Absolutely not and it's ok to HA-HA in his face as long as the joke stays fresh, but I wouldn't call the girl "queen": she's just a gold digger that gave a valid argument for even more misoginy from the other side
I said think gold digging brings misoginy by consequence, I never said I think it justifies it.
Don't put words in my mouth just to cry for a cause there is no need to fight here.
And as a side, I always found the phrase "don't hate the player, hate the game" as dumb as the culture who coined it: who the hell is playing the game? The spectators? Of course you hate the players, they're the only reason the game is being played!
It involves assuming the point of view of a misoginist who feels entitled to be misoginistic.
I know it's not a position you thought you'd end up when you woke up this morning, but trying to understand what's going on in other people's head is a first step towards fighting intolerance.
Would you consider it misogyny if someone mentions gold diggers in a conversation about dating? Or if they talk about gold diggers in any context at all? Or if someone even acknowledges that gold diggers exist?
Because a lot of people would consider that misogyny.
But an instagram model openly being a gold digger lends credence to the argument that "some women are gold diggers."
So if you consider it misogyny to acknowledge that some women are gold diggers, then a woman being a gold digger is, by your very definitions, creating a pretext to justify misogyny.
(Funny how women can generalize about men, but when men generalize about women it's suddenly a problem; or even if they don't generalize but cite specific examples, people will still make a strawman argument about them generalizing so even that's bad).
Ah, but you're forgetting that this is the age of the internet, when discussing potential solutions to a problem (or root causes of that problem so that real solutions can be found) is basically equivalent to providing justification for that problem.
We're just supposed to paper over everything to make it presentable to an audience, even if beneath the surface everything is still a wreck. Superficial, temporary solutions are preferable to lasting solutions that address the problems at their roots.
Something about toxic positivity, and confusing descriptivism with prescriptivism.
"Does" ≠"Should" (strawmen hate this one little trick!)
Yeah that's how I interpreted it too. However, even with that interpretation, it feels like they're blaming the victim for their own subjugation.
It's akin to saying that black people stealing from Walmart gets in the way of eradicating racism, without addressing the reason why they have to steal in the first place. If they had money for groceries, they wouldn't be stealing. Likewise, if that young woman had enough money to live a comfortable life, I highly doubt she would have spent two years of her life married to that crusty old man. Subjugated people do what they have to do to survive.
We all word things the wrong way sometimes, and that's okay. Everyone deserves a chance to clarify what they meant. In this case, however, it seems that pH3ra has only continued to double down on their original statement.
"So two wrong makes a right" is said when the responding party has nothing to stand on and needs some tired old broken statement to back up their lack of argument. When anyone says that the proper response is always "One turn deserves another". A equally useless ambiguous statement in response.
Lol my buddy just married one of those. I don't know the terms of their pre-nup, or if they even did one. Wish we had a remind me bot so I could report back in 2 years!
He also noted that “If nearly half of all Blacks are not OK with white people,” then they should be called a “hate group.” His remarks were widely seen as racist—Adams claimed that he was being hyperbolic—and many newspapers dropped Dilbert.
Wow. Scott adams was a cunt. I just searched why y'all are celebrating his death, and I found this. Just........ wow.
Scott Adams is dead! I didn't know. He died in January of this year. A shitty fucking person with a horrible world view is no longer putting content on the internet. Happy to learn this.
(I liked Dilbert as a kid and owned a couple of his non-Dilbert books. It's sad how he went full-rightwing-nuttter later in life.)
The non dilbert books spoke to me as an edgy teen who was smarter than most people and dumber than she thought. As an adult though I look back and think about the sheer lack of wisdom and introspection it must take to write such things as a grown adult. He died as he lived, as wise as a 16 year old and angry that everyone else didn't see the light of his brilliance that he so vividly hallucinated. And I think that is how he fell down the right wing rabbit hole, he lacked the self awareness to see through his biases and was deeply drawn to a certain type of men who are overconfident assholes.
And it's fair, it's ok to like cringy novels so long as they aren't Ayn Rand. /hj But yeah, I totally get how an edgy atheist novel would appeal ro people in the 00s. Adams was really good, especially early on, at making people feel like they were one of the only smart people in a world of idiots. It's just that when you embrace that feeling too hard you open yourself up to becoming a nutjob crank who believes everything they think, which is what he did.
I hope I found the right ep. The ep number is so low that it makes me wonder if the one I wanted was a later ep? Too many total to go through and verify.)
I used to like his comics as a kid but now, having worked as a software developer for years... I'm starting to look at them different. He was always so fucking demeaning about the pointy haired bald boss, made him an absolute idiot. The constant joke was that the chad Dilbert was smarter than the idiot manager who never understood a thing about technology.
I bet Scott was an absolute fucking asshole in the office and hated having to be told what to do by people he saw as less than him.
I had a boss in a development job once, post dot com that made the pointy haired boss look like a genius. He wasn't just uneducated, he was mean and sometimes awful.
