I used to prefer gas ranges. I grew up with one and really liked that we could still cook when the power was out. Also, fire. I just... kinda like fire.
But learning about the dangers has changed my view. Funny enough, I recently moved into a new place and have an electric stove for the first time. My heart is upset at me, but I can't deny that it's better. Not only are there fewer dangers, but it seems to heat up really fast. Much faster than any of the gas stoves I've used (which have been in almost every house and apartment that I've lived in til now.) I set a pot to boil, go sit down, and it's bubbling before the YouTuber I'm watching finishes gargling their sponsor's balls.
(Kidding, of course. I always skip the sponsor placement.)
I fucking hated the induction stove we had in the 90s, and awe moved into a place with a very nice gas range. One of them rich people brands. And I'm a food snob. Well okay I was before I wokenboken. It's going to be hard to convince me.
In the 90s you probably had one of those shitty glass top coil element stoves. Those things suck. Induction is great. Maybe there was some old tech out there but I love mine
I think a big part of the issue is the wild variances on electric stove quality.
The landlord specials are dogshit and what most people have experience with. Even a bad gas stove is 10x better than those.
But once you get to quality electric ranges, and then induction options, they are superior to gas in basically every way. But very few people have experience with these, or the money to afford upgrading to them when their existing stoves breakdown unexpectedly. So most are stuck with the cheap crappy electric options.
See this explains my experience. Shitty induction range and expensive gas range. Like, if I had a jennair induction to compare to I could make an intelligent analysis but as is I fucking love gas ranges. Very easy to see what you're getting as far as heat.
I've got a higher range induction and there are worlds between that and the run of the mill portable induction stove I bought for cooking smelly/smoky stuff outside. So much so that I prefer the 80's electric hot plate of my mother.
That mobile induction abomination regulates like a microwave: full blast or nothing (in much too long pulses). Cooking on that is a challenge. My stovetop tho goes from just hand warm (keep warm function) to the fires of mount doom in 17 silky smooth steps. I could hardly believe my eyes when it boiled pasta water faster than my electric kettle. As nice as cooking is with that, the biggest advantage is the cleaning...
Fwiw my induction range has blue LEDs built into the glass top so so can see when the big burner is on. I thought it was a stupid gimmick, but it really makes a nice stand-in for that flame
I will never own another Jenn-Air. We had one for a brief period of time. It tried it's best to burn the house down 3 times by shorting out 2 twice and having the thermocouple induce a runaway the last time.
Full size entry level induction is in the 200-300 € range nowadays and already beats gas stoves. Just check your nearest IKEA. There is ZERO reason resistive stoves should still be allowed for sale. NONE. The idea that "induction" is a premium offering is a complete myth and has been for years.
I grew up with one and really liked that we could still cook when the power was out
Is this a north america joke I'm too European to understand? I heard America gets power outages but surely they are not frequent enough this would be something influencing what stove you buy
There are two kinds of studies I really enjoy. 1. Some wildly unexpected result in a classic field. Rare. 2. Quantification of some phenomenon in greater detail, which confirms current understanding. Happens all the time. Love it the most.
Induction stoves should be Mandatory in mew construction. Coil electric works just fine but we need to introduce people to tech that's superior to gas to get the switch to stick
I think that electric cooking speed is only limited by how much power you can draw from your wiring. And if you have good wiring, cooking speeds can be extremely fast. It's a bit like with cars, where people get excited about having a lot of HP (horse power) where idk (i'm not a car expert) sth like 100 HP is considered "crazy good" and everybody wants to have it (that's combustion engine cars). Then, an electric vehicle comes across the corner (and it's not even an expensive EV, just a cheap one) and it easily has 700 HP. Like, the acceleration power is immense, it's enormous. EVs accelerate crazy fast, and it would actually be dangerously powerful if they didn't have software control to throttle the maximum engine power.
Suddenly, everybody stopped talking about HP. All these car-crazy friends i had when i was in school, the moment EVs appeared on the stage, they stopped being impressed by HP.
The same is with electric appliances like cooking stoves. They can be crazy fast and there's no upper limit on power if you get good wiring. It's only limited by the device so you don't accidentally burn your food all the time.
I think that with gas flames, the flames are more-or-less always the same size, while for electric cooking, there's a much greater range in heating power, both up and down. You can also have very small, very gentle heating, that is difficult to get with gas.
I don't get why there's such a huge push from self-declared "left-wing" people to prescribe others what to do. Supposedly, "left-wing" people don't like being told what to do, i.e. by employers (who are making them work in bad ways) or by "main-stream dominant right-wing culture". At the same time, the very same people who don't like being told what to do, tell others what to do. Such as by wanting to force everyone to switch to a specific type of technology that's supposedly superior. I don't get this behavior.
renters don't get a choice in practice, but they should in theory, and pollution from gas stoves is less than from combustion cars, just that it's densely concentrated in your apartment, so levels are still high for you. but it does not affect everyone
a better move would be to actually build social housing, instead of prescribing others what they should build. otherwise you're simply seen as "the party that wants to forbid others from doing what they like", instead of being seen as "the party that actually does some meaningful construction and adds to society that way".
We shouldn't create decades of priced in emissions or have to pau twice to rip out the gas and put in electric later. Might as well do it right the first time
If you have a gas stove and can't afford, or don't want to switch to electric, keep a window open in the kitchen while you cook. This is especially important if your over-the-range hood does not vent to the outside (yes, that's a thing.) If your hood does vent to the outside, turn it on every time you cook and you're golden.
Not just the right filter but a strong enough fan motor to draw air through it. The filter needs to be changed so at some point outside venting becomes cheaper.
The reality is most people never change the filter and rarely use the fan.
I actually have more air quality measures in my home than most and I have multiple sensors measuring the quality of the air. I be been measuring it long enough to know exactly what causes my air quality to decrease.
I also do not live in or near a big city.
Your ignorance is not equal to my knowledge situation. I wouldn't expect a willfully ignorant person to believe this.
I wish someone pointed this out 20 years ago (enough to be heard). I raised two kids with occasional asthma in a house with gas stove, and maybe that could have been different.
I recently converted from gas to induction, and find it a much better cooking appliance in every way. Pans on the stovetop heat up faster than with gas, and I can boil a pot of water faster. The oven has more options and more consistent heating, especially on the broiler.
The only problem was the cost. Way too much money to get a new circuit installed but also the range was double or more what I would have spent on gas. There were very few options at appliance stores, and I never did find one on display, of any brand. In the US, it’s unnecessarily difficult to make this switch.
When I was shopping for one I was told to pay attention to coil sizes. Sure enough experimenting with a large skillet on small coil shows very uneven heating. I did find one or two reasonable priced ranges but with only tiny coils. Even at spending way too much, I only have one coil that works well with 12” skillet or stock pot. I know ikea now sells an induction range for more reasonable price but coil size is critical and the first thing I’d look at
Having a proper exhaust hood that sucks air outside mitigates this to a huge degree, but a lot of us have hoods that "filter" the air through nothing and then shoot it up towards the ceiling.
The flippers who did my house disconnected the outside air vent, I'm still pissed and mean to get it fixed, cause I can't afford an induction range either.
If you think you can't afford an induction range, you also can't afford to hire contractors to have your new ductwork put in and/or unborked.
Much as I hate to recommend Frigidaire for various reasons, the FCFI3083AS is I think the most economical freestanding 30" induction range on the market at the moment and has an MSRP of $1099. You can probably score one from some discount or independent appliance retailers (i.e. not Home Depot, Lowes, or Best Buy) for a little under a thousand.
As a taller guy who wears glasses, I’ve had the horrible experience of some of these filters blowing greasy air in my face and settling on my glasses. Not pleasant
Mine has a vent, but no hood so there’s only so much it can do. And the way they built out the kitchen means there’s no good way to install a hood without remodelling.
But now I don’t care as much. The current vent (and window) is good enough for induction
It's a failure to read the manual thing. Every OTR microwave ever manufactured functions as a hood by definition, and basically all of them (I can only think of like two exceptions) have the option to be configured for either recirculation or to duct outside. It's just that most models come out of the box already configured for recirculation and most people ('s contractors) are so averse to reading that they fail to realize you can flip the blower motor over and thus cause it to actually accomplish something (provided a duct is in place) rather than just blowing stale air back in your face.
The ducting behind a microwave is not that common in my experience. It makes sense for microwaves to come preconfigured to recirculate instead of trying to exhaust to a sheet of drywall because most people are going to install it how it comes out of the box. I’ve installed dozens of microwaves and only twice has ducting existed to flip the venting for. Higher end houses typically have dedicated exhaust fans and lower end houses never seem to have ducting for a microwave. I installed a dedicated fan that exhausts out the roof at my house. Even with ducting those microwave exhaust fans barely provide anything of value. I’m sure my experience is very regional but it seems like a really niche middle ground where someone would bother venting out of the kitchen but also not care enough to have a purpose built exhaust fan.
Part of the problem there is I have guys just absolutely insist at me that a microwave "can't" be vented outside so they don't bother to install a duct, and tell me that in order to vent outside you "have" to get a hood instead. This is obviously bogus.
This also leads to the inevitable Contractor Special where a duct was there, often when the user is replacing an old hood with a microwave, but the installer just shrugs and slaps the microwave on the wall as-is where A) it is inevitably too tall and now way too close to the stovetop, and B) covering the duct outlet while still recirculating back into the room. Whenever I unearth one of these in my travels it makes me want to track down whoever the hell installed it and then punch them so hard they come clean out of their socks.
People are for some reason hyperfixated on getting appliances off of their countertops, which is why the over-the-range microwaves became so prevalent in the first place. (And then they all immediately filled the spot where their countertop microwave used to be with a countertop air fryer instead, but that's a whole different discussion.)
Yeah that would drive me insane to run across. It’s not even particularly hard to tell that the exhaust fan motor is reversible just by looking at the top/back of the microwave before it is installed. Every one I’ve seen looks pretty damn modular in comparison to the rest of the microwave shell.
Edit: reversible is the wrong word, able to be unscrewed and rotated, I’m sure you know what I meant but on a reread of my comment I wanted to clarify.
Because a lot of people assume that everything is fine with things that have been around forever. They need a heads up or a reminder that it isn't the case.
More like researches need to constantly publish. If they take up too much time with some big project they will lose funding as non productive scholar. That's why we have so much bullshit papers saying "water is wet". Publish or perish.
eh...if you want the horde to adopt something you need to put a reference to it in a popular movie/show. not an ad but like...some kind of plotline where someone blows up their house/dies via gas-stove.
and of course...make it cheap, majority of america lives paycheck to paycheck...when your living paycheck to paycheck the only thing that matters (especially in the US, with it's lack of basic social safety nets) is $
only the nerdiest of nerds reads at all, let alone reads research publications.
Speaking as a board member in a housing community where we are actively dealing with residents who claim that their precious gas stoves are safe and they don't want electric replacements, I appreciate this post being shared.
