Americans seem allergic to showing a simple single payable amount that the customer pays. It must be exhausting. It must be like trying to book RyanAir tickets, but with everything.
It is exhausting. It would be nice to live somewhere with consumer protections, but shockingly those places aren't particularly enthusiastic about taking immigrants from the US
You're really primed to expect to pay so much more than the asking price for literally every transaction. It's fucking awful. Tax. Tip. "Estimated totals" convenience fees. Fuck you fees. Fees for the bees. You got too many fees fees. Subscription fee. "That was the price if you subscribe, it costs more if you don't" fee.
Sadly nor would I but they may have to take them by gov regulation as this would be insane that you had to pay a fee to pay a fee. It counter intuitive from a normal mindset, not the mindset of a gouging insurance company. Make perfect sense to those idiot, lol
Read the image. They charge a higher premium if you don't use their auto pay.
The only way I can see around it is if you make annual payments instead of monthly. Fewer payments, less fees.
If we're feeling petty, though, we can accept the higher premium, and send them weekly (or even daily) check payments instead of monthly. Let them process 30 transactions per month instead of just one.
Yup! The bakery where I buy my coffee on occasion has their menus listed with two prices.. The card prices are 4% higher. So an item that is priced at 7 bucks cash is listed as $7.28 for card.
Makes me so glad that I have never signed up for a card.
It's exactly what my father does for places. He can't stand these fees and if whatever service he is paying has them then a check will be sent. He says it's what hes uses to anyway since that is how he had done it most of his life.
I love that mentaility and wish I could do the same, but sadly I just want it to be known its paid right away and also since i live paycheck to paycheck waiting weeks on end for random checks to be cashed will be impossible for me to not accidentally use some of that money elsewhere.
Lots of banks will send a check on your behalf. It withdraws the money that day so you can predict it rather than when the business cashes it. And you have proof the money was sent and your bank/credit Union has a stake in the fight if the business gets shay about it.
Allstate has, by far, the worst customer service I've ever experienced from a car insurance company. I personally will not willingly do business with them ever again.
BEWARE
Every time I called, it felt like I was on trial. It was like they were interrogating me, picking into every little detail, looking for ways to prove I owe them more money. At one point, they threatened to increase my rates because I have a parent living with me at the same address. A parent who has no license and is not physically able to get to the car without my help. They forced me to submit documentation to prove all this under threat of having to pay more for my insurance.
When I was looking at renewal, they sent me a quote that was an order of magnitude larger than what any other insurer quoted me. I ended my policy on the spot, and then had to fight to get a prorated refund from them for the remainder of my policy term. They still tried to charge me for the new policy, despite having cancelled.
And that's not all, that's just some of the "highlights".
Good luck to you OP! May the suffering you are about to endure cleanse the karmic debts of your past lives.
My wife worked in Insurance for a while. The companies tend to follow two two business models:
Advertise like crazy to get new business in. Then refuse to payout claims and pay substandard rates. Lose customers as quickly as you gain them. Mitigate these losses by having 100's of brand names/shell companies to mask your activities.
Do minimal advertising and rely on word of mouth and sales distribution network. Pay out fairly and give decent customer service.
Generally any company that you recognize the name from advertising is going to fuck you over. Most of the other company names you've never heard of are the same companies trying to fuck you over.
The common theme is that they all want to fuck you over, because they get more money that way, and there are no negative consequences. Nobody actually wants to do honest business any more.
That's customer service for ALL companies. Nothing works any more. Just saying you have a customer service department is enough, it doesn't actually have to be effective. Most of them are just AI chatbots with canned answers. Many of them start with "I'm still learning, so be patient with me!" in a cheery voice. Bitch, I got a problem with your company, I don't want an unfinished computer program, I need HELP!
..That's customer service for ALL companies. Nothing works any more..
The insurance company that we use for our cars is delightful to deal with. I haven't even had to wait long, just leave a call back number and get a response within 15 minutes. Then again, it's a regional insurer, (Maine, NH and MAssachusetts) not a national one.
Funny as hell, as I just got a bulk mailer for Progressive Auto insurance and it was offering me coverage as low as 67 dollars a month for a basic liability policy.. For one car.
::sighs:: My dear, sweet dudes at Progressive.. I pay 740 bucks a year.. for TWO cars.
