-
The ICE officer who fatally shot Renee Good in Minneapolis on Wednesday has been identified as Jonathan Ross. -
Ross is the same officer who was dragged 50 yards by a vehicle in June 2025. -
DHS has stressed the officer acted in self-defense.
ICE officer who fatally shot woman in Minneapolis identified
https://www.ktvu.com/news/ice-officer-minneapolis-shootig-identified
141 Comments
Fondots@lemmy.world · 168 pts · 223d
So what I'm hearing is that this moron didn't learn his lesson about fucking around with vehicles after he got hurt just a few months ago.
nublug@piefed.blahaj.zone · 169 pts · 223d
nah he does it on purpose to claim self defense when he does his premeditated murders.
Pat_Riot@lemmy.today · 116 pts · 223d
He's been looking for an excuse to shoot somebody
Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world · 21 pts · 223d
Has he considered his employer?
AbidanYre@lemmy.world · 24 pts · 223d
Or himself.
slothrop@lemmy.ca · 109 pts · 223d
Jonathan David Ross of Minneapolis.
essell@lemmy.world · -38 pts · 223d
Not the first time he's been in trouble.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Russell_Brand_Show_prank_calls
WindyRebel@lemmy.world · 19 pts · 223d
Not the same person at all.
hector@lemmy.today · 0 pts · 204d
You see, you are a fucking troll. Is this your alternate account from hexbear?
WindyRebel@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 204d
You’re a fucking dumbass. People were posting that link across these stories as if that was the same person. I merely called it out that it wasn’t.
🤷♂️
essell@lemmy.world · -18 pts · 223d
Tedesche@lemmy.world · 26 pts · 223d
Part of being a good comedian is understanding concepts like time, place, and audience. You clearly do not understand these things.
frongt@lemmy.zip · 16 pts · 223d
Much like Data.
slackassassin@piefed.social · 17 pts · 223d
True. But it's OK, you'll figure it out.
Zamboni_Driver@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 223d
What's the joke, can you explain it?
mriormro@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 223d
You're a dipshit.
kingofras@lemmy.world · 86 pts · 223d
Johnathan David Ross
Doxxed by his boss no less.
Source
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 36 pts · 223d
She did that on purpose. Now he has a target on his back, and if someone attacks him, MAGA can claim outrage. Just seeding the yard, see what grows.
Gates9@sh.itjust.works · 22 pts · 223d
It’s a mixed blessing to have such a brutal criminal regime staffed by complete morons and incompetent failures
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 13 pts · 223d
I've been saying this from the beginning: they will eventually be undone by their own virtuosic incompetence. Nobody does more self-owns than MAGA. Eventually it will be fatal. A "Give'em enough rope, and they'll hang themselves" kind of thing.
They've got enough rope, and the Dump Apes are trying to figure out how to tie a noose, but they'll get there eventually.
The problem is the damage they'll do along the way, so we have to do everything we can to speed up their downfall.
ChunkMcHorkle@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 223d
I think she just helped the cause, inasmuch as she just stuck a very public foot in their retention and recruiting.
Those ICE goons aren't the sharpest, but they understand pack law very well. They travel in packs, they work in packs, they spend their off-hours in the same hotels, they support each other in packs.
So this administration has gone hellbent to get them all to this point in order to eventually be able to declare martial law, and now that they're here, committing open murder in the street, this stupid bitch just proved to them that she does not have their backs.
She literally just offered him up to mounting public rage right after he committed murder for her.
I'm pretty certain his pack, which is comprised of all his fellow heavily armed high-impulse low-self-control antisocial thugs, some of them LEOs like Ross, will not fail to take note. They may find her rush to dox enraging and act out in unexpected ways. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out in the long term.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 223d
I deeply hope it blows up violently in their face
Johnmannesca@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 223d
Some sources are saying Jonathan E Ross now, it's like they are intentionally giving misleads (not you guys, you're awesome!)
Electricd@lemmybefree.net · 1 pts · 223d
madjo@feddit.nl · 82 pts · 223d
Let him feel unsafe for the rest of his natural born life.
xta@lemmy.world · 30 pts · 223d
I'd rather he be prosecuted to the full extend of the law and spent the rest of his days in jail, like not being a menace to society anymore.
humanoftheinternet@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 223d
What law?
itisileclerk@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 223d
That would be justice. Anything else is this.
TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 222d
Sorry to sound condescending, but the full faith on the law has already gone past in the US. Americans should prepare for a potential civil war.
silicon@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 223d
Someone should call one of the Mario brothers.
mrgoosmoos@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 223d
damn that'd be crazy if he could feel unsafe in the afterlife too
Pacattack57@lemmy.world · 79 pts · 223d
Mods removed it last time. Here it is. An actual picture of the guy from Facebook.
deHaga@feddit.uk · 9 pts · 223d
90s Microsoft sales guy vibes
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 223d
more like 2006 Florida condo time share salesman.
cozzy@futurology.today · 9 pts · 223d
what a fucking loser
TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today · 7 pts · 223d
Why do they always look like they volunteered to be hall monitors in highschool?
ViceroTempus@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 223d
Gotta start that Class Traitorism early.
cozzy@futurology.today · 4 pts · 223d
hey, no talking in the hall! stomps on neck
frog_brawler@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 223d
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works · 5 pts · 223d
Sure would be a shame if someone geolocated his house based on his social media image posts and published the address everywhere alongside the story about how he murdered a random lady (who was a natural born multi generational US citizen, though that part shouldn’t matter one bit).
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 223d
This confirms my opinion of hawaiian shirts.
ayyy@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 223d
But it’s the only bright colorful garment men are allowed to wear :(
Quill7513@slrpnk.net · 1 pts · 223d
on white men, specifically
NannerBanner@literature.cafe · -4 pts · 223d
Gee, I wonder how that works out?
AcidiclyBasicGlitch@sh.itjust.works · 75 pts · 223d
Same ice agent that got dragged while trying to forcefully break into a vehicle before huh? Hmm 🤔 perhaps that should be taken into consideration when determining if he was justified in unloading multiple bullets in the head of a woman who had just dropped her child off at school.
Or, here's a novel fucking idea: Perhaps if this motherfucker could STOP BEING AN OCCUPYING TERRORIST AND TRAITOR TO THE UNITED STATES he wouldn't have to worry about getting run over while he's terrorizing people for a fucking dictator.
Vance defending this shit is like Gaddafi trying to claim the dudes he paid to ride around on horses whipping protestors during the Arab Spring, were simply innocent victims who murdered people in self defense because they had become "fearful" of being pulled off their fucking horses.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works · 74 pts · 223d
If I’m recalling that incident correctly, he wasn’t “dragged”. Someone drove away, he grabbed the handle and didn’t let go. “Dragged” implies the victim did not have any control in the matter.
TheObviousSolution@lemmy.ca · 43 pts · 223d
He zapped the driver with a taser after breaking through the car window of the back door and was surprised the victim was no longer in control of a vehicle in movement, from what I'm reading. The court papers claim he was breaking the window to open the door, but if he was able to use the taser in that way he must have been already wielding it. It wouldn't surprise me if what actually happened was that the moron used the taser and that it caused the driver to compulse and press on the accelerator. It's not like he isn't gun-ho.
lando55@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 223d
You have a source for this? I'm interested to know if this individual is just really unlucky or if his reckless abandon truly knocks things into twelfth gear.
TheObviousSolution@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 223d
It's not that clear, the possibility is just what I pierced together from the facts mentioned in https://www.newsweek.com/jonathan-ross-ice-agent-shooting-minneapolis-minnesota-11332093
The article comes with the slant from the prosecutors, which seems to suggest he broke the window and then the driver started to accelerate, at which point during the struggle he used a taser that did strike the driver. However, if someone was struck by a taser I doubt they would be "weaving to shake him lose", they would be convulsing from the shock which would cause a similar effect, including possibly stepping on the accelerator. Considering how much they are lying about Renee Good, I'm not going to give the prosecution's slant much authority except for the core facts.
Like I said, it wouldn’t surprise me if what actually happened was that the moron used the taser and that it caused the driver to compulse and press on the accelerator. That would cause the driver to start convulsing and, regardless of the prosecution's claims, that would cause a lot of the behavior they accuse the driver of. Normally, one might assume that they've already dismissed this possibility, but the US is not living in normal times and under a working system of law.
The court records are probably the best source if you want to dig at it.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 223d
None of that is in the videos.
TheObviousSolution@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 223d
Videos? Searching, there is only one of that incident: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGWwKznwdXw
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 223d
He tried to grab the handle and it slipped out of his hand because doors autolock. He was never dragged, and if he keeps claiming that, he should be referred to as a drag queen.
Derpenheim@lemmy.zip · 68 pts · 223d
snausagesinablanket@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 223d
I did Nazi this coming.
AreaKode@lemmy.world · -16 pts · 223d
Violence is never the best option. But sometimes you get pushed far enough into a corner that it becomes the most likely.
