Please, Mozilla, explain in detail exactly in which way the internet is changing again, that requires you to return to Faschitter? Please help me make sense of this.
The fuck you doing Kurt Vinnegut, speaking from fake lemmy profiles. I know it as you, Kurt. Admit your Kilgore trout@ i know your the same person! It just is as it he. Poo te weet! As I say it now. Fuck is time weird. A quake coming. And that's God's slapstick; our dumbasses.
I remember being in my freshman year of college in what would be the most disastrous nest departures in human history and watching the Fox News report on Kurt Vonnegut, how scathing it was, and that led to me reading his books, because my identity at the time was anti-right, and because this I learned this really important shit at a critical point in my life because I identified with his words and characters and humor. Now I shitpost on the internet because I told my ROTC cadre that my nonexistent sister got me pregnant because I judged the wrath of my father more of a threat that the United States military. Counterintelligence is cool, bro. That's why I pee my pants, Billy Madison style, so these kids don't feel afraid to post their retarded ass shit, cuz at least they're not as stupid as my dumb ass, which is objectively the truth because God's a funny dick. Kids, amirite? At least I found Jesus by craning my neck, trying to find him.
To me it seems like they're really pushing for mass-market appeal right now compared to just maintaining or slowly growing their existing more dedicated/niche base.
You can see it with them adding widgets, a free VPN, more visibly advertising trackers blocked (at least on Android, not sure about iOS), rebranding with a new mascot, and now going back to a platform that still has a ton of user lock-in keeping people there. They're trying to pull in regular people, I presume so they don't become as dependent on a base that has more strongly held convictions that Mozilla has to comply with to keep its users.
If it works out for them, it'll be good for their long-term funding and security, market appeal, etc, but bad for users that care a lot more about fundamental principles.
Sadly plenty of ppl still use Twitter, plenty of companies and celebs still doing their thing there. Why do we have to single out Firefox? It's not a company that as ideals like most people here do. Yeah their new stuff is definitely shady, but it's that for Chromium. I'll still use Firefox, this doesn't bother me at all, cuz honestly who gives a fuck. I get the optics, but we do not live in a perfect world of morals and ideals. I only have limited energy I can dish out and this affects me 0% so I'll put that much into it. People are addicted to being angry all the time...
My comment isn't really about them returning to X. It's about them blaming it on some type of sudden change in the internet that's supposedly happening "again", that's forcing them to return. Just be honest and say it's for the reason you mentioned, that they want to reach as many as possible. đ
There is no âreaching people.â Twitter is algorithmic. It only shows posts to people whoâd find it engaging; in others words, youâre either posting into a black hole, preaching to the choir, or intentionally rage baiting.
The is no point in advocacy there. It gives the illusion of it, but itâs a lie.
Now, if they want to prepend every post with a link to Bluesky/Fediverse?
Thatâs great.
A siphon off the site is great. Theyâd probably get deprioritized for it, kinda like how posting Lemmy links seems to get one shadowbanned on Reddit. But participating in Twitter is otherwise just feeding the trolls.
I still remember this line someone said while complaining about how The Boys was toothless at actually pushing back against hero worship and capitalism.
You don't have to care, but vou really can't even if you want to.
Companies don't have morals, all they have is just profit. Why are you holding Firefox to some mythical standard? It's a company, it's only gotten shadier. Can't wait when other browsers hit the market in a couple years and Firefox will eventually die. Just a matter of time, they can't increase their market share for fuck all.
Please elaborate on how having a twitter account financially supports fascism. I'd think the opposite if used by the majority of people. I'm genuinely asking, not trying to start a fight.
The most simple, straightforward, and concise way is my least favorite word in the world: metrics. By using X, you increase the amount of activity on the platform, which the Muskrat takes to advertisers and investors and says "Look how many people use my platform, you should be paying me more money for access to the value they have as consumers/data to harvest."
This is actually why they made that ad-blocker that clicks on every single ad it blocks that I can never remember the name of. Because it financially hurts both the company serving the ads and the advertisers themselves as well by both messing with their data on you as a consumer (they can't add your interests to a group to sell to advertisers if you just click on everything) and by hurting their click-through to sales metric. Their click-through rate goes up, but because their purchase rate doesn't, it makes the metric go down and makes them less willing to spend as much on an advertising spot when they're less likely to get a return on that money.
There's also that whole thing where people go where there's a lot of people and by being part of the group that keeps people there, you're exposing them to right-wing propaganda and the various disinformation bot campaigns and whatnot, but that's a lot harder to explain/messier to get into.
That's the reason I don't do twitter and I restrain myself for many products.
But you know what they say "there's no ethical consumption under capitalism".
It's ok to boicot things to hurt them financially as far as you are able to. But let's not demonize anyone who doesn't carry the boicot as far as you can carry it, because that's counter productive.
âthereâs no ethical consumption under capitalismâ.
The VPS hosting of every Lemmy instance is thus unethical. Mastodon is then unethical. Buying a gun to defend yourself and your home is then unethical. Buying a child food is then unethical.
Hard disagree. The issues of life are not so cut and dry.
I meant that everything you buy in a capitalist world is putting money in hands of bad people.
You buy baby food from nestle and you are giving money to terrible people.
What I implied in the post, is that that doesn't make you a bad person. You need to live, and most importantly, you have right to enjoy your life. That would inevitably lead to giving money to bad people.
Here a corporation, Mozilla, is using a service from a bad person, twitter. Are they as bad because of it? I don't think so. There are other people, like Bernie Sanders, who still have an active twitter account. They are doing consumption that profits bad people, but in a capitalist economy that is inevitable. Thus I don't think the consumption of something should be the sole factor judging the ethics of a person.
We live in a society where is very hard or sometimes impossible to avoid it. Here, Mozilla or Bernie Sanders, haven't found another social network with enough userbase for their communication purposes. I personally don't agree with their choice, But I won't call them fash for making that choice. Because I know how limited consumption offers are in a capitalist world.
That's ok. I'm all for criticize mozilla for all the questionable shit they are doing lately. Either to achieve a change on them or to promote an alternative.
I'm just agaist calling fascist people that have not shown that they are indeed fascist.
Being fascist is something very very bad. For instance, to my view, violence against fascism is justified, that's why I really try to distinguish who is actually fascist, and who is just not actively fighting them.
To be fair, there's plenty of things you can forego with no cost or negative cost. This isn't like having to buy food at a grocery store. So while you can't use the internet ethically, you can make ethical choices about which websites you visit.
But I understand that different people have different needs. A company or a politician might need reach. They are not just someone having fun online. For them is their business.
I actually think is a bad choice, because they would have better public elsewhere. But a wrong decision like that would make them just wrong, not fascist.
What way of thinking are you describing exactly? Twitter is owned and run by a Nazi, it is being used as a tool to promote his political ideology. We're 4 years in, anyone still there is either ignorant on the matter, or complacent about being paft of a fascist online platform
I've been saying Musk is fash from way before be associated himself with Trump.
He is fascist because he believes in fascist ideology.
The way of thinking I talk about is thinking someone is fascist because they use a product or service provided by a fascist. Because the logical conclusions of that line of though are terrible.
you are saying that X isnt a platform for fascist, yet its owned by one, which is it? and it has been owned by musk since 2022, you defintely need to get out from under the rock.
There are some instances that's evident that a person haven't have a serious talk with anyone thinking different than them in a long time. And that's just looping on feedback for the same line of though.
This is pretty clear when people make so broad assumptions of the type every X is Y.
In this case we are talking about people saying "everyone using twitter is fash". In my opinion that's very hard to justify unless you are deep in some echo chamber and you have just read that a thousand times and this it has got engraved in your thoughts. Because that's not a rational or logical though. It's pretty evident that there are tons of people who are on twitter and are not fascist.
Just for giving an example Bernie Sanders has a twitter account and he posted there 10 hours ago. Is Bernie Sanders a fascist?
Indeed, if that person went and said that IRL to regular people theyâd be laughed at. But alas one of the biggest symptoms of echo chambers is not being able to recognize youâre in one.
Lemmy in particular is becoming more and more extremist as time goes and nobody seems to notice or care. Where people used to argue their opinions, they now just block/downvote and move on because that person must be evil/nazi/fascist/troll/a russian bot and their mind cannot be changed.
"You say hate peanuts, but by the transitive property of being a literal nutcase, you hate yourself? Curious." đ (cmon..)
If the place you get your groceries starts giving handjobs to racists, despite what the staff and their customers want, would it be a place you still want to shop at
One thing is not liking/agreeing them. Other much different is calling them fascist.
I'm not a sith lord. Not all who is not with me is against me.
Maybe if I go, being antifascist, they also give me a handjob. Then what? Are they racist for giving handjob to racist, are they antifa for giving handjob to antifa?
Arguing with people about this I found out Bernie Sanders has an active Twitter account. Is Bernie Sanders also fash? Is Bernie Sanders supporting Musk?