People are so fucking weird! Like yeah instant heat is nice, but induction cook tops do it without poisoning your lungs. But people (conservatives) will claim it's superior in some way or another in order to be a contrarian.
Induction can also boil water much faster than gas ever could. And to be honest, as much hate as they get, I would even prefer non-induction electric over gas at this point.
I really wish I could get them to work properly, but my moka pot doesn't boil properly on a standard electric coil stove. Mine (hot plate) cycles on and off (at maximum heat and off rather than some intermediate temperature) causing inconsistent heating through the boiling cycle, making bad coffee.
I was raised with the coil guys. And even if it didn't release nitrous byproducts, just the safety factor of an electric stove being <<< than gas to blow up.
That's a significantly larger gap than what I see here at my local Lowe's. We have electric and gas stoves both about $550 at the cheapest. The gas one is $10 cheaper, not much of a price point. The induction one is $850 at the cheapest, so about 55% more expensive. That's definitely not the 3x cost difference you see here.
I can only get close to those numbers you quote by selecting a high-end induction stoves. They don't sell gas range or oven only for less, but I could see that being a cheaper alternative. Also, their search is weird and I had to specify gas to find gas stoves.
It took decades of propaganda. Paying off cooking shows and influencers to have big, obvious gas stoves. They even popularized the phrase “cooking with gas” as a euphemism for anything fast. If it was so much better, it would have sold its self.
But people (conservatives) will claim it’s superior in some way or another in order to be a contrarian.
no, that's not the reason. induction stoves are really only around for a couple years, IIRC, and old electric stoves simply weren't that great. they were mostly slow. gas, you turned on and had heat. electric meant that you had to wait for the glass pane to heat up below your cooking gear. on top of that, gas was typically cheaper than electric.
that's really only changing now, where renewable energy provides cheap electricity, while gas prices are increasing due to international situation. it simply takes a while for the news to spread, and not everybody has gotten the news yet. renewable energy will be much cheaper than gas in the long run, thanks to solar energy, and that's a news that really only started being economically meaningful around 2 years ago. It simply takes a long time for the news to go around and everybody hear it.
No, we don't force anyone to do anything, electric replacements are offered as a "free" upgrade. We're a housing cooperative, so technically it's not free, but it's paid for by the community's collective funds.
The other main problem is that people routinely forget to turn off their stoves. We've had the fire department come multiple times this year alone because someone left their gas on and filled their unit with it. One resident left his gas open for who knows how long before he passed out in his living room and shit himself. Luckily someone found him and called the paramedics.
I guess if it was one person living in the wilderness and they blew themselves up or suffocated, then that's on them. In a community though, it endangers everyone nearby.
I monitored my indoor air quality prior to getting rid of my gas stove and even with windows open, the levels of the monitored pollutants skyrocket when the stove or oven was going. Maybe if you had a box fan blowing in/out for a long time after you finish you’d be ok, but that’s not ideal if you’re heating/cooling your place.
However I will tell you my experience. People in these threads will always tell you that induction is better than gas. That might be true, but as a renter I'll never know it. Gas is better to cook on than the coil electric stoves which is what I always get in a rental. No landlord is going to spend the extra on an induction cooktop when a coil electric is one of the cheapest options.
I understand that, I've lived with gas ovens most of the time as well. Interestingly, the studio I just moved into (which is freshly converted from a garage) has a new fridge and an electric flat-top range. But I rent from a lone guy, not from a standardized apartment community. So maybe that's why he invested in the good stuff. Renovating an entire complex is way pricier than setting up a single apartment.
I also think I just got lucky. It's not a perfect place - the insulation sucks, there are paint flecks on the floor and kitchen cabinets, the shower hot/cold are backwards (which confused the hell out of me at first. I thought my hot water wasn't working) and I saw a mouse recently. But I can't complain, because the landlord is responsive and the good appliances help balance out the negatives.
some cities/states have government mandated rules requiring gas to every home. normally some dinosaur provision before the advent of electrical appliances, to insure new-builds had heat and stuff for winter (landlords have always been cheap SOB's). and sometimes that comes with a state-mandated gas monopoly (rarely a properly public-funded venture...normally some scummy price gouging company)
some even have some bullshit where you have to pay the gas-company anyway for your electrical appliances, through some equivalency-meter type shit (i assume that stuff was just lobbied bribed for by the gas companies)
And there was huge pushback a couple years ago when a few places wanted to change that - new construction must be electric only. While I can see builders like to be cheap, anything moderately expensive should be able to get heat pumps and induction at no real cost difference to gas
Switching can be expensive, but doing the right thing on construction much less so. We now have a bunch of new infrastructure/technology we’ll expect our future houses to have, and it’s past time we started doing so on new construction, where it’s much cheaper than converting
We replaced our gas stove with induction and our water heater with an electric one this past year and disconnected the gas. Now our solar panels offset a lot of the cost of electricity and our main bill is for water.
Happy with an induction cooktop, it boils water quicker and is easier to keep clean. My only concern is someone dropping a heavy pot onto the glass surface.
We averaged 1800 litres a day according to our last bill, but it’s summer here in Australia so the reticulation for the garden is on and the pool needs to be topped up because of evaporation.
Our last bill showed an average of 763 litres a day usage so that would represent the cooler months.
A quality electric makes a big difference fwiw. I’ve gone through several types depending on where I lived. I gotta admit that gas is my favorite to cook on. Just so many ways to control heat, where the heat is, and how quickly the heat can be changed. Most electric cooktops and ovens are shit unless you buy an upper tier brand, and even then heating a big coil under a glass top is inefficient AF.
Just switched to induction. While not the same as gas, and it does have a few peculiarities, it is by far better than standard electric cooktops. Way fast, more efficient, easy. These need to come down in price to help win over people used to gas.
I have found gas consistently shit for cooking at low temperatures because you can't turn it down low enough. Minimum power on the lowest ring, nope, still far too hot right in the middle of the pan.
As a foil: I grew up with an electric oven. Used an electric ofen through the 70s, 80s, 90s, 00s, and finally got a gas oven in 2017.
Because I was concerned about gas in the home, methane, CO, etc. I invested in a bunch of sensors so I’d know the moment any of it became an issue.
It’s been almost 9 years now, and I’ve yet to experience an issue.
However, that whole “you can use it when the power’s out” thing: can’t use the oven; the valve is electric. On my first gas range, the range wouldn’t even come on without electricity.
The pots and pans I use now are designed for gas and heat up fast, maintain an even heat, and cool down fast.
Essentially, I think not all devices are created equal.
I like not depending on a single utility for my energy needs, but at the same time wouldn’t shed a tear if methane production vanished tomorrow (I’d probably convert to propane short term and electric long-term).
What metrics did you monitor? With my air quality monitor I’d see CO2, particulate, nox skyrocket in rooms even far away from the gas stove. If you got a carbon monoxide detector + explosive gas detector then yeah you wouldn’t get any alarms with normal use, but those aren’t the only pollutants to monitor.
I like not depending on a single utility for my energy needs
We had an extended outage in our neighborhood. Just over a week. I let the neighbors know I had enough wood and charcoal to keep the smoker at 275 all week and we could pop on the propane grills if we needed something hotter (I have been blessed with an abundance of backyard cookery). Fed half the neighborhood at some point that week, everyone at least got some ribs.
Last thing I want the folk on my street to do is go hungry, especially if all what's wrong is the electricity.
Yes, actually. I can see the level go up slightly when the burners go on, but when the ventilation fan kicks in, the levels go back down almost immediately.
That’s what should actually be illegal. I see those everywhere now, and I can’t believe they were ever allowed. Mine is bad enough as a ceiling vent without hood but at least it does vent outside
One unexpected change with induction is the handles of my cast iron skillets take much longer to get hot. If I cook something relatively fast, like an egg, I can now pick up the cast iron bare handed!
But if I wanted to cook during a power outage, I have a propane grill.
Actually, it’s kind of amusing that my main grill is a pellet grill with powered auger to feed the pellets, so I can’t use that in a power outage
Wow calm there buddy. Ask any chef and they’ll tell you why the use gas. Inductions… a fancy gimmick if you have a good set of pots. Try using a wok on an induction stove 🤣
I was thinking of the electrical grid :-) And then heating with heat exchange either to air or to ground, which of course also requires electrical power.
Edit: Unless you want to go autonomous with regards to electrical power. Then the energy storage would become the potentially deadly local infrastructure, I suppose.
plus electricity is crazy flexible. you can easily transform electric power into other types of power, such as mechanical power (rotary movement), lighting, heat, computation.
with gas, you can only really turn it into heat. for all other uses, you'd first have to translate it into electric power or use a very bulky combustion engine.
I switched from gas to a 200v induction cooktop and I don't think I would go back. Quality definitely matters. I have a cassette gas stove for power outages or if I have something that absolutely must use gas (so far, it's never been pulled out).
It depends on the stove. The gas stoves in my building are much better, but that is because this place is ancient and the electric cooktops in question are whatever crap they find secondhand.
Depends on the quality of the stove. The bad ones regulate like most resistive glass ceramic stoves in on/off pulses, which is fine for ceramic because the thermal capacity smoothes everything. I've got a mobile induction plate like that tho and it is absolutely horrible to work with.
My decent quality stove top goes from just hand warm (keep warm function) to the fires of mount doom (power function for boiling water) in 17 silky smooth steps. On top of the pulses there is some power regulation as well (you can hear the coil hum change depending on power).
In my experience, yes. The only difference is that you don't have a visual flame so it takes a little getting used to which setting means what (unless you have the type with a knob and a temperature readout, but I do not).
Regardless of that, higher end modern gas stoves won't allow you to use the stovetop during a power outage anyway even if you match light them, because they have electronic flame presence sensors for safety. And no modern gas range or gas oven with electronic oven controls will allow you to use the oven without power.
We had maybe one in the past 12 years where I live. A lot of people around me have had more, but my house specifically hasn't had a major one that I can recall. We've been thinking about switching away from gas stove eventually.
A backup power generator that will run a household stove is kind of a tall order; most of the portable gasoline models on the American market won't put out 220v.
I've got an electric stove, and I've got a backyard grill that runs on propane and propane accessories. Ain't no power outage gonna starve me.
Every elective stove I've used has sucked for controlling the temperature. I'll deal with a little air pollution to have my food actually come out how I want it. Maybe induction ones are better but those are expensive.
Congratulations, I've cooked on all sorts of things too. Doesn't mean some weren't objectively better than others. I personally don't want to deal with a shitty heat source that I have to fight with to get it to work properly and is slow as shit to actually heat up.
Yes, induction stoves are the solution. The way I went about it is I bought a secondhand hob for just $110. Works brilliantly, controls just as well as gas. As a bonus, pumping all the energy straight into the cookware makes it heat things up REAL fast.
Regular electric stove is very inert, making it straight up impossible to do a lot of stuff.