Witchfire@lemmy.world · 96 pts · 223d
Historically, it's the only way to deal with Nazis
Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world · 26 pts · 223d
One time the nazi leader even demonstrated that on himself! Probably won't be that lucky today. Though it would be nice.....
newthrowaway20@lemmy.world · 20 pts · 223d
The only time you'd get Trump to put a gun in his mouth is if it was strapped to the crotch of a guy named Bubba.
finallymadeanaccount@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 223d
Or a five year old girl.
NannerBanner@literature.cafe · 3 pts · 223d
I don’t know (and I don’t want to know) if trump would ever even consider the art of cunnilingus. He seems the sort to want to be serviced as a god, not deign to care about the other party at all. The bubba thing would only be an initiation/hazing/forced blackmail event.
NannerBanner@literature.cafe · 0 pts · 223d
Wrong reply comment
Witchfire@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 223d
Don't lose hope! There's always a chance Shitler will follow through in the Epstein-Trump Friendship Bunker under the former site of the left wing
W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 38 pts · 223d
Th3D3k0y@lemmy.world · 26 pts · 223d
Violence should never be the FIRST answer.
MehBlah@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 223d
Its his.
Th3D3k0y@lemmy.world · 9 pts · 223d
Right, but I think we all agree that was the wrong first answer.
cheesybuddha@lemmy.world · 19 pts · 223d
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 16 pts · 223d
Since violence is never the best option, what was the best option to deal with the Nazis in Germany that would have resulted in them being removed from power?
Deceptichum@quokk.au · 3 pts · 223d
samus12345@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 223d
Eheran@lemmy.world · 14 pts · 223d
How can it never be the best option? Nonsense.
ScrambledEggs@lazysoci.al · 9 pts · 223d
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · 56 pts · 223d
I have a feeling mr. Ross may be a little afraid at the moment. As he should be.
sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz · 40 pts · 223d
Or it might kick off his own Rittenhouse celebrity tour. Conservatives are prone to hero worshipping this type
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 16 pts · 223d
The notoriety of Rittenhouse and George Zimmerman has not been kind to them, and will only be a anchor as they age. It's not a good club to be in.
sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz · 6 pts · 223d
Really? I haven't kept up on them. How's old shit-for-brains doing? Zimmerman, I mean. I'm not as curious about the killsburry dough boy
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today · 13 pts · 223d
Some domestic violence stuff, he tried selling some paintings but got shut down because he stole the designs, sold the murder gun, got banned from Twitter for revenge porn, tried to sue his victims family for $100 million, tried to sue Mayor Pete and Liz Warren, all dismissed immediately. He seems to have gone off the deep end. Hardly surprising.
Bonesince1997@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 223d
I wonder if that's the case for his lawyer, too?
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · 12 pts · 223d
Maybe we can annoy him every second of his existence. Play that Island Boy song repeatedly at loud volumes whenever spotted in public
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 223d
Gotta point really hard when the Bass/Chorus drops 👉☝️👈
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · -1 pts · 223d
ThunderWhiskers@lemmy.world · 49 pts · 223d
Would be a shame if somebody Doxxed his ass.
SARGE@startrek.website · 17 pts · 223d
Johnmannesca@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 223d
Well there are public records of him having a property loan somewhere, but I don't know if it's in the same state, there's history of him living near El Paso, TX at least a decade ago, so this is going to be a while before that can be deduced. Good idea though, I commend you for efforts to uphold the rule of law!
Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 223d
We have different definitions of "shame".
metallic_substance@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 223d
It's probably already happened
skaifer@lemmings.world · 47 pts · 223d
One is so traumatized and proceeds to step in front of a car in a heated situation. Don't make me laugh.
captainlezbian@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 223d
Also trying to act like we should be sympathetic to his trauma and understanding that he shot someone given what happened to him. Like fuck you no. Why in the goddamn hell did you put someone traumatized that badly back in the field‽ If he was this traumatized then he was clearly a danger to the public when he was reinstated
Fedizen@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 223d
If anything it means that this guy should be in jail and his manager should be as well for creating a public safety risk through negligence.