One of his favorite games was three options. For every task he wanted three options to do it. Once you gave him three, he would pick what he deemed the worst of the three just to watch people squirm.
One day after a particularly uninspired rant, one of the devs waited till he went to lunch and threw his keys into the recycling shredder box. I never went that far myself, but I fully understood it.
There's also that bit that comes out of nowhere in the middle of 'Everybody wants to be a Cat'. Which is really a damn shame, because that song is honestly kind of a banger otherwise.
That movie was one of my absolute favorites as a kid and I still maintain that O'Malley is the best Disney 'prince' but that part was certainly a choice.
Wait, what bit? I still have that song occasionally come on the 'disney playlist.' Admittedly, the only thing I can remember is a 'square with a horn,' but you'd think I would notice something racist in the middle.
I honestly would not be surprised if the version on the soundtrack has it removed, but in the actual movie there's an Asian caracature cat (big buck teeth and all) that plays chopsticks with literal chopsticks whilst singing something to the effect of "egg fu Yung, fortune cookie always wrong"
No no no. PHB is Elon Musk, 100%. (Doesn't know shit about anything and is dumber than a bag of rocks, but is still very enthusiastic about going forth and fucking things up.) Trump is like the CEO of Dilbert's company (a lot dumber than the PHB, but fortunately too stupid to function most of the time, so his direct subordinates have to do the actual day-to-day fuck-ups, leaving only the most gigantic massive fuck-ups for him to handle personally).
Edit: And of course it comes as no surprise that when Adams went into the deep end, he worked to "rehabilitate" PHB and other dumb manager characters and made them look better. He was no man of principle, you see.
Oh, I know, I first had a bit of a whiff of him being weird when I read The Dilbert Principle. Otherwise a fairly amusing book, but the chapter on female coworkers was... uh, to put it in modern parlance, fedoraèd. This was supposed to be a funny book. Wasn't laughing.
Don't feel bad. I decided to play ATV Offroad Fury 2 a few months back. I was thoroughly enjoying the soundtrack and decided to google what band made "Shinobi vs Dragon Ninja" since it was my favorite song on the soundtrack.
Oh a band named the Lostprophets. Oh the lead singer Ian Watkins was murdered in prison. Wait why was he in prison? OH... oh no.
Fuuuuck, I forgot how much I like that song and how I knew all that already. Damn. There's been several bands and singers over the years I've had to forget. I'm not very good at separating art and artist.
One of the (arguably) greatest poets of the 20th century, Ezra Pound, was an unrepentant fascist. His family tried to have him declared insane in order to preserve his reputation.
A few modern poets were. William Butler Yeats is another I know of. His image is somewhat sanitized because he's an important national poet for Ireland, but he was a rich asshole who was supportive of the fascist movements in Ireland (Blueshirts) and abroad (Francoist Spain). Similar (but less overt) is T. S. Eliot, who also became sympathetic to fascism later in life.
I can't find the comic, but the one where Dogbert said "No expensive funeral; just wrap him up in newspapers. He would have wanted it that way." seems especially appropriate.
I remember back in the early 90s our sysadmin would grab Dilbert comics from (I think) USENET and print them on our HP laser printer. Adams built up so much goodwill only to shit all over it in the end.
No not really actually. The general idea of walt being a racist and anti Jewish is generally over blown.
Don't get me wrong he was in fact racist. But he was culturally racist. He was a man of his time. Politically and publicly he was honestly what ever.
He was far too focused on his business. And a lot of the more overt racist things that he gets accused of tends to just be from those who he worked around and because of his business would have been supporting. But it was more a byproduct of just running a successful business of the time. Not so much him going out of his way to be racist.
Like you have to really judge things by the culture of the era. What was honestly a very mild 5 out of 10 all things considered. Sure, he could have been better but be sure the f*** wasn't overly problematic. Lot of his contemporaries business partners were far worse and used their influence as well as Walt himself to exert a number of problem. Things which of course won't being more focused on his business and not really caring one way or the other just let happen so you can lay some blame in his feet.
But on the flip side you also have to consider things like song of the South. Where it's a very problematic film and clearly comes from an error of extreme racism and slavery. The focus was on Walt trying to share stories that he heard growing up and sharing the positive side of those stories. Yeah they're from slaves and you can't divorce that. So it's well-meaning just aged poorly.
Cuz by today's standards it's horribly whitewashed and incredibly racist. But back then all things considered when you put it in the context of the era and the man who LED it, it's a honest attempt to do better and share positivity out of something that was horrifically toxic.
Really every time I've ever done a deep dive into Walt's life or his history the same few things come up over and over and over again. Pretty much every major racist, anti-jewish or other problematic thing that people lay at the feet of Walt just comes down to the simple fact. He just didn't care.
He had a business to run. His partners were far worse than him and he just let them do whatever he never stood up and said this is too far because that would have been a bad business move in the era.