The problem with what I criticized is that by that logic everyone is far right, including you and me, because we both surely use or buy products that are owned by fash.
@daniskarma@BlindPenguin Musk is undeniably a fascist, and the platform actively amplifies right-wing extremism. However, X operates as an entrenched corporate monopoly over global communication; it is the de facto public square.
Maintaining a presence there is a tactical necessity for mass communication, not an ideological endorsement of its owner. Abandoning it simply surrenders the primary channel of discourse to fascists.
And the Fediverse remains an obscure niche. The vast majority of my country's populace has absolutely no awareness of Mastodon, much less the broader network.
The problem with what I criticized is that by that logic everyone is far right, including you and me, because we both surely use or buy products that are owned by fash.
He enables it like all the others on it, yes, even if they oppose it in principle. That doesn't automatically make them fascists, but it makes them complicit.
Literally owned by a billionaire who promotes fascism everywhere and has been caught manipulating the algorithms publicly. What other proofs could you possibly need?
Fucking cowards. So many spineless losers who clutched their pearls after The Salute and pledged to leave. Too many other cowards stayed, so now they go back because âwe canât lose touch with all the cowardsâ.
It's just that classic corporate moral grandstanding in another flavor, like companies who are pro-Pride for June but forget queer people exist 11 months of the year, or worse, only have Pride acknowledgement during Democrat presidencies.
Virtually every (large) (for-profit) company's moral compass is: Get more money.
If fully endorsing Hitler would result in a 1% rise in profits, they'd do it.
Mozilla doesn't really like it's users. It wants it's users to be Chrome users.
I've said for too many years that they need to stop copying Google and forge their own path, that's how you change the browser market, not copying everyone else.
as social democrats have shown, copying your shithead competition is definitely 100% certainly undoubtedly THE only way to guarantee 100% that you recover all losses and continue to grow.
Oh fuck off Mozilla. You really want to contribute to finance fucking nazis because "That's where people are"? What a world of spineless losers we have built.
Yup, as someone who tried to use Twitter back in the day it's much harder to use it than to ignore it. Twitter is just shouting your virtue signaling and dog whistles into the void for worthless Kudos. I can do that without even using a computer.
If youâre a company hosting anything youâre a target for hackers. You canât just set up a server and call it a day. You have to take extra precautions that Joe Schmoe doesnât have to worry about. And itâs a continuous effort, not one and done.
Oh no the million dollar company now has to maintain a server (likely 1-2h of dev/admin time per month) next to the hundreds of other servers that they already have...
Vivaldi makes it easier for Google to maintain its monopoly and dictate how things are on the web. Google is way worse than Mozilla in every aspect. A Firefox fork is the way.
My unwillingness to use Chromium borders on the extreme, but this is the final straw for me. Vivaldi seems more aligned with my values than any other major player at this point, and the Firefox forks don't sit quite right with me.
In general it seems to me Firefox codebase is too big for any of the current forks to really be independent alternatives. It's all just my opinion and personal experience though. Librewolf has different priorities to me to the point where I found that usability suffered, whereas Waterfox' inclusion of Brave's adnlock engine is highly unwelcome in my book - I want nothing to do with brave. Zen Browser seemed messy to me, though I can see how it's great for others.
It seems to me Chromium, WebKit and Servo are better at separating the engine from the browser, making it possible for smaller actors to make their own browsers without forking the engine. A Firefox fork seems to me to just become a very big thing very fast, and one that requires a large dedicated team to be done right. I know other people enjoy the forks, they just never feel quite right to me.
In short, if Mozilla has turned evil and does shitty things to Gecko as a result, I don't trust that the current forks of Firefox can really provide a real alternative as they depend on upstream development of Firefox.
I built servo from source about a week ago and tried visiting some websites. They have a ways to go...is putting it nicely. Still, there are many commits every day, so hopefully it is just a matter of time.
What if a cartel of cyber bridge trolls kidnap your grandma and the only way to view their riddles is reopening old social media? Is that a good excuse?
Seriously, examine the why's of the things you do. If you don't like cursing, don't curse. Use different words. Censoring on the behalf of corporate interests immediately makes you the enemy of anyone with half a brain.
Iâll choose my own words. If anyone read it, sounding it out in the readerâs inner voice would provide the intended understanding of what was being communicated.
We ainât writing code here. Ensâtification, enshitification.
I understand it either way.
Trump quit Twitter and it didn't decrease his exposure there. There were plenty of people sharing screenshots of his posts. But the fact he wasn't on there sent a message. Firefox should do the same thing. If they are respected enough their message will get spread indirectly, and the fact that it's indirect sends its own message.
People complain, and I agree it sucks, but what other options are there? Google sucks worse and chromium is automatically ruled out. All the firefox forks still run gecko and are basically just a reskinned version with all the same issues. And new engines like ladybird are still VWIP. I get that it sucks but firefox is the best out there for now.
I tried Servo earlier and it sort of works. Incorrect styling on even simple web HTML + CSS web pages. There's Kagi's Orion, but it's closed source, so arguably worse than everything else. I may check out Gemini and the Smolweb/Gemini protocol next, lol.
Sad to say, none directly attached to that project.
I just use firefox for android in all honesty. I'm already on android anyways, I already sold my soul so hard in that matter that anything else I do on it is just a small cherry on top of the shit cake.
Most users don't care about politics and won't follow your boycott. The and result is mozilla crawling back to their user base, not the other way around
Damn, it's refreshing to see the comments here. The reddit sub seems mostly unmoderated and now there are a bunch of Elon fanboys screaming words they don't understand.
Linux works out because it has a raging man running the show as a benevolent dictator. There is the Linux Foundation, but their members are at the mercy of Torvalds mood whenever they try to push a feature into the Kernel. Mozilla is more conventional in that department. If some lead dev doesn't like it, they can take their papers and leave. You can't always count on either solution to work out positively.
Elon has had every chance and advantage. He has had tremendous success. And yet he chooses to be a villain. I'm not interested in using anything he touches.
covid broke his mind, moved over to texas once california demanded more safetry protocols, and taxes. bought X, originally tried to hype his own stocks, but he was forced to buy it. since nobody supported him he decided to go full nazi and support republicans instead, which resulted in him rigging the election.
Covid just made him show his true colors. The Thai cave rescue saga where he called that guy a pedo for rescuing the children without his help was 2018. There are emails between him and Epstein about visiting the island for a party from 2012 and 2013. 2016 he was announced as an advisor to Trump #1.
He's actively been exactly who he is for decades. The EVs and SpaceX are about his savior complex. HE needs to save the world. If it's not him, then it's going to be no one.
Well, that position usually has a bunch of other responsibilities, too. But Firefox also doesn't have a natural monopoly like other browsers, so telling potential users that Firefox exists is kind of a crucial part of that whole endeavour. Don't need to build a browser, if no one uses it...
I've started using libre-wolf, I know its firefox dependant but at least if it breaks its because they didn't sell out. Also doesn't shove AI in my face every few days.
So the point is Twitter is bad? But only people who still use it would even notice this. So they think they're patrolling the bad place to make sure no one else uses it?
So? Is it that hard to believe that a company that's working in today's environment is using one of the most effective platforms out there even if it's run by a white supremacist?
News at 11, most people suck and don't have the stomach to not use something popular even if they're run by a horrible human being.
I do feel somewhat bivalent about it, but at the end of the day, they are an activist group at heart. You do need to enter the nazi bar to do activism. Also, I do want Firefox to have more users, so I can continue to use it. Advertising for Firefox on the fedi isn't terribly useful, since most people use it or a fork anyways, or have a strong reason why they don't.
Like, I'm glad that they did previously leave X, to indicate that the Elmo place is problematic. That's also activism. But I do also think, they should be visible there. And I do not think that many people would decide to not leave X, due to that being where they get their Firefox news from or whatever.
I can see some logic in this. Since X is the most populated service of its kind, it's more democratic, meeting people where they already are. Around the end of last year I updated to a crash-prone build of Nightly and while I was able to eventually find a bugzilla ticket describing and reporting the crash, checking places like r/Firefox and searchable Nitter instances (I haven't had a Twitter account in a decade and therefore can't view most posts unless I log in) was my first response in diagnosing whether it was an issue only on my end or not.
Anyway, Mozilla lost me a long time ago as a believer of their institution. They just happen to benefit from Firefox being the most well-supported FOSS browser.
We don't platform nazis and child sexual abuse image generation by adding engagement to twitter. Your comment ignores a lot of settled reality here.
There is a difference between a civil difference of opinion and what that place is. Either you know that and you ignore it or you're tuned out to the point that you're just not a serious person in this discussion
I would return to X, but they banned me for stating I was attracted to minors...despite being an FBI designated account for determining potential offenders, on a t2 level, which everyone who understood that cough my life partner made means, obviously.