I once had to pay a fee for using PayPal. I read through paypal's terms of service for vendors and it said they can't do that. I complained to paypal and they gave me 5ā¬. The vendor continued to charge a fee for using paypal.
I surmised the vendor was bringing in enough profit for paypal to not penalize them and they just gave me five bucks to shut me up. Adventures in the world of capitalism I guess.
glad to see that visa fees are being disclosed now. for a long time visa wouldn't allow vendors to show the fees, and cash transactions had to cost the same as visa transactions.
No they weren't allowed to charge a fee before. They had to build it into the cost of doing business like every other thing that goes into the price. Visa isn't "allowing" them to SHOW the fee, they're being forced to allow the fee (surcharge) to be added on because of bills the feds passed.
I guarantee this isn't working out in your favor. That's why these businesses fought so hard to have the fee. Visa and MasterCard wanted merchants to not do this because it makes credit cards less attractive if places charge fees. The thing I'm particularly skeptical about is how much they charge. The fees are like 2 to 3 percent. Checks and debit cards are flat like a few cent fees. Allstate charging 5 dollars for debit or 2 dollars for bank transfers is fucking insane.
It does work out in my favor if I pay cash. Which I'm in favor of, though these days you have to carry a lot of it. This way cash customers don't help pay the fees of credit customers.
Thing is, no one is doing that for online services. They're just charging fees to make extra money. The number of people paying cash is so small in general and most of us aren't doing that so all that really happens is the raise prices in the usual sneaky fuck you way they do where you don't know up front what things will cost. It's ridiculous honestly.
Also, never, under any circumstances, allow a company to automatically withdraw funds directly from your bank account.
"Ope, we've changed the terms of service, and charged you a backdated amount based on the new terms of service you've already consented to by paying us"
They don't get a dime until I know for damn sure I'm giving it to them. If an organization refuses to do business with you without direct access to your bank account, it's because their business model depends on them being able to fuck you.
Credit cards and physical paper checks only for recurring transactions. Amex if they'll take it. Don't let them keep your debit card on file either.
It is so strange and incredible reading americans having issues with auto payments. But I presume you do not have anything like Direct Debit, and the protections that some with that, like having to notify you well in advance of payment changes, or if the wrong amount is taken you get it back.
I submit a payment manually through my bank. Every month. Paying all of my bills this way takes about 5 minutes, once a month. At some point you have to ask yourself how much you've given up for the illusion of convenience.
There must be a way to pay without fee. It might be more work for you, but it's definitely more work for them, hence the "convenience" aspect of the fee.
In the US, some citizens go to physical locations to pay fines in coins. Hundreds of dollars in coins is very inconvenient to the establishment but they have to legally accept it. Sends a clear message to them that they suck ass.
For insurance your bill is typically for the next month instead of the previous month like utilities. At that point it's not a debt, so they can refuse whatever payment method they want.
Similar to how stores can refuse bills over $20 or refuse a bucket of pennies.
Now that they gotten us to accept a fee, sooner or later they'll jack up the fee. It's only $2 now, but in a few years, it will be $5, and then $10, and you better pay it if you want your lights to stay on.
And politicians will help them do it by passing a law that the fee can't by larger than the actual payment, or some helpful horseshit like that.
History lesson: in 1990 I worked at a computer store. If you paid by credit card you paid the listed price. If you paid with cash, you got the CASH DISCOUNT price.
Soon MasterCard and VISA went to court to prevent the cash discount practice.
Soon after, points and cash-back credit cards came out
Yeah, we really need laws defending the right to get discounts for low fee payment methods. I should pay less for using my debit card than someone using a credit card that charges a fee to the seller (which is passed on to all customers) that's high enough to give them back 1+% of what they spend. And a further discount for cash
It's so messed up that some states legally allow merchants to charge a "credit card fee". Providers of services much like the above can charge if it's a debit, credit, etc. even if they both say "Visa" on them. The concept of money in the US is so obfuscated now.
That's because every credit card swipe carries a fee of about 2.75%, and that comes out of company profit, so they are recouping that fee. They want you to pay for the processing fee, not them.
As near as I can tell, it's still free to send them a paper check, and that has to be the most expensive form of processing, and the least convenient for them, so send a check, and really piss them off.
Yeah, I'd much rather however they just be allowed to push the exact fee onto the customer. Because it isn't consistent. Higher reward cards carry higher fees while debit cards are much cheaper (0.73% average).
