to switch from antipronation to neutral shoes without issue and I feel that walking barefoot has improved my running posture. I take shorter steps and my landing zone has shifted forwards. My speed has not improved, but that't probably because I am getting older and more rickety. :-)
SaneMartigan@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 6h
I wear Asics trail running shoes while walking the dog. 2x4km daily. After about 2000km they're pretty worn out. I wear the Kayano's when running but I've only just gotten back into running due to surgeries.
Zamboni_Driver@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 1d
So were you able to fix your form?
StabbingSky@lemmy.zip · 5 pts · 23h
I was, so now I'm able to run until my foot starts hurting, although I'm pretty sure that one is just a tight tendon. My other agility training contains a lot of jumps, so that's helped with the issue.
statelesz@slrpnk.net · 3 pts · 19h
Also stretch all muscles around the joint that hurts. Ideally before and after running.
whoisearth@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 5h
This is what I'm working on. I'm a shit stretcher and it's starting to impact my Achilles.
Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de · 3 pts · 6h
this is why barefoot running is so good at making you run properly: you're not going to slam your bare heel into asphalt twice :)
Any pain caused by the gait is felt immediately (rather than slowly building up elsewhere in the limbs) and you quickly learn to not do it that way, and eventually you'll have unlearned any bad parts of your running form.
statelesz@slrpnk.net · 2 pts · 19h
You also might need orthopedic insoles. And different ones for running than for walking. Most people these days have fucked feet.
mp3@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 21h
Nah I'm just getting old and fucked up.