Six retards downvoted a cop, guys, based purely on stimulus response. Not one of them thought there was a reason I said this to determine why I said it. Instant downvotes. Children downvoted me for protecting them. Yea, it is a thankless job. Good thing I'm a better human being than all of you. I grew up!
Year-on-year I see Firefox fans akin to Chrome fans. The only ones left at this point are either afflicted with tribalism or apathy. Considering how many wear their browser choice as a flex, pretty sure it's mostly the former.
This is such a non issue. It sucks that the platform is used but its where users are at so it makes sense for ff to be there. Its just unfortunate that they dont continue posting on mastodon.
Not all users are created equal, and users who are STILL in 2026 happily ignoring what's happening at X may be a source of money, but they also continue to show on a daily basis an appalling lack of judgement and principle which, if sought, will eventually bleed into the decision-making of the direction of the product. This is not "creating a bigger tent", this is "inviting in people who are going to change the very nature of the inside of the tent". It's not an overreaction OR unreasonable for users who choose to use Firefox SPECIFICALLY for its potential to provide an unenshittified alternative to Google's trash to see Firefox desperately trying to attract people cheering for the trash and decide they want out.
In the BEST case scenario, they fail to attract the new users and this is an embarrassing culdesac, but they've STILL significantly damaged their credibility with core users who know what this tactic is. And in the WORST, they GET a massive number of new users from the large numbers on X, and now the core Firefox users no longer have a say in the direction of the product - they've become a minority.
Its a post on social media its not going to change the project. Mozilla will still be staffed by mozilla staff and X users are not going to find their way into the discussion forms and change the culture. Firefox is competing against google, edge and safari its not supposed to be a hyper niche snowflake browser. Its supposed to be a browser for every normie internet user because everyone deserves a browser than isnt spyware. To do that it needs to be where normies are. If this is moving the needle for people im shocked they havent abandoned firefox a long time ago.
i mean users of firefox aren't really on twitter; very few people are actually on twitter. it's a niche social media platform made bigger because the dc pundit class circlejerks on it to pat themselves on the back.
In the context of mainstream social media, X is relatively small. The bigger problem is that most people on there are Nazis and are not interested in building an open web. Mastodon has only 1 Million MAU but gives a comparable reach if you compare the same posts made by FirefoxWebDevs on the latest Release:
Ok so if it gives comparable reach can you point to the post that compares to the one being highlighted? I'm not aware of any Firefox mastodon post getting near a million views let alone two and a half.
No I cannot, they did not post the same post on Mastodon and have just recreated that account on there. Even if they did Mastodon does not track views.
Fact is if you leave out the drama which is obviously being heavily pushed by the algo and take a regular post informing about latest changes and news which is arguably the goal of an social media account of an organisation they are comparable even with 20x the following on X (referring to firefoxwebdevs as its on both platforms well established).
No even ignoring this post the ones on X still get 100k impressions. I wish it werent the case but it is. X has 500x the active users of Mastodon it will always outpreform. I dont think that means Firefox had to leave Mastodon but alas they need to promote their product first and foremost and they can do activism second and take the moral highroad third. If the product fails it all fails and we all end up on google chrome.
372 Comments
victorz@lemmy.world · 446 pts · 31d
Please, Mozilla, explain in detail exactly in which way the internet is changing again, that requires you to return to Faschitter? Please help me make sense of this.
pix_wbmr@lemmy.world · 173 pts · 31d
The answer is money
unexposedhazard@discuss.tchncs.de · 6 pts · 31d
Always has been at Mozilla
iamthetot@piefed.ca · 19 pts · 31d
Always has been at any company.
renegadespork@lemmy.jelliefrontier.net · 3 pts · 30d
What money? Do they get paid to be on Xitter?
victorz@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 31d
Bet
macaw_dean_settle@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 31d
You didn't state how much you are betting.
victorz@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 31d
Two
DarrinBrunner@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 31d
Is that a lot?
ivanafterall@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 31d
It's more than one, but less than 6-7.
zedgeist@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 31d
Who are you, to be so wise in the ways of counting?
kilgore_trout@feddit.it · 74 pts · 31d
Cutting off Twitter means losing potential audience. It was an ideological stance when they did it, now nothing ideological is left at MozCorp.
Auli@lemmy.ca · 17 pts · 31d
Really what real people.are left on twitter?
Dojan@pawb.social · 40 pts · 31d
Nazis, and people okay with sharing space with nazis.
AmyAye@nord.pub · 4 pts · 31d
Nazis and also Nazis. So not really people anyone should ever give a fuck about.
RiverFox713@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 30d
kilgore_trout@feddit.it · 1 pts · 21d
A lot of artists and weaboos.
AmyAye@nord.pub · 4 pts · 31d
Nazis do not deserve to be catered to or courted as an audience.
victorz@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 31d
I know, it's a facetious comment meant to put them on the spot for blaming some sort of "change in the internet (again)".
Impractical_Island@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 30d
The fuck you doing Kurt Vinnegut, speaking from fake lemmy profiles. I know it as you, Kurt. Admit your Kilgore trout@ i know your the same person! It just is as it he. Poo te weet! As I say it now. Fuck is time weird. A quake coming. And that's God's slapstick; our dumbasses.
kilgore_trout@feddit.it · 2 pts · 21d
:')
I wish I could have met him.
Impractical_Island@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 21d
I remember being in my freshman year of college in what would be the most disastrous nest departures in human history and watching the Fox News report on Kurt Vonnegut, how scathing it was, and that led to me reading his books, because my identity at the time was anti-right, and because this I learned this really important shit at a critical point in my life because I identified with his words and characters and humor. Now I shitpost on the internet because I told my ROTC cadre that my nonexistent sister got me pregnant because I judged the wrath of my father more of a threat that the United States military. Counterintelligence is cool, bro. That's why I pee my pants, Billy Madison style, so these kids don't feel afraid to post their retarded ass shit, cuz at least they're not as stupid as my dumb ass, which is objectively the truth because God's a funny dick. Kids, amirite? At least I found Jesus by craning my neck, trying to find him.
AmbitiousProcess@piefed.social · 7 pts · 30d
To me it seems like they're really pushing for mass-market appeal right now compared to just maintaining or slowly growing their existing more dedicated/niche base.
You can see it with them adding widgets, a free VPN, more visibly advertising trackers blocked (at least on Android, not sure about iOS), rebranding with a new mascot, and now going back to a platform that still has a ton of user lock-in keeping people there. They're trying to pull in regular people, I presume so they don't become as dependent on a base that has more strongly held convictions that Mozilla has to comply with to keep its users.
If it works out for them, it'll be good for their long-term funding and security, market appeal, etc, but bad for users that care a lot more about fundamental principles.
fizzle@quokk.au · 5 pts · 31d
There's potential users there, and ff isn't going to lose any users by rejoining.
freudian_slop@programming.dev · 15 pts · 31d
Maybe 5 angry Lemmy user.
fizzle@quokk.au · 10 pts · 31d
I just can't imagine anyone is going to change to chrome because ff started posting to x.
ParlimentOfDoom@piefed.zip · 4 pts · 31d
Because those are the only two browsers in existence...
fizzle@quokk.au · 8 pts · 31d
... aside from the soft forks.
JcbAzPx@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 31d
Basically, yes.
AmyAye@nord.pub · 1 pts · 31d
There are alternative forks.
fizzle@quokk.au · 4 pts · 30d
Not really. The soft forks are more like pre-packaged configurations than separate browsers. If ff dies all the forks die.
I've used LibreWolf for years now but I still consider myself to be using firefox.
Valmond@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 4 pts · 31d
Brave?
Just kidding đ
drmoose@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 31d
Just lost one now. How many did it gain?
fizzle@quokk.au · 3 pts · 31d
Did you switch to a chrome fork?
drmoose@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 31d
librewolf
fizzle@quokk.au · 2 pts · 30d
These soft forks are more like pre-packaged configurations than another browser.
Ingwerperium@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 31d
AI?
Ingwerperium@thelemmy.club · 1 pts · 30d
yes
Scotty_Trees@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 30d
Sadly plenty of ppl still use Twitter, plenty of companies and celebs still doing their thing there. Why do we have to single out Firefox? It's not a company that as ideals like most people here do. Yeah their new stuff is definitely shady, but it's that for Chromium. I'll still use Firefox, this doesn't bother me at all, cuz honestly who gives a fuck. I get the optics, but we do not live in a perfect world of morals and ideals. I only have limited energy I can dish out and this affects me 0% so I'll put that much into it. People are addicted to being angry all the time...
victorz@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 30d
My comment isn't really about them returning to X. It's about them blaming it on some type of sudden change in the internet that's supposedly happening "again", that's forcing them to return. Just be honest and say it's for the reason you mentioned, that they want to reach as many as possible. đ
espentan@lemmy.world · 178 pts · 31d
"We had a think and realized fascism is what we're all about, so we're back!"
melsaskca@lemmy.ca · 151 pts · 31d
The only way to get ahead in today's world is to abandon all of your principles. What a shitty set-up.
daychilde@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 31d
There's a debate to be had about not participating in platforms that do bad things vs. reaching people where they are, I suppose.
brucethemoose@lemmy.world · 25 pts · 31d
Aaaand thatâs how we got Twitter.