Hayduke@lemmy.world · 47 pts · 223d
His strategy finally paid off. He was able to justify to himself (no large feat) to shoot and kill someone. They will probably bring charges and dismiss them so a company court in the future can’t prosecute him. Speculation, naturally, but it wouldn’t surprise me.
frustrated_phagocytosis@fedia.io · 39 pts · 223d
If I were one of this woman's older kids, I'd want to look this prick in the face and make him answer for his actions. Even if it takes days of getting in his face, not letting him eat, shop, or work without my presence asking...why? Why are you still alive and she isn't? They'll outlive him, so they can ask him again and again until he dies. We know how hard it is to get restraining orders against actual threats, try getting one against a minor child whose mother you obliterated.
allriledup@piefed.blahaj.zone · 27 pts · 223d
WoodScientist@lemmy.world · 25 pts · 223d
There is not statute of limitations for murder in Minnesota, and state-level crimes cannot be pardoned by the president. They may not be able to prosecute him in the current political environment, but there is no end date when he can be tried for this murder.
allriledup@piefed.blahaj.zone · 9 pts · 223d
Johnmannesca@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 223d
Yeah, basically what I've gathered is nthat it's up to federal-level courts to determine his actions to be within reason, then the state charges can be issued. I fear this will go to the us supreme court, which regardless of outcome is a long time to let a murderer roam the streets terrorizing society.
Bullerfar@lemmy.world · 19 pts · 223d
I gues you didn't watch the press briefing.. JD Vance says they will take a look at the radical left, who is responsible for all the hate towards ice agents, and also says that the agent who did his duty deserves nothing but respect as all other ice agents who are doing a hell of a job. This administration is fucking insain.
allriledup@piefed.blahaj.zone · 14 pts · 223d
ChunkMcHorkle@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 223d
Right now the FBI is shutting out state law enforcement, but that does not prevent the state from charging him anyway, now or in the future. It may come down to the prosecutor bringing a case with the multiple videos and eyewitnesses, and making a bet that they don't need the actual gun or the other pieces of evidence the FBI has commandeered to make their case.
They have to be very careful how they go about it, but that option remains open forever, as others have pointed out. This murder will never NOT be hanging over that thug's worthless sociopathic head.
Red_October@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 223d
Yeah but state charges can't be pardoned by the president, so there's still a chance.
tired_n_bored@lemmy.world · 23 pts · 223d
Domestic terrorist
ViceroTempus@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 223d
Just going to point out that enough people start shooting them on sight, they can't prosecute us all. It will overwhelm the system. We hold real power but only if we are willing to use it, consequences be damned.
MiddleAgesModem@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 223d
What a stupid fucking suggestion. I'm just going to point out that on one should listen to this dumbass, because you will be prosecuted.
Let the keyboard warriors fight.
ViceroTempus@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 223d
Will you feel the same way when it's your wife shot? Will you feel the same way when it's you being hauled off to a concentration camp with horrors that has only been seen in history? How about your children and other loved ones? Will you be saying the same as they are trafficked by the pedophiles and rapists in charge?
Fedizen@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 223d
Conscripting all the posters to fight a war is the funniest idea.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 222d
I’m mean, you’re kind of right. If you shoot at the Gestapo the Nazi Regime will try to prosecute you.
Dumbass.
aquovie@lemmy.cafe · 2 pts · 223d
Yes.
LOL. Only if you're very very lucky.
MrSmith@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 223d
Why not?
winkerjadams@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 2 pts · 223d
We shoot them too?
SLVRDRGN@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 223d
They did a great job prosecuting all the Jan 6th mob..
MiddleAgesModem@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 223d
They prosecuted 1500 people, dumbass.
tocopherol@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 3 pts · 223d
That was in one location live broadcasted and watched by millions, and a lot of them didn't believe in masks. It's different when it's spread across the country and people actually try to hide.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 222d
FBI estimated 2000-2500 people were there so no, they did not catch them all.
Dumbass.
ViceroTempus@lemmy.world · -2 pts · 223d
Because we out number them millions to one. Even concentration camps aren't large enough to hold us. It's why WW2 Nazi's had to use gas chambers to keep clearing them out. And if we start thinning their numbers now they won't ever have enough manpower to get that far.
MrSmith@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 223d
Oh my god, stop watching Hollywood films and go outside. This is some absolute delulu talk.
ViceroTempus@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 223d
Naw I just pay attention to history and know that violence is the answer to our current pattern. Crack open a book.
MrSmith@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 223d
Lmao 21% of americans can't read. How about you guys start cracking more books open, and watch fewer superhero films.
ViceroTempus@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 223d
Alright well it seems you aren't capable of comprehending what you read, so it m not going to waste my time further with you.
MrSmith@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 223d
Good luck being the main character in your fantasy.
Fredthefishlord@lemmy.blahaj.zone · -6 pts · 223d
It pains me that so many of both liberals and leftists alike refuse to own guns
madjo@feddit.nl · 10 pts · 223d
Are you sure about that?
