Except those tulips were a plaything for the rich and the fallout was contained to the rich, and with AI the fallout is going to be put on everybody else.
Does it count if I know for a fact that I've already been scraped??
I didn't mind when it was just tiny pieces that I recognized. It feels like deju-vu at first.. memes, phrases. You find out well before it goes public and chalk it up to "bots". Eventually, it gets a bit too coincidental.
...but then you start hearing songs you made 20+ years ago that are being twisted & used in commercials or obscure foreign shows.
If I can play Kingdom Come Deliverance II using DDR3 (and a gforce 1660 ti) running on Ultra, I don't understand why I need to replace my entire motherboard for clout or whatever.
I built an AM5 system because I wanted to ensure that if I want to upgrade it, I won't have to buy an entirely new motherboard. Coming from Intel who change their socket every two weeks, I thought it was a great idea at the time.
The cost wasn't prohibitive, the kinks ironed out quite fast. But I don't like DDR5 RAM. Like, it's RAM, I don't notice anything spectacular about it. What I do notice, is that it takes FUCKING AGES to post!
Startup finished in 20.971s (firmware) + 4.818s (loader) + 785ms (kernel) + 4.440s (initrd) + 7.741s (userspace) = 38.757s
graphical.target reached after 7.697s in userspace.
It's taking 21 fucking seconds to do some kind of "memory training!" It used to be over 40 seconds! For what? No noticeable difference in user experience other than it taking forever to boot.
That was always the case. This PC replaced my 1150 socket intel PC, which had new CPUs made for it from Q3 2013 to Q3 2014. AMD at least keeps their sockets usable for a couple of years before they change them.
1150 was superceded by 1151. Those are the number of pins on the header by the way, so they had to add one extra pin because it was obviously stifling innovation.
Aye, figured it was worth noting that they obsoleted it because they absolutely had to cram in that one extra pin! You can't convince me that they didn't do that just to fuck with people.
Exactly! Just upgraded to 12 gigs of DDR3 this year. Still have my i5 750 for gaming, just had to upgrade the GPU, but even that was almost 10 years ago. And it runs all the games that are worth playing.
The smooth focus effect on the heatsink made me think it was stock photography but tineye can't find it beyond February so it could easily be generated.
Aren't the ram slots also straight up placed wrong in the motherboard? I have never seen ram on a diagonal from the CPU before, or running parallel to the pcie slots, even on weird prebuilts.
Oh, definitely. I was questioning whether or not the irony was actually deliberate, illustrating the end result of the fake money ouroboros
All kinds of weird going on with how the right hand is āholdingā that module (while pinching another one behind it?)
Memory module is symmetrical.
No motherboard Iāve ever seen would have DIMM slots parallel to PCI slots, let alone that far from the CPU socket
Have a look at what would normally be the 24-Pin ATX connector - fewer pins, which is not unheard of in some proprietary cases, but the connector itself looks weird and garbled.
The question is whether or not itād deliberately ironic, the hallucination machine canāt even properly hallucinate PC Hardware despite heaps of training data.
The real reason is that the people running those AIs that they put so much money into to get where they currently are are well aware that people can just run their own models locally and cut them out of the picture entirely so they are attempting to monopolize the hardware needed to run it under the guise of getting ready to expand into the future.
Though the storage I think is more about wanting to keep a log of each interaction with their model for training and other ways to profiting from it (openly or covertly).
Like the whole "ai output isn't copyrightable" benefits them because they can just straight up use whatever output their models generate and it will be perfectly legal.
Not just AI. Many of these companies are also very entrenched in Cloud Services and have pushed cloud/subscription only models as a perpetual source of income.
By manipulating the supply chain to push up the prices of hardware, it's similar to how buying up the housing market allows incumbents to squeeze out competitors and ensure that they control how much "rent" people have to pay
Yup. I sometimes suspect the āhigher electric billā (near datacenters) is to force people to use cloud services, rather than a private cloud method.
as an electrical engineer who consults for utilities and worked directly for them for about 10 years I can tell you this isn't directly the case... meaning they didn't raise rates to force you to use cloud services.
Now what might have happened realistically is the data center is using so much electricity, the utility doesn't have that kind of capacity available so they have to raise rates to mitigate the difference in energy usage and to also raise revenue to build more infrastructure.