There is no âreaching people.â Twitter is algorithmic. It only shows posts to people whoâd find it engaging; in others words, youâre either posting into a black hole, preaching to the choir, or intentionally rage baiting.
The is no point in advocacy there. It gives the illusion of it, but itâs a lie.
Now, if they want to prepend every post with a link to Bluesky/Fediverse?
Thatâs great.
A siphon off the site is great. Theyâd probably get deprioritized for it, kinda like how posting Lemmy links seems to get one shadowbanned on Reddit. But participating in Twitter is otherwise just feeding the trolls.
vithigar@lemmy.ca · 6 pts · 31d
Also reaching the people who most need to be reached.
Krauerking@lemy.lol · 14 pts · 31d
I still remember this line someone said while complaining about how The Boys was toothless at actually pushing back against hero worship and capitalism.
toxicbubble@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 31d
i find it ironic how a lot of anti-capitalist shows are owned by Amazon and Apple
grrgyle@slrpnk.net · 13 pts · 30d
Let the people play out their fantasies of justice, equity, and revolution in a totally contained, purely virtual way.
Krauerking@lemy.lol · 4 pts · 31d
Sell back the answer so people dont look for one themself.
Scotty_Trees@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 30d
Companies don't have morals, all they have is just profit. Why are you holding Firefox to some mythical standard? It's a company, it's only gotten shadier. Can't wait when other browsers hit the market in a couple years and Firefox will eventually die. Just a matter of time, they can't increase their market share for fuck all.
ExtremeDullard@piefed.social · 137 pts · 31d
Mozilla is embracing the fasch like all the other motherfuckers.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 30d
mozillas existence is too intertwined with GOOGLe.
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -90 pts · 31d
Fascism is when using twitter?
It might be disappointing, but not much more.
ExtremeDullard@piefed.social · 123 pts · 31d
Musk bought Twitter and renamed it X, and it now serves at the semi-official fascist-international forum.
In case you've lived under a giant rock since 2022...
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -70 pts · 31d
I just don't live in a echo chamber so closed that I would believe that any person using twitter is a fascist.
What would be next, anyone using firefox is a fascist?
You do understand where that way of thinking ends? You must understand it.
OwOarchist@pawb.social · 64 pts · 31d
Not every person on Twitter is a fascist.
But every person on Twitter supports fascists. Very literally. In a financial sense.
Omnipitaph@reddthat.com · -2 pts · 30d
Please elaborate on how having a twitter account financially supports fascism. I'd think the opposite if used by the majority of people. I'm genuinely asking, not trying to start a fight.
EldritchFeminity@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 10 pts · 30d
The most simple, straightforward, and concise way is my least favorite word in the world: metrics. By using X, you increase the amount of activity on the platform, which the Muskrat takes to advertisers and investors and says "Look how many people use my platform, you should be paying me more money for access to the value they have as consumers/data to harvest."
This is actually why they made that ad-blocker that clicks on every single ad it blocks that I can never remember the name of. Because it financially hurts both the company serving the ads and the advertisers themselves as well by both messing with their data on you as a consumer (they can't add your interests to a group to sell to advertisers if you just click on everything) and by hurting their click-through to sales metric. Their click-through rate goes up, but because their purchase rate doesn't, it makes the metric go down and makes them less willing to spend as much on an advertising spot when they're less likely to get a return on that money.
There's also that whole thing where people go where there's a lot of people and by being part of the group that keeps people there, you're exposing them to right-wing propaganda and the various disinformation bot campaigns and whatnot, but that's a lot harder to explain/messier to get into.
Omnipitaph@reddthat.com · 2 pts · 30d
Ah, thanks! That was very easy to understand!
Nythos@sh.itjust.works · 7 pts · 30d
Higher MAU = More companies buying advertisements = supporting twitter
crispbacon99@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 30d
Its about Musk having control of a major social platform. Just think about the implications an evil person can do i.e. mark Zuckerberg except richer
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -27 pts · 31d
I won't argue that.
That's the reason I don't do twitter and I restrain myself for many products.
But you know what they say "there's no ethical consumption under capitalism".
It's ok to boicot things to hurt them financially as far as you are able to. But let's not demonize anyone who doesn't carry the boicot as far as you can carry it, because that's counter productive.
Trampampoline@sh.itjust.works · 13 pts · 31d
The VPS hosting of every Lemmy instance is thus unethical. Mastodon is then unethical. Buying a gun to defend yourself and your home is then unethical. Buying a child food is then unethical.
Hard disagree. The issues of life are not so cut and dry.
Fuck Twitter tho.
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 31d
I meant that everything you buy in a capitalist world is putting money in hands of bad people.
You buy baby food from nestle and you are giving money to terrible people.
What I implied in the post, is that that doesn't make you a bad person. You need to live, and most importantly, you have right to enjoy your life. That would inevitably lead to giving money to bad people.
Here a corporation, Mozilla, is using a service from a bad person, twitter. Are they as bad because of it? I don't think so. There are other people, like Bernie Sanders, who still have an active twitter account. They are doing consumption that profits bad people, but in a capitalist economy that is inevitable. Thus I don't think the consumption of something should be the sole factor judging the ethics of a person.
We live in a society where is very hard or sometimes impossible to avoid it. Here, Mozilla or Bernie Sanders, haven't found another social network with enough userbase for their communication purposes. I personally don't agree with their choice, But I won't call them fash for making that choice. Because I know how limited consumption offers are in a capitalist world.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 13 pts · 31d
Yeah but we donât need to defend corps that support fascists either.
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -8 pts · 31d
That's ok. I'm all for criticize mozilla for all the questionable shit they are doing lately. Either to achieve a change on them or to promote an alternative.
I'm just agaist calling fascist people that have not shown that they are indeed fascist.
Being fascist is something very very bad. For instance, to my view, violence against fascism is justified, that's why I really try to distinguish who is actually fascist, and who is just not actively fighting them.
explodicle@sh.itjust.works · 10 pts · 31d
To be fair, there's plenty of things you can forego with no cost or negative cost. This isn't like having to buy food at a grocery store. So while you can't use the internet ethically, you can make ethical choices about which websites you visit.
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 0 pts · 31d
That's why I don't go on twitter or reddit.
But I understand that different people have different needs. A company or a politician might need reach. They are not just someone having fun online. For them is their business.
I actually think is a bad choice, because they would have better public elsewhere. But a wrong decision like that would make them just wrong, not fascist.
inlandempire@jlai.lu · 29 pts · 31d
What way of thinking are you describing exactly? Twitter is owned and run by a Nazi, it is being used as a tool to promote his political ideology. We're 4 years in, anyone still there is either ignorant on the matter, or complacent about being paft of a fascist online platform
https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international/article/2024/08/13/how-elon-musk-uses-x-to-support-the-far-right-and-its-financial-interests_6714673_4.html
https://theconversation.com/a-few-weeks-of-xs-algorithm-can-make-you-more-right-wing-and-it-doesnt-wear-off-quickly-276153
https://www.avclub.com/twitter-x-amplifying-right-wing-accounts
https://english.elpais.com/technology/2026-07-15/from-twitter-to-x-the-most-polarizing-social-network-still-dominates-20-years-on.html
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -2 pts · 31d
You don't need to convince me of that.
I've been saying Musk is fash from way before be associated himself with Trump.
He is fascist because he believes in fascist ideology.
The way of thinking I talk about is thinking someone is fascist because they use a product or service provided by a fascist. Because the logical conclusions of that line of though are terrible.
Iunnrais@piefed.social · 14 pts · 31d
Thereâs a saying⌠âIf there are ten people sitting at a table eating dinner, and one of them is a nazi, youâve got ten nazis.â
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -7 pts · 31d
That logic leads to infinite nazi generation.
And to some incongruencies.
What happens if there's 10 person in the table, one is nazi and one is antifa. Are them all nazis? Are them all antifascist?
It doesn't seem like good logic to me.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today · 0 pts · 30d
you are saying that X isnt a platform for fascist, yet its owned by one, which is it? and it has been owned by musk since 2022, you defintely need to get out from under the rock.
Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de · 22 pts · 31d
at this point i can't take anyone who says "echo chamber" seriously any more, it's only used to defend shitheads
0x0@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 30d
You do realize you're proving the exact point you're criticizing... right?
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -3 pts · 31d
There are some instances that's evident that a person haven't have a serious talk with anyone thinking different than them in a long time. And that's just looping on feedback for the same line of though.
This is pretty clear when people make so broad assumptions of the type every X is Y.
