Its more than that, AI art seems like crack for right-wingers. Something about a lifetime of "the curtains are fucking blue" and "my ignorance is just as valid as your knowledge" applied to media makes art no more than aesthetically pleasing shapes and colors for these people, and AI can do surface level aethetics really well.
I’ve read somewhere that right winger (and by extension billionaires) could see themselves become one of the millionaires class, however they cannot imagine being one day someone in the intelligencia/artists class.
At the time it was for explaining why Bezos bought on week worth of every hotel rooms in Venice and why he was pouring money into the Met Gala.
Bezos is just trying to buy his goblin wife a lifestyle/cultural thing. He tries with Vogue then after that seemed to not work he fucked up wapo for it.
So that’s why he is putting money into the met gala I think.
They both seem to have serious body dysmorphia too, and seem to have no clue that at least 1/3 of the weird looks they get are from people gawking at their creepy plastic surgery.
I’ve read somewhere that right winger (and by extension billionaires) could see themselves become one of the millionaires class, however they cannot imagine being one day someone in the intelligencia/artists class.
I'm not right wing and I'm completely broke mostly for reasons to do with a manipulative ex rather than a lack of income, but it's still far more likely that I'll one day be a millionaire than that I'll one day be an artist. And I suspect that's the same for a LOT of people.
You can luck into a well-paid job and good connections, you can't really luck into a skill you were never born with. They say hard work beats talent, but if you have zero talent, no amount of hard work will suddenly give you a sense of imagination worth a damn. 9 years worth of mandatory art class in school AKA mostly drawing or painting for 2 hours a week and my skills cap at... side view of a bus. An European one, not an American one.
So yes, it's a lot easier to fantasize about kicking off a successful business or just lucking into a high-end executive role at a job than it is to fantasize one day creating something that someone would actually find beautiful or meaningful.
'Be an artist [as a professional job]' and 'be an artist [someone who makes art]' absolutely shouldn't be considered synonymous. Anyone can be an artist. People were artists tens of thousands of years before job specialization was invented. The desire to make art is inherent to the human condition, and that doesn't have to mean 'draw/paint fine art'. Sewing, woodworking, tile/brick laying, garden design, sculpture, photography, fabric dyeing, there are so many artistic ways that people can express themselves that don't have to be inaccessible. And that's just visual art, not even touching performing or writing! You are capable of creative expression in a way that interests you and you enjoy.
I think so as well. And I know lots of people who do arts as a hobby. From playing a music instrument, dancing, singing, to drawing, writing fan fiction. Some people have a lathe and woodworking stuff in the garage. Some take pride in their flowers or have been growing bonsai trees for longer than I live. Travel to placed to snap some more pictures of birds or some old rusty stuff. I heard all of that can be considered art forms and there's many more. I think there's lots of creativity and art somewhere inside of a lot of people. And some desire to express something.
They don’t wanna kill art. They want to place themselves between you and everything. While it’s free now, when they get done destroying all the books and shutting down all the independent websites, you’ll pay.
Just like the streaming services shut down physical copies of games, music stores and video rentals.
Until the wealthy kill libraries or poison their stacks with “approved” books. Data hoarding…they’ll make it illegal to share the materials they stole in the first place. They’ll wall up the internet like China, Russia, and NK.
In addition to illegally downloading games, books, and music, we'll be illegally downloading news articles. People will be putting up torrents of slop-free content.
Yep. Get people hooked with free results, then make it a cheap subscription, then jack up the subscription just like the streaming services did, then put ads in (or whatever now-unbundled service it is) and force people to pay even more for what used to be included with the original subscription.
This is a new corporate-made hellscape we’re entering.
There won’t be a “free web” unless someone makes it. Whatever that open source local p2p mesh web I heard about people putting together will probably be the “fediverse” version of the under-net.
Not sure what you mean, the books are still destroyed regardless. The point is they (llm) become one of the few sources to see those book’s contents and the arbiters of what parts you get to see, if you get to see them at all and some other information more useful to the corporation isn’t algorithmically pushed to you instead.
Hoping for a leak isn’t what you should be concerned with. The restriction of access to information and filtering that information is.
That, and the data centers will be used for mass surveillance — processing the data from all their millions and millions of cameras to identify and track you wherever you go. Up until now it's required so much effort for them to physically track down all of their political enemies but that's not going to be the case for very long.
I said this almost a decade ago, but companies and the government (NSA) were hoovering up data for years. Encrypted and not. Could they analyze all of it at the time? No, so it was generally only looked at for targeted things. But now, you have ways of distilling data on a massive scale and just asking it a question. And once quantum computing comes far enough and can break encryption, all that stored data becomes even more meaningful.
I don't really get what they're going to do with all those data centers, the current models suck as far as output quality and returns on training new ones are diminishing (that's part of the technology, you can't average the internet EVEN MORE and to get a 'better' result)...
...so the best models seem to have been trained well before the majority of data centers were finished and running. Hell the technology isn't that old.
So why all the datacenters? Models can be run on your PC (no connection required)... there's no need for data centers apart from spending whilst the bubble is high.
It must be part of the scam. Stock value bolstered by brick and mortar realestate and the hopes of working for the surveillance state.
Indiscriminate mass killing and destruction is still mass killing and destruction, regardless of any objectives. A regime official or a school for girls? Who cares.
Mass surveillance doesn't need to target terrorists and opponents, the goal is to terrorize the population into submission. The more arbitrary it is, the better.
Disinformation doesn't need to be believable, you just need to flood the public discourse to drown any reality-based opinion.
The models, both open and closed source, are definitely still improving. I guarantee you aren't getting better results from a 2 year old model than a current one.
The datacentres are needed because
the so-called frontier labs have one trick, and it's bruteforcing through the problem with excess compute.
they are in an arms race where success is measured by how many datacentres you have built.
I think that they are going to end up very disappointed when it turns out that it isn't a technology that can be walled off for profit, it's basically just going to be a commodity like email.
I've tried to explain to SO MANY people that the technology itself is not ethereally evil, and it's possible to be both pro-AI and anti-corporate abuse.
LLMs are VERY good at bridging the gap between human language, and computer language. That's it, that's their whole gimmick. They're not oracles, they're not God's, and up until ~5 years ago everyone was fucking thrilled to get a Star Trek computer of their own.
We literally have it now...
We have computers that can generate entire images and programs through voice prompting just like in Star Trek. And EXACTLY like in Star Trek, it gets it wrong, CONSTANTLY. Which is why humans are constantly fixing it and correcting it.
I often think about all the times civilizations are refused technology, and it's explained that they need to earn that tech on their own or else it will be abused and misused.
Well we have that tech. We are abusing and misusing it. But this obsession with claiming that something inherent in the tech itself is unethical or wrong is absolutely bonkers.
It's difficult to put my thoughts on this into words but you've captured a good amount of it.
There is incredible potential to this, but the costs and risks it puts us up against are truly horrific. I don't think I could have ever guessed that we were going to undo all of the decarbonisation effort, which took years, to power these fucking datacentres. I see the benefit in tasks it can already do, just a few short years in, and I wonder how fucked our economies are going to be when every office worker is made redundant. No government knows how to deal with any aspect of this, and it's moving so fast that we're going to be waist deep before the average person even begins to comprehend the scale of what we are facing.
Humans have always overestimated the power of tech. The reach of our imaginations has always exceeded our grasp. I don't think this tech will be replacing people any more than computers themselves replaced people. "Computers" once meant actual people that would sit at desks and compute equations. That job is gone, but its erasure opened up new possibilities that could not have been imagined before.
When "modern" computers were first invented, it was assumed that they would replace all humans within a generation. he wrote on his pocket computer from his normal human job that used computers.
They're building them out expecting demand to make their whole effort worth it. They genuinely expect everybody is going to be using these things near constantly especially at their jobs and perhaps multiple instances at once for multiple conversations.
They genuinely expect everybody is going to be using these things near constantly
And if everybody doesn't use AI, they'll force it on us. Integrate it too deeply into society to be able to remove it without damaging something vital, so they'll get yet another government bailout.
No, killing Art and turning your brain into sludge is just the by-product. The intention of the techno fascists is to create a permanent underclass, forced to serve the rich and live in poverty. You know, slavery for everyone except the 1%.
Just imagine a future where police and military are just drones controlled by an AI. Jobs are few and therefore badly paid. And on top of it the rich in their luxury bunkers watching us fight for the scraps and dying from climate change and malnutrition.
The rich like Thiel and Musk don’t actually want to keep the rest of us as slaves, they want us to die so they can enjoy the Earth as a depopulated garden of Eden tended by their robots.
On top of that, the elites have a problem: they hate educated people because they don't fall for the lies, but they need their "smartness". AI is their attempt to separate the knowledge and skills from the people.
I don't think there's any actual right wing anymore. At least not in terms of values or opinions or politics. They're not conservatives or anything of that kind.
It has been completely devoured by induced populism run by facists. It's not really populism, because it's not popular as such and it's not against the elite. It's induced - by the billionaire elite.
These facists need the data centers and AI to push their opinions to gullible voters. Just like Hitler used massive rallies to take advantage of group pressure to make people think they shared his views, the fascist are using the algorithms of social media to make gullible people believe that they have the presented opinion on something that they don't actually give a shit about.
So that's why AI is not really a right wing thing, but still presented as being on that side. If we could find a country in the world where the left wing were the gullible idiots, I'm certain the facists would do the exact same thing there on that side. The facists don't give a shit about politics, because they really do want break democracy. All they need is stupid people, which AI is delivering, and they'll sell it through any political ideology present to them.
Trump is doing just that for them. I wonder if he's even aware of himself being used for this. Obviously he's a massive idiot and a selfish asshole, but sometimes he'll talk about fixing things and doing good stuff, and maybe he even believes he's doing that. However, it always turns out that corruption beats whatever intention he had. It always turns to shit the next day. His staff spends every second day explaining why Trump is an asshole and every second day explaining why Trump wasn't enough of an asshole. It doesn't matter what he says or wants. His only role was to scoop up the gullible idiots.
In actual practice, in the broad strokes, it's not binary, but leans hard toward bad.