That said, I do think there needs to be a reasonably accessible payment option with no fees added. This will usually be cash, but sometimes debit, check, or ebt
I hope this BS leads to competition with Visa/MC. The fees they charge are ridiculous. Then you're paying for stripe or whatever on top. A govt run system that's not for profit would be awesome.
We did have something resembling competition, maybe a decade or so ago, with the emergence of Venmo and Cashapp and Zelle - basically just digital front-ends for e-checks between bank accounts. They all hit major stumbling blocks, in no small part thanks to how Visa/AMEX/MC conspired to freeze them out.
Allstate is a horrible insurance company. I was hit by someone running a red light who had Allstate, and the way they handled their insured party's non-cooperation was terrible. Both my dashcam and a police camera recorded the collision. They called the driver but got cursed out and hung up on. I don't think they tried anything else before denying the claim.
My Allstate account doesn't do that. There are no payment option fees. Is there something odd about your account? Have you had missed payments or insufficient funds when paying?
The auto-pay discount for AT&T also was cut in half unless you add a bank, not a credt/debit card, and I'm an inch away from just turning off the cards and telling them all to stuff it sideways sans lube.
what's stopping you from mailing a paper check? frontiersmen had no convenience but they made due. my great-great-great grandmother fought bears in utah with her bare hands to protect the family homestead.
The fee isnāt for the payment method, itās for āfinancingā the cost of the policy over six months. Iām sure that there is no fee if you pay in full.
I've personally never seen in my own policies any kind of financing when paying monthly. It's always been policy total / 6 = monthly payment. Then there is a modest (and yes, mildly infuriating) fee per payment. When I said the fee was the cost of financing, I didn't mean it literally was that, but more of an "effective" cost of financing. I'd love to see someone's policy that has a financing increase line item.
I say this with all respect; can we not use Gemini or other AI agents as "evidence." I see your other post, and I'm not disputing your point. My own policy offers a $20 discount when paying in full (on top of avoiding monthly per-payment fees, which are $4 per payment.)
Gargle that corporate knob harder, man. Hope it tastes good.
Fees for processing payments used to be considered āa cost of doing businessā. Now theyāre being passed onto the consumer as the price of convenience and another profit vector for an already predatory industry.
Because thereās no way a real human with a real job can have these feelings, unless they were the biggest fascist pussy bootlicker the sewers have ever vomited out onto the pavement
Such a fee is absolutely normal, adequate, and simply human.
Interesting take, but also not accurate. ACH / direct bank connection costs merchants a fraction of a cent to use. Additionally even bank cards that are more expensive likely donāt exceed $1 in fees for such a transaction.
The merchant in this case is likely taking in more money than necessary to cover transaction costs i.e. they are making money on you paying them money (which is not normal, nor adequate).
Charging a fee to accept payment is ridiculous. If a cost is unavoidable then it should be included in the price.
I accept that some payment providers charge more than others but there should be at least one that is free even if that means adding the cost of the cheapest one to the base price.
Ideally they would all be free and youād just add the average cost of payment processing to the price.
There was a time in the UK when you could get a flight from Manchester to London for Ā£8 but the final price ended up being ten times that due to additional costs that werenāt optional.
If there's an unavoidable fee for processing, it needs to be included in the initially advertised price of whatever you're purchasing. In this case, the price should have been set $2 higher and the bank account fee should be $0. Otherwise it is just false advertising, since you cannot actually receive the service for the initially advertised price.
Why should I have to pay a fee for YOU to take my money? Do you not want my money?
I want to pay for services rendered at an agreed upon price. If you want my money for those services, then it's on you to pay those fees. End of story.
112 Comments
blackn1ght@feddit.uk · 131 pts · 4d
Americans seem allergic to showing a simple single payable amount that the customer pays. It must be exhausting. It must be like trying to book RyanAir tickets, but with everything.
CombatWombat@feddit.online · 56 pts · 4d
It is exhausting. It would be nice to live somewhere with consumer protections, but shockingly those places aren't particularly enthusiastic about taking immigrants from the US
apftwb@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 4d
Cannot be done. We are a special and unique country.
BreakerSwitch@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 4d
There WERE laws against this sort of thing. Briefly.
Sackett@thelemmy.club · 21 pts · 4d
Congress has more important things to worry about. Like who can join which basketball team.