I know little of cooking tortillas, but to me the main limiter with gas cooking is that it cuts off at certain gas pressure, not allowing you to use it at very low heating.
Also, it mainly heats in a certain ring and not equally through the whole surface, which might probably be critical for tortillas unless you have a big cast iron pan.
I think it might simply be a matter of getting used to it. For example, i can cook well enough with an electric (induction) furnace but it's difficult for me to use a gas stove without burning my food.
Try: putting it on the highest setting,
Use less water (10+liter is a lot and can happen quickly in big pots),
Plug it into 3 phase power
Make sure to use the highest power section
In a lot of cases ceran cooktops have higher power delivery to the pot than gas.
Also read the manual for how much power each burner has.
Guess what else would drastically reduce air pollution. Switching to electric heating aka heat pumps instead of burning wood and coal. While cooking the ventilation is already good enough but if you cannot open the damn windows because everyone is poisoning the air…
Same goes for various industries and energy production in general. Burning stuff is usually the easiest way to do it, but it comes with some serious long term consequences. Ideally, we would use renewables to produce electricity, and then use that electricity to heat things up when needed.
Unfortunately, large parts of various industries has been built around the idea of burning things instead of using electricity. In order to fully transition, we would need to completely rebuild many factories and radically modify countless others.
Like anything else, it could have gone smoothly if we did it in an intelligent way as opportunity presents, but turning it partisan, proceeding in fits and starts, only looking short term, refusing out of fear of change, means we keep putting it off. That’s just going to build into an emergency.
On top of that, the economics only make it harder. Those who take dirty shortcuts, will have lower CAPEX and maybe even OPEX. This gives them a competitive advantage compared to those companies that choose to follow a more sustainable path.
Im stuck with an all electric house... to expensive just to live and it has left me with no money to upgrade to cheaper options like heat pumps and solar. My monthly equal payment plan is currently $850 a month. This is with me keeping my house cold during winter where its set to 64 on average. At night I drop it to 58. Maybe one day ill be able to afford it to break this shitty cycle.
Yeah, I grew up in an all electric house, and even as a kid who didn’t have to pay bills, I hated it and vowed never to be stuck in one again.
But heat pumps make a huge difference in heating cost and induction is better than cooking with gas.
You do have to factor in the cost of utilities and where I live electricity is very expensive. Even here regular heat pumps are cheaper than heating with propane or oil (or of course resistive electric) but gas is still cheapest. Installers generally recommend a hybrid system so you can use the heat pumps in the shoulder seasons, but gas when it’s cold. If you could use a ground source heat pump or solar panels, that changes everything.
But all that is hugely expensive to convert to and we’re not going to make any progress if that’s the way forward. Requiring it for new construction, where it’s much cheaper, is the least we can do, but this is something that’s worth a little government help
My state still has incentives for landlords and homeowners by income level: any chance there’s some help there?
Gas stoves have a place, and I'm not about to take away anyone's choice on the matter. With all that being said, to the title of this article, I say "duh".... Honestly, who thought that cooking using an open flame inside your home was somehow safer than the alternative?
I use electric, I've pretty much always used electric. I will continue to use some form of electric stove. I want to have complete control over the heat going into my cookware, and while it may not be as flashy or as quick to use electric, I can't see any situation where electric would not be safer.
I had gas stoves my whole life until about 5 years ago I when I moved into this home I live in now that doesn't have gas lines in the neighborhood. I have a glass top electric stove, not induction and after about a week of adjustment it suits my purposes just fine and I got used to it and it wasn't a big deal at all. I cook pretty much every meal my family and I eat at home too with 0 issues.
Growing up we usedgas. Mother's home (not our childhood home) also has gas. I'm in a home that is wired for either but had electric when I moved in. We had to replace the stove and I choose to keep it electric which surprised my mom. "But gas baking is so much nicer!" And no it's not. Electric interior was much easier and nicer to use. But she didn't bake much so lol.
This is odd to me, as someone who has owned both gas and electric. Baking is pretty comparable between the two. Preheat oven, put in item for amount of time. Though, our gas oven's exhaust would really heat up the kitchen, which was not so great in the summer.
Usually when people praise gas it's about stovetop performance. As gas instantly changes temperature and lets you use things like woks. I have also heard people praise them for working in power outages just fine.
The glass top electrics are so damn easy to clean though. That alone has made them the winner for me. On the other side, every exposed coil electric I have used sucked ass and I would pick a gas well before I pick one of those.
Well because it is woke. And that's a good thing. Acknowledging that gas stoves cause indoor pollution is woke as fuck.
So sick and tired of "woke" being used as a negative term, because the republicans labeled it as such. They hate it so much because they hate change, even if it's positive change for the betterment of society.
Cheap 90s era induction stoves in apartments that are still kicking give induction a bad name. New ones are the closest thing you can get to temperature control and speed of a full burner stove. My ideal would be an induction stove with one zone rounded for a round bottom wok. For a home kitchen, it's the best choice because you're not going to get the amazing jet burner stoves you get in commercial kitchens
I have cooked on gas, induction, infrared and the old style resistive elements. Currently I have a Wolf duel fuel range which is one of the best you can buy in the U.S. and I love it.
I'll just come out and say it...
Gas has seen its day. I say that as a current gas cook top user.
A good quality induction cook top is fantastic. It gets a lot hotter faster than gas while also simmering better. Responsiveness is off the charts too, depending on how heavy your cookware is, which is gas's major advantage over older electric cook tops. The only issue I personally have with induction is that cheaper units make a weird buzzing noise with some cookware and settings. I did get to cook on a Viking induction cook top a few times and did not notice that issue.
Honest answer: Induction stoves aren't shit in the US. They don't run at a lower voltage because our homes are wired for 240V same as Europe.
Honest explanation: The American power grid closely remembles anyone else's, we've got the big long distance power lines up on those big pylons that transmit power in the megavolts, those get stepped down at substations to a dozen kilovolts to snake into neighborhoods, and then those pole mounted transformers step it down to 240V to make the couple hundred foot trip from the pole to a few houses. The difference is that in America, the transformer is connected to the house with three wires, not two. The third wire is a center tap, so you have the two outer wires and a center wire.
Measure the voltage between the outer two wires, you find 240V. Measure between the center wire and either of the outer two, you find 120V.
Most of the normal outlets throughout an American home or business are wired between one of the outers and the center, to deliver 120V. But, we routinely wire some circuits across the two outer wires for 240V, we even have special plugs for this to make sure you don't plug a 120V appliance into a 240V outlet. Things such as electric water heaters, HVAC units, clothes dryers, electric car chargers and electric stoves are indeed wired for 240V here.
Induction cooktops took on a low reputation in the US because early models were hilariously expensive (Westinghouse was selling an induction range in the 70's for $1500, that's about $10,000 in today's money) and not particularly reliable. Another factor was all the trendy cookware from the 60's on. CorningWare and Pyrex (ceramic and borosilicate glass) was huge in the 70's, Calphalon (anodized aluminum) and Revere Ware (high-nickel stainless steel) was on all the wedding registries in the 80's, and solid copper was big in the early 90's. None of which work on induction stoves. Which means, for decades, Americans perceived induction ranges as gimmicky crap that required "special" cookware, that to buy into an induction range would require throwing away all your pots and pans. Americans continued preferring resistive coil electric or natural gas stoves.
Well, we arrived into the 21st century, teflon-coated steel and tri-ply stainless pans come into vogue, Corning stops making consumer ceramic and glass products, Revere changes their stainless formula, and now we find that most cookware on the market is induction compatible. Induction stoves are the fastest growing market segment in kitchen appliances in the US, everybody wants one.
In the us, wall sockets run on 110v, but it's standard for all residencies to also have specific appliance wall sockets specially wired for 220v, usually two areas of a home, for washer/dryer and stove/oven. It's a totally different plug design, too.
I don't personally have induction, but I know people that have them and say they love them.
What nobody is saying is that they’re viewed and priced as premium items, almost double the cost of a cheap electric cooktop and even more than gas. For instance, cheapest I could find for a basic multi-burner in-countertop cooktop with a quick search: Gas $175, Electric $199, Induction $330. This gets worse for a typical range that is found in most homes (cooktop/oven combo). You can get a cheap gas range for under $500. An induction range starts at just under $1000.
220v isn't achieved via two phases; we get 110v out of a single phase by center tapping the transformer. The center tap wire is called the "neutral" and is at ground potential, and then the two "hot" wires. There's 110v between the neutral and either one of the hots, and the hots are 220v apart. It's still one phase.
Note I used 110/220v here and 120/240 above. peak-to-peak, root-mean-square, ask an actual electrician, I'm just an asshole on the internet.
You'd presumably install a 240, a NEMA 6-20, so you can get all the power you need. So a 6-20 gets about 5k watts, versus 3k for standard British plug, versus 2400 on US standard. And these numbers are all fudgy because for some reason it all varies.
I'm here in Europe where I've never ever seen anyone using a gas stove, ever. Not even the old timey stove in my grandparents' tiny summer home. I'm almost 40 years old. Seriously, gas stoves are ancient and not efficient.
Going from a 1 to a 7 back to a 1 takes about 20 minutes on an induction.
Bullshit, it takes seconds. On my consumer grade home hob even. Not even sure what a "7" means, but from highest heat (14, or even the P(ower) mode) to lowest heat (1) takes probably 30 seconds or less on my hob as well.
Induction is very responsive both up and down. Not sure what kind of garbage/faulty equipment you've tried that takes twenty minutes, but that is not representative in any way whatsoever.
I guess gas would have to be a quarter as efficient as induction for it to be worth it. I don't know of exact numbers regarding that. Interesting point.
I do, yes. But people are renovating and modernizing their homes and I don't know anyone who chose induction - they are available here, and so is electricity.
Indeed, that is very much true. Electric stoves are also much safer as it is less likely to cause a fire.
But still, I'm pretty pissed it is very VERY difficult to find a house on rent with gas stoves. I don't care about this stuff, I like cooking and there's nothing better (except a cooking wood stove) to cook in a house.
I'm just sad about that, besides that if you do not care about which one to cook on for sure go ahead with induction.