Malt is a fantastic example of the cruelty of indifference and capitalism. The business world does not care for morals. It does not care for people. It only cares for money and progress.
Oh he cared alright, about fingering anyone who tried to unionize as communists, ruining their lives and blacklisting them. He ruined people who were not even communist because they cost him money. He was absolutely a garbage human being.
Fighting takes too much energy. It was never a witty comic, but it would resonate with you when you were in the office job that had a nepo boss making random decisions. The life of the comic was just the same joke said in a thousand different ways though, which is why we can now look at it and mentally shrug.
But when it first came out, it fit right in with Dave Barry and Milton, etc. If you were working just to get a paycheck, you could relate. The overuse of sarcasm could be overlooked bc it only happened once a week.
It never grew or evolved with the times, mirroring Adams.
Okay: it criticized the corporate bullshit machine, how it promotes short-term thinking, and how it turns hopeful, creative people into burned out cynics. Yes, it had flaws, it overused the "work, amiright" trope and it liked to kick downwards, for instance. But at its core it was a sarcastic criticism of capitalism and our broken society that resonated with lots of people. Even if it never spelled such things out.
Doesn't excuse the author being a racist asshole, of course.
uh okay i guess. since you staked out my position though, i'm gonna have to pick something ridiculous like scott adams character the pointy eared boss was inspired by an interaction that adams had with a mirror while on mescaline
stopped clock moment, goku is based off a character from chinese mythology. still bad to call him what john mulaney rightly described as "the laziest slur ever" though. anyway fuck dilbert and his stupid dead dad
He also invented a vegan burrito called the Dilberito that was somewhat questionable
"As for Adams, he left the world of food behind, considering the Dilberito a failure, a lesson to be learned. Adams would later describe the nutritional value of the burrito as such: 'Three bites of the Dilberito made you fart so hard your intestines formed a tail.'"
My idea of the image is that people like Disney or Toriyama were openly racist (and horrible) and shown it in their cartoons, the diference is they were really successfull
P.s: Dont know why's Kermit there
Popo was based on Jinns or genies. Staff Officer Black, yes that's his name, comes more from the Japanese getting a lot of Jim Crow era cartoons, but not knowing the historic baggage that comes along with it. It was mostly considered a racial caricature that didn't really carry the same sort of hate we know it for in America. He also had Native America caricatures that most people don't seem to have an issue with.
Honestly, I wouldn't be looking to Toriyama for anything other then "Big Guy punches other Big Guy until one goes down". He's politically naive, not hateful. There's a short list of other manga-ka who's politics and... crimes should give you more concern. How Nobuhiro Watsuki is a free man bogus my mind.
You can't just remember the good parts and ignore the bad parts. By that same logic you should leave Hitler alone because he was a good painter. Fuck that. That's not how a real life works, dead or alive.
A lot of his comics were just based on stories his fans sent him. They weren't really his ideas anyway. If you want to dive deeper into his own mind, check out his Bob Bastard episode of his cartoon. It's incredibility incel coded.
140 Comments
swizzlestick@lemmy.zip · 163 pts · 69d
pH3ra@lemmy.ml · 71 pts · 69d
If shitty person #1 does a shitty thing to shitty person #2, doesn't make shitty person #1 less shitty
Honytawk@discuss.tchncs.de · 70 pts · 69d
Does it need to? I just love it when shitty things happen to shitty people. Its karma.
pH3ra@lemmy.ml · 13 pts · 69d
Absolutely not and it's ok to HA-HA in his face as long as the joke stays fresh, but I wouldn't call the girl "queen": she's just a gold digger that gave a valid argument for even more misoginy from the other side
Hazel@piefed.blahaj.zone · 9 pts · 69d
You think gold digging warrants misogyny? Yikes 🤢
She just played the capitalist patriarchy, good on her. Don't hate the player, hate the game.
pH3ra@lemmy.ml · 29 pts · 69d
I said think gold digging brings misoginy by consequence, I never said I think it justifies it.
Don't put words in my mouth just to cry for a cause there is no need to fight here.
And as a side, I always found the phrase "don't hate the player, hate the game" as dumb as the culture who coined it: who the hell is playing the game? The spectators? Of course you hate the players, they're the only reason the game is being played!
Hazel@piefed.blahaj.zone · -10 pts · 69d
You literally called it a valid argument, don't know how else to interpret that.
pH3ra@lemmy.ml · 9 pts · 69d
It involves assuming the point of view of a misoginist who feels entitled to be misoginistic. I know it's not a position you thought you'd end up when you woke up this morning, but trying to understand what's going on in other people's head is a first step towards fighting intolerance.
wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz · 6 pts · 69d
Would you consider it misogyny if someone mentions gold diggers in a conversation about dating? Or if they talk about gold diggers in any context at all? Or if someone even acknowledges that gold diggers exist?