Malyca@lemmy.zip · 8 pts · 4d
It's exactly like that
glasratz@feddit.org · 1 pts · 20h
That's the "free" market for you. God forbid that the consumer can make an informed decision on where to buy.
SippyCup@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
It is!
You're really primed to expect to pay so much more than the asking price for literally every transaction. It's fucking awful. Tax. Tip. "Estimated totals" convenience fees. Fuck you fees. Fees for the bees. You got too many fees fees. Subscription fee. "That was the price if you subscribe, it costs more if you don't" fee.
I fucking hate this place
TIEPilot@lemmy.world · 92 pts · 4d
I would send a check, its more work for them in the end.
cattywampas@lemmy.world · 46 pts · 4d
I wouldn't be surprised if they don't accept checks.
TIEPilot@lemmy.world · 22 pts · 4d
Sadly nor would I but they may have to take them by gov regulation as this would be insane that you had to pay a fee to pay a fee. It counter intuitive from a normal mindset, not the mindset of a gouging insurance company. Make perfect sense to those idiot, lol
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 4d
š¤£
cannedtuna@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 4d
If they donāt accept checks (because they can bounce) they should have to take a money order.
TIEPilot@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 4d
I don't think the possibility of a check bouncing is a reason not to accept them as its been the primary way we pay bills for over 100 years.
But money order should be ok but they have a fee too.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 4 pts · 4d
Didnāt this admin literally get rid of the āno extra feesā regulation?
PalmTreeIsBestTree@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 3d
Like that shit is enforced anymore LMAO
Rivalarrival@lemmy.today · 6 pts · 4d
Read the image. They charge a higher premium if you don't use their auto pay.
The only way I can see around it is if you make annual payments instead of monthly. Fewer payments, less fees.
If we're feeling petty, though, we can accept the higher premium, and send them weekly (or even daily) check payments instead of monthly. Let them process 30 transactions per month instead of just one.
Death__BySnuSnu@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 4d
Show up with a dump truck full of pennies.
Onomatopoeia@lemmy.cafe · 15 pts · 4d
Best part is all these payment methods, including checks incur the same processing fees since 2006 with the Check21 regulations.
This made all transactions - debit card, check, transfer, function the same way through the same processing.
So a check genuinely costs them more - from not charging thebfee, to requiring at least some manual oversight.
TIEPilot@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 4d
Oh I didn't know that, checks it is! Fuck these bozo's right!?!
boonhet@sopuli.xyz · 1 pts · 3d
Is that true in the US? Where I come from, card payments have a fee that the merchant has to pay, but bank transfers are free and instant.
foodandart@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 3d
Yup! The bakery where I buy my coffee on occasion has their menus listed with two prices.. The card prices are 4% higher. So an item that is priced at 7 bucks cash is listed as $7.28 for card.
Makes me so glad that I have never signed up for a card.
Over 60 with NO credit rating.. delightful.
HeyJoe@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 4d
It's exactly what my father does for places. He can't stand these fees and if whatever service he is paying has them then a check will be sent. He says it's what hes uses to anyway since that is how he had done it most of his life.
I love that mentaility and wish I could do the same, but sadly I just want it to be known its paid right away and also since i live paycheck to paycheck waiting weeks on end for random checks to be cashed will be impossible for me to not accidentally use some of that money elsewhere.
TIEPilot@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 4d
And for 99.999% of utilities/etc there is no fee so paying online is great imo. But this is a BS money grab for the sake of being an easy money grab.
HeyJoe@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 4d
Sadly not my area. Electric is $1.50 and my water is $3.
feannag@sh.itjust.works · 5 pts · 4d
Lots of banks will send a check on your behalf. It withdraws the money that day so you can predict it rather than when the business cashes it. And you have proof the money was sent and your bank/credit Union has a stake in the fight if the business gets shay about it.
HeyJoe@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 4d
Thanks for the tip. I will look into this. Im sure my bank does a lot of things I know nothing about.
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de · 6 pts · 4d
Changing payment methods may result in a premium increase.
Fuck them. I would be switch companies. If they try to turn a buck on shit like this, you know they'll try to fuck you on a claim.
mojofrododojo@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
certified mail w/ tracking so you can prove it was done, but yeah
InvalidName2@lemmy.zip · 52 pts · 4d
Allstate has, by far, the worst customer service I've ever experienced from a car insurance company. I personally will not willingly do business with them ever again.