Another fuckass article trying to shift blame to the individual instead of holding gigantic corporations and tech giants responsible for making conditions so bad that even indoor air is polluted.
not… quite. these are research findings that what we've long suspected is true: gas stoves aren't great for your indoor environment. the question you should really be asking isn't "why are we saying this now" but "why is there so much pro-natural gas stove propaganda out there in the world when modern energy efficient electric stoves are just as good in the areas that gas excels in at a lower long term cost to the owner?"
what you'll find is that it's the gas companies who are pushing the narrative that gas is better and landlords not performing upgrades because they don't cover their tenants' utility bills so those upgrades cut into their exploitative profit models. so. yes, the problem is gigantic corporations and the capital class in general. but don't shoot the messenger, especially when the messenger has brought you weaponry to arm yourself against a common enemy
Not everything is propaganda man, using that argument against people's directly observed comparisons and preferences kinda undermines the whole idea. I've got panels on the roof and an electric chainsaw, propane is still the best fit for my stove. I've got wood, diesel, and electric heat, all of which have their season. It's easy to get blindly optimistic about exciting new tech (electric cars are probably the biggest one here) but nothing is universally applicable and you need to have some faith that your fellow man is an intelligent, thinking being trying to navigate this world just like you
Nah, that's selfish as fuck. Gas lines have innumerable leaks and methane has much more greenhouse potential than CO2. It doesn't make sense to have gas lines in 2025, and they should be substituted by electricity for ecological reasons
It’s not just a matter of dying faster, it’s raising kids with asthma, gasping for breath at any cold or allergy, unnecessary pain and hospital stays, and taking longer to get over colds. It’s your aging parents wheezing and coughing, hospitalized after not catching breath, and yes, dying early of colds
Its more like you can't use a wok on a cheap electric stove, but you can use it on a cheap gas stove. That's it. You get what you pay for and landlords are parasites, so if you rent gas is what you prefer.
With wok specifically, you either have the specific Chinese high burner that you absolutely can not and should not have in your house, or you can't do fancy tossing. I am unsure fancy tossing actually achieves anything, but even if it is, you can't do proper technique at your home kitchen anyway, even with the highest quality flame burner.
For what it's worth I have an induction stove and if I put my steel wok on it empty I can made the bottom third of it glow red hot within about 10 seconds of powering it on.
Gas is absolutely not necessary for this, but there is a grain of truth to the fact that outside of induction stovetops, practically all radiant electric stoves do indeed suck ass.
Well fuck me. According to the downvotes I should really switch to an electric stove (which I can't because my kitchen doesn't have the proper outlet for it, so I need to convince the landlord to install it) and then I can cook food with electricity generated by burning coal or uranium.
Thanks for making me a better human being, I guess.
229 Comments
Whats_your_reasoning@lemmy.world · 57 pts · 221d
I used to prefer gas ranges. I grew up with one and really liked that we could still cook when the power was out. Also, fire. I just... kinda like fire.
But learning about the dangers has changed my view. Funny enough, I recently moved into a new place and have an electric stove for the first time. My heart is upset at me, but I can't deny that it's better. Not only are there fewer dangers, but it seems to heat up really fast. Much faster than any of the gas stoves I've used (which have been in almost every house and apartment that I've lived in til now.) I set a pot to boil, go sit down, and it's bubbling before the YouTuber I'm watching finishes gargling their sponsor's balls.
(Kidding, of course. I always skip the sponsor placement.)
SapphironZA@sh.itjust.works · 39 pts · 221d
Induction tops are the best. Instant heat, very safe and energy efficient. Not compatible with cheap non magnetic cookware though.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · -12 pts · 220d
I fucking hated the induction stove we had in the 90s, and awe moved into a place with a very nice gas range. One of them rich people brands. And I'm a food snob. Well okay I was before I wokenboken. It's going to be hard to convince me.
tyrant@lemmy.world · 27 pts · 220d
In the 90s you probably had one of those shitty glass top coil element stoves. Those things suck. Induction is great. Maybe there was some old tech out there but I love mine
SapphironZA@sh.itjust.works · 23 pts · 220d
Not sure if induction stoves existed back then.
Do you recall if it got hot with no pot on it?
If it got hot with nothing on it, it was not an induction top, but a normal electric one with glass on top.
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 5 pts · 220d
I don't think anybody wants to convince you, it's your own choice.
MisterFrog@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 219d
The fact you didn't reply to any of the replies here makes me think you're not capable of having your mind changed.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 218d
Or I had other shit to do than be on the internet, but you do you King
MisterFrog@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 218d
Sorry, yeah this is fair. I did not read the timestamps properly.
halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 221d
I think a big part of the issue is the wild variances on electric stove quality.
The landlord specials are dogshit and what most people have experience with. Even a bad gas stove is 10x better than those.
But once you get to quality electric ranges, and then induction options, they are superior to gas in basically every way. But very few people have experience with these, or the money to afford upgrading to them when their existing stoves breakdown unexpectedly. So most are stuck with the cheap crappy electric options.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 220d
See this explains my experience. Shitty induction range and expensive gas range. Like, if I had a jennair induction to compare to I could make an intelligent analysis but as is I fucking love gas ranges. Very easy to see what you're getting as far as heat.
Onsotumenh@discuss.tchncs.de · 3 pts · 220d
I've got a higher range induction and there are worlds between that and the run of the mill portable induction stove I bought for cooking smelly/smoky stuff outside. So much so that I prefer the 80's electric hot plate of my mother.
That mobile induction abomination regulates like a microwave: full blast or nothing (in much too long pulses). Cooking on that is a challenge. My stovetop tho goes from just hand warm (keep warm function) to the fires of mount doom in 17 silky smooth steps. I could hardly believe my eyes when it boiled pasta water faster than my electric kettle. As nice as cooking is with that, the biggest advantage is the cleaning...
AA5B@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
Fwiw my induction range has blue LEDs built into the glass top so so can see when the big burner is on. I thought it was a stupid gimmick, but it really makes a nice stand-in for that flame
Bluewing@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
I will never own another Jenn-Air. We had one for a brief period of time. It tried it's best to burn the house down 3 times by shorting out 2 twice and having the thermocouple induce a runaway the last time.
azertyfun@sh.itjust.works · -1 pts · 220d
Full size entry level induction is in the 200-300 € range nowadays and already beats gas stoves. Just check your nearest IKEA. There is ZERO reason resistive stoves should still be allowed for sale. NONE. The idea that "induction" is a premium offering is a complete myth and has been for years.
Anivia@feddit.org · 5 pts · 220d
Is this a north america joke I'm too European to understand? I heard America gets power outages but surely they are not frequent enough this would be something influencing what stove you buy
JcbAzPx@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Summer thunderstorms will knock out power, especially in the Midwest where tornadoes are common.
Anivia@feddit.org · 1 pts · 219d
Fascinating, where I'm from power outages are a once in a lifetime occurrence. I've never experienced one
RheumatoidArthritis@mander.xyz · 1 pts · 220d
It's called disaster preparedness
DarrinBrunner@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 221d
In Pornhub, gargling the balls is the content. It's all about context... condoms.
Atelopus-zeteki@fedia.io · 42 pts · 221d
There are two kinds of studies I really enjoy. 1. Some wildly unexpected result in a classic field. Rare. 2. Quantification of some phenomenon in greater detail, which confirms current understanding. Happens all the time. Love it the most.
Integrating indoor and outdoor nitrogen dioxide exposures in US homes nationally by ZIP code https://academic.oup.com/pnasnexus/article/4/12/pgaf341/8361964?login=false
Switching to electric stoves can dramatically cut indoor air pollution https://news.stanford.edu/stories/2025/12/gas-propane-stoves-nitrogen-dioxide-exposure-health-risks-switching-electric
fluffykittycat@slrpnk.net · 41 pts · 221d
Induction stoves should be Mandatory in mew construction. Coil electric works just fine but we need to introduce people to tech that's superior to gas to get the switch to stick
HugeNerd@lemmy.ca · 26 pts · 220d
User name checks out.
tyrant@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 220d
I got an induction maybe 10 years ago or so. It is amazing how fast I can boil water or just get going in general. Lovely tech
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 220d
I think that electric cooking speed is only limited by how much power you can draw from your wiring. And if you have good wiring, cooking speeds can be extremely fast. It's a bit like with cars, where people get excited about having a lot of HP (horse power) where idk (i'm not a car expert) sth like 100 HP is considered "crazy good" and everybody wants to have it (that's combustion engine cars). Then, an electric vehicle comes across the corner (and it's not even an expensive EV, just a cheap one) and it easily has 700 HP. Like, the acceleration power is immense, it's enormous. EVs accelerate crazy fast, and it would actually be dangerously powerful if they didn't have software control to throttle the maximum engine power.
Suddenly, everybody stopped talking about HP. All these car-crazy friends i had when i was in school, the moment EVs appeared on the stage, they stopped being impressed by HP.
The same is with electric appliances like cooking stoves. They can be crazy fast and there's no upper limit on power if you get good wiring. It's only limited by the device so you don't accidentally burn your food all the time.
I think that with gas flames, the flames are more-or-less always the same size, while for electric cooking, there's a much greater range in heating power, both up and down. You can also have very small, very gentle heating, that is difficult to get with gas.
Nalivai@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 220d
Modern electric heaters are also superior to gas in any way. And yeah, induction is just a new level of superiority.
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · -3 pts · 220d
I don't get why there's such a huge push from self-declared "left-wing" people to prescribe others what to do. Supposedly, "left-wing" people don't like being told what to do, i.e. by employers (who are making them work in bad ways) or by "main-stream dominant right-wing culture". At the same time, the very same people who don't like being told what to do, tell others what to do. Such as by wanting to force everyone to switch to a specific type of technology that's supposedly superior. I don't get this behavior.
fluffykittycat@slrpnk.net · 2 pts · 220d
Renters don't get a choice, and pollution affects everyone
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 220d
renters don't get a choice in practice, but they should in theory, and pollution from gas stoves is less than from combustion cars, just that it's densely concentrated in your apartment, so levels are still high for you. but it does not affect everyone
a better move would be to actually build social housing, instead of prescribing others what they should build. otherwise you're simply seen as "the party that wants to forbid others from doing what they like", instead of being seen as "the party that actually does some meaningful construction and adds to society that way".
fluffykittycat@slrpnk.net · 1 pts · 220d
We shouldn't create decades of priced in emissions or have to pau twice to rip out the gas and put in electric later. Might as well do it right the first time
DarrinBrunner@lemmy.world · 20 pts · 221d
If you have a gas stove and can't afford, or don't want to switch to electric, keep a window open in the kitchen while you cook. This is especially important if your over-the-range hood does not vent to the outside (yes, that's a thing.) If your hood does vent to the outside, turn it on every time you cook and you're golden.
vin@lemmynsfw.com · 3 pts · 220d
Where the fuck else can it vent to?
dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 220d
Through an activated charcoal filter and right back into your face.
This is depressingly common and functionally accomplishes just about as much as you expect it does.
vin@lemmynsfw.com · 2 pts · 220d
Ohhh, thanks. With the right filter it can make sense but it will be far cheaper to just pipe it out.
Clent@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 2 pts · 220d
Not just the right filter but a strong enough fan motor to draw air through it. The filter needs to be changed so at some point outside venting becomes cheaper.
The reality is most people never change the filter and rarely use the fan.
Bluewing@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 220d
Yeah, I'm going to open a window every time I want to fry a couple of eggs or bake a loaf of bread at -25F/-32C.
Just how many hours a day do you think any stove is continuously on? That 3D printer you might own runs far, far longer.
Clent@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 220d
If you don't want to poison yourself with fumes, then yes.
Bluewing@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 219d
Then you must only breathe the finest purified filtered canned air. And not the dirty polluted air in whatever big city you live in.