Because a lot of people would consider that misogyny.
But an instagram model openly being a gold digger lends credence to the argument that "some women are gold diggers."
So if you consider it misogyny to acknowledge that some women are gold diggers, then a woman being a gold digger is, by your very definitions, creating a pretext to justify misogyny.
(Funny how women can generalize about men, but when men generalize about women it's suddenly a problem; or even if they don't generalize but cite specific examples, people will still make a strawman argument about them generalizing so even that's bad).
MehBlah@lemmy.world · 29 pts · 69d
sukhmel@programming.dev · 20 pts · 69d
I read their comment in a way 'that stands in the way of eradicating misogyny' not in a way 'it makes misogyny allowed'
pH3ra@lemmy.ml · 16 pts · 69d
Thank you, you reasonable person
JigglySackles@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 69d
You're in the right here. Some people just lack reading comprehension.
wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz · 3 pts · 69d
Ah, but you're forgetting that this is the age of the internet, when discussing potential solutions to a problem (or root causes of that problem so that real solutions can be found) is basically equivalent to providing justification for that problem.
We're just supposed to paper over everything to make it presentable to an audience, even if beneath the surface everything is still a wreck. Superficial, temporary solutions are preferable to lasting solutions that address the problems at their roots.
Something about toxic positivity, and confusing descriptivism with prescriptivism.
"Does" ≠"Should" (strawmen hate this one little trick!)
cobalt32@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 1 pts · 68d
Yeah that's how I interpreted it too. However, even with that interpretation, it feels like they're blaming the victim for their own subjugation.
It's akin to saying that black people stealing from Walmart gets in the way of eradicating racism, without addressing the reason why they have to steal in the first place. If they had money for groceries, they wouldn't be stealing. Likewise, if that young woman had enough money to live a comfortable life, I highly doubt she would have spent two years of her life married to that crusty old man. Subjugated people do what they have to do to survive.
We all word things the wrong way sometimes, and that's okay. Everyone deserves a chance to clarify what they meant. In this case, however, it seems that pH3ra has only continued to double down on their original statement.
xkbx@startrek.website · -9 pts · 69d
so two wrongs make a right when two wrongs make two wrongs?
MehBlah@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 69d
One turn deserves another.
"So two wrong makes a right" is said when the responding party has nothing to stand on and needs some tired old broken statement to back up their lack of argument. When anyone says that the proper response is always "One turn deserves another". A equally useless ambiguous statement in response.
MehBlah@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 69d
Shit clings to one another until some other shit comes along.
pH3ra@lemmy.ml · 18 pts · 69d
a_non_monotonic_function@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 68d
No, but in this case it is pretty fucking funny.
unemployedclaquer@sopuli.xyz · 16 pts · 69d
That's rough what is that, my brain and psyche are all so fucked I started to think about fucking all of the billionaires
swizzlestick@lemmy.zip · 8 pts · 69d
Adapt to the world you live in, I guess 🤷‍♂️
jballs@sh.itjust.works · 13 pts · 69d
Lol my buddy just married one of those. I don't know the terms of their pre-nup, or if they even did one. Wish we had a remind me bot so I could report back in 2 years!
FiniteBanjo@feddit.online · 162 pts · 69d
I feel like Mickey wouldn't be THAT shocked.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works · 61 pts · 69d
OwOarchist@pawb.social · 29 pts · 69d
That's not his shocked face. That's his 'I have found my people' face.
somethingsnappy@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 69d
Is is weird for a black mouse to be racist against black people? Well. Yes. Especially since there are quite a few colors of mice.
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 20 pts · 69d
msage@programming.dev · 19 pts · 69d
The song of the Souuuthhh...
snoons@lemmy.ca · 13 pts · 69d
Nah, Mickey is public domain now. He's ours.
osanna@lemmy.vg · 95 pts · 69d
Wow. Scott adams was a cunt. I just searched why y'all are celebrating his death, and I found this. Just........ wow.
papalonian@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 65d
I was going to suggest looking up some of the earlier comics depicting black people, but those were the Dennis the Menace comics I was thinking of.
You should look those up anyways, though. They're pretty bad.
EtAl@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 88 pts · 69d
Wait. Scott Adams died in January and I didn't know!? Where is his grave? I have a dance routine I'd love to perform.
ChickenLadyLovesLife@lemmy.world · 54 pts · 69d
Don't forget to hydrate.
unemployedclaquer@sopuli.xyz · -28 pts · 69d
I will say, the Dilbert guy died, looo CR CR Scott Adams died, oh what a tiresome little dfuck HaruphadumphHaruphadumph
bitjunkie@lemmy.world · 25 pts · 69d
c/strokeposting
some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org · 83 pts · 69d
Scott Adams is dead! I didn't know. He died in January of this year. A shitty fucking person with a horrible world view is no longer putting content on the internet. Happy to learn this.