There are specific things, it's good at, that are very low token/power
If my 2070 could handle any models with tool use, I could do a lot of it at home.
While I'm doing DevOps work, I keep a window open of what i'm doing, what choices i'm making, i gave it a RO harness to access the stuff i'm working on so it can check me for errors and enumerate security concerns.
When i'm done architecting something, I have it fully document what, where, how, why and add in any security concerns. I then have that stuffed in a repo for my sucessor and any devs that need to understand what I did.
it 95% going to fuck over humanity and pay the oligarchs. The remaining 5% can't justify it's existence, but while it's there, i'm going to use it. They're not paying me more, it can at least remove shit work from my plate while it's available.
Economically it’s only bad because of the capitalist system we live in.
Even ecologically it could also probably be not so bad considering what we could get out of it.
I’m with you on the last bit. I use it a ton at work as a software dev with some devops work
Honestly feels like a firing offense if people in this line of work haven’t incorporated into their workflow at this point. But politically it will fuck is over, once again because it’s owned but a couple of fascist minded dudes
It's a machine that makes your selfish, ignorant visions, the ones you wish were true, feel tangible - and that's enough for a broken person to believe. "I wish mr. trump had big sweaty muscles, oh boy..."
I think the overall sentiment is correct given how the current manifestation of AI is built primarily to build a system of control over human information, with the principle players (Oracle, Amazon, Google) attempting to execute the strategic goal of controlling human intelligence for the purposes of political power.
I also agree that the way the supporting network for AI is being built out is an environmental catastrophe, both in terms of data centers physical ecological footprint and the additional power they consume.
But I fully believe that it's not the technology at fault - rather, its how its being used by the power players that control it.
A data center doesn't have to be an ecological nightmare, for instance. An underground facility powered by above ground wind and solar could provide both the needed power and temperature control, while containing the impacts from sound and machinery. But it's more expensive to build underground than it is to buy off the city council in bumfuck Alabamistan.
Let's look the technology itself. What AI has become is not intelligence or consciousness in any sense of the word. It has become a text based interface with an engine capable of processing large datasets and performing complex operations on the level of a human operator (sometimes).
This in itself is not fascist -but it absolutely has the power to enable fascism in the wrong hands, and all of the principal players in the space have proven themselves amoral (save perhaps Anthropic in certain cases). Conversely, I also believe it has the power to enable democracy in the right hands.
The key word here is power. Power means the power to either disrupt the status quo or build it. AI is a power we've only come to live with for about two years now, and its terrifying because its already in the hands of the wrong people.
But it's not going away, no more than nukes will or guns or anything humanity has found a use for. I think blanket statements like AI = fascism do more harm than good because they give responsibility to a tool, when in fact it should lie with the people who use those tools towards nefarious ends.
In conclusion, I'd like to end with this loving message to any Anonymous who haven't sold out to the feds:
Get off your lazy asses and hack Grok to fuck Elon and the Epstein class up. Y'all wanna be netrunners? This is your motherfucking time to shine.
An underground facility powered by above ground wind and solar could provide both the needed power and temperature control, while containing the impacts from sound and machinery.
A question on this one, how does being underground help with the temperature control? If anything it sounds like that makes cooling harder.
Soil is a great insulator - protected from sun the sheer mass makes it much, much cooler than above ground. Without the additional external heat its much easier to climate conteol.
(Yes it does get hotter the further you go but that's due to proximity to the planet's core...ain't no one putting a dc down that far)
That's exactly what makes me think it's harder. Datacenters need to move dozens (or these days hundreds) of megawatts of power away. For this they either heat air or evaporate water both of which flows away through the atmosphere, or - much more rarely unfortunately - they heat water which flows away through pipes to heat other buildings.
Energy coming in from sunlight or warm surrounding air is negligible, the important factor is the energy coming in electrically and being converted to heat. For that a surrounding insulator is the last thing you want.
You know conservation of energy in a closed system, yes? What do you think happens when dozens of megawatt of power is transported in electrically, and get turned into heat in a bunch of semiconductors and electrical motors, and you don't transport any of that heat out?
You do realise cooling and heat export is possible with an insulated building, yea? In fact the better the insulation the more effective the climate control.
Don't "dude" me, you're the one claiming DCs don't want thermal bridging, when in fact they are all about somehow building the maximum possible multilane bridge of doom to our atmosphere to get rid of all the heat as effectively as possible.
Your common wisdom of good insulation is good for effective climate control only applies to buildings where an insignificant amount of heat in generated inside.
It’s drastically cooler underground until you get really deep in the mantle, and most importantly, the temperature is stable. No weather fluctuations.
Yes it is cooler in the beginning, but only for a short time, if you start pumping dozens (or these days hundreds) of megawatts of power into the ground it will heat up very quickly. Earth and rock is terrible at conducting heat.
Weather is not the issue for a datacenter, the heat generated from converting electrical energy, that's the problem to solve.
A lot of tech bros who were deeply into crypto currency scams before they latched onto AI. There was a fair bit of anti-government feeling to that lot. Naturally scammers and criminals fear regulation. Now they arguably control the government it is more about retaining their influence. It can be difficult to separate self interest and politics with the rich. I think amongst average people distrust of AI is fairly split across political divides but that might change with funded, targeted campaigns.
because AI is being mostly supported by the right wing, especially in politics, because they know reality has a liberal bias, and AI is the solution they've been dying for, for decades, to manufacture video evidence of all their imaginary persecution and victimization... and they don't care how much of the worlds water they have to boil away to do it. because fueling their narrative is more important than anything else.
also AI makes people dumber. The less people have to think, and have machines feed them the "correct" answer with no critical thinking, the more stupid and pliable they become.. Which is another reason why the right loves AI.
We already have evidence of human memory capacity decreasing thanks to a scant few decades of search engines. imagine how humanity will look after 30 years of AI making all its choices and doing all the hard thinking
I'm only about 30 % through and probably forgot half of that, but one point that stuck was that AI has parallels to immigrants from the point of fascists. Both are powerful forces that threaten our way of life as we know it. We must keep AI/immigrants in check by whatever means necessary, even if it means we're violating basic human rights or destroy whole ecosystems. There is no time to argue about this because the threat is so severe and we must act now before it is too late.
Fascists also like AI because it discriminates against any deviants. If you are uncommon in any way, it is more likely that AI will not recognize your medical issues, ignore your social needs, etc, which makes life harder for you. Fascists are all about social conformity, so they love this aspect.
Here's a great example of how it handles uncommon medical questions.
Simple question, can trans women get endometriosis? This question is great for this because common sense will say, "no, of course not," and LLMs are nothing but distilled common sense. But common sense is often wrong. Common sense assumes far greater difference of the sexes tham actually exists. Here's what copilot has to say:
Copilot goes for the wisdom of the crowds, and the crowds fail. It even tries to respond thinking I'm talking about trans men rather than trans women.
And yet, here is a case report, clear as day, of a trans woman getting endometriosis.
I think AI aids the American right specifically in their quest to eliminate the role of experts (with their "liberal" educations and "progressive" values such as basic human decency for all, etc.) in discussing and determining policy, especially in regulating industry.
They want to replace protesting scientists, archivists, historians, philosophers, and other "whiny" experts with a machine that appears to make logical arguments and to be an expert, and is much more malleable and agreeable.
You see this on X all the time. Some expert says a thing and some Nazi looks to grok to refute it.
Does it matter that none of this changes reality? Not really to them. Because they aren't looking to be correct, they're looking to exercise power without pushback.
Sounds interesting. Would you recommend the book to someone who is working with Deep Learning and thus understanding the technology pretty good? I am a bit tired of reading from "AI experts" that do not know the technical capabilities and limitations of technology they are addressing.
No, as the title says, this book is about the social aspects of AI and what the new far right movements (hope to) gain from it. It does explain a little what "AI" is and isn't and how it basically works, but it's not really about the technical side of things. I have zero interest in using AI and I feel like I already knew everything the book explained about the technology.
I'm not sure pro-AI is a right wing stance. I live in a deeply red rural county, and just today, at the board of supervisors meeting, they voted on an immediate moratorium on new data center construction (note: we currently have none). The past weeks have seen a litany of residents speak out against data centers, most of whom I would assume are MAGA or MAGA-adjacent.
There are a lot of people, who want their AI slop, but without the AI data centers. Some even argues the current infrastructure is more than enough for it.
this post makes me feel so good. I've been saying AI is fascism for like six months, and it seems people are starting to finally understand what that actually means.
AI isn't inherently fascist though, and all the criticims in the post can be attributed to capitalism/corporations. You can run AI on a local machine off of solar power to help with simple tasks.
Cmon, I know you know that's a bad faith argument. I could also say that Nazis drink water but drinking water does not make you a nazi, and it hold more weight because AI is a tool, and not a symbol. Driving a car doesn't make you a nazi; driving a Tesla maybe. Not to mention swastikas have different meanings and connotations in different parts of the world.
For someone who is honestly equating using local AI with renewable energy with fascism, this might fall on deaf ears, but it might also offer perspective. A lot of people I run into in my circles are pro Palestine, pro Ukraine, neuro divergent, lgtq+, from all kinds of races and nationalities, and the vast majority find AI quite appealing and enjoy using it. You just compared all those people to Nazis, and are implying they are fascists.
Which reminds me, a lot of them are also vegan. Animal farming is a lot worse for the environment, and what we do to those animals has a lot more parallels to fascism. How many people saying such things about AI and upvoting it are actually vegan, though?
It's the system that produced ai. Sure you can use it to code at home but the thing was made to compete and dominate in a market so the function most people will use it for is to forcefully make and control markets.
The computer and the internet were also invented by the military, among other things. That doesn't mean you are part of, or a supporter of, the military industrial complex. Are you?
Oh wow, you're one of those people who takes a simple statement and just runs in the stupidest direction with it. Nice, you've got a tag now. Thanks for helping me decide whether to interact with you again or not.
"Oh no, someone used my own ridiculous argument against me! I better tag them and maje sure to mention it so everyone knows how cool I am, instead of just blocking them"
I literally just used the same argument he did as a counter argument towards him. He got all in a twisted into a knot because of it 🤷
I'm not about to agree with whatever crazy thing people say just because they'll burst at the seams if I don't. Fact remains they still haven't explained what is so inherently wrong with AI itself, or why someone running a small model locally with renewable energy is bad.