Clent@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 219d
I actually have more air quality measures in my home than most and I have multiple sensors measuring the quality of the air. I be been measuring it long enough to know exactly what causes my air quality to decrease.
I also do not live in or near a big city.
Your ignorance is not equal to my knowledge situation. I wouldn't expect a willfully ignorant person to believe this.
AA5B@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 220d
I wish someone pointed this out 20 years ago (enough to be heard). I raised two kids with occasional asthma in a house with gas stove, and maybe that could have been different.
I recently converted from gas to induction, and find it a much better cooking appliance in every way. Pans on the stovetop heat up faster than with gas, and I can boil a pot of water faster. The oven has more options and more consistent heating, especially on the broiler.
The only problem was the cost. Way too much money to get a new circuit installed but also the range was double or more what I would have spent on gas. There were very few options at appliance stores, and I never did find one on display, of any brand. In the US, it’s unnecessarily difficult to make this switch.
When I was shopping for one I was told to pay attention to coil sizes. Sure enough experimenting with a large skillet on small coil shows very uneven heating. I did find one or two reasonable priced ranges but with only tiny coils. Even at spending way too much, I only have one coil that works well with 12” skillet or stock pot. I know ikea now sells an induction range for more reasonable price but coil size is critical and the first thing I’d look at
BanMe@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 220d
Having a proper exhaust hood that sucks air outside mitigates this to a huge degree, but a lot of us have hoods that "filter" the air through nothing and then shoot it up towards the ceiling.
The flippers who did my house disconnected the outside air vent, I'm still pissed and mean to get it fixed, cause I can't afford an induction range either.
dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
If you think you can't afford an induction range, you also can't afford to hire contractors to have your new ductwork put in and/or unborked.
Much as I hate to recommend Frigidaire for various reasons, the FCFI3083AS is I think the most economical freestanding 30" induction range on the market at the moment and has an MSRP of $1099. You can probably score one from some discount or independent appliance retailers (i.e. not Home Depot, Lowes, or Best Buy) for a little under a thousand.
AA5B@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
As a taller guy who wears glasses, I’ve had the horrible experience of some of these filters blowing greasy air in my face and settling on my glasses. Not pleasant
Mine has a vent, but no hood so there’s only so much it can do. And the way they built out the kitchen means there’s no good way to install a hood without remodelling.
But now I don’t care as much. The current vent (and window) is good enough for induction
Rooster326@programming.dev · 1 pts · 220d
Everyone I know has a microwave. Is that a class thing?
dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
It's a failure to read the manual thing. Every OTR microwave ever manufactured functions as a hood by definition, and basically all of them (I can only think of like two exceptions) have the option to be configured for either recirculation or to duct outside. It's just that most models come out of the box already configured for recirculation and most people ('s contractors) are so averse to reading that they fail to realize you can flip the blower motor over and thus cause it to actually accomplish something (provided a duct is in place) rather than just blowing stale air back in your face.
Waraugh@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 220d
The ducting behind a microwave is not that common in my experience. It makes sense for microwaves to come preconfigured to recirculate instead of trying to exhaust to a sheet of drywall because most people are going to install it how it comes out of the box. I’ve installed dozens of microwaves and only twice has ducting existed to flip the venting for. Higher end houses typically have dedicated exhaust fans and lower end houses never seem to have ducting for a microwave. I installed a dedicated fan that exhausts out the roof at my house. Even with ducting those microwave exhaust fans barely provide anything of value. I’m sure my experience is very regional but it seems like a really niche middle ground where someone would bother venting out of the kitchen but also not care enough to have a purpose built exhaust fan.
dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Part of the problem there is I have guys just absolutely insist at me that a microwave "can't" be vented outside so they don't bother to install a duct, and tell me that in order to vent outside you "have" to get a hood instead. This is obviously bogus.
This also leads to the inevitable Contractor Special where a duct was there, often when the user is replacing an old hood with a microwave, but the installer just shrugs and slaps the microwave on the wall as-is where A) it is inevitably too tall and now way too close to the stovetop, and B) covering the duct outlet while still recirculating back into the room. Whenever I unearth one of these in my travels it makes me want to track down whoever the hell installed it and then punch them so hard they come clean out of their socks.
People are for some reason hyperfixated on getting appliances off of their countertops, which is why the over-the-range microwaves became so prevalent in the first place. (And then they all immediately filled the spot where their countertop microwave used to be with a countertop air fryer instead, but that's a whole different discussion.)
Waraugh@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 2 pts · 220d
Yeah that would drive me insane to run across. It’s not even particularly hard to tell that the exhaust fan motor is reversible just by looking at the top/back of the microwave before it is installed. Every one I’ve seen looks pretty damn modular in comparison to the rest of the microwave shell.
Edit: reversible is the wrong word, able to be unscrewed and rotated, I’m sure you know what I meant but on a reread of my comment I wanted to clarify.
r0ertel@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
I have gas and would fight anyone who tries to tell me otherwise. I rented a place with an induction range and now I want one so bad.
NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de · 11 pts · 221d
(I only read the title)
Pretty damn obvious. Yes, it needed to be tested and verified experimentally, but.. well, I really mean no offense, but why is this worth sharing?
snooggums@piefed.world · 47 pts · 221d
Because a lot of people assume that everything is fine with things that have been around forever. They need a heads up or a reminder that it isn't the case.
Korkki@lemmy.ml · -8 pts · 221d
More like researches need to constantly publish. If they take up too much time with some big project they will lose funding as non productive scholar. That's why we have so much bullshit papers saying "water is wet". Publish or perish.
IronBird@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
eh...if you want the horde to adopt something you need to put a reference to it in a popular movie/show. not an ad but like...some kind of plotline where someone blows up their house/dies via gas-stove.
and of course...make it cheap, majority of america lives paycheck to paycheck...when your living paycheck to paycheck the only thing that matters (especially in the US, with it's lack of basic social safety nets) is $
only the nerdiest of nerds reads at all, let alone reads research publications.
lukecooperatus@lemmy.ml · 24 pts · 221d
Speaking as a board member in a housing community where we are actively dealing with residents who claim that their precious gas stoves are safe and they don't want electric replacements, I appreciate this post being shared.
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today · 9 pts · 221d
People are so fucking weird! Like yeah instant heat is nice, but induction cook tops do it without poisoning your lungs. But people (conservatives) will claim it's superior in some way or another in order to be a contrarian.
Fuck em, let them suffocate.
Edit: and some non conservative lemmy users.
AmbiguousProps@lemmy.today · 11 pts · 221d
Induction can also boil water much faster than gas ever could. And to be honest, as much hate as they get, I would even prefer non-induction electric over gas at this point.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
I really wish I could get them to work properly, but my moka pot doesn't boil properly on a standard electric coil stove. Mine (hot plate) cycles on and off (at maximum heat and off rather than some intermediate temperature) causing inconsistent heating through the boiling cycle, making bad coffee.
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today · 2 pts · 221d
I was raised with the coil guys. And even if it didn't release nitrous byproducts, just the safety factor of an electric stove being <<< than gas to blow up.
ghostlychonk@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 221d
Hule@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 221d
Tl;dr: electric is better.
I'm in the EU. "Range" is a cooktop plus oven, right?
We got rid of out old gas appliance and bought an induction top and an electric oven.
They both cost as much as the gas stove, so double the price. Running them costs about the same.
But induction is just so easy and quick! Setting the time for eggs, getting water to boil in seconds.. It's truly next level.
The oven is just alright, maybe heats more evenly with the fan.
Other than that? I guess no danger of explosions. No yearly checkups.
I like it much more, and wouldn't go back.
ghostlychonk@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 221d
Hule@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Yes, the US is different. My range has a normal 220V plug, and a simple menu to set the maximum wattage it's allowed to draw..
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today · 2 pts · 220d
most US stoves use 220v as well.
frongt@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 221d
Range is the top part. Oven is the box. Stove is the whole thing.
But if you mix them up everyone will still know what you mean.
SpikesOtherDog@ani.social · 2 pts · 220d
That's a significantly larger gap than what I see here at my local Lowe's. We have electric and gas stoves both about $550 at the cheapest. The gas one is $10 cheaper, not much of a price point. The induction one is $850 at the cheapest, so about 55% more expensive. That's definitely not the 3x cost difference you see here.
I can only get close to those numbers you quote by selecting a high-end induction stoves. They don't sell gas range or oven only for less, but I could see that being a cheaper alternative. Also, their search is weird and I had to specify gas to find gas stoves.
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 221d
They sell single induction tops for like $50.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
You mean hot plates?
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today · 2 pts · 220d
No.
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today · 0 pts · 220d
Curious, when did you last need an oven with flame heating?
ghostlychonk@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 220d
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 220d
Sorry I was drinking last night. I was asking when you needed the enclosed space to be heated up fast, like a gas stove would.
Jason2357@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 221d
It took decades of propaganda. Paying off cooking shows and influencers to have big, obvious gas stoves. They even popularized the phrase “cooking with gas” as a euphemism for anything fast. If it was so much better, it would have sold its self.
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 0 pts · 220d
no, that's not the reason. induction stoves are really only around for a couple years, IIRC, and old electric stoves simply weren't that great. they were mostly slow. gas, you turned on and had heat. electric meant that you had to wait for the glass pane to heat up below your cooking gear. on top of that, gas was typically cheaper than electric.
that's really only changing now, where renewable energy provides cheap electricity, while gas prices are increasing due to international situation. it simply takes a while for the news to spread, and not everybody has gotten the news yet. renewable energy will be much cheaper than gas in the long run, thanks to solar energy, and that's a news that really only started being economically meaningful around 2 years ago. It simply takes a long time for the news to go around and everybody hear it.
DarrinBrunner@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 221d
Are you forcing people to switch to electric stoves? Are you buying the stoves for them and installing them?
Also, simply opening a window while cooking, and/or keeping a hood that vents to the outside turned on, makes them safe to use.
lukecooperatus@lemmy.ml · 6 pts · 220d
No, we don't force anyone to do anything, electric replacements are offered as a "free" upgrade. We're a housing cooperative, so technically it's not free, but it's paid for by the community's collective funds.
The other main problem is that people routinely forget to turn off their stoves. We've had the fire department come multiple times this year alone because someone left their gas on and filled their unit with it. One resident left his gas open for who knows how long before he passed out in his living room and shit himself. Luckily someone found him and called the paramedics.
I guess if it was one person living in the wilderness and they blew themselves up or suffocated, then that's on them. In a community though, it endangers everyone nearby.
Gas is not safe.
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 220d
that is nightmare level stuff
swampdownloader@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 3 pts · 220d
I monitored my indoor air quality prior to getting rid of my gas stove and even with windows open, the levels of the monitored pollutants skyrocket when the stove or oven was going. Maybe if you had a box fan blowing in/out for a long time after you finish you’d be ok, but that’s not ideal if you’re heating/cooling your place.
tempest@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 221d
I wouldn't claim either of those things.