Decided to check the Synology RAM just for fun. I think they were quite overpriced even before.
Anyway, 16GB DDR4 Synology stick is EUR 1,409. What makes it EUR 88/GB?
When you zoom out and look at the bigger picture, this is just the latest instance of ever expanding credit being converted into assets, just like housing, and reflected in everything down to groceries.
The structural problem lies in the very fact that we have, since 1971 and the end of the Bretton Woods system, fiat currencies backed by nothing tangible or physical, allowing for limitless expansion and by extension inevitable devaluation.
That money has to go somewhere to avoid being eaten by the very inflation it created, holding onto a resource that can be infinitely replicated, like currency in our present system, is a guaranteed loss.
The goal of fiat fueled VC bubbles is never to generate immediate, honest profits from selling a product to consumers, the goal is asset inflation and capital preservation.
The system is not broken, it is in fact working exactly as intended.
I wouldn't blame fiat at all. It's an issue of governance, classes and growing poverty. Capital has been shrinking labour's share, year on year. Your inability to afford a nominal price has nothing to do with fiat. The capitalist class have just grown more brazen and they've realised no one will say "no".
If you want to quip about AI being mentioned in the above article do note that labour's share of GDP had been on the decline before 'AI' was a twinkle in your father's eye. It's been a set trend, with politician's endlessly arguing with the working class: you'll get your share soon(tm), but not now. It never came and it never will. The political promises are the same, but they increasingly sound ever hollower.
It's just more capitalists doing what capitalists do.
Because a cutting edge semiconductor fab takes about $10 billion and 3-5 years to build. So when they made the plans in 2020 based on anticipated demand in 2023-2025, they started the process for manufacturing memory that would be useful for DDR5 specs. Then big orders came in later, during the AI boom of 2023 onward, to claim the cutting edge fabs' 2025 production, to manufacture that very fast memory to be connected directly to logic chips rather than standalone memory packages/DIMMs.
In other industries, production would just pick up to meet the new demand, faster, to claim all that money sloshing around. But when the bottleneck is with something that takes 5-10 years to finance and plan, sudden increases in demand usually result in crazy price volatility.
See also the whiskey market of 2015-2025, where the production of whiskeys that required 12+ years of aging hit a bottleneck, because 2005 producers couldn't have predicted just how much 12-year-old whiskey people would want in 2017.
In preparation for the future, we need to come up with a way to connect HBM to DIMM and SODIMM modules, since we're going to have a bumper crop of the memory chips...
73 Comments
TheJesusaurus@piefed.ca · 122 pts · 68d
This has got to be what tulip mania felt like right? Like we all know this is going to end badly.
s38b35M5@lemmy.world · 53 pts · 68d
I learned something new today!
alternategait@lemmy.world · 25 pts · 68d
s38b35M5@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 68d
Totally! Now let's go make a soda bomb!
Strider@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 68d
We, as a whole however, learned nothing.
s38b35M5@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 67d
Truth
titter@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 67d
I see cale i say cake
Thanks for being on the Fediverse!
s38b35M5@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 67d
Woah! Look at that; 3yrs since Spez ruined the internet for me. Glad to be here.
Flower@sh.itjust.works · 14 pts · 68d
Except those tulips were a plaything for the rich and the fallout was contained to the rich, and with AI the fallout is going to be put on everybody else.
MalReynolds@slrpnk.net · 1 pts · 68d
Doesn't have to be, likely will (USians with retirement funds might like to move them from NASDAQ vulnerable positions).
Rothe@piefed.social · 2 pts · 68d
At least they still had some nice tulips in the end. All we get is shitty AI infecting everything.
TheJesusaurus@piefed.ca · 1 pts · 68d
They kinda didn't, cause it was the bulbs that were expensive, if you planted the tulip you lost your investment.
NM_Gringo@lemmy.world · 73 pts · 68d
When you say it like that AI sounds like one big scam.