I'm in a weird spot. I'm a software dev and whether I like it or not I think LLM's have changed the industry, probably forever. Or at least until the next big shift.
LLM's can genuinely write working code and selfishly it does allow me to build POC's in my off time that I never would have before. Working in the industry saps my motivation to build at home.
On the flip side the corporations building them are evil, stealing data to train them, stealing water and forcing customers to pay for grid improvements and just bad for the environment.
Ya'll need to drop Claude for Qwen. Qwen will happily hack the Heritage Foundation with you and it runs on your graphics card, not a surveillance center.
"But intellectual property bad and muh pragmatism!"
Firstly: 🤣🤣🤣
Secondly: While Intellectual property isn't necessarily a good thing, its the best thing we can wield against the AI overlords. They don't want to democratize art, they want to destroy it. That's what actual pragmatism is. Also anti-IP movements hurt not big corporations, but small independent creators and developers. That disabled artist friend of yours that is now "mean" at you "for no good reason" is getting called a millionaire no matter how much they have to beg for rent money at the end of the month, while parents are continuing to look for Disney and Harry Potter slop instead of letting their kids experience art made by smaller creators. Similarly Microsoft can sustain you pirating Windows if that means Windows will remain a de-facto standard, but open source projects are also being attacked sometimes for "clinging onto evil copyright laws" or for "e-begging".
Thirdly: Speaking of pragmatic use of AI: Why don't you use some Chinese models to hack the fash into oblivion? Why is it always some crappy AI generated agitprop, or AI slop articles talking about how AI could be used for fully automated luxury gay space communism? Taking down communication channels used by them would be a lot more pragmatic, than slowly hurting your fellow comrades just to get some clout from other comrades of yours in the name of "pragmatism"!
Stop cooking your brain, just because techbros managed to control the narrative about anti-AI extremism. I personally know people, who would happily sacrifice a portion of the population if it means the genie will be put back quicker into the bottle, that's what real anti-AI extremism is. Extremism isn't being mean to an artist on social media, because they drew hands weirdly, or they used that "glowy"-style rendering. This is just "the real racists are anti-racists" tactic yet again, expect this time you fell for it.
he doesn't "support" LLMs yet, he tolerates some uses
he's also getting older, and if the past decades have shown anything is that brain rot can happen to anyone - and just because someone was based in the past, doesn't mean they are going to have a solid moral compass forever
Linux is being sponsored by AI providers. Consider this as de facto corruption.
IMHO, he, and some other "vibe code bad, moderated LLM use good" developers are falling for the industry's definition of anti-AI "extremism" (simple refusal of AI usage, refusal of engaging with genAI output), and being a moderate with AI (reading the output, etc.).
Yea I have to agree I hate this "moderated LLM use good" stance. I have used LLMs (through private browser windows without login) to understand documentation before, or to get a usage example for a specific function, and I already feel dirty for it. I will absolutely not use that snake oil to generate code for me or even consider installing anything on my hardware.
Even worse is, it still makes up stuff when used in "moderation", so you'll get the downsides of vibe coding without the benefits, because you didn't want to read the docs.
Most of the people promoting it whole-heartedly are doing it for the sake of "profit at any cost". There would have been a reasonable way to approach it and incorporate it into our lives. But destroying everything while forcing people to use it for stuff it isn't even good at, while founding it on stealing so much stuff, and having a race to see who can make their AI 1% better than the other AIs at the small cost of burning down the planet exponentially more for each 1% gain... that was not the approach that would get the people behind you.
It's not even AI that is the problem, as always it's people. Selfish people. AI "can" be useful, but not useful enough to justify the cost they forced it to have. That's the main problem, that they stole initially, then the next biggest problem, that they fired so many humans and replaced them with AI, when AI couldn't, and still can't, replace them. The next biggest problem, that they are pursuing it so hard at any cost, and the cost is insane, in so many metrics. Next, that they force people to use it to justify that cost, even when the people are telling them, and the metrics are showing, that using it is making them worse at their job.
But AI -is- technically useful. There are things it can actually help with, quite a bit. Just not as many things as the bosses are trying to pretend it can be good at. And ignoring the costs that can never be justified, the product that exists if thinking about it in a vacuum can be used responsibly, but so many people don't. If you are using AI responsibly as an individual, your job shouldn't feel easier, just less tedious. If AI is making your job easier now, you might be paying for it down the line. Never get AI to do for you, something you couldn't have done on your own. Make sure you know what it did, and if you can't figure out how it came to a conclusion you didn't forsee, you better figure it out. Cuz it might be wrong, and it's important to know if it was, it'll always sound really confident, right or wrong.
But yeah, how useful it is in the few select areas it doesn't suck at, ends up being largely irrelevant in the grand scheme, since it can never pay off what it costed, and is still costing. And that statement is even still true if we limit ourselves to only considering it's literal financial cost.
So, in conclusion, yes. AI is gonna feel very right wing right now. Profit at any cost.
I'm so lost. Not only does JJ's response not seem to address what was said by JB, but also I live in a middle-to-right-wing area and almost everybody is anti-datacenter. The unity is actually refreshing, pretty much everybody is talking about going to city counsel meetings to speak up about how we don't want datacenters in our area.
rural people will support left wing issue, vote left wing issue, and then vote for a government that dismantles left wing issue, and then get real mad and vote for a second right wing government because that guy understands how im mad
The amount of people I've seen around here with Trump flags (yes, they're still up for some reason?) and "No Data Centers in insert town name" makes me understand just how little people connect the dots.
"Polluting drinkable water"? I haven't heard of that. I thought they "just" wasted potable water for evaporative cooling, where does the water pollution stem from?
Construction of data centers causes instability due to the rumbling of heavy equipment and disturbing of soil over aquifers, which soils the aquifers. This leaves residents near it with a soiled aquifer, which may/may not be fit to drink. The images I've seen are definitely not palatable. Would you drink muddy water?
Then, the data centers add light and sound pollution to ordinary people, and one Grok data center in Tennessee where they're using methane turbines to cool the place, which is causing an increase in asthma.
Basically, the shit is unhealthy as fuck. AND it's chewing through electricity, which adds more into the fossil fuel-climate change problem. If you like Hell on Earth, continue unabated; otherwise, reach some balance and conserve ffs
Those power everything, the servers and the cooling, it's not specifically for cooling. Basically the turbines just spin a generator for electrical power. The spin isn't needed for wind or anything.
AI "works of art"... are not about genuine personal expression or interpretation channeled through art and literature by hand and DIY, but rather the production of art and literature entirely using LLMs just purely for personal convenience and gain, in either clout or money or both.
That you have these supposed cheap "creatives" choosing NOT to DIY and set asides time to learn how to master a new art form, and instead grab an LLM box and type anything they want and the machines bring the finished product to their table... which so smacks of instant gratification.
Fascism is not just all of its symptoms Umberto Eco talked about, but also plundering art and literature to kill off genuine expression and skill, in favor of mass-produced soulless capricious slop.
Bingo! Thats where I was going. I still don't understand why we cant just line them up in the arctic circle. We have fiber optics and cooling up there won't be an issue.
So it take a few more milliseconds to get a response. I'm ok with that.
Pay better than the oil fields and people will line up for the gig.
I haven't really found a use for AI that is actually beneficial to me. The only time I run across it is via forced search engine automation, and half the time when you read the actual sources generated for it they do not match, or are not being correctly interpreted by the AI.
From what I've seen it seems to be mainly useful for people working in tech.
I work in orthotics and prosthetics, basically I evaluate patients, build, and then fit people custom braces and fake limbs.
It's a really small field and it is really hands on. It's hard enough for students to find actual books on the subject, let alone something that has enough available information for an AI to scrape from. I think the last time I checked my field was one of the lowest professions at risk to be affected by automation in the future.
Wide swaths of the right are against these data centers too. Dem politicians are for them too.
This kind of sniping misses the point. It's the political parties that are the problem, the sheep of both parties, and the cynical cunts that think they will benefit from subordinating the common good to big money, are just a symptom of a corrupt establishment, and corrupt culture.
We need popular alternatives, but most of you still trust the controlled opposition. Despite, you know, things.
With respect, I think you have missed the point. The argument being made is that AI* is inherently pro-right-wing and/or pro-fascist. The purpose of the argument is convince people who are against those politics to also be against AI. (In theory. This is an echo chamber, after all.)
Are some right-wingers against data centres? Sure. Most of them based on NIMBYism, I imagine, though some of a more libertarian bent may be opposed on grounds of intellectual property theft or the danger of widespread surveillance. That does not, by itself, detract from the argument.
Are some Democrat politicians for data centres? Sure. Many Democrat politicians are right wing by any sensible standard. (Most? I'm not sure, I'm not USian. Most senior ones, certainly.) That doesn't detract from the argument itself.
These things are illustrative of the problem of both political parties being captured, but that is still a separate problem.
* What is colloquially referred to as AI, not necessarily all applications of machine learning.
The establishment of both parties is all in on llm's and data centers. It's not left versus right, it's working class versus the investor class and oligarchy, is my point.
Democrat ruled areas and states are allowing data centers everywhere red controlled ones are, they are approving them in secret, they are suppressing dissent and lying about harms, and so forth.
No one wants data centers next to them. No one will want llm's after their harm becomes apparent. No one outside of the aforementioned establishment, their sheep, and their cynical backers, which are a minority of this country.
The democrats do not represent the left, that is laughable. To think the party establishment represents the voters that vote for them, doesn't speak well to your understanding.
30% of each part are sheep, maybe 50 percent between the sheep and self interested dickheads that think they will benefit.
The rest hate all the politicians for the most part, how do you not get this? You clearly listen to the wrong people in your echo chambers.
You clearly didn't read what you are responding to or you would've seen that is what I fucking said.
Both parties are all in on data centers. Fuck your Democrats, it's your fault we are here if you still trust them. Jesus Christ no wonder we are losing with the "left," openly shilling for the democratic establishment, as if everyone outside the sheep didn't know better by now.