BEWARE
Every time I called, it felt like I was on trial. It was like they were interrogating me, picking into every little detail, looking for ways to prove I owe them more money. At one point, they threatened to increase my rates because I have a parent living with me at the same address. A parent who has no license and is not physically able to get to the car without my help. They forced me to submit documentation to prove all this under threat of having to pay more for my insurance.
When I was looking at renewal, they sent me a quote that was an order of magnitude larger than what any other insurer quoted me. I ended my policy on the spot, and then had to fight to get a prorated refund from them for the remainder of my policy term. They still tried to charge me for the new policy, despite having cancelled.
And that's not all, that's just some of the "highlights".
Good luck to you OP! May the suffering you are about to endure cleanse the karmic debts of your past lives.
LodeMike@lemmy.today · 15 pts · 4d
Exactly what I expect from a company that advertises so much
The_v@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 4d
My wife worked in Insurance for a while. The companies tend to follow two two business models:
Advertise like crazy to get new business in. Then refuse to payout claims and pay substandard rates. Lose customers as quickly as you gain them. Mitigate these losses by having 100's of brand names/shell companies to mask your activities.
Do minimal advertising and rely on word of mouth and sales distribution network. Pay out fairly and give decent customer service.
Generally any company that you recognize the name from advertising is going to fuck you over. Most of the other company names you've never heard of are the same companies trying to fuck you over.
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 4 pts · 3d
The common theme is that they all want to fuck you over, because they get more money that way, and there are no negative consequences. Nobody actually wants to do honest business any more.
foodandart@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 3d
Insurers have never been "honest business"..
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 5 pts · 3d
That's customer service for ALL companies. Nothing works any more. Just saying you have a customer service department is enough, it doesn't actually have to be effective. Most of them are just AI chatbots with canned answers. Many of them start with "I'm still learning, so be patient with me!" in a cheery voice. Bitch, I got a problem with your company, I don't want an unfinished computer program, I need HELP!
foodandart@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 3d
The insurance company that we use for our cars is delightful to deal with. I haven't even had to wait long, just leave a call back number and get a response within 15 minutes. Then again, it's a regional insurer, (Maine, NH and MAssachusetts) not a national one.
Funny as hell, as I just got a bulk mailer for Progressive Auto insurance and it was offering me coverage as low as 67 dollars a month for a basic liability policy.. For one car.
::sighs:: My dear, sweet dudes at Progressive.. I pay 740 bucks a year.. for TWO cars.
PieMePlenty@lemmy.world · 28 pts · 3d
I once had to pay a fee for using PayPal. I read through paypal's terms of service for vendors and it said they can't do that. I complained to paypal and they gave me 5ā¬. The vendor continued to charge a fee for using paypal.
I surmised the vendor was bringing in enough profit for paypal to not penalize them and they just gave me five bucks to shut me up. Adventures in the world of capitalism I guess.
llama@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 3d
Target won't let you checkout with PayPal if their margin on a specific sale is too low like their daily deals or whatever they're called.
pr06lefs@lemmy.ml · 27 pts · 4d
glad to see that visa fees are being disclosed now. for a long time visa wouldn't allow vendors to show the fees, and cash transactions had to cost the same as visa transactions.
dan1101@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 4d
It's like 3%, which I don't love but I like better than dealing with cash or checks.
webhead@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 3d
No they weren't allowed to charge a fee before. They had to build it into the cost of doing business like every other thing that goes into the price. Visa isn't "allowing" them to SHOW the fee, they're being forced to allow the fee (surcharge) to be added on because of bills the feds passed.
I guarantee this isn't working out in your favor. That's why these businesses fought so hard to have the fee. Visa and MasterCard wanted merchants to not do this because it makes credit cards less attractive if places charge fees. The thing I'm particularly skeptical about is how much they charge. The fees are like 2 to 3 percent. Checks and debit cards are flat like a few cent fees. Allstate charging 5 dollars for debit or 2 dollars for bank transfers is fucking insane.
pr06lefs@lemmy.ml · 1 pts · 3d
It does work out in my favor if I pay cash. Which I'm in favor of, though these days you have to carry a lot of it. This way cash customers don't help pay the fees of credit customers.
webhead@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
Thing is, no one is doing that for online services. They're just charging fees to make extra money. The number of people paying cash is so small in general and most of us aren't doing that so all that really happens is the raise prices in the usual sneaky fuck you way they do where you don't know up front what things will cost. It's ridiculous honestly.