(I liked Dilbert as a kid and owned a couple of his non-Dilbert books. It's sad how he went full-rightwing-nuttter later in life.)
captainlezbian@lemmy.world · 43 pts · 69d
The non dilbert books spoke to me as an edgy teen who was smarter than most people and dumber than she thought. As an adult though I look back and think about the sheer lack of wisdom and introspection it must take to write such things as a grown adult. He died as he lived, as wise as a 16 year old and angry that everyone else didn't see the light of his brilliance that he so vividly hallucinated. And I think that is how he fell down the right wing rabbit hole, he lacked the self awareness to see through his biases and was deeply drawn to a certain type of men who are overconfident assholes.
But yeah I liked dilbert as a kid too
nonfuinoncuro@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 69d
i liked god's debris but yeah i think if i read it now 20 years later may be a little cringy
captainlezbian@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 68d
And it's fair, it's ok to like cringy novels so long as they aren't Ayn Rand. /hj But yeah, I totally get how an edgy atheist novel would appeal ro people in the 00s. Adams was really good, especially early on, at making people feel like they were one of the only smart people in a world of idiots. It's just that when you embrace that feeling too hard you open yourself up to becoming a nutjob crank who believes everything they think, which is what he did.
some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org · 1 pts · 67d
I will take this opportunity to recommend a podcast ep about him from the QAA podcast:
https://soundcloud.com/qanonanonymous/episode-43-scott-adams
I hope I found the right ep. The ep number is so low that it makes me wonder if the one I wanted was a later ep? Too many total to go through and verify.)
And Behind the Bastards:
Part 1, Part 2
He became pretty unhinged later in life. He put some bizarre content into the world.
coolansplanet@lemmy.today · -32 pts · 69d
If you hate the hater, you become one of them. Just look at him as a person who was confused.
HikingVet@lemmy.ca · 18 pts · 69d
Nah, he knew what he was doing.
JigglySackles@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 69d
Hating right wing lunacy doesn't make you one of them.
ricecake@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 68d
What? That doesn't even make sense. Being shitty makes you shitty, not thinking it's shitty to be shitty.
You're essentially sweeping all negative behavior under the rug of "confusion".
Yes, he was wrong. That doesn't mean he wasn't also shitty.
Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works · 77 pts · 69d
Oh, Scott Adams died?
Nothing of value was lost.
terranoid@lemmy.cafe · 46 pts · 69d
I used to like his comics as a kid but now, having worked as a software developer for years... I'm starting to look at them different. He was always so fucking demeaning about the pointy haired bald boss, made him an absolute idiot. The constant joke was that the chad Dilbert was smarter than the idiot manager who never understood a thing about technology.
I bet Scott was an absolute fucking asshole in the office and hated having to be told what to do by people he saw as less than him.
rumba@lemmy.zip · 50 pts · 69d
I had a boss in a development job once, post dot com that made the pointy haired boss look like a genius. He wasn't just uneducated, he was mean and sometimes awful.
One of his favorite games was three options. For every task he wanted three options to do it. Once you gave him three, he would pick what he deemed the worst of the three just to watch people squirm.
One day after a particularly uninspired rant, one of the devs waited till he went to lunch and threw his keys into the recycling shredder box. I never went that far myself, but I fully understood it.
Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In@lemmy.world · 22 pts · 69d
Did you get promoted recently?
a_non_monotonic_function@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 68d
Then you start to consider how backward and stupid he made foreigners.
randombullet@programming.dev · 63 pts · 69d
He noted that taking ivermectin and fenbendazole to treat the cancer did not work.
Ceruleum@lemmy.wtf · 18 pts · 69d
Didn't tried bleach or sunlight?
wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz · 1 pts · 69d
What about ibogaine and benzos?
kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 59 pts · 69d
Why is Mickey surprised? Walt Disney was incredibly racist.
muusemuuse@sh.itjust.works · 24 pts · 69d
Anyone got a link to that dumbo scene with the crows? Or the tarbaby thing?
rumba@lemmy.zip · 18 pts · 69d
Song of the south, there was plenty.
Phantaloons@piefed.zip · 27 pts · 69d
There's a Kingdom Hearts level we're never getting.
rumba@lemmy.zip · 6 pts · 69d
God let's hope not, I'd have said that about Winnie the Pooh Blood and Honey too.
HikingVet@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 69d
That was a HORRIBLE movie. I hate that some fucking guy probably has it backed up so we will never be rid of it.
mister_flibble@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 69d
There's also that bit that comes out of nowhere in the middle of 'Everybody wants to be a Cat'. Which is really a damn shame, because that song is honestly kind of a banger otherwise.