TheFriendlyDickhead@feddit.org · 26 pts · 68d
š®
Aneb@lemmy.world · 20 pts · 68d
Kirk@startrek.website · 55 pts · 68d
s38b35M5@lemmy.world · 38 pts · 68d
I think Louis Rossmann said it right: https://youtu.be/WpPIW4aeeag?t=699
tl;dw: "Fuck you!" ..."You have them for Sam Altman, just not for me."
brem@lemmy.world · 34 pts · 68d
DDR3 still works just fine
Been running that shit since 2009
Slots open still, 4 to go
32 gigs and I can buy mo'
mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works · 23 pts · 68d
Since DDR4 is relatively reasonable in price, production of AM4 CPU's and motherboards are starting back up to make use of it.
TBH, I'm for it. I'm still on that generation of hardware and it still works great
PattyMcB@lemmy.world · 13 pts · 68d
The problem is organic demand is going up for older gen hardware and that will drive THOSE prices up.
brem@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 68d
That's why we only talk about this on posts that don't get scraped by LLM
x264@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 68d
You need to be really optimistic to assume that this post isn't going to be scraped
brem@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
Does it count if I know for a fact that I've already been scraped??
I didn't mind when it was just tiny pieces that I recognized. It feels like deju-vu at first.. memes, phrases. You find out well before it goes public and chalk it up to "bots". Eventually, it gets a bit too coincidental.
...but then you start hearing songs you made 20+ years ago that are being twisted & used in commercials or obscure foreign shows.
mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 68d
brem@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 68d
If I can play Kingdom Come Deliverance II using DDR3 (and a gforce 1660 ti) running on Ultra, I don't understand why I need to replace my entire motherboard for clout or whatever.
melfie@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 68d
I also tend to gauge hardware by how well it runs this one particular game. š Iāll upgrade if necessary KCD 3 comes out, I guess.
MalReynolds@slrpnk.net · 2 pts · 68d
B550 at best new (likely old stock), decent chipsets are second hand only. Makes me nervous.
mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 68d
AMD literally spent a bunch of development on reworking the 5800X3D for a different manufacturing process. It's new production.
Dojan@pawb.social · 5 pts · 68d
I built an AM5 system because I wanted to ensure that if I want to upgrade it, I won't have to buy an entirely new motherboard. Coming from Intel who change their socket every two weeks, I thought it was a great idea at the time.
The cost wasn't prohibitive, the kinks ironed out quite fast. But I don't like DDR5 RAM. Like, it's RAM, I don't notice anything spectacular about it. What I do notice, is that it takes FUCKING AGES to post!
It's taking 21 fucking seconds to do some kind of "memory training!" It used to be over 40 seconds! For what? No noticeable difference in user experience other than it taking forever to boot.
brem@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
This makes me really sad & concerned for the future of modern computation.
It's obviously planned obsolescence for the sake of suppression pertaining to the masses.
Dojan@pawb.social · 2 pts · 68d
That was always the case. This PC replaced my 1150 socket intel PC, which had new CPUs made for it from Q3 2013 to Q3 2014. AMD at least keeps their sockets usable for a couple of years before they change them.
1150 was superceded by 1151. Those are the number of pins on the header by the way, so they had to add one extra pin because it was obviously stifling innovation.
brem@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
The last time I upgraded my CPU was at least 8 years before I upgraded my GPU which was about 5 years ago..lol
You're right, my socket allowed me to get a much better model.
I know about pins and sockets, btw. But for the other readers, thanks for explaining ;)
Dojan@pawb.social · 3 pts · 68d
Aye, figured it was worth noting that they obsoleted it because they absolutely had to cram in that one extra pin! You can't convince me that they didn't do that just to fuck with people.
brem@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
Planned obsolescence
Corporate essence
The end game is your wallets bane
Bring me to life, so says Evanescence
brem@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 68d
Please do a Nathan Fielder reference
To me, he is Spielberg in his best essence
Miracle on the Mojave, I hold in great reverence
Donnie Darko is a story about seeing the future & doing the right thing, Donald Trump.
Chaf@slrpnk.net · 2 pts · 68d
Exactly! Just upgraded to 12 gigs of DDR3 this year. Still have my i5 750 for gaming, just had to upgrade the GPU, but even that was almost 10 years ago. And it runs all the games that are worth playing.
brem@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
High fruckin' five, friendo!
DDR3 club unite!
bridgeenjoyer@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 68d
Ddr3 and an an fx 8350 here! Runs great considering its 13 years old
brem@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
For sure!