In this case we are talking about people saying "everyone using twitter is fash". In my opinion that's very hard to justify unless you are deep in some echo chamber and you have just read that a thousand times and this it has got engraved in your thoughts. Because that's not a rational or logical though. It's pretty evident that there are tons of people who are on twitter and are not fascist. Just for giving an example Bernie Sanders has a twitter account and he posted there 10 hours ago. Is Bernie Sanders a fascist?
SorryQuick@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 31d
Indeed, if that person went and said that IRL to regular people theyâd be laughed at. But alas one of the biggest symptoms of echo chambers is not being able to recognize youâre in one.
Lemmy in particular is becoming more and more extremist as time goes and nobody seems to notice or care. Where people used to argue their opinions, they now just block/downvote and move on because that person must be evil/nazi/fascist/troll/a russian bot and their mind cannot be changed.
galoisghost@aussie.zone · 17 pts · 31d
You accept the standard you walk past.
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -11 pts · 31d
Just a question.
If firefox is a fascist company for using the product of a fascist.
Is everyone using firefox a fascist for using the product of what you say is a fascist company?
tetris11@feddit.uk · 6 pts · 31d
"You say hate peanuts, but by the transitive property of being a literal nutcase, you hate yourself? Curious." đ (cmon..)
If the place you get your groceries starts giving handjobs to racists, despite what the staff and their customers want, would it be a place you still want to shop at
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -6 pts · 31d
One thing is not liking/agreeing them. Other much different is calling them fascist.
I'm not a sith lord. Not all who is not with me is against me.
Maybe if I go, being antifascist, they also give me a handjob. Then what? Are they racist for giving handjob to racist, are they antifa for giving handjob to antifa?
fyzzlefry@retrolemmy.com · 1 pts · 31d
Lot of sealions in this thread
BlindPenguin@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 31d
Do you understand where supporting the far-right and giving them free airtime ends?
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 31d
Arguing with people about this I found out Bernie Sanders has an active Twitter account. Is Bernie Sanders also fash? Is Bernie Sanders supporting Musk?
The problem with what I criticized is that by that logic everyone is far right, including you and me, because we both surely use or buy products that are owned by fash.
daesorin@hachyderm.io · 4 pts · 31d
@daniskarma @BlindPenguin Musk is undeniably a fascist, and the platform actively amplifies right-wing extremism. However, X operates as an entrenched corporate monopoly over global communication; it is the de facto public square.
Maintaining a presence there is a tactical necessity for mass communication, not an ideological endorsement of its owner. Abandoning it simply surrenders the primary channel of discourse to fascists.
And the Fediverse remains an obscure niche. The vast majority of my country's populace has absolutely no awareness of Mastodon, much less the broader network.
0x0@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 30d
Which Mozilla wouldn't really need if it wasn't being run for-profit by C-suits.
Longylonglong@sh.itjust.works · 0 pts · 31d
And you don't see a problem with that?
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 3 pts · 30d
Yes! That's why I have the polĂitical ideology I have. And why I try to boicot them as much as I can.
I'm here and not in reddit because I do want to change that.
CommanderCloon@lemmy.ml · 10 pts · 31d
It's nazi Facebook dude. Yes, using twitter is supporting fascism, quite literally
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -3 pts · 31d
So Bernie Sanders is literally supporting fascism?
Rose@lemmy.zip · 6 pts · 31d
He enables it like all the others on it, yes, even if they oppose it in principle. That doesn't automatically make them fascists, but it makes them complicit.
RiverFox713@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 30d
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · -3 pts · 31d
At least they are no longer "fascist".
A step in the good direction.
drmoose@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 31d
Literally owned by a billionaire who promotes fascism everywhere and has been caught manipulating the algorithms publicly. What other proofs could you possibly need?
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 0 pts · 31d
In order to call Mozilla a fascist company the proof I would need is a evidence of them believing and promoting the fascist ideology.
On another example Bernie Sanders used Twitter. I would also need extra proof that he is a fascist.
drmoose@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 31d
no one's saying these are fascists but contributing to fascist network makes fascists stronger not weaker, no?
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 1 pts · 31d
Quite some people here is actually saying they are. And that's the only thing I'm arguing. That they are not fascist.
Using any Musk service does make Musk stronger. That's real, I won't argue that.
RiverFox713@lemmy.today · 1 pts · 30d
baggachipz@sh.itjust.works · 119 pts · 31d
Fucking cowards. So many spineless losers who clutched their pearls after The Salute and pledged to leave. Too many other cowards stayed, so now they go back because âwe canât lose touch with all the cowardsâ.
HCSOThrowaway@lemmy.world · 37 pts · 31d
It's just that classic corporate moral grandstanding in another flavor, like companies who are pro-Pride for June but forget queer people exist 11 months of the year, or worse, only have Pride acknowledgement during Democrat presidencies.
Virtually every (large) (for-profit) company's moral compass is: Get more money.
If fully endorsing Hitler would result in a 1% rise in profits, they'd do it.
Serinus@lemmy.world · 112 pts · 31d
Pathetic
adam_y@lemmy.world · 108 pts · 31d
0x0@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 30d
If Mozilla needs money they can start by firing whomever they hired to run it.
Zier@fedia.io · 94 pts · 31d
Mozilla doesn't really like it's users. It wants it's users to be Chrome users. I've said for too many years that they need to stop copying Google and forge their own path, that's how you change the browser market, not copying everyone else.
Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de · 34 pts · 31d
as social democrats have shown, copying your shithead competition is definitely 100% certainly undoubtedly THE only way to guarantee 100% that you recover all losses and continue to grow.
oh wait
drmoose@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 31d
They clearly don't want to. Everyone at Mozzila is happy to be Google's anti monopoly excuse and live in utter mediocrity. It's by design.
Rothe@piefed.social · 84 pts · 31d
This really requires the angry goose meme with the goose yelling: "Why did you take time off x?"
bitjunkie@lemmy.world · 83 pts · 31d
"We're here for the open internet"
- Mozilla on Nazi social platform
grrgyle@slrpnk.net · 11 pts · 30d
"Greetings fellow Nazis!" Yeah fuck these guys
Maxxie@piefed.blahaj.zone · 75 pts · 31d
no balls
Yerbouti@sh.itjust.works · 68 pts · 31d
Oh fuck off Mozilla. You really want to contribute to finance fucking nazis because "That's where people are"? What a world of spineless losers we have built.
kevinsky@feddit.nl · 67 pts · 31d
Twitter is litterally the easiest platform to stay away from...
njordomir@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 30d
Yup, as someone who tried to use Twitter back in the day it's much harder to use it than to ignore it. Twitter is just shouting your virtue signaling and dog whistles into the void for worthless Kudos. I can do that without even using a computer.
Zedstrian@sopuli.xyz · 62 pts · 31d
Mozilla is truly going for tech bro territory with an unhealthy dose of AI mixed with fascism.
Snapz@lemmy.world · 59 pts · 31d
No excuse. Fucking cowards
gedaliyah@lemmy.world · 53 pts · 31d
Ridiculous.
Don't forget how quickly they shut down their Mastodon instance even though it cost them nothing.
forkDestroyer@infosec.pub · 11 pts · 31d
It cost them nothing? Isn't there some kind of hardware or software/IT/power cost for hosting?
carrylex@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 31d
I'm pretty sure self-hosting a single mastodon server where you're basically the only person on it likely costs less than 50$ per month...
That's a peanut for a million dollar company.
freudian_slop@programming.dev · 6 pts · 31d
Firefox could probably create an account a Linux / open source focussed server or just the default mastodon server.
fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 2 pts · 30d
If youâre a company hosting anything youâre a target for hackers. You canât just set up a server and call it a day. You have to take extra precautions that Joe Schmoe doesnât have to worry about. And itâs a continuous effort, not one and done.
carrylex@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 30d
Oh no the million dollar company now has to maintain a server (likely 1-2h of dev/admin time per month) next to the hundreds of other servers that they already have...
NotEasyBeingGreen@slrpnk.net · 1 pts · 30d
I don't pay anything for my Mastodon account. ÂŻ\_(ă)_/ÂŻ
rimu@piefed.social · 49 pts · 31d
It's one thing to have a hard time tearing yourself away from Twitter, quite another to knowingly go back.
Might as well just use Vivaldi at this point.
Rose@lemmy.zip · 54 pts · 31d
Vivaldi makes it easier for Google to maintain its monopoly and dictate how things are on the web. Google is way worse than Mozilla in every aspect. A Firefox fork is the way.
rimu@piefed.social · 9 pts · 31d
You're right.
Plus, after trying it for an hour, I can't get used to Vivaldi's gross font rendering.
cabbage@piefed.social · -10 pts · 31d
My unwillingness to use Chromium borders on the extreme, but this is the final straw for me. Vivaldi seems more aligned with my values than any other major player at this point, and the Firefox forks don't sit quite right with me.
I can't wait for Servo to be ready.