That movie was one of my absolute favorites as a kid and I still maintain that O'Malley is the best Disney 'prince' but that part was certainly a choice.
imadethis@fedinsfw.app · 4 pts · 69d
Wait, what bit? I still have that song occasionally come on the 'disney playlist.' Admittedly, the only thing I can remember is a 'square with a horn,' but you'd think I would notice something racist in the middle.
mister_flibble@sh.itjust.works · 8 pts · 69d
I honestly would not be surprised if the version on the soundtrack has it removed, but in the actual movie there's an Asian caracature cat (big buck teeth and all) that plays chopsticks with literal chopsticks whilst singing something to the effect of "egg fu Yung, fortune cookie always wrong"
jdr@lemmy.ml · 3 pts · 69d
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXqd5d-zHMQ
This one?
There's a scholarly discussion about racism in the comments if you're into that sort of thing.
HumanOnEarth@lemmy.ca · 52 pts · 69d
Dilbert would have hated Adams. PHB is basically Trump and somehow he completely missed it. What a shame.
umbraroze@slrpnk.net · 18 pts · 69d
No no no. PHB is Elon Musk, 100%. (Doesn't know shit about anything and is dumber than a bag of rocks, but is still very enthusiastic about going forth and fucking things up.) Trump is like the CEO of Dilbert's company (a lot dumber than the PHB, but fortunately too stupid to function most of the time, so his direct subordinates have to do the actual day-to-day fuck-ups, leaving only the most gigantic massive fuck-ups for him to handle personally).
Edit: And of course it comes as no surprise that when Adams went into the deep end, he worked to "rehabilitate" PHB and other dumb manager characters and made them look better. He was no man of principle, you see.
Duamerthrax@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 69d
Adams was always a little weird. He just masked it better until his divorce. I knew he was a crackpot in 2007 with his "Fossils are Bullshit" article.
https://web.archive.org/web/20070325000042/https://dilbertblog.typepad.com/the_dilbert_blog/2007/03/fossils_are_bul.html
umbraroze@slrpnk.net · 3 pts · 69d
Oh, I know, I first had a bit of a whiff of him being weird when I read The Dilbert Principle. Otherwise a fairly amusing book, but the chapter on female coworkers was... uh, to put it in modern parlance, fedoraèd. This was supposed to be a funny book. Wasn't laughing.
Rothe@piefed.social · 8 pts · 69d
Adams made Dilbert pretty insufferable and (right wing) political in his later years.
A_Chilean_Cyborg@feddit.cl · 46 pts · 69d
I liked dilbert a lot before knowing that the author is like that.
Is a pitty how you can't enjoy nothing without the author ruining it anymore.
Ferroto@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 69d
Don't feel bad. I decided to play ATV Offroad Fury 2 a few months back. I was thoroughly enjoying the soundtrack and decided to google what band made "Shinobi vs Dragon Ninja" since it was my favorite song on the soundtrack.
Oh a band named the Lostprophets. Oh the lead singer Ian Watkins was murdered in prison. Wait why was he in prison? OH... oh no.
Don't google your heros kids.
QueenHawlSera@sh.itjust.works · 8 pts · 68d
According to a quick google search, he tried to rape a baby.
Like that's something I'd joke about someone doing when sarcastically branding them evil.... But no he actually tried to rape an infant.
What the fuck?
codexarcanum@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 4 pts · 68d
Fuuuuck, I forgot how much I like that song and how I knew all that already. Damn. There's been several bands and singers over the years I've had to forget. I'm not very good at separating art and artist.
JackFrostNCola@aussie.zone · 1 pts · 68d
I used to also enjoy burn-burn by them but now it makes my skin crawl every time i see a trackname of theirs
The_Lurker@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 69d
One of the (arguably) greatest poets of the 20th century, Ezra Pound, was an unrepentant fascist. His family tried to have him declared insane in order to preserve his reputation.
zikzak025@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 68d
A few modern poets were. William Butler Yeats is another I know of. His image is somewhat sanitized because he's an important national poet for Ireland, but he was a rich asshole who was supportive of the fascist movements in Ireland (Blueshirts) and abroad (Francoist Spain). Similar (but less overt) is T. S. Eliot, who also became sympathetic to fascism later in life.
Landless2029@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 69d
I feel that way about a lot of creatives.
The content can be good when the person is a shitcake.
Actors, musicians, artists and writers. Every medium has loads of public and secret assholes.
Ignorance is bliss when you're not paying for it.
Tigeroovy@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 68d
Yeah I hear ya, I was a huge Ren & Stimpy fan growing up.
dan@upvote.au · 6 pts · 68d
Oh no. Not sure I want to look up what he did.
Tigeroovy@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 68d
Not as bad as the Lost Prophets guy but it ain’t good.
Etterra@discuss.online · 2 pts · 69d
Yes same here. Fucking Scott Adams man.
spicehoarder@lemmy.zip · 31 pts · 69d
This seems relevant
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 10 pts · 69d
I can't find the comic, but the one where Dogbert said "No expensive funeral; just wrap him up in newspapers. He would have wanted it that way." seems especially appropriate.