Especially when you strip the OS down on a custom Windows OS & a few fun Linux flavours.
Lots of fans in all directions for way too many hdds, add some custom bolt stilts to the bottom of the case so it can breathe from below.
Clean the fans and filters every month because you smoke too much!!!
And be sure to remind people that we deserve the full epstein list (as a free & true democracy)
Romkslrqusz@lemmy.zip · 22 pts · 68d
Bit ironic that the image is generative AI slop
ā¦ or is it?
TacticalToothbrush@discuss.tchncs.de · 20 pts · 68d
I am quite positive that it is AI gen.
gdog05@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 68d
The smooth focus effect on the heatsink made me think it was stock photography but tineye can't find it beyond February so it could easily be generated.
DarkSirrush@piefed.ca · 4 pts · 68d
Aren't the ram slots also straight up placed wrong in the motherboard? I have never seen ram on a diagonal from the CPU before, or running parallel to the pcie slots, even on weird prebuilts.
TheFriendlyDickhead@feddit.org · 1 pts · 68d
Oh I think they actually are wrong. Didn't even notice that before.
Romkslrqusz@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 68d
Oh, definitely. I was questioning whether or not the irony was actually deliberate, illustrating the end result of the fake money ouroboros
All kinds of weird going on with how the right hand is āholdingā that module (while pinching another one behind it?)
Memory module is symmetrical.
No motherboard Iāve ever seen would have DIMM slots parallel to PCI slots, let alone that far from the CPU socket
Have a look at what would normally be the 24-Pin ATX connector - fewer pins, which is not unheard of in some proprietary cases, but the connector itself looks weird and garbled.
ccunning@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 68d
Ironic? Or GenAI?
Romkslrqusz@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 68d
Ironic - itās clearly GenAI
The question is whether or not itād deliberately ironic, the hallucination machine canāt even properly hallucinate PC Hardware despite heaps of training data.
WagnasT@piefed.world · 2 pts · 68d
vsauce music intensifies
sundray@lemmus.org · 3 pts · 68d
HBomberguy rips through the background
"I tricked you! This post is actually about professional wrestling!"
Buddahriffic@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 68d
The real reason is that the people running those AIs that they put so much money into to get where they currently are are well aware that people can just run their own models locally and cut them out of the picture entirely so they are attempting to monopolize the hardware needed to run it under the guise of getting ready to expand into the future.
Though the storage I think is more about wanting to keep a log of each interaction with their model for training and other ways to profiting from it (openly or covertly).
Like the whole "ai output isn't copyrightable" benefits them because they can just straight up use whatever output their models generate and it will be perfectly legal.
phx@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 68d
Not just AI. Many of these companies are also very entrenched in Cloud Services and have pushed cloud/subscription only models as a perpetual source of income.
By manipulating the supply chain to push up the prices of hardware, it's similar to how buying up the housing market allows incumbents to squeeze out competitors and ensure that they control how much "rent" people have to pay
heartSagan5@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 68d
Yup. I sometimes suspect the āhigher electric billā (near datacenters) is to force people to use cloud services, rather than a private cloud method.
6_Electrons@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
as an electrical engineer who consults for utilities and worked directly for them for about 10 years I can tell you this isn't directly the case... meaning they didn't raise rates to force you to use cloud services.
Now what might have happened realistically is the data center is using so much electricity, the utility doesn't have that kind of capacity available so they have to raise rates to mitigate the difference in energy usage and to also raise revenue to build more infrastructure.
heartSagan5@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 67d
Sure, but if the rates are up, you likely wonāt run a private cloud setup because financially and administratively, itās much.
AccoSpoot1@lemmy.world · 16 pts · 68d
Reminds me of the Ankh Morpork Pork Futures Warehouse.
https://wiki.lspace.org/Pork_Futures_Warehouse
Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works · 15 pts · 68d
... by doing things that are impossible.
HAL_9_TRILLION@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 14 pts · 68d
It's irrational because this is being driven by billionaire techbros who think AI will bring them immortality.
mnfalconia_a2gc@retrolemmy.com · 7 pts · 68d
I've said it before and I'll say it again: the rich and powerful seeking immortality is nothing new.
chocrates@piefed.world · 12 pts · 68d
How is it these days? I really need to build a nas and haven't checked prices in a few months.