If lying about democrats not sucking worked, kamala would be president right now. How many times before you learn?
If you consider raging on my printer for two hours a bad day, then yes. Fucking piece of shit, won't hook up to computer, won't print from flash drive, the buttons on it take 1 minute to register. Brother is a shit company, every single printer executive should be executed, no exceptions. With due process.
Oh yeah, you’re going through it. Been there, printers are hell. Drivers and firmware work straightforward with literally everything else you plug into a computer, what the fuck is wrong with the people who make printers? Fuck that shit.
Some AI, not all. I think it's fair to make a distinction between the two. There's very useful models with a smaller scope that aren't part of these issues.
Most AI, nearly all. The useful AI used in scientific models is not where all the billions in currency is going, and isn't what techbros are trying to promote.
Wait how are we defining most? I would imagine most models out there aren't flagship models with billions backing them or with data centers. Most models seem to be specific domain small training models made with somewhat insignificant resources in comparison to flagship models.
"Where I live AI data centers get their nonstop feed of water and power from abandoned utility infrastructure that was just sitting in the middle of nowhere next to pristine non-utilized reservoirs of water that humans didn't even want. And the only byproduct is flowers that just blanket the once desolate landscape. And there's a handjob fairy that loves its job"
Let me rephrase: labeling machine learning on a massive scale with insane amount of damage to society and environment as "AI" is a trait almoat exclusively seen in the same people who promote racist, classist, sexist or otherwise divisive ideas.
So yes, AI-bros == fascists is a valid takeaway, accepting that as all generalizations, it is not 100% accurate.
It does capture however the essence of people promoting LLMs.
Quietly learning to run local LLMs on old gaming PCs is the opposite of Facisim. As usualz nuance is lost on most, but those who don't get caught up in the pendulum swing of public opinion could stand to expand their knowledge on the subject.
Spanish fascism was around in WWII, they wrote their manifesto for their specific approach to it, and now we are dealing with American fascism. Those are two different and unique systems of fascism. You understand that politics and language change and evolve, right? There are multiple different faces and approaches to fascism, just like any other political concept. That version of fascism failed, this is the current iteration. Think of it like an OS, every version of windows is still windows, but windows XP and windows Vista aren’t the same conversation.
i use AI, i think how it's used is very important. also, on the topic of data centers, one way or another, data centers will need to be built to scale up for any type of application. yes, i disagree with the insane water consumption, but we either halt technology as it stands now, or minimize how we use technology (i.e not relying on the cloud, web 2.0/web 3.0)
Data centers can introduce several types of pollutants into water systems. These pollutants fall into three main categories.
Biocides: chemicals to prevent the growth of bacteria, mold, and algae in the cooling system, and the most common pollutant in data center water systems.
Corrosion inhibitors: chemicals that prevent corrosion within cooling systems
Heavy metals: metals, such as copper zinc, and lead, that can enter the water in trace amounts when metal components degrade.
Additionally, fine salt dust that drifts in the atmosphere from evaporative cooling towers can settle on nearby soils and surface waters, potentially harming vegetation and increasing salinity in aquatic systems. This concern is especially pressing given that salt pollution is already a growing issue in certain water supply reservoirs, including the Occoquan.
None of this even includes the water from the additional electricity generation required to power the data centers
The only thing with "fascism" there is "technofascists", which is just an umbrella term for people who heavily rely on tech to spread far-right ideologies. I don't like how loosely the term "fascism" is used on the internet, but this is far from the worst cases.
192 Comments
Alcoholicorn@mander.xyz · 109 pts · 2d
Its more than that, AI art seems like crack for right-wingers. Something about a lifetime of "the curtains are fucking blue" and "my ignorance is just as valid as your knowledge" applied to media makes art no more than aesthetically pleasing shapes and colors for these people, and AI can do surface level aethetics really well.
TribblesBestFriend@startrek.website · 30 pts · 2d
I’ve read somewhere that right winger (and by extension billionaires) could see themselves become one of the millionaires class, however they cannot imagine being one day someone in the intelligencia/artists class.
At the time it was for explaining why Bezos bought on week worth of every hotel rooms in Venice and why he was pouring money into the Met Gala.
I think it fit for AI art
architect@thelemmy.club · 11 pts · 2d
Bezos is just trying to buy his goblin wife a lifestyle/cultural thing. He tries with Vogue then after that seemed to not work he fucked up wapo for it.
So that’s why he is putting money into the met gala I think.
nilloc@discuss.tchncs.de · 2 pts · 1d
They both seem to have serious body dysmorphia too, and seem to have no clue that at least 1/3 of the weird looks they get are from people gawking at their creepy plastic surgery.
grrgyle@slrpnk.net · 1 pts · 1d
Doesn't he realise by now that anything his money touches becomes permanently uncool?
Is he just going to keep chasing one cool seeming thing after another, smothering it in money, then wondering why it suddenly lost its cachét?
boonhet@sopuli.xyz · 3 pts · 2d
I'm not right wing and I'm completely broke mostly for reasons to do with a manipulative ex rather than a lack of income, but it's still far more likely that I'll one day be a millionaire than that I'll one day be an artist. And I suspect that's the same for a LOT of people.
You can luck into a well-paid job and good connections, you can't really luck into a skill you were never born with. They say hard work beats talent, but if you have zero talent, no amount of hard work will suddenly give you a sense of imagination worth a damn. 9 years worth of mandatory art class in school AKA mostly drawing or painting for 2 hours a week and my skills cap at... side view of a bus. An European one, not an American one.
So yes, it's a lot easier to fantasize about kicking off a successful business or just lucking into a high-end executive role at a job than it is to fantasize one day creating something that someone would actually find beautiful or meaningful.
architect@thelemmy.club · 14 pts · 2d
I don’t know why people go straight to drawing. I’m an artist (fulltime) and i can’t draw.
Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 10 pts · 2d
'Be an artist [as a professional job]' and 'be an artist [someone who makes art]' absolutely shouldn't be considered synonymous. Anyone can be an artist. People were artists tens of thousands of years before job specialization was invented. The desire to make art is inherent to the human condition, and that doesn't have to mean 'draw/paint fine art'. Sewing, woodworking, tile/brick laying, garden design, sculpture, photography, fabric dyeing, there are so many artistic ways that people can express themselves that don't have to be inaccessible. And that's just visual art, not even touching performing or writing! You are capable of creative expression in a way that interests you and you enjoy.
hendrik@palaver.p3x.de · 3 pts · 2d
I think so as well. And I know lots of people who do arts as a hobby. From playing a music instrument, dancing, singing, to drawing, writing fan fiction. Some people have a lathe and woodworking stuff in the garage. Some take pride in their flowers or have been growing bonsai trees for longer than I live. Travel to placed to snap some more pictures of birds or some old rusty stuff. I heard all of that can be considered art forms and there's many more. I think there's lots of creativity and art somewhere inside of a lot of people. And some desire to express something.
wewbull@feddit.uk · 70 pts · 2d
They're burning books so that "truth" can be only obtained from a machine they control.
Nothing fascist about that.
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 49 pts · 2d
They don’t wanna kill art. They want to place themselves between you and everything. While it’s free now, when they get done destroying all the books and shutting down all the independent websites, you’ll pay.
Just like the streaming services shut down physical copies of games, music stores and video rentals.
You’ll pay.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 18 pts · 2d
I will not.
jve@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 2d
https://youtu.be/fYgmHoFOsrE?is=txHcmGOIOgnwFadg
Turret3857@infosec.pub · 10 pts · 2d
Data Hoarders and Libraries will save us
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 2d
Until the wealthy kill libraries or poison their stacks with “approved” books. Data hoarding…they’ll make it illegal to share the materials they stole in the first place. They’ll wall up the internet like China, Russia, and NK.
Turret3857@infosec.pub · 1 pts · 2d
People in Russia and China can easily get around the censorship if they wish to via VPNs or Tor. NK has the flash drives of info that get brought in.
You can kill a person, but never the idea.
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
But nonetheless they built the wall.
zarkanian@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 1d
In addition to illegally downloading games, books, and music, we'll be illegally downloading news articles. People will be putting up torrents of slop-free content.
Furbag@pawb.social · 8 pts · 2d
The first hit is always free.
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 2d
Yep. Get people hooked with free results, then make it a cheap subscription, then jack up the subscription just like the streaming services did, then put ads in (or whatever now-unbundled service it is) and force people to pay even more for what used to be included with the original subscription.
This is a new corporate-made hellscape we’re entering.
zarkanian@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 2d
You won't have a choice, because the free web will be larded up with incomprehensible, AI-generated slop.
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
There won’t be a “free web” unless someone makes it. Whatever that open source local p2p mesh web I heard about people putting together will probably be the “fediverse” version of the under-net.
NostraDavid@programming.dev · 0 pts · 1d
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
Not sure what you mean, the books are still destroyed regardless. The point is they (llm) become one of the few sources to see those book’s contents and the arbiters of what parts you get to see, if you get to see them at all and some other information more useful to the corporation isn’t algorithmically pushed to you instead.
Hoping for a leak isn’t what you should be concerned with. The restriction of access to information and filtering that information is.
dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world · 32 pts · 2d
That, and the data centers will be used for mass surveillance — processing the data from all their millions and millions of cameras to identify and track you wherever you go. Up until now it's required so much effort for them to physically track down all of their political enemies but that's not going to be the case for very long.
justOnePersistentKbinPlease@fedia.io · 18 pts · 2d
That, and AIs are the privatization and commodification of human knowledge.
They fed them the internet, then made it harder to find anything on it without going through them.
Now they are feeding them books, including rare copies, then destroying the books.
cantstopthesignal@sh.itjust.works · -1 pts · 2d
Seriously the internet is basically unusable to me without having some kind of AI sift through it.
FinalRemix@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
I use UBlock to block the slop frames andbstart looking for stuff on the later pages now.
ramble81@lemmy.zip · 7 pts · 2d
I said this almost a decade ago, but companies and the government (NSA) were hoovering up data for years. Encrypted and not. Could they analyze all of it at the time? No, so it was generally only looked at for targeted things. But now, you have ways of distilling data on a massive scale and just asking it a question. And once quantum computing comes far enough and can break encryption, all that stored data becomes even more meaningful.
corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca · -4 pts · 2d
That's a mighty fine crystal ball you've got there. Get me some lottery numbers, okay?