TomMasz@piefed.social · 30 pts · 69d
I remember back in the early 90s our sysadmin would grab Dilbert comics from (I think) USENET and print them on our HP laser printer. Adams built up so much goodwill only to shit all over it in the end.
Fedizen@lemmy.world · 27 pts · 69d
Also wasn't walt disney like even shittier? How is mickey mouse surprised by this?
Edit fixed it:
Holytimes@sh.itjust.works · 11 pts · 68d
No not really actually. The general idea of walt being a racist and anti Jewish is generally over blown.
Don't get me wrong he was in fact racist. But he was culturally racist. He was a man of his time. Politically and publicly he was honestly what ever.
He was far too focused on his business. And a lot of the more overt racist things that he gets accused of tends to just be from those who he worked around and because of his business would have been supporting. But it was more a byproduct of just running a successful business of the time. Not so much him going out of his way to be racist.
Like you have to really judge things by the culture of the era. What was honestly a very mild 5 out of 10 all things considered. Sure, he could have been better but be sure the f*** wasn't overly problematic. Lot of his contemporaries business partners were far worse and used their influence as well as Walt himself to exert a number of problem. Things which of course won't being more focused on his business and not really caring one way or the other just let happen so you can lay some blame in his feet.
But on the flip side you also have to consider things like song of the South. Where it's a very problematic film and clearly comes from an error of extreme racism and slavery. The focus was on Walt trying to share stories that he heard growing up and sharing the positive side of those stories. Yeah they're from slaves and you can't divorce that. So it's well-meaning just aged poorly.
Cuz by today's standards it's horribly whitewashed and incredibly racist. But back then all things considered when you put it in the context of the era and the man who LED it, it's a honest attempt to do better and share positivity out of something that was horrifically toxic.
Really every time I've ever done a deep dive into Walt's life or his history the same few things come up over and over and over again. Pretty much every major racist, anti-jewish or other problematic thing that people lay at the feet of Walt just comes down to the simple fact. He just didn't care.
He had a business to run. His partners were far worse than him and he just let them do whatever he never stood up and said this is too far because that would have been a bad business move in the era.
Malt is a fantastic example of the cruelty of indifference and capitalism. The business world does not care for morals. It does not care for people. It only cares for money and progress.
Fedizen@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 68d
So you're saying mickey would be indifferent?
qarbone@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 68d
Mickey would be more put-off by the cursing than the racism. "Hohoh call him a Chinaman, sure, but there's no need to use the F-word!"
Doomsider@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 68d
Oh he cared alright, about fingering anyone who tried to unionize as communists, ruining their lives and blacklisting them. He ruined people who were not even communist because they cost him money. He was absolutely a garbage human being.
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 68d
Disney, racist? No, no, whatever gave you that idea?
ZoteTheMighty@lemmy.zip · 24 pts · 68d
Scott Adams was an asshole and a lunatic long before Trumpism made it mainstream.
BilSabab@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 68d
he was ahead of the curve for like solid 15 years at minimum.
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 22 pts · 69d
Dilbert was never funny anyway. Fight me about it.
imadethis@fedinsfw.app · 34 pts · 69d
Fighting takes too much energy. It was never a witty comic, but it would resonate with you when you were in the office job that had a nepo boss making random decisions. The life of the comic was just the same joke said in a thousand different ways though, which is why we can now look at it and mentally shrug.
Windex007@lemmy.world · 14 pts · 69d
Boss: I hav a nu idea
Gilbert: No don't u realize how stoopid that
Boss: oh well I stil say do
Garfeel: oh boy Monday... NOT
tacosanonymous@mander.xyz · 31 pts · 69d
I don’t actually want to fight.
But when it first came out, it fit right in with Dave Barry and Milton, etc. If you were working just to get a paycheck, you could relate. The overuse of sarcasm could be overlooked bc it only happened once a week.
It never grew or evolved with the times, mirroring Adams.
JcbAzPx@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 69d
It did add a bald CEO in later years, but that's about it.
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 1 pts · 68d
That's it, we're gonna fight now
LH0ezVT@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 68d
Okay: it criticized the corporate bullshit machine, how it promotes short-term thinking, and how it turns hopeful, creative people into burned out cynics. Yes, it had flaws, it overused the "work, amiright" trope and it liked to kick downwards, for instance. But at its core it was a sarcastic criticism of capitalism and our broken society that resonated with lots of people. Even if it never spelled such things out.
Doesn't excuse the author being a racist asshole, of course.
Fight me, 1v1 on dust 2 deagle only
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 67d
I said it wasn't funny, not that it had chosen a bad target.
OldChicoAle@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 69d
The most boring comic in the Sunday paper.
bitchkat@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 69d
I didn't know we were talking about Family Circus or Nancy.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 69d
uh okay i guess. since you staked out my position though, i'm gonna have to pick something ridiculous like scott adams character the pointy eared boss was inspired by an interaction that adams had with a mirror while on mescaline
bitchkat@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 69d
Have my up vote. Never cared for it one bit.