Zidane@lemmy.ca · 13 pts · 31d
What is wrong with ff forks?
cabbage@piefed.social · 2 pts · 30d
In general it seems to me Firefox codebase is too big for any of the current forks to really be independent alternatives. It's all just my opinion and personal experience though. Librewolf has different priorities to me to the point where I found that usability suffered, whereas Waterfox' inclusion of Brave's adnlock engine is highly unwelcome in my book - I want nothing to do with brave. Zen Browser seemed messy to me, though I can see how it's great for others.
It seems to me Chromium, WebKit and Servo are better at separating the engine from the browser, making it possible for smaller actors to make their own browsers without forking the engine. A Firefox fork seems to me to just become a very big thing very fast, and one that requires a large dedicated team to be done right. I know other people enjoy the forks, they just never feel quite right to me.
In short, if Mozilla has turned evil and does shitty things to Gecko as a result, I don't trust that the current forks of Firefox can really provide a real alternative as they depend on upstream development of Firefox.
shirasho@feddit.online · 2 pts · 31d
I built servo from source about a week ago and tried visiting some websites. They have a ways to go...is putting it nicely. Still, there are many commits every day, so hopefully it is just a matter of time.
cabbage@piefed.social · 1 pts · 30d
Why did you build it from source? They frequently update it with servo shell here, and I got it running well on both Android and desktop Linux.
Enabling experimental features is important. While it's still not ready it is already much better than when I first tried it a few months ago. :)
Lanske@lemmy.world · 47 pts · 31d
Fuck off Mozilla
TigerAce@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 41 pts · 30d
What was the good reason to go back onto that right wing extremist pedophile platform?
Gloomy@mander.xyz · 2 pts · 30d
$$$
exupulosion@sh.itjust.works · 38 pts · 31d
fuck mozilla
desmosthenes@lemmy.world · 38 pts · 31d
new mozilla sold out; this anthony dude not it
titanicx@lemmy.zip · 11 pts · 31d
Firefox has been shitty for years. They just have good marketing.
Zoomboingding@lemmy.world · 32 pts · 31d
The only non-chromium browser is pretty good marketing
dasrael@lemmy.zip · 36 pts · 31d
LodeMike@lemmy.today · 5 pts · 31d
Best part of the movie
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 31d
title? that looks like potentially entertaining
LodeMike@lemmy.today · 6 pts · 31d
Dr. Strangelove. Very well made movie.
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 31d
oh damn - that's been on my bucket list for decades. thank you!
LodeMike@lemmy.today · 3 pts · 31d
Decades?
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 30d
yes? Don't you know when you keep postponing a thing and suddenly 20 years have gone by?
AndyMFK@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 36 pts · 30d
Firefox could do nothing but provide a standard working browser and be loved, but instead they go out of their way to be hated
BCsven@lemmy.ca · 7 pts · 30d
They must have CEOs that think you always need to act, when sometimes inaction is the best action
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 30d
Do they even have a Tee-ball team?
Etterra@discuss.online · 35 pts · 30d
So I guess Firefox holds respect in zero value. There's no excuse for returning to Twitter.
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 30d
Now how does one refer to a tweet in the past tense? Does a tweet ever become a twat?
Etterra@discuss.online · 1 pts · 26d
Always has been.
deft@lemmy.wtf · 1 pts · 30d
What if a cartel of cyber bridge trolls kidnap your grandma and the only way to view their riddles is reopening old social media? Is that a good excuse?
Etterra@discuss.online · 1 pts · 26d
All my grandparents are dead, so no.
Wispy2891@lemmy.world · 35 pts · 31d
They even paid for the "verification" đ¤Ž
JackbyDev@programming.dev · 5 pts · 30d
I may be mistaken, but I thought Twitter still granted it to some people without paying? Or maybe they fully moved it to "check = subscription".
mintiefresh@piefed.ca · 34 pts · 31d
Very disappointing.
silentjohn@lemmy.ml · 31 pts · 30d
"we're ok with the Nazi platform..."
sobchak@programming.dev · 29 pts · 31d
I never understood why non-profits hire "leadership" from for-profit companies. You're just going to get a non-profit that acts like a for-profit.
Marshezezz@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 28 pts · 31d
fraksken@infosec.pub · -2 pts · 31d
No need to call names. Height challenged special people are people as well
FreddiesLantern@leminal.space · 26 pts · 30d
The internet is changing how btw? Are they referring to the sloppening?
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · -4 pts · 30d
Pretty sure they are referring to the ensâtification process.
leg@leminal.space · 12 pts · 30d
is your comment monetized?
Jax@sh.itjust.works · 8 pts · 30d
Why even bother using the word if you're going to self censor?
They even gave you a perfectly good alternative and you corrected it with a self censored word. Do you like how tight your leash feels?
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · -5 pts · 29d
I dunno. But at least I feel acknowledged by the time and effort you put into a response. Iâm delighted you took that time for me.
Jax@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 29d
Seriously, examine the why's of the things you do. If you don't like cursing, don't curse. Use different words. Censoring on the behalf of corporate interests immediately makes you the enemy of anyone with half a brain.
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · -3 pts · 29d
Iâll choose my own words. If anyone read it, sounding it out in the readerâs inner voice would provide the intended understanding of what was being communicated. We ainât writing code here. Ensâtification, enshitification. I understand it either way.
T00l_shed@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 30d
Enshitification*
khanh@lemmy.zip · 3 pts · 30d
enshittification*
HarneyToker@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 27d
You both are so pleasant.
khanh@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 27d
i know đđ
Grimdraken@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 30d
To the what?
0x0@lemmy.zip · 24 pts · 30d
That was most likely a Mozilla decision, not Firefox team, but yeah... dumb move (so on par with all their other moves).
zebidiah@lemmy.ca · 23 pts · 30d
I support Firefox doing whatever Firefox needs to do to keep doing what they do.....
I won't fucking touch it, but I need them to continue to exist so I can use forks of it like waterfox and librewolf
CannedYeet@lemmy.world · 21 pts · 31d
Trump quit Twitter and it didn't decrease his exposure there. There were plenty of people sharing screenshots of his posts. But the fact he wasn't on there sent a message. Firefox should do the same thing. If they are respected enough their message will get spread indirectly, and the fact that it's indirect sends its own message.
FirmDistribution@lemmy.world · 21 pts · 30d
"we're here as and independent voice".
Yeah, sure. Tell Donald Trump, Elon Musk and Israel to fuck off, just to test your independence.
iterable@sh.itjust.works · 19 pts · 31d
So Mozilla indirectly supports CP now? Never saw that coming.
nutbutter@discuss.tchncs.de · 4 pts · 30d
Mozilla has always supported CP (cross platform)
Hehe
Geekshere@lemmy.world · 17 pts · 31d
People complain, and I agree it sucks, but what other options are there? Google sucks worse and chromium is automatically ruled out. All the firefox forks still run gecko and are basically just a reskinned version with all the same issues. And new engines like ladybird are still VWIP. I get that it sucks but firefox is the best out there for now.
Funwayguy@lemmy.world · 6 pts · 31d
I'm personally sticking with Gecko while holding out hope for Servo to pickup where Gecko left off.
sobchak@programming.dev · 1 pts · 30d
I tried Servo earlier and it sort of works. Incorrect styling on even simple web HTML + CSS web pages. There's Kagi's Orion, but it's closed source, so arguably worse than everything else. I may check out Gemini and the Smolweb/Gemini protocol next, lol.
qevlarr@lemmy.world · 16 pts · 31d
Boo
lemmylump@lemmy.world · 16 pts · 31d
I am Jack's complete disappointment.
Strider@lemmy.world · 16 pts · 31d
I stuck to Firefox all this time, but now I am thinking of finally jumping to a fork of it.
explodicle@sh.itjust.works · 10 pts · 31d
Any suggestions? I want
Zeh_oniam@lemmy.eco.br · 12 pts · 31d
Librewolf works just the same, so there's that.
If you're feeling fancy, you can try others, but the dog is the simplest one to start with.
w3ird_sloth@lemmy.world · 5 pts · 31d
Woof
explodicle@sh.itjust.works · 3 pts · 31d
Does it work on Android too?
Zeh_oniam@lemmy.eco.br · 4 pts · 31d
Sad to say, none directly attached to that project.
I just use firefox for android in all honesty. I'm already on android anyways, I already sold my soul so hard in that matter that anything else I do on it is just a small cherry on top of the shit cake.
GalacticRobot@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 31d
I am a fan of IronFox, but plenty of alternatives.
0x0@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 30d
Not Librewolf.
Ironfox and Fennec do.
a_postmodern_hat@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 31d
Just FYI thereâs currently no built-in auto-update for LibreWolf on MacOS. So youâll probably want to follow the repo or something
pory@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 31d
Waterfox for the most minimal touch, it's just FF with no Moz Corp in it and no other changes.