SalmonTractor@discuss.tchncs.de · 24 pts · 4d
To directly quote a painted piece of wood in a pile of rubble on the side of the road after a big flood in Colorado in 2013: Fuck Allstate.
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 23 pts · 3d
Go back to sending them a check for every payment, like my 87 year old mother insists on doing. Make them work for it.
SippyCup@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 2d
Seriously, do this.
Also, never, under any circumstances, allow a company to automatically withdraw funds directly from your bank account.
"Ope, we've changed the terms of service, and charged you a backdated amount based on the new terms of service you've already consented to by paying us"
They don't get a dime until I know for damn sure I'm giving it to them. If an organization refuses to do business with you without direct access to your bank account, it's because their business model depends on them being able to fuck you.
Credit cards and physical paper checks only for recurring transactions. Amex if they'll take it. Don't let them keep your debit card on file either.
OrgunDonor@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 2d
It is so strange and incredible reading americans having issues with auto payments. But I presume you do not have anything like Direct Debit, and the protections that some with that, like having to notify you well in advance of payment changes, or if the wrong amount is taken you get it back.
https://www.directdebit.co.uk/direct-debit-guarantee/
You can also cancel it directly from your bank app as well, no messing around, its a simple 2 click process.
glasratz@feddit.org · 1 pts · 20h
What? And pay your utilities manually every month? At some point you have to ask yourself what the monetary value of your lifetime is.
SippyCup@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 5h
Correct.
I submit a payment manually through my bank. Every month. Paying all of my bills this way takes about 5 minutes, once a month. At some point you have to ask yourself how much you've given up for the illusion of convenience.
jaschen306@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 3d
I worked at a bank and our customers had to pay more money the more checks they brought in. Won't be surprised if they started charging for that too.
Soulphite@reddthat.com · 20 pts · 4d
There must be a way to pay without fee. It might be more work for you, but it's definitely more work for them, hence the "convenience" aspect of the fee.
In the US, some citizens go to physical locations to pay fines in coins. Hundreds of dollars in coins is very inconvenient to the establishment but they have to legally accept it. Sends a clear message to them that they suck ass.
kungen@feddit.nu · 8 pts · 4d
According to whom? As far as I'm aware, there's no such law in the US regarding private companies. So they can be jerks if they want to.
Serinus@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 4d
https://www.consumerfinance.gov/ask-cfpb/what-is-a-convenience-fee-or-pay-to-pay-fee-en-2126/
They can charge fees, as long as there is an alternate way to pay without a fee. Usually it's by check in the mail.
kungen@feddit.nu · 7 pts · 4d
Which is most likely defined in their terms.
Malyca@lemmy.zip · 4 pts · 4d
Who cares about laws if no one will enforce them? No consumer protection, no more watch dogs, it's all but legal now.
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 3d
MAGA views anything you can get away with as legal.
village604@adultswim.fan · 3 pts · 4d
For insurance your bill is typically for the next month instead of the previous month like utilities. At that point it's not a debt, so they can refuse whatever payment method they want.
Similar to how stores can refuse bills over $20 or refuse a bucket of pennies.
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 3d
Now that they gotten us to accept a fee, sooner or later they'll jack up the fee. It's only $2 now, but in a few years, it will be $5, and then $10, and you better pay it if you want your lights to stay on.
And politicians will help them do it by passing a law that the fee can't by larger than the actual payment, or some helpful horseshit like that.
MisterD@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 4d
History lesson: in 1990 I worked at a computer store. If you paid by credit card you paid the listed price. If you paid with cash, you got the CASH DISCOUNT price.
Soon MasterCard and VISA went to court to prevent the cash discount practice.
Soon after, points and cash-back credit cards came out
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 3 pts · 3d
There are several gas stations who offer a cash price that is about 10 cents a gallon cheaper than the credit card price.
MisterD@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 3d
Better hope the CC cartel does find out
captainlezbian@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 3d
Yeah, we really need laws defending the right to get discounts for low fee payment methods. I should pay less for using my debit card than someone using a credit card that charges a fee to the seller (which is passed on to all customers) that's high enough to give them back 1+% of what they spend. And a further discount for cash
tonyn@lemmy.ml · 4 pts · 4d
You can always mail a check, right? Isn't that still a thing?