Arrandee@lemmy.world · 22 pts · 69d
Aww you’re just talking about Scott Adams.
Don’t tease me.
HikingVet@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 69d
He dead.
curbstickle@anarchist.nexus · 22 pts · 69d
Well damn, I totally missed that Scott Adams died!
Its late but I still feel like something celebratory is deserved... Maybe a bowl of ice cream with a birthday candle? Yeah I'm gonna go with that.
ApathyTree@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 6 pts · 69d
How was it? Delicious?
curbstickle@anarchist.nexus · 6 pts · 69d
It was delightful
Overkrill@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 20 pts · 69d
stopped clock moment, goku is based off a character from chinese mythology. still bad to call him what john mulaney rightly described as "the laziest slur ever" though. anyway fuck dilbert and his stupid dead dad
OwOarchist@pawb.social · 12 pts · 69d
Still, I don't think "chinaman" is quite the best way to say that.
DisasterTransport@startrek.website · 15 pts · 69d
Am I missing something or did you just quote their first sentence and then restate the second
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today · 2 pts · 69d
it was chinaman, and now chink.
Duamerthrax@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 69d
Just be glad they didn't use a harder slur and censored it.
btsax@reddthat.com · 17 pts · 69d
He also invented a vegan burrito called the Dilberito that was somewhat questionable
"As for Adams, he left the world of food behind, considering the Dilberito a failure, a lesson to be learned. Adams would later describe the nutritional value of the burrito as such: 'Three bites of the Dilberito made you fart so hard your intestines formed a tail.'"
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today · 10 pts · 69d
goku can use ultra instinct to instantly snap his neck.
ShinkanTrain@lemmy.ml · 3 pts · 69d
If Goku really hated racism he would have killed Freeza on Namek. Then again on Earth in the Broly movie
JcbAzPx@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 69d
He was too much of a fight junkie to kill a strong opponent.
Duamerthrax@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EANmcleSSuE
westingham@sh.itjust.works · 8 pts · 69d
Wait, why is Kermit here? Is there a dark part to Jim Henson?
vithigar@lemmy.ca · 69 pts · 69d
No, I believe it's just other characters whose original creators are dead offering commiseration.
westingham@sh.itjust.works · 14 pts · 69d
Oh, phew. I was worried, Henson was awesome.
TallonMetroid@lemmy.world · 16 pts · 69d
I think it's just that the characters' creators are all dead.
darthsundhaft@piefed.social · 3 pts · 68d
Top 10 character assassinations.
ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 69d
Dilbert wasn't like that.
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 12 pts · 69d
No, his racism was more subtle and hidden in smugness.
ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 69d
The Indian intern was depicted positively at least. Albiet shy and anxious.
x0x7@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
FYI, Goku is a chinaman in some sense. In that the original manga is based on "Journey to the West," which is a Chinese story.
NahMarcas@lemmy.ml · -1 pts · 69d
My idea of the image is that people like Disney or Toriyama were openly racist (and horrible) and shown it in their cartoons, the diference is they were really successfull P.s: Dont know why's Kermit there
QueenHawlSera@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 68d
Toriyama was racist?
NahMarcas@lemmy.ml · 1 pts · 68d
Duamerthrax@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 68d
Popo was based on Jinns or genies. Staff Officer Black, yes that's his name, comes more from the Japanese getting a lot of Jim Crow era cartoons, but not knowing the historic baggage that comes along with it. It was mostly considered a racial caricature that didn't really carry the same sort of hate we know it for in America. He also had Native America caricatures that most people don't seem to have an issue with.
Honestly, I wouldn't be looking to Toriyama for anything other then "Big Guy punches other Big Guy until one goes down". He's politically naive, not hateful. There's a short list of other manga-ka who's politics and... crimes should give you more concern. How Nobuhiro Watsuki is a free man bogus my mind.
QueenHawlSera@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 67d
I think Mr. Popo is based on a figure or yokai Japanese Folklore, but I'm not defending Black.
No really the guy on the right is named Commander Black.
Nomorereddit@lemmy.today · -5 pts · 69d
Bikes rock and trump sucks.
coolansplanet@lemmy.today · -19 pts · 69d
Nobody is perfect. Leave him rest in peace
HikingVet@lemmy.ca · 23 pts · 69d
Dude was incredibly racist.
If you want to be remember well, don't be shit in life.
Etterra@discuss.online · 1 pts · 69d
You can't just remember the good parts and ignore the bad parts. By that same logic you should leave Hitler alone because he was a good painter. Fuck that. That's not how a real life works, dead or alive.
Duamerthrax@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
A lot of his comics were just based on stories his fans sent him. They weren't really his ideas anyway. If you want to dive deeper into his own mind, check out his Bob Bastard episode of his cartoon. It's incredibility incel coded.