However I will tell you my experience. People in these threads will always tell you that induction is better than gas. That might be true, but as a renter I'll never know it. Gas is better to cook on than the coil electric stoves which is what I always get in a rental. No landlord is going to spend the extra on an induction cooktop when a coil electric is one of the cheapest options.
Whats_your_reasoning@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 221d
I understand that, I've lived with gas ovens most of the time as well. Interestingly, the studio I just moved into (which is freshly converted from a garage) has a new fridge and an electric flat-top range. But I rent from a lone guy, not from a standardized apartment community. So maybe that's why he invested in the good stuff. Renovating an entire complex is way pricier than setting up a single apartment.
I also think I just got lucky. It's not a perfect place - the insulation sucks, there are paint flecks on the floor and kitchen cabinets, the shower hot/cold are backwards (which confused the hell out of me at first. I thought my hot water wasn't working) and I saw a mouse recently. But I can't complain, because the landlord is responsive and the good appliances help balance out the negatives.
SpikesOtherDog@ani.social · 16 pts · 221d
There is pushback from some on the right that want fossil fuels piped to every residence.
IronBird@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 220d
some cities/states have government mandated rules requiring gas to every home. normally some dinosaur provision before the advent of electrical appliances, to insure new-builds had heat and stuff for winter (landlords have always been cheap SOB's). and sometimes that comes with a state-mandated gas monopoly (rarely a properly public-funded venture...normally some scummy price gouging company)
some even have some bullshit where you have to pay the gas-company anyway for your electrical appliances, through some equivalency-meter type shit (i assume that stuff was just
lobbiedbribed for by the gas companies)AA5B@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
And there was huge pushback a couple years ago when a few places wanted to change that - new construction must be electric only. While I can see builders like to be cheap, anything moderately expensive should be able to get heat pumps and induction at no real cost difference to gas
Switching can be expensive, but doing the right thing on construction much less so. We now have a bunch of new infrastructure/technology we’ll expect our future houses to have, and it’s past time we started doing so on new construction, where it’s much cheaper than converting
AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works · 13 pts · 221d
Because there are billions of people worldwide for whom this fact is unknown.
protist@mander.xyz · 7 pts · 221d
Glances at community name
Smh
Psiczar@aussie.zone · 11 pts · 221d
We replaced our gas stove with induction and our water heater with an electric one this past year and disconnected the gas. Now our solar panels offset a lot of the cost of electricity and our main bill is for water.
Happy with an induction cooktop, it boils water quicker and is easier to keep clean. My only concern is someone dropping a heavy pot onto the glass surface.
Socialism_Everyday@reddthat.com · 0 pts · 220d
Your main bill is for WATER?? Maybe this is because water in Spain is subsidized, but may I ask how much water you use per month?
Psiczar@aussie.zone · 1 pts · 220d
We averaged 1800 litres a day according to our last bill, but it’s summer here in Australia so the reticulation for the garden is on and the pool needs to be topped up because of evaporation.
Our last bill showed an average of 763 litres a day usage so that would represent the cooler months.
reksas@sopuli.xyz · 10 pts · 220d
real men use diesel stoves
HugeNerd@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 219d
I just keep a lump of sub-critical plutonium in the kitchen.
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 220d
A quality electric makes a big difference fwiw. I’ve gone through several types depending on where I lived. I gotta admit that gas is my favorite to cook on. Just so many ways to control heat, where the heat is, and how quickly the heat can be changed. Most electric cooktops and ovens are shit unless you buy an upper tier brand, and even then heating a big coil under a glass top is inefficient AF.
Just switched to induction. While not the same as gas, and it does have a few peculiarities, it is by far better than standard electric cooktops. Way fast, more efficient, easy. These need to come down in price to help win over people used to gas.
Korhaka@sopuli.xyz · 1 pts · 220d
I have found gas consistently shit for cooking at low temperatures because you can't turn it down low enough. Minimum power on the lowest ring, nope, still far too hot right in the middle of the pan.
ohulancutash@feddit.uk · 3 pts · 220d
So put the pan on the edge of the burner…
Korhaka@sopuli.xyz · 1 pts · 220d
Now the edge burns instead, while the other side remains cold. How is this helping?
sin_free_for_00_days@sopuli.xyz · 1 pts · 220d
Seems like a pretty shitty gas stove, to be honest.
pishadoot@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 219d
Sounds to me like you need better pans that don't have paper thin ass bottoms
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Guess I was lucky? Our burner had a very low setting, perfect for low heat and reducing things like jams or whatever.
Electric is horrible. It’s either full on or off. No moderation other than time.
Korhaka@sopuli.xyz · 2 pts · 220d
Huh, never seen an electric cooker that is full on/off. That sounds terrible.
RamRabbit@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
Yeah, a good number of electrics do that. 100% or 0%, and they pulse between the two.
I think the core thing I have learned is getting a decent gas stove is easy. But it's real easy to get a shit electric.
adespoton@lemmy.ca · 8 pts · 221d
As a foil: I grew up with an electric oven. Used an electric ofen through the 70s, 80s, 90s, 00s, and finally got a gas oven in 2017.
Because I was concerned about gas in the home, methane, CO, etc. I invested in a bunch of sensors so I’d know the moment any of it became an issue.
It’s been almost 9 years now, and I’ve yet to experience an issue.
However, that whole “you can use it when the power’s out” thing: can’t use the oven; the valve is electric. On my first gas range, the range wouldn’t even come on without electricity.
The pots and pans I use now are designed for gas and heat up fast, maintain an even heat, and cool down fast.
Essentially, I think not all devices are created equal.
I like not depending on a single utility for my energy needs, but at the same time wouldn’t shed a tear if methane production vanished tomorrow (I’d probably convert to propane short term and electric long-term).
swampdownloader@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 5 pts · 220d
What metrics did you monitor? With my air quality monitor I’d see CO2, particulate, nox skyrocket in rooms even far away from the gas stove. If you got a carbon monoxide detector + explosive gas detector then yeah you wouldn’t get any alarms with normal use, but those aren’t the only pollutants to monitor.
adespoton@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 220d
Co2, CO, particulates, NO2 and volatile organics.
I guess it’s down to venting?
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 220d
We had an extended outage in our neighborhood. Just over a week. I let the neighbors know I had enough wood and charcoal to keep the smoker at 275 all week and we could pop on the propane grills if we needed something hotter (I have been blessed with an abundance of backyard cookery). Fed half the neighborhood at some point that week, everyone at least got some ribs.
Last thing I want the folk on my street to do is go hungry, especially if all what's wrong is the electricity.
frongt@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 221d
Did any of those sensors measure nitrogen dioxide?
adespoton@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 221d
Yes, actually. I can see the level go up slightly when the burners go on, but when the ventilation fan kicks in, the levels go back down almost immediately.
frongt@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 220d
Yeah that's why. Most people don't have a real vent in their homes. It's the recirculating one or nothing.
AA5B@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
That’s what should actually be illegal. I see those everywhere now, and I can’t believe they were ever allowed. Mine is bad enough as a ceiling vent without hood but at least it does vent outside
AA5B@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
One unexpected change with induction is the handles of my cast iron skillets take much longer to get hot. If I cook something relatively fast, like an egg, I can now pick up the cast iron bare handed!
But if I wanted to cook during a power outage, I have a propane grill.
Actually, it’s kind of amusing that my main grill is a pellet grill with powered auger to feed the pellets, so I can’t use that in a power outage
mavu@discuss.tchncs.de · 8 pts · 220d
Staying indoors during rain can dramatically cut wetness.
jjjalljs@ttrpg.network · 6 pts · 220d
I'd rather have health than maybe marginally better cooking experiences
TwinTitans@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 220d
It’s not marginally. It’s a superior all issues aside.
HugeNerd@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 219d
Gas? What are you talking about?
TwinTitans@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 219d
Yeah gas is amazing.
HugeNerd@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 219d
Gas is dogshit. You've never used induction.
TwinTitans@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 219d
I have. You haven’t used a proper gas stove.
HugeNerd@lemmy.ca · 0 pts · 219d
LOL if you have to get a "proper" stove to beat a 49$ IKEA portable induction cooktop, you've already lost.
GTFOH with your bullshit. Gas. FFS.
TwinTitans@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 218d
Wow calm there buddy. Ask any chef and they’ll tell you why the use gas. Inductions… a fancy gimmick if you have a good set of pots. Try using a wok on an induction stove 🤣
Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de · 6 pts · 221d
It also seems safer to only attach each house to one sort of potentially deadly infrastructure.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Can we choose because I vote geothermal
the_mighty_kracken@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Sign me up for the fusion reactor
Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de · 2 pts · 220d
I was thinking of the electrical grid :-) And then heating with heat exchange either to air or to ground, which of course also requires electrical power.
Edit: Unless you want to go autonomous with regards to electrical power. Then the energy storage would become the potentially deadly local infrastructure, I suppose.
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 220d
plus electricity is crazy flexible. you can easily transform electric power into other types of power, such as mechanical power (rotary movement), lighting, heat, computation.
with gas, you can only really turn it into heat. for all other uses, you'd first have to translate it into electric power or use a very bulky combustion engine.
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 6 pts · 220d
you don't say, captain obvious is on it again today
but i guess it's nice that we now have quantitative data on it
tiredofsametab@fedia.io · 5 pts · 219d
I switched from gas to a 200v induction cooktop and I don't think I would go back. Quality definitely matters. I have a cassette gas stove for power outages or if I have something that absolutely must use gas (so far, it's never been pulled out).
HulkSmashBurgers@reddthat.com · 2 pts · 219d
A I understand it the temperature control with an induction stovetop is just as good, if not better than gas. Is that your experience?
scoobford@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 219d
It depends on the stove. The gas stoves in my building are much better, but that is because this place is ancient and the electric cooktops in question are whatever crap they find secondhand.
Onsotumenh@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 219d
Depends on the quality of the stove. The bad ones regulate like most resistive glass ceramic stoves in on/off pulses, which is fine for ceramic because the thermal capacity smoothes everything. I've got a mobile induction plate like that tho and it is absolutely horrible to work with.
My decent quality stove top goes from just hand warm (keep warm function) to the fires of mount doom (power function for boiling water) in 17 silky smooth steps. On top of the pulses there is some power regulation as well (you can hear the coil hum change depending on power).
HulkSmashBurgers@reddthat.com · 1 pts · 219d
Ah ok thanks for the explanation.
tiredofsametab@fedia.io · 1 pts · 219d
In my experience, yes. The only difference is that you don't have a visual flame so it takes a little getting used to which setting means what (unless you have the type with a knob and a temperature readout, but I do not).
HulkSmashBurgers@reddthat.com · 1 pts · 219d
Ok cool thanks for the info!