SalmonTractor@discuss.tchncs.de · 2 pts · 4d
It's so messed up that some states legally allow merchants to charge a "credit card fee". Providers of services much like the above can charge if it's a debit, credit, etc. even if they both say "Visa" on them. The concept of money in the US is so obfuscated now.
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 3 pts · 3d
That's because every credit card swipe carries a fee of about 2.75%, and that comes out of company profit, so they are recouping that fee. They want you to pay for the processing fee, not them.
As near as I can tell, it's still free to send them a paper check, and that has to be the most expensive form of processing, and the least convenient for them, so send a check, and really piss them off.
captainlezbian@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 3d
Yeah, I'd much rather however they just be allowed to push the exact fee onto the customer. Because it isn't consistent. Higher reward cards carry higher fees while debit cards are much cheaper (0.73% average).
That said, I do think there needs to be a reasonably accessible payment option with no fees added. This will usually be cash, but sometimes debit, check, or ebt
Steve@startrek.website · 1 pts · 4d
You can mail a check but postage aint free
phar@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 4d
I hope this BS leads to competition with Visa/MC. The fees they charge are ridiculous. Then you're paying for stripe or whatever on top. A govt run system that's not for profit would be awesome.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 4d
We did have something resembling competition, maybe a decade or so ago, with the emergence of Venmo and Cashapp and Zelle - basically just digital front-ends for e-checks between bank accounts. They all hit major stumbling blocks, in no small part thanks to how Visa/AMEX/MC conspired to freeze them out.
Capitalism abhors competition.
Jackcooper@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 4d
Time to leave Allstate
Nollij@sopuli.xyz · 4 pts · 4d
The best time to leave Allstate was 20 years ago. The second best time is today.
Also applies to most insurance companies, particularly the ones that do a lot of advertising.
victorz@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 4d
Explain again how I'm saving on my premium? š¤
zewm@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 4d
Itās $2 vs $5 if you pay with bank.
$5 here is the premium price and $2 is the discounted price.
victorz@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 4d
Maybe I'm just confused by what the word "premium" means.
zewm@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 4d
Every time you make a payment you will be either
$2 with your bank $5 with other payment methods
Over a year this will result in the paying
$24 with your bank $60 with other payment methods
The increase to your premium over 1 year will be $36 by using a non bank method.
victorz@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 4d
Still doesn't explain what "premium" means. English isn't my first language. š
Don't worry about it, I'll look it up. š
zewm@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 4d
The premium is what you pay to the insurance company.
The monthly payment. Or some cases you pay by quarter, half or full year at a time.
eestileib@sh.itjust.works · 10 pts · 4d
Wow that's bullshit
COASTER1921@lemmy.ml · 8 pts · 3d
Allstate is a horrible insurance company. I was hit by someone running a red light who had Allstate, and the way they handled their insured party's non-cooperation was terrible. Both my dashcam and a police camera recorded the collision. They called the driver but got cursed out and hung up on. I don't think they tried anything else before denying the claim.
3abas@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 3d
All insurance companies are evil and will do everything they can to deny any claim.
Nightsoul@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 3d
Pretty sure is illegal to have a surcharge or convenience fee for ach/bank account transactions
RattlerSix@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 4d
My Allstate account doesn't do that. There are no payment option fees. Is there something odd about your account? Have you had missed payments or insufficient funds when paying?
SatansMaggotyCumFart@piefed.world · 3 pts · 4d
Hakuso@scribe.disroot.org · 3 pts · 4d
The auto-pay discount for AT&T also was cut in half unless you add a bank, not a credt/debit card, and I'm an inch away from just turning off the cards and telling them all to stuff it sideways sans lube.
CompactFlax@discuss.tchncs.de · 2 pts · 4d
LadyMeow@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 4d
So is Google pay?
Itās actually probably because Apple gets a cut, and so does the issuing card. In apples case, mastercard
LadyMeow@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 1 pts · 4d
So is Google pay?
Itās actually probably because Apple gets a cut, and so does the issuing card. In apples case, mastercard
whereitsat@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 3d
what's stopping you from mailing a paper check? frontiersmen had no convenience but they made due. my great-great-great grandmother fought bears in utah with her bare hands to protect the family homestead.
blitzen@lemmy.ca · -7 pts · 4d
The fee isnāt for the payment method, itās for āfinancingā the cost of the policy over six months. Iām sure that there is no fee if you pay in full.