Librewolf for very hardened privacy defaults, even the sort of setting that sacrifices ease of use or compatibility in favor of privacy.
uBO works on any FF fork, i believe it's included by default in Librewolf. Waterfox has a native adblocker but it disables itself if you use uBO.
grrgyle@slrpnk.net · 5 pts · 30d
I use LibreWolf on desktop and IronFox on mobile (android, grapheneOS), and I've got 0 complaints.
brucethemoose@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 31d
Zen seems alright.
I use both though. I can just turn off whatever I donât like in FF, and security-wise, mainline FF feels a bit safer to me.
Strider@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 31d
I was thinking maybe waterfox but no real good idea tbh.
Mwa@thelemmy.club · 15 pts · 31d
they should have stuck to Bsky
krokodil2000@thelemmy.club · 7 pts · 31d
and Lemmy?
Mwa@thelemmy.club · 4 pts · 31d
But isn't lemmy more Reddit oriented?
0x0@lemmy.zip · 5 pts · 30d
More like mastodon.
Mwa@thelemmy.club · 1 pts · 30d
That too
BlackLaZoR@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 31d
Most users don't care about politics and won't follow your boycott. The and result is mozilla crawling back to their user base, not the other way around
banause@feddit.org · 8 pts · 31d
root@lemmy.world · 15 pts · 30d
Disgusting
minorkeys@sh.itjust.works · 15 pts · 30d
They gotta do a lot worse than being on X for me to bail on Firefox.
AnimalsDream@slrpnk.net · 15 pts · 30d
We don't need to replace Firefox. We need to fork it away from Mozilla, in the stewardship of a better organization.
iknewitwhenisawit@fedinsfw.app · 14 pts · 31d
Is this real? I never had a Twitter or X account, but going there I don't see this post.
MagnificentSteiner@lemmy.zip · 17 pts · 31d
Yeah, they don't show you the latest stuff if you're not logged in.
Using this alternative twitter frontend, you can see the post
https://lightbrd.com/firefox/status/2079317211152564724#m
iknewitwhenisawit@fedinsfw.app · 2 pts · 31d
Thanks. I'm a huge Firefox fanboi, but now filled with rage and uncertain what to do. Maybe it's time to quit the WWW....
BeardedBlaze@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 31d
Use a fork, like waterfox, librewolf, etc.
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com · 14 pts · 31d
I don't know if they really get more reach out there than in open platforms.
I certainly would never make a Twitter account for following them there.
If they don't post anywhere else I just won't hear them.
BlindPenguin@lemmy.world · 13 pts · 30d
Damn, it's refreshing to see the comments here. The reddit sub seems mostly unmoderated and now there are a bunch of Elon fanboys screaming words they don't understand.
TheFrirish@tarte.nuage-libre.fr · 12 pts · 31d
Hard to comment without sounding condescending. A new browser engine cannot come soon enough
pyre@lemmy.world · 12 pts · 30d
disgusting. common Mozilla L.
galoisghost@aussie.zone · 11 pts · 31d
Where are the hard forks? Thatâs whatâs truly needed.
egrets@lemmy.world · 22 pts · 31d
Who's going to maintain an independent fork? It's a crazy amount of work.
mannycalavera@feddit.uk · 10 pts · 31d
Far easier to shit on Mozilla in a low traffic social network me thinks.
galoisghost@aussie.zone · 4 pts · 31d
Yeah. It would need to be a community effort.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today · 0 pts · 30d
mozilla was suppose to do that, they got lazy and had "failure to launch" when google started funding them with ad dollars.
Lumisal@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 31d
It is, but if it can be done for the Linux Kernel, an organization running it should be possible.
Then again Servo is starting to finally get there too.
But either way, Firefox is nothing but captured opposition at this point.
BlindPenguin@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 31d
Linux works out because it has a raging man running the show as a benevolent dictator. There is the Linux Foundation, but their members are at the mercy of Torvalds mood whenever they try to push a feature into the Kernel. Mozilla is more conventional in that department. If some lead dev doesn't like it, they can take their papers and leave. You can't always count on either solution to work out positively.
Auli@lemmy.ca · 1 pts · 31d
Who hard forked the kernel?
yrnttm@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 30d
Elon has had every chance and advantage. He has had tremendous success. And yet he chooses to be a villain. I'm not interested in using anything he touches.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today · 7 pts · 30d
covid broke his mind, moved over to texas once california demanded more safetry protocols, and taxes. bought X, originally tried to hype his own stocks, but he was forced to buy it. since nobody supported him he decided to go full nazi and support republicans instead, which resulted in him rigging the election.
boonhet@sopuli.xyz · 5 pts · 30d
Covid just made him show his true colors. The Thai cave rescue saga where he called that guy a pedo for rescuing the children without his help was 2018. There are emails between him and Epstein about visiting the island for a party from 2012 and 2013. 2016 he was announced as an advisor to Trump #1.
He's actively been exactly who he is for decades. The EVs and SpaceX are about his savior complex. HE needs to save the world. If it's not him, then it's going to be no one.
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 30d
Well, thereâs that. Nothing to disagree with here. đ
Doomsider@lemmy.world · 11 pts · 30d
Booo!
solbt@feddit.org · 10 pts · 30d
Squizzy@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 29d
We desperately a full new browser. I just want to block ads,AI and tracking with a foss project.
Java blocking also.
boaratio@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 31d
Can you imagine getting paid, from any company, to post on social media? It breaks my brain that such a position exists.
trem@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 4 pts · 30d
Well, that position usually has a bunch of other responsibilities, too. But Firefox also doesn't have a natural monopoly like other browsers, so telling potential users that Firefox exists is kind of a crucial part of that whole endeavour. Don't need to build a browser, if no one uses it...
boaratio@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 30d
It just strikes me as the same level of usefulness as someone that has the job title "developer advocate."
SethDove@lemmy.world · 8 pts · 30d
Another, actively NOT taking a stand. Sigh.
m3t00@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 29d
aren't they living on a google anti-trust payouts? iono. their mozilla.social was a snooze fest
Duamerthrax@lemmy.world · 7 pts · 30d
Firefox's submission form for ideas.
https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/forums/postpage/board-id/ideas
pyre@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 30d
i wonder if "go fuck yourselves" is high on the list.
Duamerthrax@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 30d
I hope not. It should be "go fuck yourselves for going back to Nazi twitter", so they don't get confused as to where the anger is coming from.
newton@feddit.online · 6 pts · 31d
đ
Anarki_@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 5 pts · 30d
Unsure why people are so pissy.
If you want hearts and minds for a cause, do you go to the people who already agree or do you go to where the others are?
How do you expect them to spread the word of their product(s) if they are not where the "normies" are?
pedroapero@lemmy.ml · 5 pts · 29d
I found @FirefoxOfficial@mastodon.social ; created on July 14th and verified domain ownership. Shouldn't we mention this as well?
Ingwerperium@thelemmy.club · 3 pts · 30d
cowardly Firefox
CheeseNoodle@lemmy.world · 3 pts · 31d
Yet another reason firefox is now relegated to being my second browser (a spot previously ocupied by edge)
Zidane@lemmy.ca · 6 pts · 31d
First being? Genuinely curious if there is a good option I'm willing to give it a try
Evotech@lemmy.world · 4 pts · 31d
Iâve started to use Zen. Itâs a firefox base. But has some features i really like
CheeseNoodle@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 31d
I've started using libre-wolf, I know its firefox dependant but at least if it breaks its because they didn't sell out. Also doesn't shove AI in my face every few days.
Hypx@piefed.social · 3 pts · 31d
Don't forget Waterfox too.
FreddiesLantern@leminal.space · 3 pts · 30d
Lets go ladybird
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 30d
And thatâs with a long A. Laaaaaaaady Birrrrrrrrrddddd.
Smaile@lemmy.ca · 2 pts · 30d
Weak. Time to bail since I I suspect things will only get worse from here.
a_good_hunter@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 31d
Niding
Abyssian@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 30d
Why does anyone care? Never in my life will I be like "Oh, fuck, Cuisinart made a new social media account!"
GoatSynagogue@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 30d
Youâre not virtue signaling enough like the rest of the people.
Abyssian@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 30d
So the point is Twitter is bad? But only people who still use it would even notice this. So they think they're patrolling the bad place to make sure no one else uses it?
Virtue signaling sounds about right.
GoatSynagogue@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 29d
Bingo.
inclementimmigrant@lemmy.world · 2 pts · 30d
So? Is it that hard to believe that a company that's working in today's environment is using one of the most effective platforms out there even if it's run by a white supremacist?
News at 11, most people suck and don't have the stomach to not use something popular even if they're run by a horrible human being.
6stringringer@lemmy.zip · 1 pts · 30d
Oh my my, what a feature bugaboo we have here.
ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 29d
Should I make the meme "Meet potential browser engine"?
hal_5700X@sh.itjust.works · 1 pts · 30d
Okay. đ¤ˇââď¸
IndustryStandard@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 31d
Of all the nonsense to get angry about the Twitter usage is the dumbest. Pure virtue signaling from people who do not use Twitter.
cardboardcruncher6400@lemmy.world · -7 pts · 31d
Agree ! Dey all BIG (B-I-G) DUMMIEZZZ !!! LOL
MattGade@lemmy.world · -1 pts · 30d
Time to drop Mozilla
Darcranium@lemmy.world · -2 pts · 30d
Use ecosia instead?
trem@lemmy.blahaj.zone · -2 pts · 30d
I do feel somewhat bivalent about it, but at the end of the day, they are an activist group at heart. You do need to enter the nazi bar to do activism. Also, I do want Firefox to have more users, so I can continue to use it. Advertising for Firefox on the fedi isn't terribly useful, since most people use it or a fork anyways, or have a strong reason why they don't.
Like, I'm glad that they did previously leave X, to indicate that the Elmo place is problematic. That's also activism. But I do also think, they should be visible there. And I do not think that many people would decide to not leave X, due to that being where they get their Firefox news from or whatever.
Deebster@infosec.pub · 6 pts · 30d
Well, turns out it is a word! Not the one you wanted though, which is "ambivalent".
trem@lemmy.blahaj.zone · 2 pts · 30d
Ah, damn. Thanks for the correction! đ
SaneMartigan@lemmy.world · -3 pts · 31d
I eventually needed another reddit account. I still have a facebook one. I don't want to but I've a bunch of people who will not use another platform.
explodicle@sh.itjust.works · 10 pts · 31d
You'll talk to people who will only use this guy's website?
There's a whole internet including email, bro. You don't need the nazi bar.
HamburgHouston@discuss.tchncs.de · -3 pts · 30d
I can see some logic in this. Since X is the most populated service of its kind, it's more democratic, meeting people where they already are. Around the end of last year I updated to a crash-prone build of Nightly and while I was able to eventually find a bugzilla ticket describing and reporting the crash, checking places like r/Firefox and searchable Nitter instances (I haven't had a Twitter account in a decade and therefore can't view most posts unless I log in) was my first response in diagnosing whether it was an issue only on my end or not.
Anyway, Mozilla lost me a long time ago as a believer of their institution. They just happen to benefit from Firefox being the most well-supported FOSS browser.
reksas@sopuli.xyz · -4 pts · 31d
there is no twitter anymore. x shouldnt be called it especially since its even more vile than twitter ever was.
PacketPilgrim@thelemmy.club · -5 pts · 31d
I feel like differences of opinion on any platform is good. I don't like echo chambers.
Snapz@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 31d
We don't platform nazis and child sexual abuse image generation by adding engagement to twitter. Your comment ignores a lot of settled reality here.
There is a difference between a civil difference of opinion and what that place is. Either you know that and you ignore it or you're tuned out to the point that you're just not a serious person in this discussion
PlaidBaron@lemmy.world · 10 pts · 31d
You must not be familiar with the 'moderation' on X.
Impractical_Island@lemmy.world · -6 pts · 30d
I would return to X, but they banned me for stating I was attracted to minors...despite being an FBI designated account for determining potential offenders, on a t2 level, which everyone who understood that cough my life partner made means, obviously.
Impractical_Island@lemmy.world · 0 pts · 30d
Six retards downvoted a cop, guys, based purely on stimulus response. Not one of them thought there was a reason I said this to determine why I said it. Instant downvotes. Children downvoted me for protecting them. Yea, it is a thankless job. Good thing I'm a better human being than all of you. I grew up!
saltesc@lemmy.world · -7 pts · 31d
Year-on-year I see Firefox fans akin to Chrome fans. The only ones left at this point are either afflicted with tribalism or apathy. Considering how many wear their browser choice as a flex, pretty sure it's mostly the former.
Auli@lemmy.ca · 5 pts · 31d
I use it to try and avoid chromium monopoly.
explodicle@sh.itjust.works · 2 pts · 31d
Which browser do you use?
saltesc@lemmy.world · 1 pts · 31d
Steam
Saapas@piefed.zip · -13 pts · 31d
Well, that's where the people are
Trampampoline@sh.itjust.works · 13 pts · 31d
Saapas@piefed.zip · 1 pts · 31d
I'm just looking at it from their pov
cardboardcruncher6400@lemmy.world · -13 pts · 31d
U guyz R so LOST ! ! ! Is funnie 2 me.
Fizz@lemmy.nz · -15 pts · 31d
This is such a non issue. It sucks that the platform is used but its where users are at so it makes sense for ff to be there. Its just unfortunate that they dont continue posting on mastodon.
Rothe@piefed.social · 35 pts · 31d
Definitely not a non-issue to continue supporting an openly fascist social media. And especially declaring with proudness that they have returned.
Fizz@lemmy.nz · -16 pts · 31d
They got 2.4m views on a single post. Firefox needs to reach users and this is a successful and free method of doing so.
I sure hope your hands are clean from similar support I'd hate for stones to be getting thrown in glass houses.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 15 pts · 31d
Corps donât need you defending them for supporting fascists.
Fizz@lemmy.nz · -4 pts · 31d
Firefox is not supporting facists.
athatet@lemmy.zip · 6 pts · 31d
Twitter is owned by a Nazi. If you use Twitter you are supporting fascism.
Fizz@lemmy.nz · -2 pts · 30d
Do you support fascism?
athatet@lemmy.zip · 2 pts · 30d
Dumb. Dumb question.
cupcakezealot@piefed.blahaj.zone · 13 pts · 31d
views on engagement bait don't really mean anything, especially on a site like twitter.
Fizz@lemmy.nz · -3 pts · 31d
Any post with the firefox logo and brand does something to the people who view it
Auli@lemmy.ca · 4 pts · 31d
How many are bots?
Fizz@lemmy.nz · -2 pts · 31d
Even being generous and saying 50% its still good reach for Firefox.
mycodesucks@lemmy.world · 18 pts · 31d
It needs to be said...
Not all users are created equal, and users who are STILL in 2026 happily ignoring what's happening at X may be a source of money, but they also continue to show on a daily basis an appalling lack of judgement and principle which, if sought, will eventually bleed into the decision-making of the direction of the product. This is not "creating a bigger tent", this is "inviting in people who are going to change the very nature of the inside of the tent". It's not an overreaction OR unreasonable for users who choose to use Firefox SPECIFICALLY for its potential to provide an unenshittified alternative to Google's trash to see Firefox desperately trying to attract people cheering for the trash and decide they want out.
In the BEST case scenario, they fail to attract the new users and this is an embarrassing culdesac, but they've STILL significantly damaged their credibility with core users who know what this tactic is. And in the WORST, they GET a massive number of new users from the large numbers on X, and now the core Firefox users no longer have a say in the direction of the product - they've become a minority.
Fizz@lemmy.nz · -6 pts · 31d
Its a post on social media its not going to change the project. Mozilla will still be staffed by mozilla staff and X users are not going to find their way into the discussion forms and change the culture. Firefox is competing against google, edge and safari its not supposed to be a hyper niche snowflake browser. Its supposed to be a browser for every normie internet user because everyone deserves a browser than isnt spyware. To do that it needs to be where normies are. If this is moving the needle for people im shocked they havent abandoned firefox a long time ago.
cupcakezealot@piefed.blahaj.zone · 6 pts · 31d
i mean users of firefox aren't really on twitter; very few people are actually on twitter. it's a niche social media platform made bigger because the dc pundit class circlejerks on it to pat themselves on the back.
vogi@piefed.social · 4 pts · 31d
In the context of mainstream social media, X is relatively small. The bigger problem is that most people on there are Nazis and are not interested in building an open web. Mastodon has only 1 Million MAU but gives a comparable reach if you compare the same posts made by FirefoxWebDevs on the latest Release:
X: https://xcancel.com/FirefoxWebDevs/status/2079542497466835112 (3 Comments, 9 Reposts, 98 Likes)
Mastodon: https://mastodon.social/@firefoxwebdevs/116957940443303728 (4 Comments, 11 Reposts, 32 Likes)
Fizz@lemmy.nz · 1 pts · 29d
Ok so if it gives comparable reach can you point to the post that compares to the one being highlighted? I'm not aware of any Firefox mastodon post getting near a million views let alone two and a half.
vogi@piefed.social · 1 pts · 29d
No I cannot, they did not post the same post on Mastodon and have just recreated that account on there. Even if they did Mastodon does not track views.
Fact is if you leave out the drama which is obviously being heavily pushed by the algo and take a regular post informing about latest changes and news which is arguably the goal of an social media account of an organisation they are comparable even with 20x the following on X (referring to firefoxwebdevs as its on both platforms well established).
Fizz@lemmy.nz · 1 pts · 27d
No even ignoring this post the ones on X still get 100k impressions. I wish it werent the case but it is. X has 500x the active users of Mastodon it will always outpreform. I dont think that means Firefox had to leave Mastodon but alas they need to promote their product first and foremost and they can do activism second and take the moral highroad third. If the product fails it all fails and we all end up on google chrome.