Coconut1233@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 220d
How often are yall getting power outages?
dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 220d
Regardless of that, higher end modern gas stoves won't allow you to use the stovetop during a power outage anyway even if you match light them, because they have electronic flame presence sensors for safety. And no modern gas range or gas oven with electronic oven controls will allow you to use the oven without power.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 220d
A couple days a year typically, between hurricanes, tornadoes and winter ice storms.
projectsquared@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Once a year maybe? Almost always due to storm damage.
chunes@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Every month or so. Every two if I'm lucky
titanicx@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 220d
I've had one in the past 2 years.
daq@lemmy.sdf.org · 1 pts · 220d
One long enough to be worth considering in the last 7 years.
ohlaph@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
We had maybe one in the past 12 years where I live. A lot of people around me have had more, but my house specifically hasn't had a major one that I can recall. We've been thinking about switching away from gas stove eventually.
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 1 pts · 220d
the question might be more properly phrased as:
what is better, using electricity + backup power generator, or using gas stove in the first place?
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 220d
A backup power generator that will run a household stove is kind of a tall order; most of the portable gasoline models on the American market won't put out 220v.
I've got an electric stove, and I've got a backyard grill that runs on propane and propane accessories. Ain't no power outage gonna starve me.
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 2 pts · 220d
yeah that's what i meant with "backup generator" :-)
SocialMediaRefugee@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 219d
Having a gas stove certainly came in handy when we've had blackouts.
Electricity is expensive in my state but gas is relatively cheap.
GreenKnight23@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 219d
get a camping stove for those occasions. I was worried about the same, that's what I did.
lightnsfw@reddthat.com · 5 pts · 220d
Every elective stove I've used has sucked for controlling the temperature. I'll deal with a little air pollution to have my food actually come out how I want it. Maybe induction ones are better but those are expensive.
JcbAzPx@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 220d
That's a skill issue.
ameancow@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
lightnsfw@reddthat.com · 1 pts · 220d
Congratulations, I've cooked on all sorts of things too. Doesn't mean some weren't objectively better than others. I personally don't want to deal with a shitty heat source that I have to fight with to get it to work properly and is slow as shit to actually heat up.
Allero@lemmy.today · 2 pts · 220d
Yes, induction stoves are the solution. The way I went about it is I bought a secondhand hob for just $110. Works brilliantly, controls just as well as gas. As a bonus, pumping all the energy straight into the cookware makes it heat things up REAL fast.
Regular electric stove is very inert, making it straight up impossible to do a lot of stuff.
partofthevoice@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 220d
Never heard of these limitations. All I know is you can’t prep a tortilla the right way on gas stoves.
Allero@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 220d
I know little of cooking tortillas, but to me the main limiter with gas cooking is that it cuts off at certain gas pressure, not allowing you to use it at very low heating.
Also, it mainly heats in a certain ring and not equally through the whole surface, which might probably be critical for tortillas unless you have a big cast iron pan.
ameancow@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de · 2 pts · 220d
I think it might simply be a matter of getting used to it. For example, i can cook well enough with an electric (induction) furnace but it's difficult for me to use a gas stove without burning my food.
Kekzkrieger@feddit.org · 1 pts · 220d
Bullshit
Gladaed@feddit.org · 1 pts · 220d
Either gross incompetence or lack of proper pans is at cause. Electric stoves are perfectly fine.
lightnsfw@reddthat.com · 1 pts · 219d
Curious how taking 20 minutes for a pot of water to boil could be "gross incompetence".
Gladaed@feddit.org · 0 pts · 219d
Try: putting it on the highest setting, Use less water (10+liter is a lot and can happen quickly in big pots), Plug it into 3 phase power Make sure to use the highest power section
In a lot of cases ceran cooktops have higher power delivery to the pot than gas. Also read the manual for how much power each burner has.
setnof@sh.itjust.works · 4 pts · 221d
Guess what else would drastically reduce air pollution. Switching to electric heating aka heat pumps instead of burning wood and coal. While cooking the ventilation is already good enough but if you cannot open the damn windows because everyone is poisoning the air…
GissaMittJobb@lemmy.ml · 5 pts · 221d
Of course, one does not exclude the other.
Hamartiogonic@sopuli.xyz · 3 pts · 221d
Same goes for various industries and energy production in general. Burning stuff is usually the easiest way to do it, but it comes with some serious long term consequences. Ideally, we would use renewables to produce electricity, and then use that electricity to heat things up when needed.
Unfortunately, large parts of various industries has been built around the idea of burning things instead of using electricity. In order to fully transition, we would need to completely rebuild many factories and radically modify countless others.
AA5B@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
We do need to completely rebuild …
Like anything else, it could have gone smoothly if we did it in an intelligent way as opportunity presents, but turning it partisan, proceeding in fits and starts, only looking short term, refusing out of fear of change, means we keep putting it off. That’s just going to build into an emergency.
Hamartiogonic@sopuli.xyz · 2 pts · 220d
On top of that, the economics only make it harder. Those who take dirty shortcuts, will have lower CAPEX and maybe even OPEX. This gives them a competitive advantage compared to those companies that choose to follow a more sustainable path.
Lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.ca · 3 pts · 221d
Not going to open the windows when it’s -20C.
HeyJoe@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 221d
Im stuck with an all electric house... to expensive just to live and it has left me with no money to upgrade to cheaper options like heat pumps and solar. My monthly equal payment plan is currently $850 a month. This is with me keeping my house cold during winter where its set to 64 on average. At night I drop it to 58. Maybe one day ill be able to afford it to break this shitty cycle.
AA5B@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Yeah, I grew up in an all electric house, and even as a kid who didn’t have to pay bills, I hated it and vowed never to be stuck in one again.
But heat pumps make a huge difference in heating cost and induction is better than cooking with gas.
You do have to factor in the cost of utilities and where I live electricity is very expensive. Even here regular heat pumps are cheaper than heating with propane or oil (or of course resistive electric) but gas is still cheapest. Installers generally recommend a hybrid system so you can use the heat pumps in the shoulder seasons, but gas when it’s cold. If you could use a ground source heat pump or solar panels, that changes everything.
But all that is hugely expensive to convert to and we’re not going to make any progress if that’s the way forward. Requiring it for new construction, where it’s much cheaper, is the least we can do, but this is something that’s worth a little government help
My state still has incentives for landlords and homeowners by income level: any chance there’s some help there?
frongt@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 221d
No chance there are government grants to do those upgrades?
I assume you've also done the math on financing those upgrades, and on just plain moving out.
MystikIncarnate@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 220d
Gas stoves have a place, and I'm not about to take away anyone's choice on the matter. With all that being said, to the title of this article, I say "duh".... Honestly, who thought that cooking using an open flame inside your home was somehow safer than the alternative?
I use electric, I've pretty much always used electric. I will continue to use some form of electric stove. I want to have complete control over the heat going into my cookware, and while it may not be as flashy or as quick to use electric, I can't see any situation where electric would not be safer.
yrnttm@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 220d
I just like being able to put tortillas directly on the flame burner.
hamid@crazypeople.online · 3 pts · 220d
I had gas stoves my whole life until about 5 years ago I when I moved into this home I live in now that doesn't have gas lines in the neighborhood. I have a glass top electric stove, not induction and after about a week of adjustment it suits my purposes just fine and I got used to it and it wasn't a big deal at all. I cook pretty much every meal my family and I eat at home too with 0 issues.
RebekahWSD@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
Growing up we usedgas. Mother's home (not our childhood home) also has gas. I'm in a home that is wired for either but had electric when I moved in. We had to replace the stove and I choose to keep it electric which surprised my mom. "But gas baking is so much nicer!" And no it's not. Electric interior was much easier and nicer to use. But she didn't bake much so lol.
RamRabbit@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
This is odd to me, as someone who has owned both gas and electric. Baking is pretty comparable between the two. Preheat oven, put in item for amount of time. Though, our gas oven's exhaust would really heat up the kitchen, which was not so great in the summer.
Usually when people praise gas it's about stovetop performance. As gas instantly changes temperature and lets you use things like woks. I have also heard people praise them for working in power outages just fine.
The glass top electrics are so damn easy to clean though. That alone has made them the winner for me. On the other side, every exposed coil electric I have used sucked ass and I would pick a gas well before I pick one of those.
Cloudstash@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
ComradeRachel@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 5 pts · 220d
What’s even more sad is that in the USA it’s seen as woke to give up your gas stove.
Psythik@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 220d
Well because it is woke. And that's a good thing. Acknowledging that gas stoves cause indoor pollution is woke as fuck.
So sick and tired of "woke" being used as a negative term, because the republicans labeled it as such. They hate it so much because they hate change, even if it's positive change for the betterment of society.
Stay safe. Stay woke.
mojofrododojo@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
it's like they consider asthma a badge of pride.
these fucks are making their kids suffer, again, for their silly stupid ideas
Cloudstash@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Stupendous@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 220d
Cheap 90s era induction stoves in apartments that are still kicking give induction a bad name. New ones are the closest thing you can get to temperature control and speed of a full burner stove. My ideal would be an induction stove with one zone rounded for a round bottom wok. For a home kitchen, it's the best choice because you're not going to get the amazing jet burner stoves you get in commercial kitchens
Canopyflyer@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 219d
I have cooked on gas, induction, infrared and the old style resistive elements. Currently I have a Wolf duel fuel range which is one of the best you can buy in the U.S. and I love it.
I'll just come out and say it...
Gas has seen its day. I say that as a current gas cook top user.
A good quality induction cook top is fantastic. It gets a lot hotter faster than gas while also simmering better. Responsiveness is off the charts too, depending on how heavy your cookware is, which is gas's major advantage over older electric cook tops. The only issue I personally have with induction is that cheaper units make a weird buzzing noise with some cookware and settings. I did get to cook on a Viking induction cook top a few times and did not notice that issue.
Gammelfisch@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Indeed, we're going with an induction stove top and a speed oven. Adios gas!
TheEighthDoctor@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 220d
Are induction stoves shit in the US because of the lower voltage? Honest question
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works · 8 pts · 220d
Honest answer: Induction stoves aren't shit in the US. They don't run at a lower voltage because our homes are wired for 240V same as Europe.
Honest explanation: The American power grid closely remembles anyone else's, we've got the big long distance power lines up on those big pylons that transmit power in the megavolts, those get stepped down at substations to a dozen kilovolts to snake into neighborhoods, and then those pole mounted transformers step it down to 240V to make the couple hundred foot trip from the pole to a few houses. The difference is that in America, the transformer is connected to the house with three wires, not two. The third wire is a center tap, so you have the two outer wires and a center wire.
Measure the voltage between the outer two wires, you find 240V. Measure between the center wire and either of the outer two, you find 120V.
Most of the normal outlets throughout an American home or business are wired between one of the outers and the center, to deliver 120V. But, we routinely wire some circuits across the two outer wires for 240V, we even have special plugs for this to make sure you don't plug a 120V appliance into a 240V outlet. Things such as electric water heaters, HVAC units, clothes dryers, electric car chargers and electric stoves are indeed wired for 240V here.