K1nsey6@lemmy.world · 16 pts · 4d
Financing the bill is figured into the total amount. This is a processing fee
blitzen@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 4d
I've personally never seen in my own policies any kind of financing when paying monthly. It's always been policy total / 6 = monthly payment. Then there is a modest (and yes, mildly infuriating) fee per payment. When I said the fee was the cost of financing, I didn't mean it literally was that, but more of an "effective" cost of financing. I'd love to see someone's policy that has a financing increase line item.
K1nsey6@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 4d
Both my policies with Progressive and Allstate offer a pay in full discount. My total premium is different depending on which option I choose
blitzen@lemmy.ca · 6 pts · 4d
I say this with all respect; can we not use Gemini or other AI agents as "evidence." I see your other post, and I'm not disputing your point. My own policy offers a $20 discount when paying in full (on top of avoiding monthly per-payment fees, which are $4 per payment.)
K1nsey6@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 4d
Who do you use?
blitzen@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 4d
Progressive. And Iāve now set aside enough money to finally switch to pay in full on my next policy.
K1nsey6@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 4d
Progressive has always offered a pay in full discount. It's an amount that comes off the premium, not the transaction
K1nsey6@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 4d
TheGoldenV@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 4d
Incorrect. You donāt get the auto pay discount if you pay in full. Seriously.
blitzen@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 4d
That is indeed mildly infuriating. Do you get the discount AND avoid fees if you auto-pay in full?
TheGoldenV@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 4d
Nope. You can pay in full and not get the auto pay discount or you can auto pay and pay fees each time.
The auto pay and fees are slightly less costly than not getting the discount if you choose to pay in full.
Allstate are cunts.
artwork@lemmy.world · -91 pts · 4d
_chris@lemmy.world · 55 pts · 4d
Gargle that corporate knob harder, man. Hope it tastes good.
Fees for processing payments used to be considered āa cost of doing businessā. Now theyāre being passed onto the consumer as the price of convenience and another profit vector for an already predatory industry.
lIlIlIlIlIlIl@lemmy.world · 23 pts · 4d
This has to be copypasta.
Because thereās no way a real human with a real job can have these feelings, unless they were the biggest fascist pussy bootlicker the sewers have ever vomited out onto the pavement
TheGoldenV@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 4d
I just learned how to tag people. Iām going to use this as their descriptor now.
driving_crooner@lemmy.eco.br · 5 pts · 4d
Just bate
emergencyfood@sh.itjust.works · 11 pts · 4d
Domestic transactions in my country have zero fees. Because it's a fully computerised system. Because we live in the year 2026. Catch up.
LongMember69@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 4d
Interesting take, but also not accurate. ACH / direct bank connection costs merchants a fraction of a cent to use. Additionally even bank cards that are more expensive likely donāt exceed $1 in fees for such a transaction.
The merchant in this case is likely taking in more money than necessary to cover transaction costs i.e. they are making money on you paying them money (which is not normal, nor adequate).
nogooduser@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 4d
Charging a fee to accept payment is ridiculous. If a cost is unavoidable then it should be included in the price.
I accept that some payment providers charge more than others but there should be at least one that is free even if that means adding the cost of the cheapest one to the base price.
Ideally they would all be free and youād just add the average cost of payment processing to the price.
There was a time in the UK when you could get a flight from Manchester to London for Ā£8 but the final price ended up being ten times that due to additional costs that werenāt optional.
balsoft@lemmy.ml · 7 pts · 4d
If there's an unavoidable fee for processing, it needs to be included in the initially advertised price of whatever you're purchasing. In this case, the price should have been set $2 higher and the bank account fee should be $0. Otherwise it is just false advertising, since you cannot actually receive the service for the initially advertised price.
huppakee@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 4d
To be fair those are some serious fees, and usually the seller eats some of it.
thejml@sh.itjust.works · 6 pts · 4d
Why should I have to pay a fee for YOU to take my money? Do you not want my money?
I want to pay for services rendered at an agreed upon price. If you want my money for those services, then it's on you to pay those fees. End of story.
starlinguk@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 4d
I can usually pay in 5 different ways (including bank transfer) here in Germany and 0 of them cost anything.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 4d
Omg, it's That One Guy! Can't believe I found one in the wilds of Lemmy.
PissMissile@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 4d
People like you are responsible for the word "retard" making a comeback.