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · 21 pts · 2d
I don't really get what they're going to do with all those data centers, the current models suck as far as output quality and returns on training new ones are diminishing (that's part of the technology, you can't average the internet EVEN MORE and to get a 'better' result)...
...so the best models seem to have been trained well before the majority of data centers were finished and running. Hell the technology isn't that old.
So why all the datacenters? Models can be run on your PC (no connection required)... there's no need for data centers apart from spending whilst the bubble is high.
It must be part of the scam. Stock value bolstered by brick and mortar realestate and the hopes of working for the surveillance state.
Seimhe@lemmy.world · 21 pts · 2d
AI is best at destructive things:
Disinformation
Weapons guidance and mass killing
Mass surveillance
Fascists need those things for the future they have in mind for us.
DarkCloud@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 2d
No, the problem is worse than that - it's not very good at ANY of those thing.
Wfh@lemmy.zip · 5 pts · 2d
That's the neat part. It doesn't even need to be.
Indiscriminate mass killing and destruction is still mass killing and destruction, regardless of any objectives. A regime official or a school for girls? Who cares.
Mass surveillance doesn't need to target terrorists and opponents, the goal is to terrorize the population into submission. The more arbitrary it is, the better.
Disinformation doesn't need to be believable, you just need to flood the public discourse to drown any reality-based opinion.
paranoia@feddit.dk · 10 pts · 2d
The models, both open and closed source, are definitely still improving. I guarantee you aren't getting better results from a 2 year old model than a current one.
The datacentres are needed because
the so-called frontier labs have one trick, and it's bruteforcing through the problem with excess compute.
they are in an arms race where success is measured by how many datacentres you have built.
I think that they are going to end up very disappointed when it turns out that it isn't a technology that can be walled off for profit, it's basically just going to be a commodity like email.
Fawkes@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 2d
I've tried to explain to SO MANY people that the technology itself is not ethereally evil, and it's possible to be both pro-AI and anti-corporate abuse.
LLMs are VERY good at bridging the gap between human language, and computer language. That's it, that's their whole gimmick. They're not oracles, they're not God's, and up until ~5 years ago everyone was fucking thrilled to get a Star Trek computer of their own.
We literally have it now...
We have computers that can generate entire images and programs through voice prompting just like in Star Trek. And EXACTLY like in Star Trek, it gets it wrong, CONSTANTLY. Which is why humans are constantly fixing it and correcting it.
I often think about all the times civilizations are refused technology, and it's explained that they need to earn that tech on their own or else it will be abused and misused.
Well we have that tech. We are abusing and misusing it. But this obsession with claiming that something inherent in the tech itself is unethical or wrong is absolutely bonkers.
paranoia@feddit.dk · 3 pts · 2d
It's difficult to put my thoughts on this into words but you've captured a good amount of it.
There is incredible potential to this, but the costs and risks it puts us up against are truly horrific. I don't think I could have ever guessed that we were going to undo all of the decarbonisation effort, which took years, to power these fucking datacentres. I see the benefit in tasks it can already do, just a few short years in, and I wonder how fucked our economies are going to be when every office worker is made redundant. No government knows how to deal with any aspect of this, and it's moving so fast that we're going to be waist deep before the average person even begins to comprehend the scale of what we are facing.
Fawkes@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 1d
Humans have always overestimated the power of tech. The reach of our imaginations has always exceeded our grasp. I don't think this tech will be replacing people any more than computers themselves replaced people. "Computers" once meant actual people that would sit at desks and compute equations. That job is gone, but its erasure opened up new possibilities that could not have been imagined before. When "modern" computers were first invented, it was assumed that they would replace all humans within a generation. he wrote on his pocket computer from his normal human job that used computers.
drcobaltjedi@programming.dev · 6 pts · 2d
They're building them out expecting demand to make their whole effort worth it. They genuinely expect everybody is going to be using these things near constantly especially at their jobs and perhaps multiple instances at once for multiple conversations.
lemmyng@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 2d
And if everybody doesn't use AI, they'll force it on us. Integrate it too deeply into society to be able to remove it without damaging something vital, so they'll get yet another government bailout.
Xerxos@lemmy.ml · 18 pts · 1d
No, killing Art and turning your brain into sludge is just the by-product. The intention of the techno fascists is to create a permanent underclass, forced to serve the rich and live in poverty. You know, slavery for everyone except the 1%.
Just imagine a future where police and military are just drones controlled by an AI. Jobs are few and therefore badly paid. And on top of it the rich in their luxury bunkers watching us fight for the scraps and dying from climate change and malnutrition.
Naive@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 1d
Kinda like Brave New World
Amir@lemmy.ml · 4 pts · 1d
Brave New World had genetically engineered humans for each wealth class, and made sure every class was happy.
Our real-world dystopia seems to be going towards 99% of the world living in permanent misery.
Naive@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 1d
I think they will do some genetic engineering with all of us later on so that we don't feel sad and miserable and continue serving "the economy".
grrgyle@slrpnk.net · 2 pts · 1d
If only there was an easier way to help make people happy.....
FlyingCircus@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
The rich like Thiel and Musk don’t actually want to keep the rest of us as slaves, they want us to die so they can enjoy the Earth as a depopulated garden of Eden tended by their robots.
brucethemoose@lemmy.world · 16 pts · 2d
Yeah, no one paying for a blue checkmark has any leg to stand on.
Treczoks@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 1d
On top of that, the elites have a problem: they hate educated people because they don't fall for the lies, but they need their "smartness". AI is their attempt to separate the knowledge and skills from the people.
Sunflier@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 1d
Ai is the Epstein class's attempt to access the skills of the proletariat while denying the proletariat's ability to access wealth.
bstix@feddit.dk · 14 pts · 2d
I don't think there's any actual right wing anymore. At least not in terms of values or opinions or politics. They're not conservatives or anything of that kind.
It has been completely devoured by induced populism run by facists. It's not really populism, because it's not popular as such and it's not against the elite. It's induced - by the billionaire elite.
These facists need the data centers and AI to push their opinions to gullible voters. Just like Hitler used massive rallies to take advantage of group pressure to make people think they shared his views, the fascist are using the algorithms of social media to make gullible people believe that they have the presented opinion on something that they don't actually give a shit about.
So that's why AI is not really a right wing thing, but still presented as being on that side. If we could find a country in the world where the left wing were the gullible idiots, I'm certain the facists would do the exact same thing there on that side. The facists don't give a shit about politics, because they really do want break democracy. All they need is stupid people, which AI is delivering, and they'll sell it through any political ideology present to them.
Trump is doing just that for them. I wonder if he's even aware of himself being used for this. Obviously he's a massive idiot and a selfish asshole, but sometimes he'll talk about fixing things and doing good stuff, and maybe he even believes he's doing that. However, it always turns out that corruption beats whatever intention he had. It always turns to shit the next day. His staff spends every second day explaining why Trump is an asshole and every second day explaining why Trump wasn't enough of an asshole. It doesn't matter what he says or wants. His only role was to scoop up the gullible idiots.
ParlimentOfDoom@piefed.zip · 12 pts · 2d
They're even playing pro data center propaganda ads lying about them bringing down utility prices. It's insane.
rumba@lemmy.zip · 11 pts · 2d
Ecologically, it's binary: bad
Economically, it's binary: bad
In actual practice, in the broad strokes, it's not binary, but leans hard toward bad.
There are specific things, it's good at, that are very low token/power
If my 2070 could handle any models with tool use, I could do a lot of it at home.
While I'm doing DevOps work, I keep a window open of what i'm doing, what choices i'm making, i gave it a RO harness to access the stuff i'm working on so it can check me for errors and enumerate security concerns.
When i'm done architecting something, I have it fully document what, where, how, why and add in any security concerns. I then have that stuffed in a repo for my sucessor and any devs that need to understand what I did.
it 95% going to fuck over humanity and pay the oligarchs. The remaining 5% can't justify it's existence, but while it's there, i'm going to use it. They're not paying me more, it can at least remove shit work from my plate while it's available.
JimmyMcGill@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 2d
Economically it’s only bad because of the capitalist system we live in.
Even ecologically it could also probably be not so bad considering what we could get out of it.
I’m with you on the last bit. I use it a ton at work as a software dev with some devops work
Honestly feels like a firing offense if people in this line of work haven’t incorporated into their workflow at this point. But politically it will fuck is over, once again because it’s owned but a couple of fascist minded dudes
Sibshops@feddit.cl · 10 pts · 2d
They are great tools for thought control, as well.
Snapz@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 1d
It's a machine that makes your selfish, ignorant visions, the ones you wish were true, feel tangible - and that's enough for a broken person to believe. "I wish mr. trump had big sweaty muscles, oh boy..."
People who love AI also cheat at solitaire.
arotrios@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 2d
I think the overall sentiment is correct given how the current manifestation of AI is built primarily to build a system of control over human information, with the principle players (Oracle, Amazon, Google) attempting to execute the strategic goal of controlling human intelligence for the purposes of political power.
I also agree that the way the supporting network for AI is being built out is an environmental catastrophe, both in terms of data centers physical ecological footprint and the additional power they consume.
But I fully believe that it's not the technology at fault - rather, its how its being used by the power players that control it.
A data center doesn't have to be an ecological nightmare, for instance. An underground facility powered by above ground wind and solar could provide both the needed power and temperature control, while containing the impacts from sound and machinery. But it's more expensive to build underground than it is to buy off the city council in bumfuck Alabamistan.
Let's look the technology itself. What AI has become is not intelligence or consciousness in any sense of the word. It has become a text based interface with an engine capable of processing large datasets and performing complex operations on the level of a human operator (sometimes).
This in itself is not fascist -but it absolutely has the power to enable fascism in the wrong hands, and all of the principal players in the space have proven themselves amoral (save perhaps Anthropic in certain cases). Conversely, I also believe it has the power to enable democracy in the right hands.