PattyMcB@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 68d
Still horrible
testaccount789@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 68d
Decided to check the Synology RAM just for fun. I think they were quite overpriced even before.
Anyway, 16GB DDR4 Synology stick is EUR 1,409. What makes it EUR 88/GB?
crimson_iris@piefed.social · 2 pts · 68d
Remember when Synology decided to make their NASs incompatible with any hard drive not from Synology?
MalReynolds@slrpnk.net · 3 pts · 68d
Same as always, best time was last year, next best is now. Consider LTO5 tape backups.
lennee@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 68d
well they are mathematically possible just not necessarily economically feasible
rumba@lemmy.zip · 5 pts · 68d
TBF, step 1 was to take a shit ton of equity and purchase the small house sized machinery to make the memory stacks that will never be used....
TheFrirish@tarte.nuage-libre.fr · 5 pts · 68d
Damn this just describes capitalism 101
Aneorthisio@lemmy.ml · 4 pts · 67d
When you zoom out and look at the bigger picture, this is just the latest instance of ever expanding credit being converted into assets, just like housing, and reflected in everything down to groceries.
The structural problem lies in the very fact that we have, since 1971 and the end of the Bretton Woods system, fiat currencies backed by nothing tangible or physical, allowing for limitless expansion and by extension inevitable devaluation.
That money has to go somewhere to avoid being eaten by the very inflation it created, holding onto a resource that can be infinitely replicated, like currency in our present system, is a guaranteed loss.
The goal of fiat fueled VC bubbles is never to generate immediate, honest profits from selling a product to consumers, the goal is asset inflation and capital preservation.
The system is not broken, it is in fact working exactly as intended.
dropdrip@lemmy.ml · 11 pts · 67d
I wouldn't blame fiat at all. It's an issue of governance, classes and growing poverty. Capital has been shrinking labour's share, year on year. Your inability to afford a nominal price has nothing to do with fiat. The capitalist class have just grown more brazen and they've realised no one will say "no".
https://fortune.com/2026/01/13/us-workers-smallest-labor-share-gdp-on-record/
If you want to quip about AI being mentioned in the above article do note that labour's share of GDP had been on the decline before 'AI' was a twinkle in your father's eye. It's been a set trend, with politician's endlessly arguing with the working class: you'll get your share soon(tm), but not now. It never came and it never will. The political promises are the same, but they increasingly sound ever hollower.
It's just more capitalists doing what capitalists do.
cattywampus@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 67d
TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 68d
Like the subprime housing bubble.
brokenwing@discuss.tchncs.de · 2 pts · 68d
Tenet guys Tenet. Reverse Entropy.
nuko147@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 68d
Why don't they do this for every product I wonder.
GamingChairModel@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 66d
Because a cutting edge semiconductor fab takes about $10 billion and 3-5 years to build. So when they made the plans in 2020 based on anticipated demand in 2023-2025, they started the process for manufacturing memory that would be useful for DDR5 specs. Then big orders came in later, during the AI boom of 2023 onward, to claim the cutting edge fabs' 2025 production, to manufacture that very fast memory to be connected directly to logic chips rather than standalone memory packages/DIMMs.
In other industries, production would just pick up to meet the new demand, faster, to claim all that money sloshing around. But when the bottleneck is with something that takes 5-10 years to finance and plan, sudden increases in demand usually result in crazy price volatility.
See also the whiskey market of 2015-2025, where the production of whiskeys that required 12+ years of aging hit a bottleneck, because 2005 producers couldn't have predicted just how much 12-year-old whiskey people would want in 2017.
DarkSirrush@piefed.ca · 1 pts · 68d
HappyZed30@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 67d
Its really good to learn something new everyday. Now i know why.
cattywampus@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 67d
Blaster_M@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 68d
In preparation for the future, we need to come up with a way to connect HBM to DIMM and SODIMM modules, since we're going to have a bumper crop of the memory chips...
IPeaceInYourFace@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 67d
Nobody is stopping us from pooling our money together to do the same thing. Once capital coagulates, then we can use it speculate and leverage it.
The only problem is, nobody can be bothered.