Fredthefishlord@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 0 pts · 222d
Yes.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 222d
You should go buy one then.
sturmblast@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 223d
Many of us have guns
Fedizen@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 223d
If anything shooting other people who aren't rich is exactly what the oligarchs want. It gives them an excuse to use more force and the people being killed are not the people orchestrating this.
Imo, if Luigi Mangioni scares these fucks more than any head of state on the planet, maybe that's the glowing neon sign to look at more closely.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 222d
They’re already using more force. Oh but maybe now they will stop ramping up the violence.
Fedizen@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 221d
They're going to do shit no matter what but how much of the public's consent they're doing it with is variable
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 0 pts · 223d
Maybe because they aren't scared of everything.
MiddleAgesModem@lemmy.world · -5 pts · 223d
Fuck you, I have no obligation to own a gun. Arrogant fucking gun nuts.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 222d
Dumbass.
ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net · 14 pts · 223d
That's 45 meters.
metallic_substance@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 223d
It's also about 98.4 Cubits (for folks time travelling from ancient Mesopotamia)
Echolynx@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 223d
The Sumerians will have a lot of catching up to do...
iamkindasomeone@feddit.org · 2 pts · 223d
New Record!
Yeet his fascist ass off the planet!
raynethackery@lemmy.world · 13 pts · 223d
So, he'll claim PTSD.
Johnmannesca@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 223d
Yet he's magnetized to car doors like a fucking moth to a lamp? Nobody will buy that shit. Even Bush (Yes, that Bush) said, "Fool me one time, shame on you, fool me two times shame on me." Implying that when the second time these things occur, even the utmost conservatives know this isn't someone fearful, just a complete fucking fool.
silvadinlabop@lemmy.cafe · 9 pts · 223d
I missed the vehicle dragging? What was that?
Depress_Mode@lemmy.world · 22 pts · 223d
An unrelated matter from months ago
Boiglenoight@lemmy.world · 44 pts · 223d
Sounds like he told himself if he’s ever in that situation again he’s going to blow the driver away. Then proceeded to seek out said situation.
notwhoyouthink@lemmy.zip · 24 pts · 223d
I thought the exact same thing when I read about his previous incident. If he wants to claim that he’s sensitive to vehicular injury because of what happened 6 months ago, that defense should be blown up by the fact that he approached her car and practically hopped on the hood to get aim at her with his gun. He leaned on the front of it while it was moving. Motherfucker wasn’t scared of shit, he was taking his opportunity.
Boiglenoight@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 223d
“ICE is going after only the worst of the worst.” Along the lines of “every accusation is an admission,” they're not sending their best... They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.
jballs@sh.itjust.works · 31 pts · 223d
I don't know if it's entirely unrelated. It shows he absolutely has no law enforcement training and is incapable of learning from his mistakes. Seems like he's got an MO of trying to assault people in their cars.
silvadinlabop@lemmy.cafe · 2 pts · 223d
Sounds pretty related?
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca · 7 pts · 223d
he seemed so nice on TV...
muusemuuse@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 223d
Jokerpopcorn.gif
borQue@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 223d
Electricd@lemmybefree.net · -1 pts · 223d
Well that changes some things
The guy already experienced being ran over and in the action took the bad decision to shoot when it could happen again
That nuanced things, but still it’s probably a mistake, and they don’t assume it
Paddzr@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 223d
Tough shit?
Murder with car is okay after all. Murder with guns is only okay for police and ice isn't police!
He should get zero leaniency with this. Fear for one's life doesn't give you right to murder someone. They're armoured thugs.
Electricd@lemmybefree.net · 1 pts · 223d
USA kinda works like this though
Taleya@aussie.zone · 8 pts · 223d
You don't get to kill people because you are afraid
frongt@lemmy.zip · 0 pts · 223d
Cops do
Electricd@lemmybefree.net · 0 pts · 223d
When it’s about saving your life, you do. Survival instinct
Or just tell that to people that shoot burglars when they enter their house
You’ve never exaggerated in extreme situations and made mistakes?
Taleya@aussie.zone · 3 pts · 223d
I can tell you right now I've never shot someone because my life was in danger. And it has been, repeatedly.
How the fuck is "You don't get to kill people because you are afraid" something to argue against to you?
Electricd@lemmybefree.net · -2 pts · 223d
If you believe you’re going to be killed, then you shoot first
And the goal is not to kill, just to fight the threat to be safe from it. Killing is an unfortunate result