The key word here is power. Power means the power to either disrupt the status quo or build it. AI is a power we've only come to live with for about two years now, and its terrifying because its already in the hands of the wrong people.
But it's not going away, no more than nukes will or guns or anything humanity has found a use for. I think blanket statements like AI = fascism do more harm than good because they give responsibility to a tool, when in fact it should lie with the people who use those tools towards nefarious ends.
In conclusion, I'd like to end with this loving message to any Anonymous who haven't sold out to the feds:
Get off your lazy asses and hack Grok to fuck Elon and the Epstein class up. Y'all wanna be netrunners? This is your motherfucking time to shine.
Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de · 2 pts · 2d
A question on this one, how does being underground help with the temperature control? If anything it sounds like that makes cooling harder.
Taleya@aussie.zone · 2 pts · 2d
What makes you think it's harder to keep cool?
Soil is a great insulator - protected from sun the sheer mass makes it much, much cooler than above ground. Without the additional external heat its much easier to climate conteol.
(Yes it does get hotter the further you go but that's due to proximity to the planet's core...ain't no one putting a dc down that far)
Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 1d
That's exactly what makes me think it's harder. Datacenters need to move dozens (or these days hundreds) of megawatts of power away. For this they either heat air or evaporate water both of which flows away through the atmosphere, or - much more rarely unfortunately - they heat water which flows away through pipes to heat other buildings.
Energy coming in from sunlight or warm surrounding air is negligible, the important factor is the energy coming in electrically and being converted to heat. For that a surrounding insulator is the last thing you want.
Taleya@aussie.zone · 1 pts · 1d
Yeah nah, that's not how it works. Most dcs are insulated to prevent thermal bridging to the outside world
Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 1d
Hahahah absolutely not.
You know conservation of energy in a closed system, yes? What do you think happens when dozens of megawatt of power is transported in electrically, and get turned into heat in a bunch of semiconductors and electrical motors, and you don't transport any of that heat out?
Taleya@aussie.zone · 1 pts · 1d
Dude.
You do realise cooling and heat export is possible with an insulated building, yea? In fact the better the insulation the more effective the climate control.
Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 1d
Don't "dude" me, you're the one claiming DCs don't want thermal bridging, when in fact they are all about somehow building the maximum possible multilane bridge of doom to our atmosphere to get rid of all the heat as effectively as possible.
Your common wisdom of good insulation is good for effective climate control only applies to buildings where an insignificant amount of heat in generated inside.
arotrios@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 2d
It's drastically cooler underground until you get really deep in the mantle, and most importantly, the temperature is stable. No weather fluctuations.
This is why wine caves were invented before refrigeration - consistently cool, stable temperatures.
Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 1d
Yes it is cooler in the beginning, but only for a short time, if you start pumping dozens (or these days hundreds) of megawatts of power into the ground it will heat up very quickly. Earth and rock is terrible at conducting heat.
Weather is not the issue for a datacenter, the heat generated from converting electrical energy, that's the problem to solve.
shirro@aussie.zone · 9 pts · 1d
A lot of tech bros who were deeply into crypto currency scams before they latched onto AI. There was a fair bit of anti-government feeling to that lot. Naturally scammers and criminals fear regulation. Now they arguably control the government it is more about retaining their influence. It can be difficult to separate self interest and politics with the rich. I think amongst average people distrust of AI is fairly split across political divides but that might change with funded, targeted campaigns.
A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 2d
because AI is being mostly supported by the right wing, especially in politics, because they know reality has a liberal bias, and AI is the solution they've been dying for, for decades, to manufacture video evidence of all their imaginary persecution and victimization... and they don't care how much of the worlds water they have to boil away to do it. because fueling their narrative is more important than anything else.
also AI makes people dumber. The less people have to think, and have machines feed them the "correct" answer with no critical thinking, the more stupid and pliable they become.. Which is another reason why the right loves AI.
We already have evidence of human memory capacity decreasing thanks to a scant few decades of search engines. imagine how humanity will look after 30 years of AI making all its choices and doing all the hard thinking
zarkanian@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 2d
Obey the computer. The computer is your friend!
A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 2d
The Computer is Good, the Penis is Evil.
horsesaysweird@feddit.org · 8 pts · 2d
I'm currently reading AI and the New Fascism by Rainer Mühlhoff which is exactly about this.
I'm only about 30 % through and probably forgot half of that, but one point that stuck was that AI has parallels to immigrants from the point of fascists. Both are powerful forces that threaten our way of life as we know it. We must keep AI/immigrants in check by whatever means necessary, even if it means we're violating basic human rights or destroy whole ecosystems. There is no time to argue about this because the threat is so severe and we must act now before it is too late.
Fascists also like AI because it discriminates against any deviants. If you are uncommon in any way, it is more likely that AI will not recognize your medical issues, ignore your social needs, etc, which makes life harder for you. Fascists are all about social conformity, so they love this aspect.
WoodScientist@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 2d
Here's a great example of how it handles uncommon medical questions.
Simple question, can trans women get endometriosis? This question is great for this because common sense will say, "no, of course not," and LLMs are nothing but distilled common sense. But common sense is often wrong. Common sense assumes far greater difference of the sexes tham actually exists. Here's what copilot has to say:
Copilot goes for the wisdom of the crowds, and the crowds fail. It even tries to respond thinking I'm talking about trans men rather than trans women.
And yet, here is a case report, clear as day, of a trans woman getting endometriosis.
https://academic.oup.com/jes/article/7/Supplement_1/bvad114.2078/7291745
And this phenomenon has also been observed in cis men undergoing estrogen therapy for prostate cancer.
I admit this isn't a common thing, as far as we know, among trans women. But the AI flat out says the possible is impossible.
aesthelete@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 2d
I think AI aids the American right specifically in their quest to eliminate the role of experts (with their "liberal" educations and "progressive" values such as basic human decency for all, etc.) in discussing and determining policy, especially in regulating industry.
They want to replace protesting scientists, archivists, historians, philosophers, and other "whiny" experts with a machine that appears to make logical arguments and to be an expert, and is much more malleable and agreeable.
You see this on X all the time. Some expert says a thing and some Nazi looks to grok to refute it.
Does it matter that none of this changes reality? Not really to them. Because they aren't looking to be correct, they're looking to exercise power without pushback.
postmateDumbass@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 2d
Its a way for a minority of wealth/supremist/zealot/etc. to leverage <20% of the people into an overwhelming number of enforcers and overseers.
Every wealthy schmuck will try to become a warlord until they crash out.
lokalhorst@feddit.org · 1 pts · 2d
Sounds interesting. Would you recommend the book to someone who is working with Deep Learning and thus understanding the technology pretty good? I am a bit tired of reading from "AI experts" that do not know the technical capabilities and limitations of technology they are addressing.
horsesaysweird@feddit.org · 2 pts · 2d
No, as the title says, this book is about the social aspects of AI and what the new far right movements (hope to) gain from it. It does explain a little what "AI" is and isn't and how it basically works, but it's not really about the technical side of things. I have zero interest in using AI and I feel like I already knew everything the book explained about the technology.
lokalhorst@feddit.org · 2 pts · 2d
Thanks for sharing your impressions!
CyLith@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 2d
I'm not sure pro-AI is a right wing stance. I live in a deeply red rural county, and just today, at the board of supervisors meeting, they voted on an immediate moratorium on new data center construction (note: we currently have none). The past weeks have seen a litany of residents speak out against data centers, most of whom I would assume are MAGA or MAGA-adjacent.
ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 1d
There are a lot of people, who want their AI slop, but without the AI data centers. Some even argues the current infrastructure is more than enough for it.
100_kg_90_de_belin@feddit.it · 4 pts · 1d
NIMBY.
"We already shipped our nuclear and e-waste to non-Western countries, can't we do the same with data centers?"
HasturInYellow@lemmy.world · -2 pts · 1d
It's anti-life which could easily be confused with an alt right viewpoint, as there is considerable overlap
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 2d
this post makes me feel so good. I've been saying AI is fascism for like six months, and it seems people are starting to finally understand what that actually means.
The_Terrible_Humbaba@slrpnk.net · 1 pts · 2d
AI isn't inherently fascist though, and all the criticims in the post can be attributed to capitalism/corporations. You can run AI on a local machine off of solar power to help with simple tasks.
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 2d
Swastikas aren't inherently Nazi, but when you see one you automatically think of Nazis.
The_Terrible_Humbaba@slrpnk.net · 0 pts · 1d
Cmon, I know you know that's a bad faith argument. I could also say that Nazis drink water but drinking water does not make you a nazi, and it hold more weight because AI is a tool, and not a symbol. Driving a car doesn't make you a nazi; driving a Tesla maybe. Not to mention swastikas have different meanings and connotations in different parts of the world.
For someone who is honestly equating using local AI with renewable energy with fascism, this might fall on deaf ears, but it might also offer perspective. A lot of people I run into in my circles are pro Palestine, pro Ukraine, neuro divergent, lgtq+, from all kinds of races and nationalities, and the vast majority find AI quite appealing and enjoy using it. You just compared all those people to Nazis, and are implying they are fascists.
Which reminds me, a lot of them are also vegan. Animal farming is a lot worse for the environment, and what we do to those animals has a lot more parallels to fascism. How many people saying such things about AI and upvoting it are actually vegan, though?
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · -2 pts · 1d
not sure you realize where you are.
this is "fuck AI". no exceptions.
fuck AI.
AI IS FASCISM.
edit: hyuck it up. I have a morbid curiosity if there's an upper limit my block list length.
The_Terrible_Humbaba@slrpnk.net · 0 pts · 1d
I know exactly where I am, that doesn't make it any more or less true. No matter how loud you shout, or how big of a font you use.
Sabrinamycarpet@sh.itjust.works · -1 pts · 1d
There is no correlation between line 3 and line 4.
NostraDavid@programming.dev · -1 pts · 1d
sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz · 3 pts · 2d
It's the system that produced ai. Sure you can use it to code at home but the thing was made to compete and dominate in a market so the function most people will use it for is to forcefully make and control markets.