Induction cooktops took on a low reputation in the US because early models were hilariously expensive (Westinghouse was selling an induction range in the 70's for $1500, that's about $10,000 in today's money) and not particularly reliable. Another factor was all the trendy cookware from the 60's on. CorningWare and Pyrex (ceramic and borosilicate glass) was huge in the 70's, Calphalon (anodized aluminum) and Revere Ware (high-nickel stainless steel) was on all the wedding registries in the 80's, and solid copper was big in the early 90's. None of which work on induction stoves. Which means, for decades, Americans perceived induction ranges as gimmicky crap that required "special" cookware, that to buy into an induction range would require throwing away all your pots and pans. Americans continued preferring resistive coil electric or natural gas stoves.
Well, we arrived into the 21st century, teflon-coated steel and tri-ply stainless pans come into vogue, Corning stops making consumer ceramic and glass products, Revere changes their stainless formula, and now we find that most cookware on the market is induction compatible. Induction stoves are the fastest growing market segment in kitchen appliances in the US, everybody wants one.
mech@feddit.org · 3 pts · 220d
In Germany we have 230V for normal appliances and 400V for stoves.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 220d
Why?
Decq@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 220d
The same reason you use 240V for stoves instead of 110V
mech@feddit.org · 1 pts · 220d
To make food hotter fasterer.
My induction stove is actually insane.
It can get a gallon of water boiling in 2 minutes (11kW power).
Hobo@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
bitchkat@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
We're actually split phase and higher power appliances like stoves, EV chargers, water heaters run on 240 volts.
But the "standard" wall outlets are 15 amps at 120 volts.
Decq@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Electric stoves run on 400v in Europe, so they are still faster
bitchkat@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
And how many amps? My search says in Europe 230-240 volts at 32 amps are most common.
mojofrododojo@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
pretty sure that's due to the spoiler and racing stripe.
TheEighthDoctor@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 220d
Only if you have three phase power at home I think, mine can be wired both ways but to have three phase you pay more per month
SCmSTR@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 1 pts · 220d
In the us, wall sockets run on 110v, but it's standard for all residencies to also have specific appliance wall sockets specially wired for 220v, usually two areas of a home, for washer/dryer and stove/oven. It's a totally different plug design, too.
I don't personally have induction, but I know people that have them and say they love them.
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Just switched to induction. They work great.
What nobody is saying is that they’re viewed and priced as premium items, almost double the cost of a cheap electric cooktop and even more than gas. For instance, cheapest I could find for a basic multi-burner in-countertop cooktop with a quick search: Gas $175, Electric $199, Induction $330. This gets worse for a typical range that is found in most homes (cooktop/oven combo). You can get a cheap gas range for under $500. An induction range starts at just under $1000.
daq@lemmy.sdf.org · 1 pts · 220d
No, they work really well because they run on two phases so 220v.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 220d
220v isn't achieved via two phases; we get 110v out of a single phase by center tapping the transformer. The center tap wire is called the "neutral" and is at ground potential, and then the two "hot" wires. There's 110v between the neutral and either one of the hots, and the hots are 220v apart. It's still one phase.
Note I used 110/220v here and 120/240 above. peak-to-peak, root-mean-square, ask an actual electrician, I'm just an asshole on the internet.
daq@lemmy.sdf.org · 2 pts · 220d
You're correct. I tried to keep it short and misspoke. Two hot wires from previously split phase.
Dozzi92@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
You'd presumably install a 240, a NEMA 6-20, so you can get all the power you need. So a 6-20 gets about 5k watts, versus 3k for standard British plug, versus 2400 on US standard. And these numbers are all fudgy because for some reason it all varies.
ThomasWilliams@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
The stove doesn't use the wall outlet, its wired directly to the fusebox with a 30 Amp current. (wall outlet is 15 Amp).
victorz@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
I'm here in Europe where I've never ever seen anyone using a gas stove, ever. Not even the old timey stove in my grandparents' tiny summer home. I'm almost 40 years old. Seriously, gas stoves are ancient and not efficient.
cabillaud@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 220d
I'm in Europe too, and I've seen a lot of them, and I think they are still standard in restaurants. I've owned gas stoves in 2 of my apartments.
victorz@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 220d
In restaurants seems like it's like some sort of tradition, even though it's much less efficient than induction.
Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Gas is much faster to heat and cool. Also it's harder to flambe with electricity.
victorz@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
I don't think gas is faster to heat and cool than induction...
Flambeing should be possible with just using something else to ignite, right? Shouldn't be that hard.
Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Going from a 1 to a 7 back to a 1 takes about 20 minutes on an induction.
Takes 30s with gas.
Yeah, you can ignite with other sources, but it's not as available or as cool looking.
victorz@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Bullshit, it takes seconds. On my consumer grade home hob even. Not even sure what a "7" means, but from highest heat (14, or even the P(ower) mode) to lowest heat (1) takes probably 30 seconds or less on my hob as well.
Induction is very responsive both up and down. Not sure what kind of garbage/faulty equipment you've tried that takes twenty minutes, but that is not representative in any way whatsoever.
Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Hmm. Maybe I'm confusing electric convection hobs with induction.
ohulancutash@feddit.uk · 1 pts · 220d
Gas is often greatly cheaper than electricity (4x cheaper in Britain for instance) so that really adds up in commercial usage.
victorz@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
I guess gas would have to be a quarter as efficient as induction for it to be worth it. I don't know of exact numbers regarding that. Interesting point.
RheumatoidArthritis@mander.xyz · 6 pts · 220d
Europe, I've seen induction only in airbnbs, everyone has gas at home
victorz@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Northern Europe here, everyone has either induction or electric glass/ceramic.
I have induction, live in an apartment, not an Airbnb. You live in eastern Europe by any chance? Maybe less far along technology wise?
RheumatoidArthritis@mander.xyz · 1 pts · 220d
I do, yes. But people are renovating and modernizing their homes and I don't know anyone who chose induction - they are available here, and so is electricity.
victorz@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Habit maybe? Just like Americans seem to be stuck in the past because of fear of progress.
polle@feddit.org · 3 pts · 220d
Depends alot where you are living. As a kid I never saw anyone using gas. But later, especially living in a bigger city gas stoves are really common.
victorz@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Which part of Europe? I'm living in the biggest city in my region.
Sam_Bass@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
Electrics are all I've used for the last 30 years
ranzispa@mander.xyz · 1 pts · 221d
Indeed, that is very much true. Electric stoves are also much safer as it is less likely to cause a fire.
But still, I'm pretty pissed it is very VERY difficult to find a house on rent with gas stoves. I don't care about this stuff, I like cooking and there's nothing better (except a cooking wood stove) to cook in a house.
I'm just sad about that, besides that if you do not care about which one to cook on for sure go ahead with induction.
varyingExpertise@feddit.org · 1 pts · 221d
Have you ever used a proper, three phase induction stove?
ranzispa@mander.xyz · 1 pts · 220d
Yes
etherphon@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 221d
etherphon@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 221d
Yes, but ovens are expensive.
destructdisc@lemmy.world · -3 pts · 220d
Another fuckass article trying to shift blame to the individual instead of holding gigantic corporations and tech giants responsible for making conditions so bad that even indoor air is polluted.
Quill7513@slrpnk.net · 5 pts · 220d
not… quite. these are research findings that what we've long suspected is true: gas stoves aren't great for your indoor environment. the question you should really be asking isn't "why are we saying this now" but "why is there so much pro-natural gas stove propaganda out there in the world when modern energy efficient electric stoves are just as good in the areas that gas excels in at a lower long term cost to the owner?"
what you'll find is that it's the gas companies who are pushing the narrative that gas is better and landlords not performing upgrades because they don't cover their tenants' utility bills so those upgrades cut into their exploitative profit models. so. yes, the problem is gigantic corporations and the capital class in general. but don't shoot the messenger, especially when the messenger has brought you weaponry to arm yourself against a common enemy
moonshadow@slrpnk.net · -1 pts · 220d
Not everything is propaganda man, using that argument against people's directly observed comparisons and preferences kinda undermines the whole idea. I've got panels on the roof and an electric chainsaw, propane is still the best fit for my stove. I've got wood, diesel, and electric heat, all of which have their season. It's easy to get blindly optimistic about exciting new tech (electric cars are probably the biggest one here) but nothing is universally applicable and you need to have some faith that your fellow man is an intelligent, thinking being trying to navigate this world just like you
5in1k@lemmy.zip · -3 pts · 221d
Don’t care. Give me fire. I don’t want an electric stove. I’m fine dying slightly earlier, what fucking ever.
Socialism_Everyday@reddthat.com · 2 pts · 220d
Nah, that's selfish as fuck. Gas lines have innumerable leaks and methane has much more greenhouse potential than CO2. It doesn't make sense to have gas lines in 2025, and they should be substituted by electricity for ecological reasons
5in1k@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 220d
Meh. Fuck it. If rich people can have private planes I want god damned fire when I cook.
AA5B@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
It’s not just a matter of dying faster, it’s raising kids with asthma, gasping for breath at any cold or allergy, unnecessary pain and hospital stays, and taking longer to get over colds. It’s your aging parents wheezing and coughing, hospitalized after not catching breath, and yes, dying early of colds
glorkon@lemmy.world · -7 pts · 220d
I feel like the health benefits I get being able to cook proper, healthy Asian style food with my wok outweigh the health risks of a gas stove.
Nalivai@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 220d
You can use wok with electric stove
nulluser@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
"No, you don't understand. It's a different kind of heat." - them, probably.
0tan0d@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 220d
Its more like you can't use a wok on a cheap electric stove, but you can use it on a cheap gas stove. That's it. You get what you pay for and landlords are parasites, so if you rent gas is what you prefer.
Nalivai@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 220d
With wok specifically, you either have the specific Chinese high burner that you absolutely can not and should not have in your house, or you can't do fancy tossing. I am unsure fancy tossing actually achieves anything, but even if it is, you can't do proper technique at your home kitchen anyway, even with the highest quality flame burner.
onehundredsixtynine@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 220d
dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 220d
For what it's worth I have an induction stove and if I put my steel wok on it empty I can made the bottom third of it glow red hot within about 10 seconds of powering it on.
Gas is absolutely not necessary for this, but there is a grain of truth to the fact that outside of induction stovetops, practically all radiant electric stoves do indeed suck ass.
JcbAzPx@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 220d
Shouldn't you be using your outdoor kitchen to do that properly.
moonshadow@slrpnk.net · -2 pts · 220d
hmm, which kitchen shall i use for this meal?
mfr most of us are grateful to be able to access a kitchen at all, American Suburbia-ass take
JcbAzPx@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 219d
No experience with Asian culture, I see.
glorkon@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 220d
Well fuck me. According to the downvotes I should really switch to an electric stove (which I can't because my kitchen doesn't have the proper outlet for it, so I need to convince the landlord to install it) and then I can cook food with electricity generated by burning coal or uranium.
Thanks for making me a better human being, I guess.