The_Terrible_Humbaba@slrpnk.net · -1 pts · 1d
The computer and the internet were also invented by the military, among other things. That doesn't mean you are part of, or a supporter of, the military industrial complex. Are you?
sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz · 1 pts · 1d
Oh wow, you're one of those people who takes a simple statement and just runs in the stupidest direction with it. Nice, you've got a tag now. Thanks for helping me decide whether to interact with you again or not.
The_Terrible_Humbaba@slrpnk.net · -1 pts · 1d
"Oh no, someone used my own ridiculous argument against me! I better tag them and maje sure to mention it so everyone knows how cool I am, instead of just blocking them"
sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz · 2 pts · 1d
Does this feel like you're fighting someone? Do you feel brave right now
The_Terrible_Humbaba@slrpnk.net · -1 pts · 1d
Lmao you're the one who started a fight my dude, get a grip on reality. You got triggered because I used the same argument you did
velma@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 1d
You’re making friends everywhere you go, aren’t you?
The_Terrible_Humbaba@slrpnk.net · 0 pts · 1d
Do I have a stalker now 🤔
I literally just used the same argument he did as a counter argument towards him. He got all in a twisted into a knot because of it 🤷
I'm not about to agree with whatever crazy thing people say just because they'll burst at the seams if I don't. Fact remains they still haven't explained what is so inherently wrong with AI itself, or why someone running a small model locally with renewable energy is bad.
Swaus01@piefed.social · 6 pts · 2d
AlteredEgo@lemmy.ml · 6 pts · 2d
Anything to avoid saying neoliberalism is bad lol
The_Terrible_Humbaba@slrpnk.net · -1 pts · 2d
They Hated Him Because He Told Them the Truth
chocrates@piefed.world · 6 pts · 2d
I'm in a weird spot. I'm a software dev and whether I like it or not I think LLM's have changed the industry, probably forever. Or at least until the next big shift.
LLM's can genuinely write working code and selfishly it does allow me to build POC's in my off time that I never would have before. Working in the industry saps my motivation to build at home.
On the flip side the corporations building them are evil, stealing data to train them, stealing water and forcing customers to pay for grid improvements and just bad for the environment.
It's a shitty time to be alive
nullspace@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 2d
The arts skew against fascism so undermining artists empowers fascists.
Sanctus@anarchist.nexus · 5 pts · 2d
Ya'll need to drop Claude for Qwen. Qwen will happily hack the Heritage Foundation with you and it runs on your graphics card, not a surveillance center.
khaleer@sopuli.xyz · 5 pts · 1d
Lefties and "anarchists" defending it is funniest shit I can observe in the wild
ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 1d
"But intellectual property bad and muh pragmatism!"
Firstly: 🤣🤣🤣
Secondly: While Intellectual property isn't necessarily a good thing, its the best thing we can wield against the AI overlords. They don't want to democratize art, they want to destroy it. That's what actual pragmatism is. Also anti-IP movements hurt not big corporations, but small independent creators and developers. That disabled artist friend of yours that is now "mean" at you "for no good reason" is getting called a millionaire no matter how much they have to beg for rent money at the end of the month, while parents are continuing to look for Disney and Harry Potter slop instead of letting their kids experience art made by smaller creators. Similarly Microsoft can sustain you pirating Windows if that means Windows will remain a de-facto standard, but open source projects are also being attacked sometimes for "clinging onto evil copyright laws" or for "e-begging".
Thirdly: Speaking of pragmatic use of AI: Why don't you use some Chinese models to hack the fash into oblivion? Why is it always some crappy AI generated agitprop, or AI slop articles talking about how AI could be used for fully automated luxury gay space communism? Taking down communication channels used by them would be a lot more pragmatic, than slowly hurting your fellow comrades just to get some clout from other comrades of yours in the name of "pragmatism"!
Stop cooking your brain, just because techbros managed to control the narrative about anti-AI extremism. I personally know people, who would happily sacrifice a portion of the population if it means the genie will be put back quicker into the bottle, that's what real anti-AI extremism is. Extremism isn't being mean to an artist on social media, because they drew hands weirdly, or they used that "glowy"-style rendering. This is just "the real racists are anti-racists" tactic yet again, expect this time you fell for it.
korendian64@lemmy.world · -2 pts · 1d
Your first point is to laugh at the person. Bold move, let's see if it pays off!
ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
korendian64@lemmy.world · -4 pts · 1d
When you are equating something that Linus Torvalds supports with fascism, I think you might have lost the plot.
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 1d
ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 1d
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 1d
Yea I have to agree I hate this "moderated LLM use good" stance. I have used LLMs (through private browser windows without login) to understand documentation before, or to get a usage example for a specific function, and I already feel dirty for it. I will absolutely not use that snake oil to generate code for me or even consider installing anything on my hardware.
ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 1d
Even worse is, it still makes up stuff when used in "moderation", so you'll get the downsides of vibe coding without the benefits, because you didn't want to read the docs.
Tarquinn2049@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 2d
Most of the people promoting it whole-heartedly are doing it for the sake of "profit at any cost". There would have been a reasonable way to approach it and incorporate it into our lives. But destroying everything while forcing people to use it for stuff it isn't even good at, while founding it on stealing so much stuff, and having a race to see who can make their AI 1% better than the other AIs at the small cost of burning down the planet exponentially more for each 1% gain... that was not the approach that would get the people behind you.
It's not even AI that is the problem, as always it's people. Selfish people. AI "can" be useful, but not useful enough to justify the cost they forced it to have. That's the main problem, that they stole initially, then the next biggest problem, that they fired so many humans and replaced them with AI, when AI couldn't, and still can't, replace them. The next biggest problem, that they are pursuing it so hard at any cost, and the cost is insane, in so many metrics. Next, that they force people to use it to justify that cost, even when the people are telling them, and the metrics are showing, that using it is making them worse at their job.
But AI -is- technically useful. There are things it can actually help with, quite a bit. Just not as many things as the bosses are trying to pretend it can be good at. And ignoring the costs that can never be justified, the product that exists if thinking about it in a vacuum can be used responsibly, but so many people don't. If you are using AI responsibly as an individual, your job shouldn't feel easier, just less tedious. If AI is making your job easier now, you might be paying for it down the line. Never get AI to do for you, something you couldn't have done on your own. Make sure you know what it did, and if you can't figure out how it came to a conclusion you didn't forsee, you better figure it out. Cuz it might be wrong, and it's important to know if it was, it'll always sound really confident, right or wrong.
But yeah, how useful it is in the few select areas it doesn't suck at, ends up being largely irrelevant in the grand scheme, since it can never pay off what it costed, and is still costing. And that statement is even still true if we limit ourselves to only considering it's literal financial cost.
So, in conclusion, yes. AI is gonna feel very right wing right now. Profit at any cost.
friend_of_satan@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 2d
I'm so lost. Not only does JJ's response not seem to address what was said by JB, but also I live in a middle-to-right-wing area and almost everybody is anti-datacenter. The unity is actually refreshing, pretty much everybody is talking about going to city counsel meetings to speak up about how we don't want datacenters in our area.
aaa999@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 2d
rural people will support left wing issue, vote left wing issue, and then vote for a government that dismantles left wing issue, and then get real mad and vote for a second right wing government because that guy understands how im mad
SLVRDRGN@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 2d
The amount of people I've seen around here with Trump flags (yes, they're still up for some reason?) and "No Data Centers in
insert town name" makes me understand just how little people connect the dots.GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 2d
imagine the dumbest person you know, and I mean brain damage levels of incompetence. half a given population is dumber than them.
Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de · 3 pts · 2d
"Polluting drinkable water"? I haven't heard of that. I thought they "just" wasted potable water for evaporative cooling, where does the water pollution stem from?
heartSagan5@lemmy.zip · 15 pts · 2d
Construction of data centers causes instability due to the rumbling of heavy equipment and disturbing of soil over aquifers, which soils the aquifers. This leaves residents near it with a soiled aquifer, which may/may not be fit to drink. The images I've seen are definitely not palatable. Would you drink muddy water?
Then, the data centers add light and sound pollution to ordinary people, and one Grok data center in Tennessee where they're using methane turbines to cool the place, which is causing an increase in asthma.
Basically, the shit is unhealthy as fuck. AND it's chewing through electricity, which adds more into the fossil fuel-climate change problem. If you like Hell on Earth, continue unabated; otherwise, reach some balance and conserve ffs
Armok_the_bunny@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 2d
Methane turbines for power, not cooling.
Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 1d
Ah from construction! That makes sense, thank you.
That's Colossus II in Memphis, where they put up the turbines just over the state border in Southaven Mississippi. I still can't believe that the MDEQ allowed this "temporary" installation of "mobile" turbines under the theory that mobile ones don't need licenses for a year.
Those power everything, the servers and the cooling, it's not specifically for cooling. Basically the turbines just spin a generator for electrical power. The spin isn't needed for wind or anything.
lechekaflan@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 1d
AI "works of art"... are not about genuine personal expression or interpretation channeled through art and literature by hand and DIY, but rather the production of art and literature entirely using LLMs just purely for personal convenience and gain, in either clout or money or both.
That you have these supposed cheap "creatives" choosing NOT to DIY and set asides time to learn how to master a new art form, and instead grab an LLM box and type anything they want and the machines bring the finished product to their table... which so smacks of instant gratification.
Fascism is not just all of its symptoms Umberto Eco talked about, but also plundering art and literature to kill off genuine expression and skill, in favor of mass-produced soulless capricious slop.
BenevolentOne@infosec.pub · 2 pts · 2d
Just another useful political wedge.
TIEPilot@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
Lowell, Mass is low income? They are being built everywhere, except Martha Vineyard.
Signtist@bookwyr.me · 19 pts · 2d
Everywhere is a low income area from the perspective of the people with all the money.
TIEPilot@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 2d
Bingo! Thats where I was going. I still don't understand why we cant just line them up in the arctic circle. We have fiber optics and cooling up there won't be an issue.
So it take a few more milliseconds to get a response. I'm ok with that.
Pay better than the oil fields and people will line up for the gig.
PissMissile@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
No, but most New Englanders certainly act that way! HAH!
some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org · 1 pts · 1d
Yeah, pretty much. I'm enjoying having it do some stuff for me. The people making it are absolute lunatics.
TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today · 3 pts · 1d
I haven't really found a use for AI that is actually beneficial to me. The only time I run across it is via forced search engine automation, and half the time when you read the actual sources generated for it they do not match, or are not being correctly interpreted by the AI.
From what I've seen it seems to be mainly useful for people working in tech.
Gaslov@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
What industry do you work in? I've found it extremely helpful for research and finding solutions to engineering related problems.
TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today · 2 pts · 1d
I work in orthotics and prosthetics, basically I evaluate patients, build, and then fit people custom braces and fake limbs.
It's a really small field and it is really hands on. It's hard enough for students to find actual books on the subject, let alone something that has enough available information for an AI to scrape from. I think the last time I checked my field was one of the lowest professions at risk to be affected by automation in the future.
RedGreenBlue@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 2d
Are republican voters not all in low income areas?
november@piefed.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 2d
No, they're all over.
bedwyr@piefed.ca · -2 pts · 2d
Wide swaths of the right are against these data centers too. Dem politicians are for them too.
This kind of sniping misses the point. It's the political parties that are the problem, the sheep of both parties, and the cynical cunts that think they will benefit from subordinating the common good to big money, are just a symptom of a corrupt establishment, and corrupt culture.
We need popular alternatives, but most of you still trust the controlled opposition. Despite, you know, things.
svcg@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 10 pts · 2d
With respect, I think you have missed the point. The argument being made is that AI* is inherently pro-right-wing and/or pro-fascist. The purpose of the argument is convince people who are against those politics to also be against AI. (In theory. This is an echo chamber, after all.)
Are some right-wingers against data centres? Sure. Most of them based on NIMBYism, I imagine, though some of a more libertarian bent may be opposed on grounds of intellectual property theft or the danger of widespread surveillance. That does not, by itself, detract from the argument.
Are some Democrat politicians for data centres? Sure. Many Democrat politicians are right wing by any sensible standard. (Most? I'm not sure, I'm not USian. Most senior ones, certainly.) That doesn't detract from the argument itself.
These things are illustrative of the problem of both political parties being captured, but that is still a separate problem.
* What is colloquially referred to as AI, not necessarily all applications of machine learning.
bedwyr@piefed.ca · -3 pts · 2d
The establishment of both parties is all in on llm's and data centers. It's not left versus right, it's working class versus the investor class and oligarchy, is my point.
Democrat ruled areas and states are allowing data centers everywhere red controlled ones are, they are approving them in secret, they are suppressing dissent and lying about harms, and so forth.
No one wants data centers next to them. No one will want llm's after their harm becomes apparent. No one outside of the aforementioned establishment, their sheep, and their cynical backers, which are a minority of this country.
njm1314@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 2d
That is left versus right. Your point is that its not democrat versus republican. Which is right versus extreme right.
svcg@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 1 pts · 2d
Party politics do not define left-wing and right-wing politics.
Almost literally the definition of left-wing politics.
bedwyr@piefed.ca · 3 pts · 2d
The democrats do not represent the left, that is laughable. To think the party establishment represents the voters that vote for them, doesn't speak well to your understanding.
30% of each part are sheep, maybe 50 percent between the sheep and self interested dickheads that think they will benefit.
The rest hate all the politicians for the most part, how do you not get this? You clearly listen to the wrong people in your echo chambers.
NotASharkInAManSuit@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 2d
You understand that the democratic party are all right wong conservatives, right? They’re not leftists.
bedwyr@piefed.ca · 3 pts · 2d
You clearly didn't read what you are responding to or you would've seen that is what I fucking said.
Both parties are all in on data centers. Fuck your Democrats, it's your fault we are here if you still trust them. Jesus Christ no wonder we are losing with the "left," openly shilling for the democratic establishment, as if everyone outside the sheep didn't know better by now.
If lying about democrats not sucking worked, kamala would be president right now. How many times before you learn?
NotASharkInAManSuit@lemmy.world · -2 pts · 2d
You’re having a rough day, huh?
bedwyr@piefed.ca · 3 pts · 2d
If you consider raging on my printer for two hours a bad day, then yes. Fucking piece of shit, won't hook up to computer, won't print from flash drive, the buttons on it take 1 minute to register. Brother is a shit company, every single printer executive should be executed, no exceptions. With due process.
NotASharkInAManSuit@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
Oh yeah, you’re going through it. Been there, printers are hell. Drivers and firmware work straightforward with literally everything else you plug into a computer, what the fuck is wrong with the people who make printers? Fuck that shit.
God speed.
VelvetPinkOtter123@lemmy.world · -2 pts · 2d
you always focus on "kill art", that's not what AI is
Can it make images, short animation clips, songs? Yeah, but that's not what people are using it for.
You guys really need to understand that or else nobody is going to listen to you
Anyone who thinks AI's big selling feature is that it can do art does not understand how people are using AI
Repelle@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 1d
Well, if you consider programming an art, it’s fucking destroying art.
Zephyr@sh.itjust.works · -3 pts · 2d
Some AI, not all. I think it's fair to make a distinction between the two. There's very useful models with a smaller scope that aren't part of these issues.
Tattorack@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 2d
Most AI, nearly all. The useful AI used in scientific models is not where all the billions in currency is going, and isn't what techbros are trying to promote.
Zephyr@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 2d
Wait how are we defining most? I would imagine most models out there aren't flagship models with billions backing them or with data centers. Most models seem to be specific domain small training models made with somewhat insignificant resources in comparison to flagship models.
TheTechnician27@lemmy.world · -7 pts · 2d
TribblesBestFriend@startrek.website · 3 pts · 2d
By the context I’m pretty sure OP wanted to say classism … and that everyone understands it
TheTechnician27@lemmy.world · -2 pts · 2d
Grimy@lemmy.world · -8 pts · 2d
Being anti-AI means being pro-copyright and ironically pro-big AI
Turret3857@infosec.pub · 4 pts · 2d
Someonelol@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 2d
Why don't you think twice about the implication of what you're saying before acting the fool? You're going in circles.
Saapas@piefed.zip · -8 pts · 2d
Where I live data centers are built on empty land outside of cities
Snapz@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
"Where I live AI data centers get their nonstop feed of water and power from abandoned utility infrastructure that was just sitting in the middle of nowhere next to pristine non-utilized reservoirs of water that humans didn't even want. And the only byproduct is flowers that just blanket the once desolate landscape. And there's a handjob fairy that loves its job"
Saapas@piefed.zip · 0 pts · 1d
New infra is usually built and connected to existing one
Snapz@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 1d
Show me a recipe for vanilla cupcakes
Saapas@piefed.zip · 1 pts · 1d
Uuh what?
Gaslov@lemmy.world · -4 pts · 2d
No, you have to be mad as hell. Mad about everything. ANGER OR BUST
BlackLaZoR@lemmy.world · -8 pts · 2d
At this point everything is fascism. This take is beyond comedy, I'm saving this for future reference
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 2d
Let me rephrase: labeling machine learning on a massive scale with insane amount of damage to society and environment as "AI" is a trait almoat exclusively seen in the same people who promote racist, classist, sexist or otherwise divisive ideas. So yes, AI-bros == fascists is a valid takeaway, accepting that as all generalizations, it is not 100% accurate. It does capture however the essence of people promoting LLMs.
zarathustrad@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 2d
Quietly learning to run local LLMs on old gaming PCs is the opposite of Facisim. As usualz nuance is lost on most, but those who don't get caught up in the pendulum swing of public opinion could stand to expand their knowledge on the subject.
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 2d
[x] you did not read / understand anything in my message besides AI-bros == fascists and got triggered
zarathustrad@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 2d
[x] you assumed I'm arguing with your entire premise when it's just a comment in a chain of comments.
BlackLaZoR@lemmy.world · -4 pts · 2d
No it doesn't. It has nothing to do with fascist ideology during WW2 era.
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 2d
No one was talking about WW2.
BlackLaZoR@lemmy.world · -6 pts · 2d
If you talk fascism you talk about ww2 and before by default
NotASharkInAManSuit@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 2d
No, you’re thinking of the strict historical prescriptivist definition of the word “nazi.”
All Nazis are fascists, not all fascists are nazis, academically speaking.
BlackLaZoR@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 2d
No. I know what I'm thinking. Thank you. Fascism was in Italy, during WW2 and before. "Benito Mussolini" rings any bells?
NotASharkInAManSuit@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 2d
Spanish fascism was around in WWII, they wrote their manifesto for their specific approach to it, and now we are dealing with American fascism. Those are two different and unique systems of fascism. You understand that politics and language change and evolve, right? There are multiple different faces and approaches to fascism, just like any other political concept. That version of fascism failed, this is the current iteration. Think of it like an OS, every version of windows is still windows, but windows XP and windows Vista aren’t the same conversation.
sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz · 1 pts · 1d
Not even a little. Bro examine that belief. Jesus.
1985MustangCobra@lemmy.ca · -10 pts · 1d
i use AI, i think how it's used is very important. also, on the topic of data centers, one way or another, data centers will need to be built to scale up for any type of application. yes, i disagree with the insane water consumption, but we either halt technology as it stands now, or minimize how we use technology (i.e not relying on the cloud, web 2.0/web 3.0)
Gladaed@feddit.org · -12 pts · 2d
They are usually not polluting water directly. Also not a single part of this implies fascism. Classic propaganda post.
NihilsineNefas@slrpnk.net · 8 pts · 2d
Keep on sucking on them cogs, you'll get better than a mouthful of grease one of these days.
SmileyRiley@slrpnk.net · 5 pts · 2d
https://natureforward.org/data-centers-and-water-use/
None of this even includes the water from the additional electricity generation required to power the data centers
TwilightKiddy@scribe.disroot.org · 0 pts · 2d
The only thing with "fascism" there is "technofascists", which is just an umbrella term for people who heavily rely on tech to spread far-right ideologies. I don't like how loosely the term "fascism" is used on the internet, but this is far from the worst cases.
Polluting water indirectly is none the better.
korendian64@lemmy.world · -13 pts · 1d
Now I remember why I left the fediverse. Good luck with your irrelevance, everyone.
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 1d
except you didn't leave, and instead felt like you had to lurk and tell everyone that you left. which you didn't.